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 Post subject: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 1:55 am 
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I'm going to jump the gun and make a thread.

Not much is known

To be announced in October, released in November
Named after Carribean islands (Barts, Cayman, Antilles)
Most likely same 40nm process, so don't expect better power consumption.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 3:16 am 
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All of this is speculation, but interesting nonetheless;

Barts ~ "Juniper" series
-1GB 5GHz GDDR5 memory
-2 six pin PCI-E power connectors
-TDP ~ 150W
-2x DVI, 2x Mini-Displayport, 1x HDMI

Cayman ~ "Cypress" series
-1GB 6GHz GDDR5 memory
-six pin & eight pin PCI-E power connectors

Antilles
-2x Cayman GPUs on a single board, a-la 5970.

Whole series:
-40nm process
-EyeFinity4 (eyefinity with 4 monitors instead of 3)
-same PCB as current 5800 series
-release penned for October but may appear in the last few days of September
-No great advances from the 5xxx series

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:44 pm 
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Latest rumors

Barts (67xx) cards will have 256bit memory bus
(makes sense because thay are based on 58xx PCB)

Cayman may be delayed until beginning of 2011
(which doesn't make sense missing Christmas sales unless they are having problems somewhere)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:25 am 
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A post on anand forums filled with lots of speculations.

Seems like internally new cards will be redesigned quite a bit

http://forums.anandtech.com/showpost.php?p=30402647&postcount=497

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:00 am 
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Some HD6350 screens are circulating the web. For me, the most interesting things one can see in them is the low profile and vapor chamber passive cooler. Pure awesome, I don't need it to be faster than a 4550 now. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 9:20 am 
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A question about passive cards in general: Are they released same time as active ones or do they come later?
Since 67xx card will prolly have the performance of 58xx card is there any possibility of it running passive?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 9:33 am 
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AFAIK 58xx series cards come with dual PCI-E 6 pin connectors. I don't think this kind of load can be handled with a fanless cooler. And I think the power consumption on 67xx to provide this level of performance will not be dramatically lower.

A pity no VGA manufacturer has come up with a card that would stop its fan in idle and run it when loaded. You can do that easily manually, but the holy grail would be to have this feature out of the box.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 9:51 am 
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kater wrote:
AFAIK 58xx series cards come with dual PCI-E 6 pin connectors. I don't think this kind of load can be handled with a fanless cooler. And I think the power consumption on 67xx to provide this level of performance will not be dramatically lower.

You're ignoring the fact that we'll almost certainly see a fanless 6770 (or whatever the name), which will be a 5770 plus, say, 20% performance. I'm also quietly hoping for a fanless 6850, but that is iffy.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 10:32 am 
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I'm not sure fanless 6770 is a fact...there were no fanless 5850 (which performances will be similar). 6850 will be even more powerfull so wishing it will be passive...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 10:59 am 
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Modo wrote:
...

Let's wait for these cards. And then wait for complaints about cooked VRMs. While it's perfectly possible to cool the GPU of a card drawing around 100W fanlessly (I hereby claim this new adverb!), it's much harder to keep its power section cool and healthy.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 11:05 am 
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It's the same thing with GPUs and CPUs: Model names change, but you get more and more computing power at any given TDP (i.e. without increased cooling requirements). So yeah, I'm pretty sure a more powerfull while still fanless 5770 is around the corner, no matter what they'll call it. If it's a cooler running 5850, so much the better.

Edit: I happen to have a fanless graphics card that draws over 100 W under load. It's not a problem to cool it, and it doesn't have problems running Furmark or other overload scenario at over 100 C (with system fans deliberately kept at low speeds). The thing is, it came fanless out of the factory—it's not a quick Accelero mod on the cheapest reference design available.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 1:31 pm 
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@kater: if you'd search the 'fanlessly' term in SPCR forums, you'd find 83 matches, so I doubt you can 'claim' it as 'new'. :?

