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 Post subject: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3, ...?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 6:00 am 
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Hi,

I have a 100% passively cooled PC (signature). And now I want to add a graphics card.

I already tried a Sapphire RX 570 ITX with lowered Voltage (@ stock clocks) using an Accelero S3, but the card keeps overheating under heavy load (Heaven Benchmark, Valley Benchmark, 3D Mark).
The cooler already does a really good job. The card is only throttling for about 5 seconds (at about -30% clock) and then it's cooled down enough to reach full speed again for a few seconds. But this throttling is noticeable on the screen.

Though I am looking for a stronger GPU cooler. I couldn't find any useful comparisons on the internet about passive GPU coolers.

The Morpheus II looks pretty heavy, but I don't want to waste 60€ on another cooler that can't keep up with the RX 570.
Or maybe there's another passive cooler with enough power?

Thanks in advance,
benneq

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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 7:23 am 
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Welcome to SPCR.

I don't think you can add another 120W to your system without some case/gpu airflow or going to a case that is also a heat sink.

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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 7:53 am 
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As I said: I was pretty close to working perfectly. By undervolting the card it went from 135W to 105W peak in Heaven Benchmark. In 3D Mark SkyDiver it went from 133W to 113W peak.

I also tried running a fan on the Accelero S3 using an Adapter (directly connected to the GPUs Fan Port). Something like this: https://javees.com/images/TF3835.jpg
But then the Zero-Fan-Mode doesn't work anymore. I tried Noiseblocker B12-1 and B12-PS. There's no change in fan speed and it never turns off.

Custom cooler with Zero-Fan Mode would be a solution for me, too. But I don't know how to get it working.

Though I would just try to use a bigger cooler and hope it works this way. I don't care if the card runs at max Temp all the time as long it doesn't throttle.

Or maybe I just have to wait until next year when AMD releases its 7nm GPUs.

Still the question: What is the best / biggest / strongest passive GPU cooler?

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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:43 pm 
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You say there is no change speed for the B12-1 or B12-PS ? I did a mod on my 1080 with 2 Noctua A12X25 and a controler na-fc1. The controler lower the PWM signal coming from the GPU(reduction ranging from 0% to 100% of the original signal), and you can make any fan quiet with this system. If the PWM from your GPU fan header doesn't vary you will get a constant fan; but that can do the trick.


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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 4:39 pm 
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Yeah, like I said: The Noiseblocker fans (one with PWM, one without PWM - doesn't matter) always run at constant speed.
I thought: When the card uses Zero-Fan there should be actually ZERO Fan Speed, but the B12 fan still runs.

Though I have 2 theories:
1. The PWM is different from what the B12 expects, i.e. still "too high" to turn off the fan
2. The Pins on the GPU fan header are different than normal mainboard fan headers, so the wrong pin is used for the PWM signal

Somewhere I read that someone got Zero-Fan working with some Noctua Fan. This guy tested a few different fans from Noiseblocker and Noctua, and only Noctua worked. But I don't understand why. Shouldn't be 0rpm via PWM = 0rpm?

Did you connect the NA-FC1 to you graphics card?

EDIT: Or is the problem that the B12-PS specification ( https://www.blacknoise.com/site/en/prod ... 0x25mm.php ) says: 400-1500rpm? Does this mean that the fan cannot go below 400rpm?
The Noctua NF-A12x25 PWM specs ( https://noctua.at/en/nf-a12x25-pwm/specification ) says: 450-2000rpm

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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:36 pm 
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benneq wrote:
Still the question: What is the best / biggest / strongest passive GPU cooler?
Accelero S3. There is not much into passive on high tdp gpus, your best bet is going with a passive case that has a big amount of pipes using the chassis as a cooler, Steacom and HDPlex comes to mind, as steve already suggested, but Calyos would be the best bet for a hot running gpu, THIS HEATSINK IS OVER FORTY POUNDS!

Now you could try something like the morpheus and use a pair of very slow 120mm fans and should be able to handle it.

