Clean that filter!

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Sun May 02, 2004 2:25 pm

Well I haven't touched this computer for nine months. It's my work-horse...in use maybe eight hours a day. I went through a lot of trouble sealing everything, adding that Xterra front filter. Well the CPU temps were up 5C lately, so I took off the front bezel....vacuumed off the filter (it was very dirty). Then I looked inside. Hardly any dust at all.

That filter is working great. My temps are back to normal...no sweat. I consider this setup a success. But remember to clean those filters.

wumpus · Post by **wumpus** » Sun May 02, 2004 7:36 pm

Better yet, don't use filters at all, and just spray out the inside of your computer every few months with compressed air

I dunno, to me, the risk of what you are describing-- reduced airflow over time unless you have a constant filter maintenance regimen-- seems much greater than the mild benefit of a slightly less dusty case interior. Not to mention the unavoidable decrease in airflow with a filter, which costs you noise and heat, every day.

kloppe · Post by **kloppe** » Sun May 02, 2004 10:20 pm

Well, if you let dust gather inside the case, bad things might happen.

(That's not my HSF, fortunately

)

thatguyX · Post by **thatguyX** » Sun May 02, 2004 10:34 pm

kloppe - looking at that thing almost made me sick... seriously... it just looked like something died and decayed. wtf

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Mon May 03, 2004 2:40 am

thatguyX.....this is exactly what I try to avoid when I design filtration systems for my computers. You're looking at more than just a dust problem in that picture. In most home settings there is air contamination with cooking odors....this also deposits grease/sticky stuff on your computer parts. Compressed air isn't going to clean that heatsink very well.

Sure you can run your computer without a filter....you can run your car without an air filter, also your furnace will run ok (for a while anyway) without any filter. But why take the chance?

ashtray_head · Post by **ashtray_head** » Mon May 03, 2004 8:13 am

if you can get a filter that dont restrict the airflow too much then you're ok!
I must admit, dust free is better

Post by **Rusty075** » Mon May 03, 2004 9:55 am

Bluefront wrote:Sure you can run your computer without a filter....you can run your car without an air filter, also your furnace will run ok (for a while anyway) without any filter. But why take the chance?

The difference being that contaminents can cause damage to your car and furnace.

The dust issue with computers isn't a "mission critical" one, it's a cleanliness/vanity/convenience one. (an increase of 5° over 9 months is not a critical thing....if you were 5° away from failure 9 months ago your cooling system was already in critical condition.

)

Adding filters is a tradeoff: You reduce the dust intrusion, but you add cost, complexity, maintainance requirements, heat, and noise...when compared to the same setup without the filter. (Blue...does the filter reduce the noise coming out of the case at all? I wouldn't think it would have much effect, but...)

Whether filters make sense for you is dependent upon the particulars of your situation and needs. Bluefront is a big proponent of them, but others aren't.

In my personal situation I don't see a need for them. I've got a machine that has been running continuously for twice as long as the machine Bf is talking about, and it has only a trivia amount of dust on the HSF, not enough to really have an effect on anything.

wumpus · Post by **wumpus** » Mon May 03, 2004 2:00 pm

Yeah, it's definitely a personal choice. I wasn't criticizing that choice, but I have a hard time understanding it. If there's one thing I've learned, it's that the key to a quiet computer is the best possible airflow.. I have to view anything that would reduce airflow with a very critical eye.

Plus, I have yet to see any of my computers get all that dusty. I suppose if you lived in a climate with CRAZY amounts of dust in the air, filters might be desirable.

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Mon May 03, 2004 3:31 pm

I think most of you guys have never built a computer with a big intake filter. My latest creation has a 4"x12" filter on the bottom of the case. When the filter area is that large, there is almost no restriction.....which of course means no extra noise plus a clean computer.

I happen to have a severe dust problem in my house (parrots)....If I had run that computer nine months without cleaning, without a filter, the inside would have looked similar to that awful photo. I clean enough as it is, so the less maintence I have to do, the better. That filter saves me a bunch of time.

I never said filters will quiet your computer, but if you don't clean often, a dust build-up on your CPU heatsink will cause you to raise the fan speeds to maintain the same temps. So I filter every computer I build.....and that last Black Knight project of mine has the best filter setup yet.

wumpus · Post by **wumpus** » Mon May 03, 2004 4:34 pm

Hey, parrots are cool. How old are they? Don't some parrots live longer than people?

