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 Post subject: Should Scythe Ninja´s copper pipes be hot under load?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2007 6:05 am 
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Hello

I´ve just built my self the system in my signature.

My system is not OCed and according to TAT the E6300 is idling around 40C and at 52C under 100% load. These temperatures are with the included ninja fan blowing at 800rpm towards the exhaust fan.

This is a little hotter than I expected regarding the ninja´s reputation so I put the system under 100% load in TAT for a few minutes and to my surprise the copper pipes underneath the fins were almost cold and the CPU at 53C.

Should this be so, or have I not installed it properly?

"System temp" and the hard drive are nominally around 39C and the north bridge heatsink to hot to touch for more than a few seconds.

Thanks for your time.

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E-6300 @ stock speed
ASUS P5B-E
2X1GB Kingston 667MHz value ram
Seagate Barracuda 320 GB
Gigabyte Radeon X1600Pro Passive
Antec SOLO
Scythe Ninja w. incl fan @ 800 rpm, used incl. heat paste
Exhaust fan @ L
1 X 92mm intake fan
Seasonic 400W PSU


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2007 7:06 am 
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Different post, same subject

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2007 11:22 am 
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Heatpipes transport heat inside them. They don't radiate it outside. They will feel cold.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2007 6:44 pm 
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This is normal. The base of the Ninja will be significantly cooler than the CPU die. 53C feels not-quite-hot to the touch, and the base and heat pipes will be much lower temperature, probably below 35C, which feels cool to the touch.

Added to this, if the pipes are lower temperature than your finger, they will suck heat out of your finger, making them actually feel cold.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:10 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2007 5:51 am
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Bluefront wrote:


Sorry, didnt notice it. Had done quite of googling of the matter where alot of threads from here had come up, but not this one. I maybe should´ve checked first....

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E-6300 @ stock speed
ASUS P5B-E
2X1GB Kingston 667MHz value ram
Seagate Barracuda 320 GB
Gigabyte Radeon X1600Pro Passive
Antec SOLO
Scythe Ninja w. incl fan @ 800 rpm, used incl. heat paste
Exhaust fan @ L
1 X 92mm intake fan
Seasonic 400W PSU


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:20 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2007 5:51 am
Posts: 4
cmthomson wrote:
This is normal. The base of the Ninja will be significantly cooler than the CPU die. 53C feels not-quite-hot to the touch, and the base and heat pipes will be much lower temperature, probably below 35C, which feels cool to the touch.

Added to this, if the pipes are lower temperature than your finger, they will suck heat out of your finger, making them actually feel cold.


OK thanks!

I´m just having my normal dosage of paranoia, its my first build....

But could some interaction between the memory and the MB be resulting in this northbridge heat? It can barely be touched during run and the system temp reads around 40C. The memory voltage is qouted "auto" in the asus utility and all settings have been left as they were. I was hoping that I could run the computer passively, with just case fans running, but I dont feel comfy turning the cpu fan off when the NB is so hot to the touch.. -or should it just be so????

_________________
E-6300 @ stock speed
ASUS P5B-E
2X1GB Kingston 667MHz value ram
Seagate Barracuda 320 GB
Gigabyte Radeon X1600Pro Passive
Antec SOLO
Scythe Ninja w. incl fan @ 800 rpm, used incl. heat paste
Exhaust fan @ L
1 X 92mm intake fan
Seasonic 400W PSU


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 3:01 am 
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Location: St Louis (county) Missouri USA
For various reasons, some NB heatsinks run very hot.....supposedly doesn't hurt anything. On my current project I installed a Thermalright HR-05. Fantastic results. It apparently conducts heat much better than a simple finned heatsink......of course it's pretty big.

