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 Post subject: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:09 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
Hello everybody,

First of all, have a look at my current rig here .

I find HDDs too noisy and the case too big for my tiny room.
I want to change the case for a smaller case ( Mini ITX/Mini DTX like the Lian Li PC-Q08B ) and i will only keep one SSD in my computer ( i will build a NAS later ).

I actually have :

CPU : i5 2500K @ 4.5Ghz (TurboBoost enable)
CPU Fan : Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45
RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 580 with Arctic Cooler
SSD : SSD Vertex Series
Case : Fractal Design R3
PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller


I live in France, which case should i buy ? ( max 140€ ).
What can i keep from my computer and what i will have to buy ?

Thanks in advance.

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 10:46 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:45 am
Posts: 519
Location: 128.0.0.1
If you're going ITX, your biggest problem is the GTX580 with the Accelero Xtreme - a 3-slot-solution, if I'm not mistaken.

There are not many ITX-cases that can take a 3-slot-cards. The only ones that come to my mind are the Lian Li Q11, Q18 and Q25. The Q11 cannot take a card of the length of the 580 and the Q25 is a server-solution. Which leaves the Q18 as the only viable case.

It's a beautiful case, but like all Q-cases by Lian Li it has the disadvantage of hanging the PSU above the mainboard. That limits the size of the CPU-cooler. Options:

1.
Use a low-profile cooler like the Scythe Big Shuriken. Con: won't cool an oc'ed 2500k quietly or very well.

2.
Use a big top-down cooler like the Thermalright AXP-140 and use the PSU-fan as the CPU-fan. This is done here: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=65338
I am sceptical of the longevity of this solution.

3.
Use a closed-loop watercooler like Corsair H60. Con: won't be quiet at all.

4.
Use the Silverstone SST-ST45SF-G PSU, a small form factor PSU and a big top-down-cooler like the AXP-140. Probably the best compromise, but also the most costly solution.

---
Other options: sell your GTX 580 on ebay, buy a 660 Ti from Asus or Gigabyte. They are 2-slot-solutions and are said to be quiet AT IDLE. Not at load though.

They will open up a bunch of other cases to choose from.


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 11:57 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
Hello tim851, thank you very much for your answer.

I think that i will probably sell my GTX580 and buy a 660TI (Gygabyte), what about the performance difference ? I cant find any 660TI vs 580 benchmark comparaison.

So let's say i buy a 2 slot video card, can i keep my current PSU and heatskin ?

In that case, i will only have to buy a new motherboard right ?
Do you know which one should i buy ?

Thank you.

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 12:20 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2003 7:16 am
Posts: 1300
Location: en.gb.uk
The Q08 can make a quiet gaming system, I'm not sure about silent. I have such a system:

Lian Li PC-Q08
Sandybridge Core i7
Thermalright AXP-140
Gainward Phantom GTX570 (which is 2-plus-a-bit slots)
Crucial M4 SSD

This is very quiet, though not silent. Given the specs I wasn't really aiming for silent, just not annoying.

With some tweaking of the fan profiles on the graphics card it remains quiet through the type of gaming I've done (BF3 was the most stressful).

Gainward do a Phantom version of the GTX670, which by all accounts is an awesome GPU.

The toughest thing with that case is the PSU. It really needs a short PSU, ideally modular. I don't recall which one I went for in this system, I've built a couple of Q08-based boxes and get mixed up what's in what :)


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 12:38 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:36 am
Posts: 4470
Location: Monterey Bay, CA
justice99 wrote:
I cant find any 660TI vs 580 benchmark comparaison.

Anandtech GPU Bench
GTX 660 Ti reviews.

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1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, MSI Z87-G45, MSI GTX 760 2GB Gaming, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung Evo 250GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic X-560. 35-40W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 200-230W Rift, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 1:03 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:45 am
Posts: 519
Location: 128.0.0.1
justice99 wrote:
I think that i will probably sell my GTX580 and buy a 660TI (Gygabyte), what about the performance difference ? I cant find any 660TI vs 580 benchmark comparaison.

They are roughly equal. I don't think you'll notice.

Quote:
So let's say i buy a 2 slot video card, can i keep my current PSU and heatskin ?

PSU yes, heatsink definitely no. As I said, the PSU hangs above the mainboard and the CPU cooler height must be less than 8 cm or so.

Quote:
In that case, i will only have to buy a new motherboard right ?
Do you know which one should i buy ?

