My difficult system

[Jekteir]

Hi, I was hoping someone could suggest what my next step might be in quieting my system. I built it for power about a year ago, and it was loud once I built it, but I now need to do some serious studio recording with it - in the same room as what I'm recording - and so really need it to be as quiet as possible. It was humming and getting on the mics recently.

My original computer setup:

- P4 3.0Ghz CPU with standard heatsink + fan
- Lian Li P61 case (black) with 4 90mm-ish case fans (2 front-bottom [in], 1 back-top [out], 1 on the top of the case [out]).
- Q-Tec 3-fan gold-plated 650W-rated PSU
- ASUS P4C800-E Deluxe motherboard with default-heatsinked northbridge
- ASUS V9999 'Gamer Edition' GeForce 6800 256mb graphics card with default cooling (blue-LED-lit fan + heatsinky-type protrusions)
- 2 DVD drives
- 2 SATA150 hard drives (1 maxtor, 1 seagate, both 300GB)
- 2 524MB DDR400 RAM DIMMs - dual speed


Think that covers it.

So, at first I thought it was the Q-Tec 3-fan 650W (supposedly) PSU that was starting to whine, because when I covered up the back of it with my hand, the whine was muted. And maybe it was that, in part.

So I bought the Antec Phantom 500 PSU and installed it today, along with a Belkin round cable for my DVD drives to make airflow easier.

Well, the sound may have gone down a little, but with the extra heat from the new PSU being radiated into the case, my CPU fan sometimes goes on crazy mode and whirs up to 5000RPM and gets whiny. It's like 80mm or something - whatever the P4 default is.

I also took out the top-of-the-case fan because it was blocking the Antec PSU. That didn't make much difference.

I have since been experimenting with stopping fans to check the sound, and discovered that my GPU fan on the V9999GE is pretty loud even when idle just running the OS. I think it's at least as loud as the CPU.

I was going to get a ThermalRight XP-120, but compatibility suggests I will need to bend a couple of capacitors to get it to fit into the P4C800-E Deluxe. Is that a very bad idea? I was going to get a Nexus 120mm fan for it and some Artic Silver Ceramique.

Alternatively I could get the XP-90, which would fit, but which I believes offers a lot less cooling with the smaller fan (and the fan is louder per CFM?). When it gets hot in there, after all, the CPU fan does become very loud.

Is it possible to take off the fan and stuff from the V9999 and replace that with a heatsink/fan/whatever that is a lot quieter but cools as well?

Should I consider the V9999 first or the stock P4? Also, that back case fan makes a fair noise... I don't know if a new one is a good idea or not. That is 90mm or so as well.

Any tips on whether the XP-120 will screw my system, and what my priority should be for keeping my system quiet and cool (GPU? CPU? Case fan?), would be very great appreciated. And apologies for the long post!

Jek

[Jekteir]

A bit of extra info, the case fans in there now all appear to be Adda fans, 80x80x25, which are rated at 22db/A, 26.2 CFM. The one I removed from the top was that, anyway, and the others seem to be the same size, though I can't see the labels.

[Jekteir]

And another point... I just removed the fan on the back and that is a different model number...I think it may be more like 38.6CFM and 26.6db/A.

[CoolGav]

P4 3.0Ghz CPU with standard heatsink + fan

OK, I'd suggest looking at the Scythe Ninja or Zalmas offersings as well as the XP120. Plenty of info on this site anf forums... I have the Ninja on my P4 2.53, with an undervolted, quiet 120mm fan

Lian Li P61 case (black) with 4 90mm-ish case fans (2 front-bottom [in], 1 back-top [out], 1 on the top of the case [out]).

I have a similar PC-7, which is pretty quiet. Of the 4 fans I only have the rear working. And that's a quiet 80mm I picked up from QuietPC, undervolted of course!

Q-Tec 3-fan gold-plated 650W-rated PSU

Glad you've changed this already. If you find the passive is making things too hot then look at the Seasonic S-12 series. My Lian Li PC-7 has a 350W version, and it made a big difference over the previous Antec TruePower 330W (a few years old, which seemed quiet when I first got it!)

ASUS P4C800-E Deluxe motherboard with default-heatsinked northbridge

I don't know about this board and don't feel like looking it up. If there's a fan on the northbridge, then Zalman it. As in get a Zalman passive one and swap.

ASUS V9999 'Gamer Edition' GeForce 6800 256mb graphics card with default cooling (blue-LED-lit fan + heatsinky-type protrusions)

Again, I know little about this card, I stick with Matrox passive cards more or less.

2 DVD drives

Why 2? Increase in power conspumption and noise if discs inserted and spinning.

2 SATA150 hard drives (1 maxtor, 1 seagate, both 300GB)

I (like many around here) go with Samsung drives. Mine are usually suspended, sometimes enclosed, and my Audio-Visual Workstation (in the Lian Li PC-7) uses a 5400rpm Samsung laptop drive suspended.

2 524MB DDR400 RAM DIMMs - dual speed

Do you mean 2x 512MB? Should be quiet!

[Jekteir]

CoolGav,

Thanks for your comments and suggestions.