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Mon May 03, 2004 5:13 pm

A 29 year old Bluefront Amazon, and a thirteen year old Yellownape Amazon......dusty critters. Had both since they were hatched. And I suspect I'll be gone before they will.

chylld · Post by **chylld** » Mon May 03, 2004 11:01 pm

rofl i just cleaned out my filter, first time i'd done it in a few months. i took it out of my BQE's front panel, and saw dust fly everywhere - which was weird because i couldn't actually see any dust on the filter itself.

then it hit me - what i was looking at wasn't just filter - it was filter with a thick layer of dust on top of it! so thick it was even enough to not be seen at first glance.

well i've cleaned it out and my hard drive temps have dropped 3c

cpu temp is unchanged because the cpu is watercooled.

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Tue May 04, 2004 5:38 am

Since it's been about 100°F here every day for the past 10 days, I decided to open my 3700BQE system to clean the filter and insides. It hadn't been open since Nov/Dec so I figured by cleaning it i could get a nice jump on the warm weather. This system is powered on 16-18 hours per day, every day and sits on a carpeted floor that is vacuumed once or twice per week. We have no indoor pets and neither of us smokes.

When I opened it I was greeted with this:

Not too bad but I figured I could lower my CPU and case temps by cleaning the front filter and heatsink. I blew everything out thoroughly and put it back together and was greeted with about 1-2°C cooler CPU temps and no drop in my case temps. Whoopee. But at least my system is clean for the summer.

SuperBusTerror · Post by **SuperBusTerror** » Tue May 04, 2004 1:45 pm

I just put together a new Athlon64-based system with the Zalman CNPS-7000AlCu, and am interested in installing an air intake filter. I'm using an "I-Style" case, and will probably have to mod it significantly, but I'm game.

Any recommendations? What kind of filter should I look for and where do I get them? I suppose I could install a 4"X12" one on the bottom of the case like bluefront did. Is there some sort of frame that makes it easy to pull out and clean?

-- SBT

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Tue May 04, 2004 3:38 pm

I am shocked! SPCR's own Ralf Hutter, the man who carefully assembles some of the best computers around, routes his wiring with great precision, casts a critical eye on every piece of hardware, reviews everything to a minute detail.........at the same time displays complete indifference when it comes to keeping dust and gunk out of his own immaculate builds. Shocking to say the very least.

I am now convinved this is some sort of conspiracy against bluefront and his total pre-occupation with filters and clean heatsinks.

Not to change the subject but that 4"x12" filter setup you might have seen, has a plastic frame I got out of a floor register vent....Home Depot about $10. It is also available at 4"x10" and a few other sizes. It could hold many different filters....foam, paper, etc.

More photos of register vent

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Wed May 05, 2004 4:53 am

Bluefront wrote:I am shocked! SPCR's own Ralf Hutter, the man who carefully assembles some of the best computers around, routes his wiring with great precision, casts a critical eye on every piece of hardware, reviews everything to a minute detail.........at the same time displays complete indifference when it comes to keeping dust and gunk out of his own immaculate builds. Shocking to say the very least.

I don't consider that amount of dust to be excessive, especially since it's been around six months since I last opened the case. It's certainly less dust than I'm used to seeing in my customers' systems. (some of which I built) Plus, since the CPU temp only dropped a degree or two after cleaning, I don't think that dust was any sort of an issue, except from an appearance point of view. (Yet another reason not to have a case window!

)

That machine is my daily workhorse and I use it every day to be productive. My general philosophy is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". It's powerful enough for what I do, runs around 25dB or less so I leave it alone and just use it. I have other systems that I experiment with and these tend to stay much cleaner than my workhorse system.

JVM · Post by **JVM** » Wed May 05, 2004 5:46 am

I think the weather also plays a part in dust. I live in an area where winter is fairly long and so is the heating season which creates lots of static in the house. I believe static makes dust accumulate more on things.