Quote:
EDIT: Or is the problem that the B12-PS specification ( https://www.blacknoise.com/site/en/prod ... 0x25mm.php ) says: 400-1500rpm? Does this mean that the fan cannot go below 400rpm?
The Noctua NF-A12x25 PWM specs ( https://noctua.at/en/nf-a12x25-pwm/specification ) says: 450-2000rpm
I leave you FanXpert3 graphs on each fan.


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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:12 am 
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When I use a fan, there's no need for Morpheus II. The Accelero S3 along with a single 300-400rpm fan is enough for the RX 570 under full load. I tested that with FurMark while connecting the B12 to mainboard fan header and setting a fixed fan speed in BIOS.

Why do you think that the Accelero S3 is more powerful for passive cooling than the Morpheus II?

I'm not able to find the website where the issue with PWM and Zero-Fan was discovered. But I'm 99% sure that the test was already 1 or 2 years old. Though they used some other Noctua fan. Do you have those graphs for some other Noctua fans? NF-F12, NF-P12, NF-S12A. Those 3 sound much more likely.

Do you think the GPU doesn't output "0rpm" when in Zero-Fan-Mode?

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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:37 am 
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benneq wrote:
Why do you think that the Accelero S3 is more powerful for passive cooling than the Morpheus II?
I don't think the Morpheus was design to be a passive cooler, its fin stack are too close. Weather you can run it passively will depend on a lot of things, very likely airflow to help the cooler dissipate the heat, cant it be done... maybe, but its not design that way, S3 on the other hand was design for passive cooling with its fins very widely spread, and they decided to also allow fan mounting for those who might need extra cooling.

benneq wrote:
Do you think the GPU doesn't output "0rpm" when in Zero-Fan-Mode?
Some fans can be stopped others cant, and even then it really depends on the PWM design on the GPU. Im not big on AMD gpu, but IIRC there was an Asus that could stop their fans on AMD, i dont think many manufactures bother implementing on AMD due to high TDP on the design, its much easier on NVidia, at least on this gens.

benneq wrote:
Do you have those graphs for some other Noctua fans? NF-F12, NF-P12, NF-S12A.
On NF-F12 i dont have a graph, only the industrial 3k, I might have the NF-S12A graph, ill check when i get home.


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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 12:07 am 
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benneq wrote:
Did you connect the NA-FC1 to you graphics card?


Yes, noctua provides a splitter with the NA-FC1 to connect the PWM to the GPU header, and the 12V from a SATA port. The documentation say you can control up to 10 fan this way, but (don't quote me on this) you don't need the 12V sata connector if you are controling only one fan.

About the 0% PWM question, if i put the NA-FC1 to 1/2 reduction or higher and my GPU send 20% PWM, the A12X25 stop, If i press the little button on the NA-FC1, the A12X25 goes at ~270 rpm.


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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Sun Nov 18, 2018 6:19 am 
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So your GPU's minimum is 20% PWM? That may explain why my fan is always running.

EDIT: I just redid some tests. GPU-Z says "Fan Speed (%): 0%", but the fan keeps spinning at 300-400rpm.
When the card is under heavy load, the "Fan Speed (%)" goes up, and the fan is running faster. This seems to work as expected. The only problem is the "0% speed"

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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:59 pm 
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benneq wrote:
So your GPU's minimum is 20% PWM? That may explain why my fan is always running.


Exactly, the board doesn't send below 20% PWM to the fan. The stop fan depends on the GPU card, some manufacturer doesn't feature the stop fan below threshold temperature. You get much better cooling with very little airflow than with no airflow at all.
I can't hear my fan below 500rpm so I'm okay with that, but if you really need the fan to stop, you could benchmark with a motherboard header PWM to make sure they stop at 0%, and if that works you could get the NA-FC1.


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 Post subject: Re: Strongest GPU Passive Cooler? Morpheus II, Accelero S3,
PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:38 am 
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benneq wrote:
EDIT: I just redid some tests. GPU-Z says "Fan Speed (%): 0%", but the fan keeps spinning at 300-400rpm.
The design of the PWM fans is key to be able to stop or not, most of the noctuas can be stopped (with very few exceptions) and most of the Thermalright/Prolimatech fans will spin on a 0% PWM.

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