Coolermaster's Fanless TC-100 mini-ITX case
Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:33 pm
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My thoughts exactly, would make an ultra silent HTPC or low-end desktop system!Ender17 wrote:swap out the hard drive for a SSD, and you should have a nice little system
April 20, 2008 by Mike Chin with Lawrence Lee
and the TIM proved to be quite thick. We should have warmed it with a hair dryer to soften it a bit.
It's not that low if you also consider that it is to be dissipated at 50C room temperature!The 35W TDP seems quite low for this box, considering the size of its heatsinks.
Olle P wrote:Given that a HDD reaches 50C when the ambient is 21C, what would happen if the room temperature went up another 25+ degrees?
/Olle
The power dissipation of SSDs is well known -- it's less than a noterbook drive, which can peak at 2.5W. Most SSDs don't exceed 1W at any time. Even if it does produce more heat than that, there's no need to use the soft grommets because the SSD has no vibration to damp. With hard screw mounting, there would be direct meat-to-metal heat conduction to the chassis, which would help keep the SSD cooler.cmanley wrote:I've don't know how much heat an uncooled SSD disk would create though compared to 2.5" HDD in this case.
Not with that NB chip. It gets scorching hot. The fan is on it, not the CPU.MoJo wrote:Looking at the TDP for the Atom I think you could just run it fanless in a case with some air vents and a large enough heatsink, like the Via EPIA boards do.
Not sure if you're saying the end user should do this -- but making a case isn't simple for most folks. The only really nice design I've seen for this is the Silverstone something-05 mentioned in the review.MoJo wrote:Alternatively, just make a case with a single 120mm low speed fan. Simple and cheap.
Ah yes, the rather inefficient NB. I'm not sure why Intel feel that a NB which idles at 90C is okay, even on "low power" or sever boards. To be fair all the ones I have tried do seem completely stable at that temperature, it's just that I wanted a computer, not a room heater...MikeC wrote:Not with that NB chip. It gets scorching hot. The fan is on it, not the CPU.
Not sure if you're saying the end user should do this -- but making a case isn't simple for most folks. The only really nice design I've seen for this is the Silverstone something-05 mentioned in the review.[/quote]MoJo wrote:Alternatively, just make a case with a single 120mm low speed fan. Simple and cheap.
Like this? (Though you aren't likely to find 6 SATA ports on any mini-ITX, but it's a 780G.) They're out there, but rather expensive, which certainly makes them less attractive, at least to me. Unless you are absolutely locked in on the mini-ITX form factor, it doesn't seem to really make economic sense over going micro-ATX (where you can get something similar for under $80). Hopefully it won't be too terribly long before mini-ITX becomes a little more common in the mainstream channels and we see prices come down.MoJo wrote:It's a shame no-one makes an ITX AM2 board. A low end Sempron or X2 combined with something like a 780g chipset would be fantastic. Low power, low heat, full HD video decoding and six SATA ports.
We did review an AM2 mITX w/4 SATA ports not long ago -- http://www.silentpcreview.com/Zotac-GF8200ITX Newegg sells it for $10 minuws $10 rebate. Also, while you can certainly debate the merits/value of mATX vs mITX, the simple fact of the latter's 6.5" square size against the 10" square of the former is undeniable. It's really where mainstream computing is going. I think a lot of people are willing to pay a bit of a premium for the small size, even $50 is not big in the context of a whole system. And mITX prices will keep declining.idale wrote:Like this? (Though you aren't likely to find 6 SATA ports on any mini-ITX, but it's a 780G.) They're out there, but rather expensive, which certainly makes them less attractive, at least to me. Unless you are absolutely locked in on the mini-ITX form factor, it doesn't seem to really make economic sense over going micro-ATX (where you can get something similar for under $80). Hopefully it won't be too terribly long before mini-ITX becomes a little more common in the mainstream channels and we see prices come down.MoJo wrote:It's a shame no-one makes an ITX AM2 board. A low end Sempron or X2 combined with something like a 780g chipset would be fantastic. Low power, low heat, full HD video decoding and six SATA ports.
Yeah, I remember seeing that. Just wanted to mention the 780G in reference to the wish for a 780G in mini-ITX form. Seems prices are currently only much lower if you either go with an Atom board (CPU+MB for less than a board -- though the performance won't be anything near a "normal" AM2/775 CPU) or a GF7000-series board.MikeC wrote:We did review an AM2 mITX w/4 SATA ports not long ago -- http://www.silentpcreview.com/Zotac-GF8200ITX Newegg sells it for $10 minuws $10 rebate.
