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 Post subject: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:24 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am
Posts: 8
Hi,

I currently have a laptop as my primary business PC, but the battery just died and I am looking at "upgrading". Since the laptop never leaves the desk, it makes little sense to purchase another one, especially since I can get a bigger monitor with a standard setup, which would be welcome.

I cannot afford "extra" desk space loss not related to monitor, KB and mouse and my desk has no space below it for a tower, so my options are as follows:

1- Purchase something similar to an "old style" desktop and mount the monitor on top.
2- Purchase a smaller system that can be set below the monitor / mounted on a VESA bracket behind the monitor.
3- Have the PC on a shelf behind me and route USB and HDMI cables to the desk (almost ilimited horizontal clearance, max 37 cm vertical, max 34 depth including cable bending clearance).

It will be a business set up (so, integrated graphics) with (probably) an i5 and SSD drive (single unit) and an optical drive on the front. Front accessible USB ports would also be a plus. I don't care for expansion capability (be it drive bays or slots).

My sticking point here is finding a case that will suit my needs AND be silent enough. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 7:33 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:22 pm
Posts: 2063
Location: Guatemala
Do you need an internal optical drive? do you use it much or can you go by with an external like ASUS External Slim Black 8X DVD-RW Stylish Diamond Cut Design Optical Drive SDRW-08D2S-U/BLK/G/AS

For no 2, i would suggest something like,

Case/PSU: Antec Mini-ITX Case ISK110-VESA (small itx case, frontal usb, has a vesa mount and can be stand also, no optical though)
Mobo: Intel Desktop Motherboard LGA1155 DDR3 1600 mini-ITX - BOXDH77DF (very efficient mobo and has good layout for 110)
CPU: Intel Core i3-3225 or if want a i5/quad, Intel Core i5-3470
SSD: Samsung 840 250GB or Crucial m4 256GB
Memo: Crucial Ballistix Sport Very Low Profile 8GB Kit (4GBx2) DDR3-1600 1.35V UDIMM 240-Pin Desktop Memory Modules BLS2C4G3D1609ES2LX0

Optional
HDD: Hitachi 5k500b or any other 2.5 (9.5) hdd (the antec 110 has 2 slots 2.5hdd, so you can add a mechanical hdd for storage).
CPU cooler: Scythe Kozuti SCKZT-1000 (in case you find the stock cooler too noisy)

Here is an interesting video of a build on 110, Antec ISK 110 Mini ITX Build Part 2: Time Lapse System Build

If you use the optical that much and has to be internal, then i would suggest to build around Morex T3500 Mini-ITX Case w/142W DC-DC Power Board and A/C Adapter and add a Toshiba TS-L633 8x DVD±RW DL Notebook SATA Drive (Black)

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms | Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2013 12:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am
Posts: 8
Hi Abuda,

Thanks for the answer. I am still undecided on a mATX (on the shelf, probably sideways) or the mini-ITX on a Vesa mount.

The CPU will have to be a i5-3570K, because HD4000 is the minimum I will accept. I do have the option of the A10-5700, but I am concerned that it may lack "punch" on the CPU side.


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:07 am 
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Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 10:29 am
Posts: 582
Location: de_DE
how about a case that has a vesa mount: Chieftec Bravo BL-01B-O, review here

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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:09 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am
Posts: 8
Hi boost,

Thanks for the reply. The idea of a VESA mount would be to mount the unit at the back of the monitor, rather than the other way around, so the Chieftec is no good.

After some careful considerations, I think I narrowed it down in terms of possibilities:

1 - Vesa mount it behind the monitor - and in this case I don't care for ODD (will get an external + a usb 3.0 hub), but the PSU will have to comfortably (and quietly) live with a 77W TDP CPU + SSD + MB + power to USB ports.

2 - Have in the shelf behind me. I can probably make it taller (so height >37 cm), but I don't want to make it overly deep (I am keeping the <34 cm depth). In this case it should take an ODD.


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:21 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am
Posts: 8
Right, another update:

I decided going with a mATX mounted on the shelf behind my desk. I cannot trust an mITX system to be able to hold a 77W TDP CPU comfortably.

In terms of case size, I also decided to have it sitting on the shelf sideways (90º), due to the short "depth" (34 cm). From what I read here at SCPR, the SST TJ08-E seems to be a safe-ish bet, but I am open to alternatives (total height can be up to 40-45 cm, but NO conectors at the top, please).

In terms of PSU, I would like a modular, not-too-expensive unit but I am having a hard time finding anything decent below 75 €. The BeQuiet units (Pure and Straight versions) can be found below that price, but the reviews I've read point out to severe fluctuations on the 3.3 V line. Any help here would be highly appreciated!


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:11 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:22 pm
Posts: 2063
Location: Guatemala
The TJ08E is a fine case but you will need to undervolt the frontal fan, even on the low preset, around 900rpm, it's not by any men's quiet, you need to drop it around 600rpm to be decent, so grab a Zalman fanmate2 and play with it until you find acceptable for you, i hide mine on the back of the case, right next to the PSU where there is enough space to stick it and keep it hidden.

On the psu, even though its not modular it's a nice small psu, Seasonic SS-360GP 360W Power Supply, more than enough to power your setup (no dedicated GPU). The TJ08E has decent space on the back to hide all the extra cables, i dont think there will be an issue as long as you put some effort into the cable management. Read SPCR review, Seasonic G360 PSU: High efficiency & performance, low price, got the editor choice.

