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 Post subject: showing my computer, any advices?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 9:44 pm 
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I am pretty satisfied with the current configuration, but I could get some ideas from you on how to improve the silence in my computer. :)

http://www.lacomunitat.net/ma/DSCN7861p.jpg
http://www.lacomunitat.net/ma/DSCN7863cp.jpg

currently, air enters the case for the 3.5 floppy hole (you can feel the air getting in) and leaves the case only for the Forton Aurora PSU 120mm fan, other back case holes are covered.

[url=http://www.lacomunitat.net/ma/DSCN7865.JPG]
Image[/url]

my temps right now that we are entering the winter are:

case: 28ºC
system: 41ºC
cpu: 44ºC
hdd: 35ºC

at summer it gets to cpu: 48ºC case 32ºC

with both fans set at min speed (zalman being 1366rpm, the psu fan is manual)

mobo is an abit nf7s, heatsink: zalman 6000CU, cpu: amd barton 2800+, hdd segate sata 200GB, psu: forton aurora, graphics: matrox G450


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2004 3:06 am 
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  • Is that the standard Zalman fan that came with the 6000 cpu cooler? If so you could swap it for a quieter model, e.g. a Nexus
  • Get the cpu fan more "in line" with the airflow direction (front to back)
  • Do something to block the direct noisepath from the inside (especially the harddisk) to the outside... an idea would be to raise the case (casters or something), make holes in the bottom, suspend the harddisk lower in your case and close up the front. Looks better too 8)
  • close up holes in your case to have better control of where the airflow goes. Right now your setup is somewhere between "streaming" and "breathing" (*)
(*): terms I picked up in another thread; the distinction is between a controlled airflow direction (streaming) and lots of holes to allow air to flow in as needed (breathing).

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II: A64 3000+, Ninja, DFI nForce3, headless, Samsung disks suspended, Enermax Pro82+ 385W, Antec 3000B padded & dampened, 2x Nexus 120 B&W


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2004 11:18 pm 
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Location: Barcelona
teejay wrote:
Is that the standard Zalman fan that came with the 6000 cpu cooler? If so you could swap it for a quieter model, e.g. a Nexus

ok, that's easy, but will only do that if that fan is the noisest of the system.

teejay wrote:
Get the cpu fan more "in line" with the airflow direction (front to back)

I don't understand that, curently the cpu fan is directly above the heatsink, shouldn't it be like that?

teejay wrote:
Do something to block the direct noisepath from the inside (especially the harddisk) to the outside... an idea would be to raise the case (casters or something), make holes in the bottom, suspend the harddisk lower in your case and close up the front. Looks better too 8)

I don't understand neither. Are you suggesting that the hdd shouldn't have the air intake next to it? because the air is cools it.
teejay wrote:
close up holes in your case to have better control of where the airflow goes. Right now your setup is somewhere between "streaming" and "breathing" (*)[/list](*): terms I picked up in another thread; the distinction is between a controlled airflow direction (streaming) and lots of holes to allow air to flow in as needed (breathing).

I said the back case holes are covered, so right now I'd say I have a streaming case: the air gets in at the floppy hole, and leaves for the psu fan, no other hole in the case.

thanks for the suggestions, anyone else? ;)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2004 11:56 pm 
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Quote:
teejay wrote:
Get the cpu fan more "in line" with the airflow direction (front to back)

I don't understand that, curently the cpu fan is directly above the heatsink, shouldn't it be like that?


What he's saying is, with your current setup, air is going in through the floppy hole and immediately being exhausted by the PSU. It's not going anywhere the CPU so the CPU fan is just churning the same air over and over again.

Quote:
teejay wrote:
Do something to block the direct noisepath from the inside (especially the harddisk) to the outside... an idea would be to raise the case (casters or something), make holes in the bottom, suspend the harddisk lower in your case and close up the front. Looks better too Cool

I don't understand neither. Are you suggesting that the hdd shouldn't have the air intake next to it? because the air is cools it.


It should. But your setup also provides a direct escape route for noise. Ideally noise should travel around a few bends before making it out of the case. Teejays suggestion is you intake air from the bottom instead of the floppy so that no front openings are left

Quote:
the air gets in at the floppy hole, and leaves for the psu fan, no other hole in the case.


That it does, but it also doesn't cool anything properly - except the hdd. What you want is air going in in one place, traveling over all the hot components and exiting in one place. Thus the bottom intake suggestion. That would force the air to go over your graphics card, CPU and hard disk before being exhausted - in addition to blocking a direct noise escape path

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 2:19 am 
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burcakb wrote:
But your setup also provides a direct escape route for noise. Ideally noise should travel around a few bends before making it out of the case. Teejays suggestion is you intake air from the bottom instead of the floppy so that no front openings are left

a front vertical opening? or "bottom" like in the floor of the case?

burcakb wrote:
mai9 wrote:
the air gets in at the floppy hole, and leaves for the psu fan, no other hole in the case.