I'd personally love to convert my Linux server over to something smaller. I've currently got a P182 housing the micro-ATX system, optical drive, and single hard drive, which is overkill (but the price/performance was right and I love the P180 I've got housing the main system), especially since we have it "hidden" in an open-backed cabinet and the P182 is a bit tall and deep to truly "fit". (Many thanks, by the way, for the work you did with Antec on the P180. Though I'm not as sensitive as many here to noise level, I much prefer whooshing to whining and being able to run as cool and quietly, with as little "extra effort", as possible.)Also, while you can certainly debate the merits/value of mATX vs mITX, the simple fact of the latter's 6.5" square size against the 10" square of the former is undeniable. It's really where mainstream computing is going. I think a lot of people are willing to pay a bit of a premium for the small size, even $50 is not big in the context of a whole system. And mITX prices will keep declining.
That's an interesting board. It doesn't specifically say (even on the Jetway web site) but it seems the two external SATA ports are probably shared with two of the on-board ones, but it's still pretty impressive.idale wrote:Like this? (Though you aren't likely to find 6 SATA ports on any mini-ITX, but it's a 780G.) They're out there, but rather expensive, which certainly makes them less attractive, at least to me. Unless you are absolutely locked in on the mini-ITX form factor, it doesn't seem to really make economic sense over going micro-ATX (where you can get something similar for under $80). Hopefully it won't be too terribly long before mini-ITX becomes a little more common in the mainstream channels and we see prices come down.
I think the real problem here is that ITX is in a catch 22 situation. People would like very small form factor PCs, but the price premium is far too much to justify them, and the only way it will come down is if the format becomes more mainstream. I don't know where you got the $50 figure Mike, but I'd be surprised if you could build a quiet mini-ITX system for only $50 more than a similar spec mATX one.idale wrote:I'd personally love to convert my Linux server over to something smaller. I've currently got a P182 housing the micro-ATX system, optical drive, and single hard drive, which is overkill (but the price/performance was right and I love the P180 I've got housing the main system), especially since we have it "hidden" in an open-backed cabinet and the P182 is a bit tall and deep to truly "fit". (Many thanks, by the way, for the work you did with Antec on the P180. Though I'm not as sensitive as many here to noise level, I much prefer whooshing to whining and being able to run as cool and quietly, with as little "extra effort", as possible.)Also, while you can certainly debate the merits/value of mATX vs mITX, the simple fact of the latter's 6.5" square size against the 10" square of the former is undeniable. It's really where mainstream computing is going. I think a lot of people are willing to pay a bit of a premium for the small size, even $50 is not big in the context of a whole system. And mITX prices will keep declining.
While the fancy fanless "heatsink" mini-ITX cases are expensive (what cases like that aren't, though), there's certainly reasonably-priced options, such as over at Mini-Box (their branded enclosures start at $40, which while is much more expensive per unit of volume, certainly seems reasonable).MoJo wrote:I don't know where you got the $50 figure Mike, but I'd be surprised if you could build a quiet mini-ITX system for only $50 more than a similar spec mATX one.
Once you include the case and power supply the cost is usually more than double. The power savings from a DC-DC PSU just arn't worth it as it would take you decades of 24/7 use to make up the extra initial outlay. Even in a large company with hundreds of PCs it's very hard to justify economically.
Still no Hello Kitty PCs at Dell that I can find, though.MoJo wrote:I was quite impressed by the Apex case. It is nice to see western manufacturers moving to SFF designs now, after looking enviously at Japanese PCs for over a decade.
Ah, very true. Despite the whole "global economy" thing (which I guess tends to be more of a euphemism for "your job's going to China" at times), there's so much variation in supply and pricing. But since the US (and Canada) is such a large market, hopefully we can help act as a catalyst for Europe and beyond as the mini-ITX format becomes more mainstream, especially with those manufacturers who have presence in Europe. Though even when products go over there, I do keep seeing stuff about pricing being all out of whack (even on simple things like software). But it'll get there, just may take a little longer to get across the Pond at favorable price points.It seems like you guys are right, but only for people living in the US. For me in the UK it's a different story.
You don't think it's already shifting significantly? Atom was the primary trigger for the development of netbooks and net tops (probably helped by the global economic downturn). The former is firmly here to stay, the latter continues to expand, tho more slowly because desktop systems are outsold by portables everywhere.idale wrote: Maybe it'll help to start shifting the technological landscape a little. (Or more likely not, but we can dream, right?)
Well, I was referring more specifically to MoJo's comment on the landscape in the UK (that being what he'd probably refer to as "barren"), more than just an overall move to smaller form factors (especially here). We're definitely taking the turn to net-*, but I was trying to express the hope that the proliferation of smaller, cheaper devices at the global level would improve the technological situation over there such that it wouldn't need to be referred to as "backwater" or anything. If prices and supply are more out of line compared to the rest of Europe (Europe's stereotypical Alabama?) then maybe the small, cheap computer option will be able to make some changes in the availability and pricing in the region (as more demand is created because the smaller devices are more affordable, beefing up supply channels, rather than one guy rowing across the Channel or whatever is the current state alluded to).MikeC wrote:You don't think it's already shifting significantly?