Cooling dilemma

CGameProgrammer · Post by **CGameProgrammer** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 10:21 am

I recently built a new system to replace my old one. The old one's noise-relevant specs were:

Case: Antec SLK3000B
Motherboard: Gigabyte nForce4 with stock fanless NB heatsink
CPU: Athlon 3500 with Freezer 64 cooler @ 5V
GPU: Gigabyte 6600GT with stock fanless heatpipe
HDD: Samsung P80 in SmartDrive enclosure
PSU: Seasonic S12-430
Fans: 2x Nexus 120mm @ 5V (one exhaust, one blowing against the GPU & NB)

I replaced the case, motherboard, and GPU. I now have:

Case: Antec P150
Motherboard: Asus nForce4 with stock fanless NB heatpipe
CPU: Athlon 3500 with Freezer 64 cooler with fan removed
GPU: Asus 7800GT with stock fanless heatpipe
HDD: Samsung P80 not in the enclosure anymore
PSU: Seasonic S12-430
Fans: 1x Nexus 120mm @ 9V? for exhaust

So right now there's just a single fan besides the PSU. This was done only because my two Nexus 92mm intake fans will arrive later today, but the Freezer 64's fan had to be removed to allow for the 7800GT's hinged heatpipe to be put in its raised position. However I *might* be able to add the fan back if I remove some of the mount's plastic.

Anyway when the fan was at 11V, the CPU idled at 44, motherboard at 37, and 7800GT at 55. Watching DVDs for a while raises the temperatures by 3, 1, and 1, respectively. I played the Serious Sam 2 demo for about 10 minutes and when I was done, the temperatures were 63, 38, and 83. Obviously that's bad, but I hope it'll be more reasonable when my intake fans get here.

I adjusted my Fanmate to bring the exhaust fan down to half volume, so possibly 9V or so at a guess, and the idles are now 47, 38, and 56. DVDs again only raise temperatures by 3/1/1.

Temperatures were measured by BIOS (CPU & MB) and nVidia's GPU utility.

I'll update when I get my intake fans, but obviously it's a bit tricky trying to cool the system without my CPU cooler's fan. In order to maximize the effect the intake fans might have, I installed the HDD on the bottom-most set of rubber bands and removed all the other sleds and bands from the HDD tray, so the air won't be restricted at all when going to the CPU/GPU area.

Anyway I posted this partly to show that a Freezer 64, which is smallish, cools adequately even without a fan and with a single exhaust fan in the entire system, and the 7800GT's passive cooling is impressive, considering the circumstances. And my screen is 1920x1200.

Anyway, this is "System Advice". So, does anyone have ideas for a better heatsink? It can't be any taller than the Freezer 64 because the GPU's heatpipe is about 2mm away from the heatsink. And if it has a fan, the fan has to be in front of the heatsink, facing the rear of the case, in order to fit. (The Freezer 64's is below, facing up, and it stuck out too much anyway.)

Aris · Post by **Aris** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 10:38 am

63,38,83 sounds ok to me. amd TMD is (i think) 90-95c, and ive heard manufacturers say vga cards can withstand over 100c temps, and your no where near either of those.

from the review ive seen of that case, the intake fans dont really drop temps much, they just give you more directed airflow over the harddrives. so as long as your hard drive temps are good then i doubt the intake fans will help your temps much, if at all.

the hight of that CPU cooler is 120mm. You could fit a Thermalright XP-120 or Si-120 with a 120x25mm fan on it. It would be able to activly cool both the cpu and the vga card heatsink over the fan.

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if you are really worried about the temps, id say get the xp-120, put a 120mm fan on it and 7v it. and then just use the single 120mm exhaust fan @ 7v along with the psu fan like you have it setup currently.

CGameProgrammer · Post by **CGameProgrammer** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 10:53 am

I'd consider 63/83 acceptable load temperatures, but they got to that point just from 10 minutes of playing a game, and that was with the exhaust fan at 11V, which is loud.

The XP120 did occur to me, but it's wide. My motherboard positions the CPU near the top, and the P150 positions the PSU just above the motherboard, so the heatsink can't stick out at all, and the GPU is very nearby as well. If it fits, it would have the advantage of probably helping to cool the VGA heatpipe, which would hover directly over the fan. Of course that means hot VGA air will be used to cool the CPU but it'll probably be fine.

Aris · Post by **Aris** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:13 am

Ive seen that cooler fit on motherboards who's sockets are alot closer to the edge than that. I think it would fit. That board is on thermalright's Compatability list for the xp-120 and doesnt specify any comments for it to fit.

dfrost · Post by **dfrost** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:44 am

My motherboard positions the CPU near the top, and the P150 positions the PSU just above the motherboard, so the heatsink can't stick out at all, and the GPU is very nearby as well.

Here's how an XP-120 fits in my Sonata system with similarly close PSU and and GPU one slot lower. Note that there is still plenty of clearance to the GPU, even with the very large VM-101 in between.