My 2 cats don't help matters by shedding fur and...whiskers. Fortunately, no whiskers found on my intake filter, but I do have to clean that filter about once a month.

chylld · Post by **chylld** » Wed May 05, 2004 5:53 am

JVM wrote:I believe static makes dust accumulate more on things.

i'd like to ask someone "in the know" to verify if this is true. i also suspect it, as i get unbelievable amounts of dust around my power cords under my desk - especially around the power brick for my speakers. to give you an idea - after a fortnight or so without cleaning, you can literally pick up a handful of dust from under my table, most of which seems to clutter around that power brick.

JVM · Post by **JVM** » Wed May 05, 2004 6:19 am

chylld wrote:
JVM wrote:I believe static makes dust accumulate more on things.
i'd like to ask someone "in the know" to verify if this is true. i also suspect it, as i get unbelievable amounts of dust around my power cords under my desk - especially around the power brick for my speakers. to give you an idea - after a fortnight or so without cleaning, you can literally pick up a handful of dust from under my table, most of which seems to clutter around that power brick.

I am pretty certain that heat from components does attract dust. Since I have an LCD screen, I have seen lots less dust, almost nothing, compared to my CRT monitor.

sthayashi · Post by **sthayashi** » Wed May 05, 2004 6:58 am

It's not heat that attracts dust, but electricity or specifically, charged particles. A CRT is basically an electron gun that shoots at your screen. Well, shoot enough electrons and you can have static electricity build up on the screen.

Well, static electricity also attracts dust. You can sometimes feel this if you have hairy arms and place your arm really close to the screen (almost touching it).

JVM · Post by **JVM** » Wed May 05, 2004 8:42 am

sthayashi wrote:It's not heat that attracts dust, but electricity or specifically, charged particles. A CRT is basically an electron gun that shoots at your screen. Well, shoot enough electrons and you can have static electricity build up on the screen.

Well, static electricity also attracts dust. You can sometimes feel this if you have hairy arms and place your arm really close to the screen (almost touching it).

Yes, that's what I meant, only you said it all better...

Sooty · Post by **Sooty** » Wed May 05, 2004 11:51 am

Searching the forums for fan info, when I came across this old thread with interesting filter data/opinions from Dorothy B.

JVM · Post by **JVM** » Wed May 05, 2004 3:06 pm

All I know is I have two systems in my house and only one has an intake air filter - no fan in front, just the air filter - and the system without a filter gets real filthy inside while my other system stays cleaner as long as I clean the filter once a month or so.

Fat Bunny · Post by **Fat Bunny** » Tue May 11, 2004 5:12 pm

Errm... don't know about Parrots but this is what happens after my machine sharing space with an occasionally shedding rabbit or two.

JVM · Post by **JVM** » Tue May 11, 2004 5:26 pm

Fat Bunny wrote:Errm... don't know about Parrots but this is what happens after my machine sharing space with an occasionally shedding rabbit or two.

I think it's time to bring in a cat...

Sooty · Post by **Sooty** » Tue May 11, 2004 5:31 pm

Fat Bunny wrote:Errm... don't know about Parrots but this is what happens after my machine sharing space with an occasionally shedding rabbit or two.

Is that the rabbit? Looks like fat bunny became flat bunny!

When sharing space with a rabbit, always be careful when picking up and putting down your machine

chylld · Post by **chylld** » Tue May 11, 2004 6:25 pm

hahaha flat rabbit

instant 2-second animal rug

HammerSandwich · Post by **HammerSandwich** » Wed May 12, 2004 7:36 pm

Fat Bunny wrote:

So THAT's where Ralf's toupee went!

loren_brothers · Post by **loren_brothers** » Wed May 12, 2004 7:43 pm

I just want to know why he (and the computer) got banished to the rabbit hutch to start with???

Bluefront · Post by **Bluefront** » Thu May 13, 2004 2:21 am

He, he. Funny picture. I don't have any furry creatures in the house....just the two parrots. But they create a very fine white feather dust, a powdery substance not visible in the air, but quite visible on flat surfaces that havn't been cleaned for awhile. Where it really shows up is on the various air-filters I use in my computers, and the other air-filtration units around the house.

The fan in my central air unit runs 24/7.....a new hi-efficiency filter lasts only about four weeks.

But the birds were here before the computers......so they stay.

Clean that filter!

Clean that filter!

Where to get filters?