Perfect Noiseless Solution

MistaMuShu · Post by **MistaMuShu** » Sat Jan 25, 2003 11:44 pm

After spending some time crawling the web, and reading up the subject, I think I've found a pretty decent solution to my noise problem for computer that'd be perfect for a server/multimedia center:

Here's what makes noise:
Hard drives, PSU, fans, monitors(CRT)

Unfortunately, this solution can't work for a MS operating system, but I think it might be viable w/ a varient of *nix. Find or make a diskless distro, and load it completing into the memory (memory is getting cheaper anyways) That get's rid of the HD, fans can be rid of w/ big heatsinks, monitor = LCD, and power is a toughy...

Besides the fact that it's really a dream to have a silent PC, another cool side factor is how much power it consumes. (Another reason the VIA mini systems attracted me) Maybe get a solar solution going

The noise i can think of would be the spinning of the dvd drive when i play movies, but i won't complain about a low hum during a cool movie...

As for storage, an external usb harddrive can be hooked up when needed.

power still kinda stumps me....

Gandalf · Post by **Gandalf** » Sun Jan 26, 2003 2:34 am

The problem with RAM is that it requires to be constantly powered, unless someone all of a sudden decides to market huge quantities of SRAM

I've actually considered solar power for my pc, but then problem is that solar panels are pretty expencive and not too reliable with the Belgian weather, not to mention that I couldn't have any nightly gaming sessions unless I had a big battery setup

.

MistaMuShu · Post by **MistaMuShu** » Sun Jan 26, 2003 10:05 pm

Well, the weather is a little better here, but i must agree that it would be next to impossible to have a 24/7 server running unless i had a huge backup battery to store the energy i collect.

And an update: I didn't know this was possible, but i guess some weaker PSU's can actually be fanless! yea!

As for the hard-drive, I was thinking, maybe it can be internal, but I can power the drive down and only wake it up and mount it when i need it. Is there a command that powers down an unmounted drive in linux or other OS's?

bluehat · Post by **bluehat** » Mon Jan 27, 2003 8:51 am

Check out 'man hdparm'. It can be used in Linux systems to set cdrom speed, ide hdd spindown time, force sleep mode etc.

Sleep mode isn't very useful if computer is used for 24/7 file server, or hard disk recording on home studio. Cool 5400rpm drives can be easily totally silenced at 0 $ budget using sand bags; hotter drives require aluminum plates and very large sand bags.

MistaMuShu · Post by **MistaMuShu** » Mon Jan 27, 2003 11:24 pm

Are you serious w/ the sandbags? And i think that the 5400 rpm drive would be a wonderful idea since i don't expect crazy performance from the system. It'd be perfect, and i didn't even think of it. Still i think it'd be nice to be able to power down the server if i got real nit picky about the noise. If anything, i can store all the files in ram (provided the server doesn't share too much)

bluehat · Post by **bluehat** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 2:37 am

Sandbags are the most cost effective way to ultimate hdd silence. I'm using them myself, here's some pictures and further explanations: http://members.fortunecity.com/bluehat1/
Without those resonating aluminum plates, and with lighter sand layer, sandbagged 5400rmp maxtor max temp is 46C (still under max operating temp according to specs, 55C).

Gxcad · Post by **Gxcad** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 4:33 pm

If you have the dough, you can go all solidstate on the harddrive. I believe they go up to ~8gigs each now and as a bonus are extremely reliable (no moving parts) and lightning fast (it will easily beat even the Seagate 15k.3). The price? Through the roof:)

I think the sand is a great idea I plan to try it "one of these days". If I do, I'll be sure to post up results:)