The Asrock Z77 ITX board is fine. Lots of people have oc'ed their 2500/3570ks to 4.5 Ghz with that board. If you wanna be sure, choose the Asus Z77 board.


nutball wrote:
The Q08 can make a quiet gaming system, I'm not sure about silent. I have such a system:

Lian Li PC-Q08
Sandybridge Core i7
Thermalright AXP-140
Gainward Phantom GTX570 (which is 2-plus-a-bit slots)
Crucial M4 SSD

Do you use the PSU fan as the CPU fan?


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 12:19 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 10, 2003 7:16 am
Posts: 1300
Location: en.gb.uk
tim851 wrote:
Do you use the PSU fan as the CPU fan?


I don't. That's not to say it wouldn't work - I did think about trying it but it's a bit of a faff, and given that the graphics card dominates the noise signature I figured it wasn't likely to gain me much.

I have the fan on the AXP mount blowing upwards though, so the PSU and CPU fans aren't fighting each other.


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 1:16 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:41 am
Posts: 708
Location: Denmark
How about a small mATX case? LIke the Silverstone Temjin TJ-08E, the Silverstone Precision PS07, or perhaps the Antec NSK-3480?

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Cooler Master Elite 341, Athlon II X3 425, Radeon 5750 (passive, fan zip-tied on), Crucial M4 64 GB.
Cooling: AC Alpine 64 Pro, rear exhaust Scythe Slipstream 800 rpm @ ~5 V


"SSD's: The difference between a casual jogger and a dog chasing a ball"


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 2:30 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:49 pm
Posts: 1189
Location: UK
tim851 wrote:
Do you use the PSU fan as the CPU fan?

This can work quite well. I used this kind of setup in my SG03 when I had an Enermax Modu82+ sucking through a Scythe Zipang 2.

I would think that these MiniITX cases aren't drastically smaller than some MicroATX cases and MicroATX is cheaper and easier to work with. However my biggest reservation is that is the size of your system REALLY important enough that you want to spend so much money on replacing half of it? It does not seem economic.

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Silverstone SG03B: E8200, Asus P5E-VM HDMI, 2Gb RAM, Leadtek 9600GT+S1 rev. 2, Samsung 500Gb, Seasonic X-400, 2x Akasa 120mm, Scythe Zipang 2 fanless


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 4:22 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
edh wrote:
I would think that these MiniITX cases aren't drastically smaller than some MicroATX cases and MicroATX is cheaper and easier to work with. However my biggest reservation is that is the size of your system REALLY important enough that you want to spend so much money on replacing half of it? It does not seem economic.


Yes i understand, i will sell my current case, gpu and motherboard to buy smaller components, but i will have to add money that's right.

So what should i do? It's important because my case is taking too much place, and what if i have to spend a year or two abroad, how can i take it with me?

So you advice me to buy a MicroATX case like kuzzia said?
Do you know any quiet and silent model?
What will i have to sell/buy with such case?

Thanks in advance.

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 10:19 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:45 am
Posts: 519
Location: 128.0.0.1
The best mATX case for me is the Silverstone TJ08 without the -E. It is no longer being sold, but maybe found on ebay. The TJ08-E has a 180mm fan in front that is not silent, from what I've heard. Silverstone sells this case with a different front as the PS07, this has 2x 120mm fans in the front. I'd guess this is a quieter choice.

If you choose an mATX case that's wide enough, you can keep everything except the mainboard. CPU cooler and graphics card should fit.

edh wrote:
tim851 wrote:
Do you use the PSU fan as the CPU fan?

This can work quite well. I used this kind of setup in my SG03 when I had an Enermax Modu82+ sucking through a Scythe Zipang 2.

Hehe, I had this setup in the SG04, also with a Zipang 2. Cooling a Core 2 Quad with a Radeon 4850 in there, the PSU got too hot to touch on the back. That's when I decided against this setup. Though that was a non-rational decision, more of a gut feeling.

My favorite setup in this type of case would be an AXP-140/Zipang style heatsink with its own dedicated fan blowing downwards and a Silverstone SFX-PSU. It frees up space above the CPU heatsink and if you turn it towards the side panel, there won't be fighting over air-


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 11:41 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
Thank your for the answer, the case looks nice but it's still too big, not worth the investment.

I better take off hdds from my computer and build a NAS :-)

I should have bought all these components when i first build my computer :P

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:03 am 
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Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 9:13 pm
Posts: 9
Location: US
Hello,
I'm in a similar situation as you. I'm trying to a build a powerful PC is a small, quiet case.