For reference and comparison to the Asus NF4, here's my motherboard layout.

The XP120...the advantage of probably helping to cool the VGA heatpipe, which would hover directly over the fan. Of course that means hot VGA air will be used to cool the CPU but it'll probably be fine.

If the XP-120 fan was configured in "suck" mode, then it would be using hot CPU air to cool the VGA, which might be even better with a high performance VGA card that runs hotter then an XP-120-cooled CPU.

Tibors · Post by **Tibors** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:06 pm

How much space is there between the Freezer 64 and the drive cages? I've seen people in these forums suspending fans, with clothing elastic or bungee cords, to cool northbridges or video cards. If you did that with a fan blowing to the side of your Freezer 64, it will probably be enough. It is a lot cheaper than buying a new heatsink too.

The XP-120 including the fan mounting clips is 130mm wide and centered over the mounting bracket. So you can just measure if it fits.

CGameProgrammer · Post by **CGameProgrammer** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 1:19 pm

I'm thinking it'll be wisest to buy a HSF in which the fan blows away from the motherboard, since that will cool both the CPU and the GPU rather elegantly. I'll take pictures tonight showing the GPU placement.

sanse · Post by **sanse** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 2:30 pm

CGameProgrammer wrote: Anyway, this is "System Advice". So, does anyone have ideas for a better heatsink? It can't be any taller than the Freezer 64 because the GPU's heatpipe is about 2mm away from the heatsink. And if it has a fan, the fan has to be in front of the heatsink, facing the rear of the case, in order to fit. (The Freezer 64's is below, facing up, and it stuck out too much anyway.)

maybe you could solve your needs with a thermaltake sonic tower. it's huge, but should fit perfectly on an asus nforce4 mobo. it can be mounted in the right direction to the rear exhaust fan. and you can mount a 120 fan mm inside it giving the cooler very good performance. mounting a thermalright heatsink disturbs the airflow, cause the fan on it is in the wrong direction. it constantly has to 'battle' with the rear exhaust fan to get some air. with a 'midship' fan in the sonic tower the airflow is much more smooth and easy. just like in the torrid thailand pc mikec sent to his friend in asia.

dfrost · Post by **dfrost** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 10:46 pm

mounting a thermalright heatsink disturbs the airflow, cause the fan on it is in the wrong direction. it constantly has to 'battle' with the rear exhaust fan to get some air.

That's why I prefer the XP-120 fan pulling air from the CPU ("suck" mode). That way it seems like it is actually supplying air to the exhaust, and with my S12, PSU fans.

The many tests I've done with fan direction give nearly identical CPU temperatures, while PWM and NB temps are about equal in suck mode and slightly higher then the CPU. When in blow mode, the NB temp (measured with an IF thermometer) is 7C lower and the PWM temp (using the MB sensor) is 7C higher. Case temp is unaffected. Load-variable fans (Papst on XP-120, Nexus 120mm exhaust and S12-430's Yate Loon) ramp up similarly regardless of Papst direction, and stay pretty quiet.

I've never tried a tower HS because of those hot MB components that need airflow on this board.

CGameProgrammer · Post by **CGameProgrammer** » Wed Feb 01, 2006 11:02 pm

I chose the Coolermaster Hyper 48, which I'll put one of my Nexus 92mm fans on. It's similar to the XP-90 but it's supposed to be easier to install, which I like, and it'll blow air away from the motherboard, cooling both the CPU (suck) and GPU (blow) so it should work rather well. I'll see when it gets here next week.

sanse · Post by **sanse** » Fri Feb 03, 2006 5:20 am

dfrost wrote:I've never tried a tower HS because of those hot MB components that need airflow on this board.

on this site [http://www.fan-x.de/testkcpu001_1.htm] a thermaltake sonic tower is tested and compared to other heatsinks including the thermalright xp-120.

it's doing pretty good; also in keeping the mosfets cool.

Felger Carbon · Post by **Felger Carbon** » Fri Feb 03, 2006 10:31 pm

Tibors wrote:How much space is there between the Freezer 64 and the drive cages? I've seen people in these forums suspending fans, with clothing elastic or bungee cords, to cool northbridges or video cards. If you did that with a fan blowing to the side of your Freezer 64, it will probably be enough. It is a lot cheaper than buying a new heatsink too.

I agree with Tibors. If you're getting adequate cooling fanless, then hang a fan on the Freezer blowing toward the chassis exhaust fan, not toward the PSU. An 80mm fan will work fine, and there's lots of cheap quiet 80mm fans out there (esp if you use a fan controller). Not only a lot cheaper than buying a new HS and a new (92 or 120) fan, but you'll have the DIY satisfaction of putting something personal into your computer.

The new 80mm Global Win ceramic bearing fan at CoolerGuys works fine, and has a projected life of 80,000 hours!

Cooling dilemma

Cooling dilemma

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