I got my ARM Systems Stealth pre-built kit today

JohnMK · Post by **JohnMK** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 11:26 am

And it is FAWWWWWINE!

And that is all. More to follow, and pictures too.

Hope you don't mind 8.0 megapixels!

PS: Dealing with ARM Systems was SUCH a pleasure. These people are professionals not only in engineering but in customer service. I am not a paid spokesman!

PretzelB · Post by **PretzelB** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 3:21 pm

Looking forward to pictures of the final product.

JohnMK · Post by **JohnMK** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 6:35 pm

So far so good. Except for a not too insignificant click I can't seem to isolate for the moment, the sound from my LCD monitor is almost more significant than that eminating from my computer. Completely honest now, I have a 21.3" Samsung 213T LCD that has a very faint electronic buzz. Never really been noticeable before. Now I guess I'll be on the market for a super silent monitor. We're SPCR's are hard to please, aren't we?

About the click, it seems to be coming from somewhere near the CPU socket area, almost like it's from a diode or capacitor or something. When I stop all the fans, the click persists. I haven't stopped the PSU fan yet but I'm very very sure it's not coming from the PSU fan, or from inside the PSU, since when I put my ear up to the PSU's exhaust the sound seems like it's for sure not coming from within. The click is now THE most annoying audible thing from my PC. Oh well, first things first. Gotta get my OS fully running.

sthayashi · Post by **sthayashi** » Mon Apr 19, 2004 7:59 am

Sounds like coil whine. Do a search on that term. Then cry.

JohnMK · Post by **JohnMK** » Thu Apr 22, 2004 8:37 pm

I found out it's both the front and rear 120mm fans. They produce a horrible and very loud clickety-click, at any voltage. The reason I didn't catch this at first is because I didn't have an easy non-brutal way of stopping them from spinning so I was just playing with the fanmate to change their speeds and the clickety-clack didn't seem to change in character/frequency too much when I did this so I immediately initially ruled out the 120mm's. But in fact it is them. My computer is quieter with the 120mm's unplugged, side off, then with the 120mm's plugged in @ any voltage, fully enclosed. Believe me I'm as shocked as you are.

What do you guys recommend I replace these with? Which fan actually works well at the voltages we folk like to use? Money is no object.

sthayashi · Post by **sthayashi** » Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:29 pm

There's a huge debate in the Fans forum on that topic.

If I had to choose, it would be one of the following three:
-Pabst 4412FGL
-Evercool Aluminum
-Nexus 120mm (normally volted).

I'd be a little cautious with the Pabsts, because I've heard complaints of ticking. The Nexus runs a lot slower than the others and generally doesn't need to be undervolted as much.

I don't know if Noiseblocker is still selling their fans, but you could also look into one of those, since I've heard good things about their products as well.

wumpus · Post by **wumpus** » Thu Apr 22, 2004 10:52 pm

DEFINITELY evercool aluminum. I haven't heard 'em all, granted, but I've owned least 5 different brands of 120mm, and these are the only ones I have that produce zero mechanical noise at any RPM.

I can't comment on the others, but I had a disturbingly bad experience with a 60mm papst, enough to turn me off the brand entirely. And I've heard enough papst clicking stories by now that I don't think I'll risk owning any more.

Just be prepared to undervolt/fanmate the Evercool 120mm aluminum fans. They do have a relatively high default RPM by the standards of the "if I can still see the fan blades moving, it's way too fast" silence freaks around here

JohnMK · Post by **JohnMK** » Wed May 05, 2004 5:41 pm

To make a long story short I decided to buy Papst 4412F/2GL (the ones with the three-pin power connector w/ RPM monitoring). While they're significantly better than what came with the case, the front Papst especially creates a sort of low muffled wobbling noise. I wouldn't describe it as a tick. Right now the most annoying sound from my case is the Zalman 7000 CNPS 7000 Al-Cu fan @ 5 volts. It has a sort of mechanical noise that seems to resonate at about 5Hz.

I don't know quite what I'll do next. I'm a little bit discouraged that producing a truly silent PC is so difficult.

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Thu May 06, 2004 6:39 am

JohnMK wrote:To make a long story short I decided to buy Papst 4412F/2GL (the ones with the three-pin power connector w/ RPM monitoring). While they're significantly better than what came with the case, the front Papst especially creates a sort of low muffled wobbling noise. I wouldn't describe it as a tick.

Have you tried running w/o the front fan? Those 4552's are one of the best ventilated cases that there are and you may very well not need a fan right up front, closest to your ears. Monitor your temps (including your HDD temps) with and without the front fan and see if you can live w/o it.

JohnMK wrote:Right now the most annoying sound from my case is the Zalman 7000 CNPS 7000 Al-Cu fan @ 5 volts. It has a sort of mechanical noise that seems to resonate at about 5Hz.

I don't know quite what I'll do next. I'm a little bit discouraged that producing a truly silent PC is so difficult.