It would be great to have 5850 performance at 5770 power draw, but I somehow doubt that, given the same 40 nm process.
The 3870 and 4870 were built on the same 55 nm process IIRC, but the performance and power draw were very different.
I read a rumor that the 6xxx cards are not 40 nm but 28 nm, but I find that hard to believe, knowing TMSC's record with process transitions.
IMO AMD is going to ramp up the clocks as much as possible in order to beat nVidia by a good margin.
The 6xxx card images that I saw seemed to have beefy VRMs, definitely more than the small ones (3 x 3 for GPU) on the stock 5770.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 9:29 pm 
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Tzupy wrote:
@kater: if you'd search the 'fanlessly' term in SPCR forums, you'd find 83 matches, so I doubt you can 'claim' it as 'new'. :?

I'm sorry, I forgot to put - :wink: - in my post.
And something tells me I'm making another mistake not putting another one in this post. But I'm a quick learner, someday I'll master the art of putting smileys in proper places.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 24, 2010 6:14 pm 
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People are saying cards are floating around now and channel is being stocked. Should have first cards on sale in retail in October just a few weeks away.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 12:51 am 
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 27, 2010 6:18 am 
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Ouch

Code:
The TDP is reference design TDP values from AMD.
Different non-reference board designs from vendors may lead to slight variations in actual TDP.

Card Load Idle
5670  64W 15W
5750  86W 16W
5770 108W 18W

6750 114W 20W
6770 146W 23W

Unless the 6750 is released in a GoGreen version I'll have to either buy a 5750 when the price drops or wait for a 6670 (I'm looking for a card on the 75W line with a stock fanless heatsink or worst case something like the MSI Hawk which is very quiet)

Besides power/heat/noise has anyone seen suggested pricing for the 6750 yet?

edit: got dyslexic on the 5670 calling it 5760 by mistake.

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Last edited by dhanson865 on Wed Sep 29, 2010 10:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 12:16 am 
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don't let the numbering fool you. 6750 and 6770 are in performance range of 5850 and 5870 while consuming less

Most likely in same price range as well

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 12:29 am 
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Fingers crossed for a fanless "5850", then. :)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 3:30 pm 
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alecmg wrote:
don't let the numbering fool you. 6750 and 6770 are in performance range of 5850 and 5870 while consuming less

Most likely in same price range as well


The Tflops and Texure units are lower than the comparison you are making would require.

Numbers I've been reading are that the 6770 is in the range of the 5850 and the 6750 is between the performance of a 5830 and 5770.

Just looking at GFLOPS which paints a slightly better picture for the 6770 and similarly worse picture for the 6750 we have:

HD 5670 620
HD 5750 1008
HD 5770 1360
6750 1624
HD 5830 1792
HD 5850 2088
6770 2304
HD 5870 2720
6850 3000
6870 4080

Between the performance difference and the fact that this is a pricing refresh I'm expecting more like

6770 gets priced near the 5830 and 6750 gets priced just above the 5770.

There will be a short term premium until the 6870/6850 comes out and blows away the rest but I'm expecting the higher TDP on the 6750 is a turn off for more than just me.

So after the premium I expect the 6750 to slide down in to the 5750/5770 price range.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 28, 2010 7:46 pm 
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The shader counts are given in an interesting way on those charts. Clusters of 4 rather than clusters of 5. I'd speculate that they changed the balance of the different types of stream units. That'd mean the difference between max theoretical gflops and real world perfomance would not be the same as with the 5000 series, so a comparison like that loses some meaning.

It's really best to just wait and see. Still, I don't think I'd get my hopes up for a fanless 5850 yet. Maybe next year.


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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 2:03 am 
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http://www.techpowerup.com/132802/Radeon-HD-6870-PCB-and-GPU-Pictured.html
Image

Latest news say that 6850 and 6870 will be roughly SAME performance as 5850 and 5870.
Same performance and price, smaller heat package. Pictured 6870 has same PCB size as 5850.

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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 2:17 am 
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According to AMDs latest earnings conference call,

"We will be launching our second-generation DX11 graphics offerings next week."

We shall see whether it's a paper launch or not, but either way we should get reviews and benchmarks.

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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 2:13 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2010 10:21 am 
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I wonder if I will be able to put Accelero S1 on the 6850 card without much trouble. Its TDP is close to the one of 5770. It will be so great...