That it does, but it also doesn't cool anything properly - except the hdd. What you want is air going in in one place, traveling over all the hot components and exiting in one place. Thus the bottom intake suggestion. That would force the air to go over your graphics card, CPU and hard disk before being exhausted - in addition to blocking a direct noise escape path


yeah, I understand that with a lower intake the air would go diagonally up to the psu fan, and that air would touch the graphics card, and currently it leaves a bag of air at the bottom of the case, but is it really worth the trouble of making a hand-made hole? The graphics card doesn't even have a fan, it's passive cooled by default.


Maybe I can add two horizontal papers above and below the hdd so the air *really* goes straight from hdd, then cpu and exits with the psu, no air bags then.

psu===========
-------cpu--------hdd
=============

being "=" the paper, and "-" emtpy space


the floppy hole is 28 to 33cm from the floor, the cpu fan is 24 to 33, and the bottom of psu at 36. So I'd say that the intake air passes through the cpu before reaching the psu. Maybe the photo doesn't make justice to these numbers, and I should make better photos ;)


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2004 11:54 am 
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Thanks, Burcakb, you explained everything exactly as I intended them :D
in that post I just jotted down a few remarks that sprang to mind based on the photo and description, in the assumption that others would "add to the list". I usually ramble a bit in my posts my so this time I tried to be brief for a change... ending up needing another member to elaborate :D

I did mean that IMO harddisks need air intake. Opinions vary on this subject though so others might feel different. Taking air in through the bottom of the case (which was what I meant) is just a possible idea, there are others of course. It all depends on what you want to achieve and how much time you want to spend achieving it. I am by no means suggesting that this is the only way to achieve any improvement and it does involve some work. To me, the biggest issue seems to be the fact that noise from the harddrive can directly exit the case. To find out if this is something to change, try to plug the hole with foam or something (just for a few minutes) and see if that improves anything.

I've seen the same cpu fan mount position on 6000's over and over. All it does in this way is disrupt airflow through the case and blow warm air over the heatsink, just like burcakb wrote. Don't get me wrong: it will cool the heatsink, since that will still be hotter than the air that gets blown over it, the cooling will simply be less efficient. How far is the cpu fan from the side of the case anyway? To close and the air impedance will cause the fan to become noisier.

What I meant by getting the cpu fan more "inline" (for lack of a better word) is something like this:
Code:
 PSU     |                                 (case)|
         |                                       |     ## : fan
######## |                                       |
########-+                                       |   /\ < : airflow
   /\                                            |
        ===      #                               |    === : cpu heatsink
        ===      #                           < < 
   /\   ===      #           +----------------+
        h/s      #     < <   |      HDD       |
        ===      #           +----------------+
        ===      #                           < < 
        ===      #                               |
                                                 |

I don't know if that explains it better... I meant it as a simple "you could try this without modding" means to improve cpu cooling. It will not help with the previous bit about the hard disk noise though.

By closing of the section you could get even better cooling results for your harddisk/cpu, but you should take care with the rest of the components. Depending on your motherboard (northbridge esp.) and video card, they might like some airflow over them even if they are passively cooled. Still won't help with hdd noise... but I'l stop repeating myself. If the harddisk noise is an issue, you could try a Bluefront special: a "bird-house".

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II: A64 3000+, Ninja, DFI nForce3, headless, Samsung disks suspended, Enermax Pro82+ 385W, Antec 3000B padded & dampened, 2x Nexus 120 B&W


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 3:16 am 
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teejay wrote:
I did mean that IMO harddisks need air intake. Opinions vary on this subject though so others might feel different. Taking air in through the bottom of the case (which was what I meant) is just a possible idea, there are others of course. It all depends on what you want to achieve and how much time you want to spend achieving it.

yes, my hdd does have air intake right now, or you do you imply it doesn't?

I don't feel like making a hole at the front bottom of the case :oops:

teejay wrote:
To me, the biggest issue seems to be the fact that noise from the harddrive can directly exit the case. To find out if this is something to change, try to plug the hole with foam or something (just for a few minutes) and see if that improves anything.

I'll try that :)

teejay wrote:
I've seen the same cpu fan mount position on 6000's over and over. All it does in this way is disrupt airflow through the case and blow warm air over the heatsink, just like burcakb wrote. Don't get me wrong: it will cool the heatsink, since that will still be hotter than the air that gets blown over it, the cooling will simply be less efficient. How far is the cpu fan from the side of the case anyway? To close and the air impedance will cause the fan to become noisier.

yeah, you've seen it over and over because it's its default position, I'll try it on the side :)

teejay, thanks for your ideas, and the ascii graphic :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:21 am 
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mai9 wrote:
yes, my hdd does have air intake right now, or you do you imply it doesn't?

Nope, I answered a question in your second post in this thread:
mai9 wrote:
Are you suggesting that the hdd shouldn't have the air intake next to it? because the air is cools it.
-----
mai9 wrote:
I don't feel like making a hole at the front bottom of the case

I understand that you don't want to cut up your case, I agree that that is quite a strong measure. What you could try (dunno if this is possible room-wise) is to put your harddisk a bit farther back and put something of a baffle in the direct path to the outside, allowing air in but blocking noise. I'd do another ascii art (gotta love 'em) but I'm at work right now so I don't really have the time.

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II: A64 3000+, Ninja, DFI nForce3, headless, Samsung disks suspended, Enermax Pro82+ 385W, Antec 3000B padded & dampened, 2x Nexus 120 B&W


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