About undervolting fans, I'm not really sure how to do that. I have a fan controller switch at the front of my case that lets me put the bottom two fans in lo, mid and hi mode, and that works fine - those two are always quiet anyway. The exhaust fan and CPU fan are powered straight from the motherboard. There is an ASUS BIOS option called 'Q-Fan' that seems to be related to CPU fan speed...If you have it enabled, it gives you an option for some sort of ratio that's right now on 15/16. But I think I just disabled it again. I thought the fan was maybe getting louder with it on.

From the mobo (P4C800-E Deluxe) manual:

"Q-Fan Control [Disabled]

This item allows you to enable or disable the ASUS Q-Fan feature that smartly adjusts the fan speeds for more efficient system operation. When this field is set to [Enabled], the Fan Speed Ratio item appears to allow selection of the appropriate fan speed ratio. Configuration options: [Disabled][Enabled]

Fan Speed Ratio [11/16]

This item allows you to select the appropriate fan speed ratio for the system. The default [11/16] is the minimum fan speed ratio. Select a higher ratio if you installed additional devices and the system requires more ventilation. Configuration options: [11/16][12/16][13/16][14/16][15/16]"

When I had it set to Enabled, I had it on 15/16, so I'll set that back to 11/16 too.

http://darkblade.ath.cx/casein-net.jpg

EDIT BY ADMIN -- IMAGE LINKED RATHER THAN DISPLaYED; IT IS TOO BIG! SEE POSTING RULES.

- That's a picture of the box...sorry about the poor quality, that's the best digicam I have right now. As you can see, the graphics card also pretty much blocks airflow from the front-bottom fans.

There is no fan on the northbridge, only a heatsink, so I guess that's OK.

Again, I know little about this card, I stick with Matrox passive cards more or less.

I gotta say, I'm not planning on shelling out the cost of another graphics card of this quality again: so can anyone tell me if there's any way of replacing the fan with a heatsink or heatsink/fan combination?

DVD drives: originally I wanted to be able to copy directly between them. But maybe you're right, maybe I should take out the ASUS DVD-ROM and just keep the NEC DVD-RW (dual layer).

Yeah, sorry, 2x512MB RAM. As for the hard drives, I don't think I can hear them, so I imagine if I can quiet the graphics card and CPU, it won't be too much of an issue.


So, yeah: could you please tell me if and how I can undervolt these fans? Can anyone say if I can safely mod this GPU cooling? The Ninja sounds good, and I can always get a 120mm fan for it if necessary... How would I undervolt this? But, having stopped the GPU fan and compared the noise without it running, I think it's pretty important I find another cooling method for that too.

Thanks a lot for all your help. Any more would be wonderful!

Jek

[stromgald]

First of all, you should enable the ASUS Q-Fan feature in the BIOS and set it to [11/16]. It will control the fan speed of both the CPU and exhaust fans. If those fans are still loud, replace them with 92mm Nexus fans. For the GPU, I would recommend getting a Zalman VF700Cu or one of the passive Zalmans for GPUs such as the ZM80D-HP. For the CPU, any of CoolGav's recommendations would work. Personally, I would get the SI-120 (a version of the XP-120 designed for better compatibility) with a 120mm Nexus or low-speed Yate Loon. For a cheaper solution, the Zalman 7000AlCu and 7700AlCu are also good options, but your CPU will most likely run a little hotter, and it'll be a little noisier.

[MikeC]

So, yeah: could you please tell me if and how I can undervolt these fans? Can anyone say if I can safely mod this GPU cooling? The Ninja sounds good, and I can always get a 120mm fan for it if necessary... How would I undervolt this? But, having stopped the GPU fan and compared the noise without it running, I think it's pretty important I find another cooling method for that too.

You've done the most important part, it seems, which is to identify your noise sources.
Now spend some time in the Recommended Section, reading and studying all articles relevant to you.

[Jekteir]

Well, I've been looking at the Arctic Cooling NV Silencer 5, which seems compatible with the ASUS V9999 GeForce 6800 GE. But I don't understand how it exhausts the air out of the case. The aperture for the card is blocked by the graphical outputs. Does it use the next-over PCI aperture? Or does that thin-looking black rubber tube exhaust the air? - Does one need to plug that into a hole somewhere? I have been looking at the images on Arctic's site ( http://www.arctic-cooling.com/vga2.php? ... ta=4&disc= ) and have not been able to figure it out.

If I get a Zalman Fanmate, as this review recommends ( http://www.silentpcreview.com/article199-page1.html ), where do I attach that to, and is it autoregulated? Also, would the Arctic Cooling NV Silencer 5 be powered by some socket on the graphics card?

Thanks again for all your help,

Jek

[thetoad30]

I personally recommend that you get the Zalman VF700CU, the Scythe Ninja, and do something with that Northbridge heatsink. I would take it off, and scrub off the pink crap Asus puts on it, and reapply with either the AS Ceramique or the Silver 5. I personally use the silver as I don't have to worry about repleated applications like reviewers do, and I like to squeeze every degree I can out of my system as I tend to do some light overclocking on my CPU and have a very heavy overclock on my graphics card (I have the new GTO2 modded to 16 pipes and 575/590 speeds. Lets just say it pulls 150+ watts when its in heavy use; I measured it). So I need very good cooling.