There are a few options for reducing hard drive noise on this thread - viewtopic.php?t=8240

According the SPCR case recommendation page, your case is 48L in size. If you go to a microATX case, there a few smaller options like SilverStone Temjin TJ08-E (30L) and Silverstone GD05 / GD04 (21.5 L). The first case will fit your current CPU cooler and but the second will not. The Noctua NH-L12 cpu cooler will work though. You will need a new motherboard for both. Measure your video card's length (longest dimension) and see if it will fit in either of those cases.

If I were you, I wouldn't bother if you have to replace the video card because you have a high end card that is expensive to replace. If it fits, the case + motherboard costs $200-300 (in the US), so there it depends the importance of space vs. the money.


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 5:44 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
Hello DNA,

I tried a lof of different options, and whatever hdd models, you can not have a quiet computer which contains 3x2To.

The heatskin is not a problem, it's cheap and i can easily sel. l my current one.

The main problem is the GPU, i have a powerful and very quiet one, Gigabyte or Asus 660ti wont be as quiet as my current video card and i dont know if i can sell my gpu for a good price on ebay

The TJ-08 is still too big, not worth the investment and the GD-05 is good for a media center, you cant fit a huge gpu and have a very quiet heatskin into a microATX case.

No big deal, i will upgrade my unit later.

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 8:49 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:45 am
Posts: 519
Location: 128.0.0.1
The TJ08 is the smallest case that fits a 3-slot-card and a tower-cooler. It is significantly smaller than a regular mATX-case, more than the 7-8 cm less height and width might suggest. It's not shoe-box-sized though.


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:56 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
Yes you are right.

For the moment, i wont upgrade my rig.
I will probably do it when i will have to ( need more power ), and i will build it with a miniATX.

Thanks by the way for all these details.

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 4:14 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
Hello,

So as a resume :

Lian Li PC-Q08
Asrock Z77 ( which model should i buy ? The cheapest with USB3 would be good )
GPU : I'm looking for a cheap and quiet "GTX570 like" since i dont play that much video game
CPU : i5 2500K
CPU Fan : Thermalright AXP-140 ? With a fan ?
RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
SSD : SSD Vertex Series
HDD : 1x2TB ( can i with a BR-Drive ? )
PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller ? I better control fans trough the bios right ?

Thanks in advance.

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 11:20 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
Any help ?

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2013 12:12 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:49 pm
Posts: 1189
Location: UK
justice99 wrote:
Asrock Z77 ( which model should i buy ? The cheapest with USB3 would be good )

Why Z77and not H77? Look at the differences between the chipsets and the only real difference is on PCI-E config and as MiniITX strictly only has a single expansion slot, Z77 is pointless. Save money, power and bling by going for an H77 based motherboard. ASRock have the H77-M-ITX if you are interested in this brand in particular. I am not familiar with their recent fan control and how it works but you might want to look into what options it would give you fan wise.

justice99 wrote:
GPU : I'm looking for a cheap and quiet "GTX570 like" since i dont play that much video game

If you don't play games much then you certainly don't need a GTX570 or anything like that power. A GTX650 or GTX650 Ti would make more sense if you do need a separate card and you might want to try the onboard Intel graphics first and see how acceptable they are.

justice99 wrote:
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller ? I better control fans trough the bios right ?

Correct, you shouldn't need a fan controller if the BIOS fan speed control is good enough.

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Silverstone SG03B: E8200, Asus P5E-VM HDMI, 2Gb RAM, Leadtek 9600GT+S1 rev. 2, Samsung 500Gb, Seasonic X-400, 2x Akasa 120mm, Scythe Zipang 2 fanless


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 4:43 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:12 am
Posts: 96
Thank you very much for answering to my message.

What about the heatskin since i will probably buy an Lian Li PC-Q08 ?
How many drive i will be able to fit into this case with my component ?

Thanks in advance.

_________________
CPU : i5 2500K 4.5Ghz with Scythe Mugen 2
Mobo : MSI P67A-G45 RAM : 1x4go G.Skill Ripjaws
GPU : GeForce GTX 460 OC, 1 Go, Gigabyte ( stock 715/1430/1800 @ 850/1700/2050)
SSD & HDD : Vertex Series & 3xWD20EARS
Case : Fractal Design R3 PSU : Enermax PRO87+ 600W
Scythe Kaze Master Fan Controller
Review


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 Post subject: Re: Advice for a Mini Gaming Rig
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2013 7:03 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:56 am
Posts: 50
I really like the Asus P8H77-I board I run. 6 SATA, 1x16x PCI-E, 2 DIMM slots. The Asus FanXpert settings make it very flexible for controlling fans.

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Workstation: Dell Latitude E7440, i5, 1080p screen, Crucial 8GB, Crucial M500 480GB mSATA, Win7
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