For CPU cooler, Thermalright HR-02 Macho Rev.A 140mm CPU Cooler Silent Fan for Socket 775/1155/1156/1366/AMD/AM2/AM3 is one of the best coolers for the money with great noise/performance ratio. Check the SCPR review, Thermalright HR-02 Macho Quiet/Fanless Cooler, also got the editor choice.

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms | Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:45 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am
Posts: 8
Thanks Abula!

The current setup is shaping up:

Case: SST TJ-08-E
PSU: Seasonic M12II-520
MB: Intel DH77EB (I am still looking for an alternative mAXT board with Z77 AND Displayport - hints welcomed)
CPU: Intel i5-3570K
Cooler: Thermaltake HR-02 Macho
SSD: Samsung 840 Pro 256 MB (no HDD)
ODD: Whatever is cheaper, most likely a Samsung

I am STILL playing around with the idea of a mini ITX setup, but due to space restrictions (can't be deeper than 30 cm), this is as far as I got:

Case: SST SG-05 (w/ USB 3.0)
PSU: Fortron Source 300W (comes with case)
MB: Intel DH77DF / Zotac Z77-ITX WiFi
CPU: Intel i5-3570K
Cooler: Thermaright AXP-100
SSD: Samsung 840 Pro 256 MB (no HDD)
SSD: Whatever is cheaper, most likely a Samsung

Thanks for your comments / suggestions! :D


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:48 am 
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Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 11:23 am
Posts: 688
Location: Germany
cfduarte wrote:
MB: Intel DH77EB (I am still looking for an alternative mAXT board with Z77 AND Displayport - hints welcomed)


Afaik there are only:

ASRock Fatal1ty Z77 Professional-M
Gigabyte G1.Sniper M3
ASUS Maximus V Gene

But adding a small GPU to another Z77 mATX just for the display port might pay off, compare prices at your favorite store.


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:55 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am
Posts: 8
Hi Pappnaas,

Yes, I found that also and they are hugely expensive...

I thought about a GPU, but I am not keen on paying for stuff I don't use (i.e. IGP).

To be honest, I am warming up (again) to the neatness of the mini ITX build.


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:26 am 
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Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 11:23 am
Posts: 688
Location: Germany
I've fallen in love with the Mini ICE from Cubitek.

http://www.cubitek.com/products/ice-series/mini-ice

To me it could be made reasonable silent, if you don't need the pcie slot, i'd add a Big Shuriken 2. Then fine tune the fan and pick your PSU. Since you list no HDD, vibrations won't occur. Looks to me like it's doable.

And you won't need the K cpu with a H77 chipset.


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 11:44 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am
Posts: 8
It's a great looking case, but too big (I am limited to a max 30 cm depth).

I don't inted to add a card now, but I like to keep my options open, so a free slot can come in handy in the future (another reason why I am only looking at 300W+ CPU). The "K" version has nothing to do with being unlock, but rather with it having the 4000 HD IGP (the non-K version has the 3000, for some strange reason).


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:10 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:22 pm
Posts: 2063
Location: Guatemala
Just wondering... What will you be doing with this Pc at work?

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms | Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:46 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 2:11 am
Posts: 8
Well, standard Office work and browsing for most of the time, but also some computacional engineering simulation packages and some heavy Excel spreadsheets (several in parallel and with cross calculations).


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:17 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:22 pm
Posts: 2063
Location: Guatemala
Another option for a mini ITX, since you already considering desktop cases, i think you should look into Lian Li PC-Q11 / Black / Mini Tower Case w/ USB 3.0, single 140mm frontal fan (i would exchange the fan for Noiseblocker NB-BlackSilentPro PK-1) and can fit standard PSU (has a limitation on lenght though), i still see the G360 as very viable for this, as you dont have a dedicated gpu, but it will work with a lot of PSU. On the CPU cooler you could pair it with Scythe Shuriken, thermalright AXP 140 (the included fan wont fit, you need a slim one), or the new therlarmight AXP-100 (this might be viable, as its smaller than axp-140 and has a low profile fan). I'll leave with a big thread of builds with it, where you can see final builds and what psu/cpu coolers they used, New Lian Li PC- Q11 itx case : Specification & Feature, btw the case can still fit decent GPU in case in the future you decide to.

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms | Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: Recommendation for a business mATX / mITX system
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:51 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:56 am
Posts: 51
I've recently moved my two main miniITX machines in to the Inwin BM648 case. It's a stocky little machine that's a desktop or tower. It's very quiet, even using the stock fan.

Bought one of the cases on a whim - liked it so much I bought another. The "HTPC1" machine replaces a Silverstone HTPC case with a microATX board in it.

Specs as per my .sig

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Workstation: i5-4690K@4.7GHz, Asus Z97I-Plus, 8GB Kingston DDR3-1600, Crucial M500 480GB, WD1003FZEX, Win7
Server: i3-4350, AsRock E3C224D2I, 16GB ECC, Intel 520 180GB, 2x Toshiba 5TB, 2xWD50EFRX, Server 2012R2, Stablebit Drivepool
HTPC1: TranquilPC ABEL H2, i3, 4GB DDR3L-12800, Crucial M4 128GB mSATA, Win7
HTPC2: Akasa Euler, DH61AG, Pentium G620, 4GB DDR3L-10666, Crucial M4 64GB mSATA, Win7


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