Image

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Last edited by Bluefront on Wed Jan 10, 2007 3:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 2:38 pm 
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Location: Pleasanton, CA
paste wrote:
But could some interaction between the memory and the MB be resulting in this northbridge heat? It can barely be touched during run and the system temp reads around 40C. The memory voltage is qouted "auto" in the asus utility and all settings have been left as they were. I was hoping that I could run the computer passively, with just case fans running, but I dont feel comfy turning the cpu fan off when the NB is so hot to the touch.. -or should it just be so????

By default the north bridge runs hot on Asus Conroe boards.

Three things to do (in order of difficulty/expense/effectiveness):

Disable "Hyper Path 3" in the BIOS. This feature is on by default, and causes the north bridge to be overclocked by 33% which makes it run hot (it ties the strapping to 800 instead of 1066).

Replace the TIM on the north bridge. Stock TIM on motherboards is typically chosen for simple reliable assembly, not performance.

Replace the north bridge heat sink. The Thermalright HR-05 is the ultimate, but there are other good choices from Zalman and Swiftech as well.

EDIT: fix typo, meant HR-05!

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i7 2600K CPU@4.4 GHz, Asrock Z68, 8GB Corsair Vengeance 1866 CL9, Intel 335 240GB SSD + Samsung HD502HI 500GB, Internal i7 graphics, Antec P180 case, Seasonic X-400 fanless PS, Megahalems CPU HS, Nexus 3-pin & AC PWM fans ~ 600 RPM, AcoustiPack foam, homemade ducts.


Last edited by cmthomson on Mon Jan 08, 2007 8:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 4:57 pm 
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Location: Malaysia
Actually I have a question here too regarding the HR-05 for the NB you guys have pointed out (HR-03 is the VGA cooler btw).

I have a HR-05 on my Asus P5B-E Plus board. First thing I noticed after installing it is that I can twist it pretty easily, but when I took it off to check, it looked like contact was OK. Now I notice that even when loading with ORTHOS or Prime, the HR-05 is still cool to the touch. In comparison, the stock SB heatsink is burning hot. Does this mean contact is bad or is the NB cool or is the HR-05 super good? :D

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 8:05 pm 
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EvilNick wrote:
Actually I have a question here too regarding the HR-05 for the NB you guys have pointed out (HR-03 is the VGA cooler btw).

I have a HR-05 on my Asus P5B-E Plus board. First thing I noticed after installing it is that I can twist it pretty easily, but when I took it off to check, it looked like contact was OK. Now I notice that even when loading with ORTHOS or Prime, the HR-05 is still cool to the touch. In comparison, the stock SB heatsink is burning hot. Does this mean contact is bad or is the NB cool or is the HR-05 super good? :D

Good chance it's a combination. The HR-05 is a superb heat sink, but if you use a phase change TIM (eg, Arctic Silver 5) that starts out greasy and becomes more like clay after about a week, and you twist or otherwise move the heat sink, you will compromise the TIM. Also, the SB heat sinks (and especially their TIM) tend to be pretty poor. So it is not unusual for the SB to be hotter than the NB.

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i7 2600K CPU@4.4 GHz, Asrock Z68, 8GB Corsair Vengeance 1866 CL9, Intel 335 240GB SSD + Samsung HD502HI 500GB, Internal i7 graphics, Antec P180 case, Seasonic X-400 fanless PS, Megahalems CPU HS, Nexus 3-pin & AC PWM fans ~ 600 RPM, AcoustiPack foam, homemade ducts.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 9:52 pm 
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I am using AS5, but their instructions do typically say to twist the heatsink a little after installation. I wonder if the support padding around the HR-05 might be alittle too thick for the 965 chip.

I'm asking because when attempting to OC, I notice that sometimes, even at a stock 266 FSB, ORTHOS can fail on small FFTs.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 12:44 am 
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Posts: 4
cmthomson wrote:
paste wrote:
But could some interaction between the memory and the MB be resulting in this northbridge heat? It can barely be touched during run and the system temp reads around 40C. The memory voltage is qouted "auto" in the asus utility and all settings have been left as they were. I was hoping that I could run the computer passively, with just case fans running, but I dont feel comfy turning the cpu fan off when the NB is so hot to the touch.. -or should it just be so????