-Ken

a3ot · Post by **a3ot** » Tue Jan 28, 2003 8:44 pm

Here are a couple more things to think about regarding the hard drive. First off you may want to consider a laptop harddrive. They run at 4200RPM and are used to being stuffed into plastic enclosures. I've been toying with the idea of crafting a small distribution for a compact flash card for my laptop, from what I've read it seems that solidstate flash like devices are only good for something like 1 million write cycles to each sector. The trick to get around this is to have a memory file system as well that handles all of the temporary files (those found in /tmp and /var for FreeBSD). This same sort of problem exists for any hard drive you plan on powering down, because everytime a file is written to /var or otherwise the harddrive will just spin up which is more annoying than the drive running constantly. To run a laptop harddrive you will need to buy a simply adapter (available at CompUSA or on the Internet). To go with compact flash or just pcmcia style flash you can either buy, or make a similar adapter. Apparently compact flash is pin compatable with ATA. Who knew?
Troy

Asmordean · Post by **Asmordean** » Thu Jan 30, 2003 4:06 pm

Hard drives - A Seagate or a Maxtor using liquid fluid bearings in an enclosure. Or sandbags, though I find that a bit ugly.
Powersupply - Use a very slow fan and mount it vertically so that the exhaust points up. Make sure there are holes in the bottom side of the

PSU - My own Enermax 365VE is almost impossible to hear with an undervolted NMB slow fan in there. Runs warm but not hot.

Fans - Use as few as possible and if you must, run them at 5v and make sure they are good fans such as Papst, NMB, or Panaflo.

Monitors - You have a noisey CRT? I have never heard of a noisy monitor until LCDs came along. They emit a high pitch squeel from the flourescent lamps in them. As far a power goes, of course the LCD will be better.

----------

What does noiseless mean for you? Would you be okay with a slight hum/moving air sound or do you want zero noise to be produced by your PC much like an Amiga?

If a small amount of noise is acceptable then look into water cooling. My pump is silent. The only noise is from my PSU and HDD. Both of which are far quieter than 99% of the PC users out ther (present crowd not included)

MistaMuShu · Post by **MistaMuShu** » Thu Jan 30, 2003 7:18 pm

I would really love a silent system, and I thought the sand bagging the HD idea was very clever and original, but I do have to agree that it does look very ugly, and take up a large amount of room. If I go with that idea, then I'd definately have to chuck out the idea of having a small mini-itx comp that takes no room. But I'm still keeping the sand idea in mind just cause of how simple and logical it seems...

As for water-cooling, I've always thought the concept to be very cool, but the high price does remind me that I work for minimum wage, and do have other matters which need money other than my comp.

I love how small the mini-itx's are, but i'm very worried about cooling in such a cramped environment. Everytime I think of it, I can just imagine hot-gluing on multiple very large heatsink flowers onto it

So to update my perfect noiseless solution, tack on these conditions:

Money issue: $$$, then easy, get the non-moving parts, and one of those giant fanless PSU's, and bam, the system is rock solid, about the size of a boulder, and a definately interesting "thing" to show friends.

Space issue: probably will have to have some fans, and cooling measures would make it harder to keep the system small. Another problem is the PSU, cause i haven't found a fanless mini solution... However, the laptop HD is appealing in the space issue.

Availability:
It will definately be more and more challenging to build a system with all of the requirements from buying just retail parts, (which i was hoping to do)

Asmordean · Post by **Asmordean** » Fri Jan 31, 2003 4:13 pm

Quite and cheap never go together in PCs it seems.

As for cost of water - My current setup cost me $130 to take it from a small jet engine to a gentle breeze. There is also the cost maintinance. Fans are install-and-forget until the bearings fail. Water systems need routine cleaning, refilling, and are hard to move around (water sloshing about in res and 500g brick screwed to your CPU)

I guess the first thing you need to decide is just how much power do you need? Are you looking for a 2GHz game system or a lower power internet system? VIA C3 based computers are small and the CPUs are passivly cooled.

MistaMuShu · Post by **MistaMuShu** » Fri Jan 31, 2003 8:42 pm

like i said before, I'd really only use this new system as a server/home multimedia system, games excluded because I doubt the C3 can handle the load. I wanted it small, but now i guess that isn't as high a priority as quiet and low power consumption if i wanted it to be always on...