That's why I use the Ninja. I find that I can run with only 2 Nexus Case fans in the P180, with the top spoiler fan as intake and the rear one as out.

As for the VF700CU, I can tell you that when its on full, it can be heard, but not like any video card fan I have ever heard. When on the low setting, to me its inaudible.

Do yourself a favor and get new, current revision hard drives. My 250 GB WD are the type that don't have the fluid bearings, and I swear to god those things are going to whine my ear off. I almost never leave the front door to the case open because of it. I did just get a 320 GB WD hard drive, and I can tell you that I can't hear that thing. If only I had 4 more for my setup... and 600 bucks for them!!!

As for the Seasonic, I can tell you that an S12-anything will be perfect for you. My 500W never increases fan speed even with the graphics card and hard drives at full, but then again I don't have the PSU above the CPU like you do.

Just some ideas I guess.

[MikeC]

Well, I've been looking at the Arctic Cooling NV Silencer 5, which seems compatible with the ASUS V9999 GeForce 6800 GE. But I don't understand how it exhausts the air out of the case. The aperture for the card is blocked by the graphical outputs. Does it use the next-over PCI aperture? Or does that thin-looking black rubber tube exhaust the air? - Does one need to plug that into a hole somewhere? I have been looking at the images on Arctic's site ( http://www.arctic-cooling.com/vga2.php? ... ta=4&disc= ) and have not been able to figure it out.

If I get a Zalman Fanmate, as this review recommends ( http://www.silentpcreview.com/article199-page1.html ), where do I attach that to, and is it autoregulated? Also, would the Arctic Cooling NV Silencer 5 be powered by some socket on the graphics card?

Thanks again for all your help,

Jek

You strayed too far from SPCR

The info is here in this review. in pics, etc:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article197-page2.html
The AC VGA silencers do need 2 slots -- the next one down is used for exhaust. It does help increase airflow through the case.

[Jekteir]

Thank you for the suggestions, all. My current thinking is:

XP-120 is a danger due to not quite fitting.
XP-90 is smaller, so less cooling with a louder fan.

The Scythe Ninja is pretty highly recommended by SPCR, and looks good, but I can't tell where the fan would be attached, and I believe that has to be a 90mm fan.

SI-120 is looking quite good now. 120mm fan, admittedly not blowing toward the case's exhaust fan...

Zalman VF700-CU looks good, but it seems to just blow the air around the case.

Now that I understand how the NV Silencer 5 exhausts air (with a plastic duct to the next PCI slot), that looks pretty darn appealing. I would love to try a totally passive solution, but I think that might be too much heat in my case.

As I understand it, I could get an SI-120, get a Nexus 120mm for the top, and even get a Zalman connector from the mobo to that fan to cut down the speed using the built-in resistor. Get a Silencer 5 and stick it on my GPU.

Is Arctic Silver better at cooling than Arctic Ceramique, then? I saw Ceramique taken as a given in a couple of reviews.

I will turn on Q-Fan again pronto. I guess that with it disabled, they're running full-speed. I guess I could work on the northbridge...


Jek

[thetoad30]

The Scythe Ninja is the best CPU heatsink to date that SPCR has reviewed. It does better both passively and non-passively than the XP-120. Don't get me wrong, I still use my XP-120 in my server, and it does an excellent job. But the Ninja is much better, and the Ninja DOES take a 120mm fan, NOT a 92mm.

Ceramique was used by the reviewers because it takes less finesse than silver. Silver is a little more "dirty" in terms of cleanup and getting it on yourself, and it takes a little more skill to appy in terms of you have to be very careful not to get any on any contacts or PCB terminal connections, otherwise it could lead to problems.

If you goup on Ceramique (note, you aren't supposed to do that, but in case you did) it is more forgiving than the AS5.

Technically speaking, though, the AS5 is the flagship product and is the "best" that AS sells in terms of pure heat transfer.

Personally for you, I really would recommend getting yourself the Ninja and the Zalman.

Yes, the Zalman may "blow" the heat around the case, but really if you have descent outflow you should be fine. It won't cause the inside of your case to heat up as long as it's keeping the card cool, which is the whole point. If you were to use your argument about blowing heat around, that's something that a downward mounted heatsink fan that the XP-120 does perfectly; you notice that as a lower northbridge temp.

[Jekteir]

Well, you've convinced me about the Ninja.

As for the Zalman... Maybe, I guess; it just doesn't look as integrated or effective as the Silencer, and it doesn't exhaust the hot air. Is there a reason to pick the Zalman over the Silencer?

Thanks,

Jek

[thetoad30]

1 reason.

Noise.

The Zalman will have the same performance as the Silencer, and from what I have read on the forums, will be a lot less noisy.

That is the reason you are here on SPCR, right?

[Jekteir]

Definitely ;) Clearly I'll have to do a little more reading on the Zalman vs. Silencer.

Jek