By default the north bridge runs hot on Asus Conroe boards.

Three things to do (in order of difficulty/expense/effectiveness):

Disable "Hyper Path 3" in the BIOS. This feature is on by default, and causes the north bridge to be overclocked by 33% which makes it run hot (it ties the strapping to 800 instead of 1066).

Replace the TIM on the north bridge. Stock
TIM on motherboards is typically chosen for simple reliable assembly, not performance.

Replace the north bridge heat sink. The Thermalright HR-05 is the ultimate, but there are other good choices from Zalman and Swiftech as well.


EDIT: fix typo, meant HR-05!


OK thanx alot for all your help!

I guess I´m now just two fans away from my goal. The Antec tricool fan that came with the Solo is now the most noisemaker, and not standing up to anything I´ve read about in various forums. It has sum eneven hum or self resonance. I´ll guess I´ll swap it and the fan that came with the ninja out for maby schyte S-flex or a Papst fans and then my system should be silent and sweet. Any thoughts on that?

Is it possible to control a three pin fan through the four pin cpu fan head? Now I´m running the cpu fan as a case 1 fan since the Asus Q fan would run the included Schyte fan at 1300 rpm in every mode.

One more question!
Does my memory give any room for OC?

_________________
E-6300 @ stock speed
ASUS P5B-E
2X1GB Kingston 667MHz value ram
Seagate Barracuda 320 GB
Gigabyte Radeon X1600Pro Passive
Antec SOLO
Scythe Ninja w. incl fan @ 800 rpm, used incl. heat paste
Exhaust fan @ L
1 X 92mm intake fan
Seasonic 400W PSU


Top
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:10 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:35 am
Posts: 1252
Location: Pleasanton, CA
EvilNick wrote:
I am using AS5, but their instructions do typically say to twist the heatsink a little after installation. I wonder if the support padding around the HR-05 might be alittle too thick for the 965 chip.

I'm asking because when attempting to OC, I notice that sometimes, even at a stock 266 FSB, ORTHOS can fail on small FFTs.

Yes, you should always twist/wiggle the heat sink after installing AS5. But don't do it again more than a day or so later, because after about a week, AS5 stops being a fluid and becomes more like clay.

I doubt if the padding around the heat sink would cause a problem; it's a rather soft foam.

_________________
i7 2600K CPU@4.4 GHz, Asrock Z68, 8GB Corsair Vengeance 1866 CL9, Intel 335 240GB SSD + Samsung HD502HI 500GB, Internal i7 graphics, Antec P180 case, Seasonic X-400 fanless PS, Megahalems CPU HS, Nexus 3-pin & AC PWM fans ~ 600 RPM, AcoustiPack foam, homemade ducts.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:13 pm 
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Location: Pleasanton, CA
paste wrote:
Is it possible to control a three pin fan through the four pin cpu fan head? Now I´m running the cpu fan as a case 1 fan since the Asus Q fan would run the included Schyte fan at 1300 rpm in every mode.

One more question!
Does my memory give any room for OC?

Your board can control a 3-pin fan. It might click a bit.

I'm not familiar with your particular DRAM, but nearly all DIMMs can be overclocked at least a little. You might need to bump the voltage a bit. Nearly all DRAM will tolerate 2.0V (+.2) and run a bit faster.

_________________
i7 2600K CPU@4.4 GHz, Asrock Z68, 8GB Corsair Vengeance 1866 CL9, Intel 335 240GB SSD + Samsung HD502HI 500GB, Internal i7 graphics, Antec P180 case, Seasonic X-400 fanless PS, Megahalems CPU HS, Nexus 3-pin & AC PWM fans ~ 600 RPM, AcoustiPack foam, homemade ducts.


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