I've heard that on the occasional Z-7000, and I think other here have too. There's a couple of threads showing how you can disconnect the Zalman fan fron the heatsink and remount it using some type of isolation material. You should look into that. Use the search. These threads have pictures in them to help you visualize things.

newtonoise · Post by **newtonoise** » Thu May 06, 2004 8:54 am

I'd like to see some pics as well when you have everything all set up. This is the foundation kit right?

Maybe an ARM representative can shed some light on the clicking issue?

dac10012 · Post by **dac10012** » Sun Aug 01, 2004 9:11 pm

Here I was all set to buy one of these (dare I say "pricey"?) systems and now you're making me think twice. I hope they fixed this problem because I can't imagine they put all that high tech effort in quieting the PSU, CPU and video card coolers, case, etc. and goofed on something as obvious as case fans?! In fact, I'm going to ask ARM directly, not sure why you haven't. Why didn't you ask them to replace the fans?

MonsterMac · Post by **MonsterMac** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 7:03 am

dac10112 - You can't win 'em all. I think he should talk to ARM about it, let them know what is going on, but acoustics is a tough thing to ask for an RMA for. Granted ARM builds their systems with acoustics in mind, everyone has a different idea of what is an acceptable noise, or what an acceptable noise level is. And for the most part, decent 120mm fans aren't that expensive, so it's not a huge deal.

JohnMK - I'd go with some thermally controlled globes, they're cheap and effective. I have a bad evercool aluminum fan (ticks at low voltages) which is why i'd shy away from those. www.mnpctech.com carries the globe fans for 9 bucks if you're interested.

dac10012 · Post by **dac10012** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 7:43 am

I mounted my case fans with thick rubber washers to absorb vibration. I'm curious whether ARM does this and if they didn't, have you tried it? It seems to me if they're still noisy, they're obviously not quiet fans.

MonsterMac · Post by **MonsterMac** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:37 am

dac10012 - i don't think that unless you have a sample of the fan yourself, you can really say whether it is quiet or not.

Stevo@ARM · Post by **Stevo@ARM** » Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:04 pm

Hey guys,

At ARM we have all been very busy in lately filling customer orders and designing new products, and though try as I might, sometimes I don't see all the threads on SPCR regarding our products.

That said, JohnMK please give us a call so we can work with you on your issue regarding the fans.

Our DIY Stealth Kits and Systems have extremely low noise levels, and what you are describing does not sound normal to me. Sometimes a fan can be excessively noisey right out of the box even though it spins and otherwise functions as it should. I have seen posts by MikeC (and others similar to his) where he said that he has gotten batches of fans that are known and proven quiet models, but some of them will make excessive noise even though they are the exact same make and model.

This may be the case in your DIY kit, which is the exception, definitely not the norm. And while each person's hearing may differ, and all fans make some noise, we certainly do not want our customers to have to live with a truly defective fan.

So please give us a call at 800.276.9450 and ask for either Steve x107 or Roy x106 so we work with you to see if there is any way that we can help out and ensure that you are a satisfied ARM customer.

Also, for everyone reading this thread who may be considering one of our StealthPC systems, please see this SPCR forum link where SPCR reader ChrisM asks about us and three SPCR regulars, who are also ARM StealthPC customers, have replied with their own individual experiences:

http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=14020

Cheers,
Stevo

JohnMK · Post by **JohnMK** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 11:53 am

Hi Stevo,

I am a satisfied customer, your kit was perfect except for the fans, which I have since replaced with Globe fans that are utterly perfect. If I could make a suggestion -- use Globe fans.

Do your research first but perhaps and hopefully they're one of those "consistently good" fans.

Thank you.

silverback · Post by **silverback** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 4:18 am

Which case do they send with the foundation kit. All black or black with grey trim. Just curious. Any pics available?

rfinney · Post by **rfinney** » Sat Jan 01, 2005 1:59 pm

John,

I would really like to know exactly what Globe fans worked for you. Thanks in advance for any info.

JohnMK · Post by **JohnMK** » Mon Jan 03, 2005 3:59 pm

http://www.mnpctech.com/Globe.html

Case: Black/Black.

JohnMK · Post by **JohnMK** » Mon Jan 03, 2005 4:01 pm

In retrospect I have determined the fans weren't the issue. Rather, the motherboard's (Intel D875PBZ) PWM was attrocious. If you can adjust your fan regulation to DC from PWM in your BIOS, as I can with my new Asus 925XE chipset motherboard, then none of this will be an issue for you. If you cannot, then simply power the fans directly off your power supply.

rfinney · Post by **rfinney** » Mon Jan 03, 2005 4:08 pm

Thanks for the info - I will see what I can do!

I got my ARM Systems Stealth pre-built kit today

I got my ARM Systems Stealth pre-built kit today

Silent PC with noisy case fans (no brainer?)

Quiet case fans