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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 1:41 am 
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Anatorax wrote:
I wonder if I will be able to put Accelero S1 on the 6850 card without much trouble. Its TDP is close to the one of 5770. It will be so great...


Hell, I have the S1 on my 5870, and that's pretty damn hot.


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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 7:16 pm 
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Not bad. I'm more interested in Cayman though.


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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 9:38 pm 
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6850 consumes 10~15 watts more than 5770, probably possible to run it passively but that will be pushing it a bit...


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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:35 am 
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Overall not much is gained in power efficiency. Same 40nm TSMC manufacturing process, a bit smaller die, expected result. Idle clocks for both new cards 100MHz core and 300MHz memory and idle consumption on par with 5770.

AMD made a good mainstream card to compete with GTX 460, but nothing spectacular.
And I'm afraid 69xx cards won't be too frugal either. Oh well lets wait for 28nm process

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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:46 am 
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alecmg wrote:
Overall not much is gained in power efficiency. Same 40nm TSMC manufacturing process, a bit smaller die, expected result. Idle clocks for both new cards 100MHz core and 300MHz memory and idle consumption on par with 5770.

What do you mean "not much gained"? The power consumption of the 6850 is nearly identical to that of the 5770 while the performance is closer to that of the 5850. Finally a worthy candidate for a fanless 4850 replacement.

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 Post subject: Re: Radeon HD 6xxx
PostPosted: Fri Oct 22, 2010 7:04 am 
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Modo wrote:
alecmg wrote:
Overall not much is gained in power efficiency. Same 40nm TSMC manufacturing process, a bit smaller die, expected result. Idle clocks for both new cards 100MHz core and 300MHz memory and idle consumption on par with 5770.

What do you mean "not much gained"? The power consumption of the 6850 is nearly identical to that of the 5770 while the performance is closer to that of the 5850. Finally a worthy candidate for a fanless 4850 replacement.


Code:
The TDP is reference design TDP values from AMD.
Different non-reference board designs from vendors may lead to slight variations in actual TDP.

Card Load Idle GFLOPS
5670  64W 15W    620
5750  86W 16W   1008
5770 108W 18W   1360

6670  63W  8W   1152
6850 127W 15W   1488
6870 151W 19W   2016


Not much gained as in going from the 5770 which no ODM sells as a fanless card in the US the 6850 has a higher TDP. For those of us in the US or those in hot environments or any risk adverse buyer we want a card under 100W TDP, preferably right near the 75W line so a fanless "green" version can be made with higher quality components and be run without the PEG power connector from the PSU. That leaves us ignoring the new 6xxx cards right now and still focusing on the 5750.

Now if the Wikipedia article is correct it looks like the 6670 will be faster than the 5750 though if that is the case I wonder why it doesn't have a 67xx name. Whatever they decide to call it if it has the performance of a 5750 with the power draw of a 5670 as suggested by those numbers it will be the ultimate performance/power quiet video card.

I'll paste in a quote from another thread to support the fanless 5770 isn't available line of thought
dhanson865 wrote:
flemeister wrote:


First off I can't buy that card in the US. A google price search including the terms "Gigabyte Radeon HD 5770 Silent Cell" doesn't show it on any site that doesn't list the price in Euros.

If I search for the part number I get 3 US sites that don't have it in stock all of which call it "HD 5770 1GB Silent RTL" whatever RTL stands for (one of which shows a picture of a card with fan) so I'm not sure I'm getting a valid search by part number.


Second you do have to admit they really push the boundaries on that card

* replaced two DVI connectors with one DUAL link DVI connector
* Heatsink protrudes into space where the 2nd DVI connector normally would be
* Heatsink protrudes vertically keeping this card out of some smaller cases due to height.
* Heatsink protrudes length wise keeping this card out of some smaller cases due to length.

In fact in all the searches I've done I still haven't found the measurements of this card. The Gigabyte support download center doesn't have a manual for that card yet. And the specifications page has no physical dimensions.

I give up. It's a interesting paper launch or maybe an interesting Euro only option but I can't find it and I've been searching way too long.


the next reply in that thread mentioned the 5770 silent cell doesn't fit in an Antec Solo.

newegg 5xxx fanless

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