nForce4 Chipset Fan Replacement Thread

Mikael · Post by **Mikael** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:08 am

Hey! I need a quick answer to this question:

Does anyone use the NB47J while overclocking the HTT frequency of the Nforce4 chipset and how well does it work?

I'm overclocking the computer I'm building for a friend and it would be nice to hear if anyone else has any experience with this. I'm currently overclocking with the stock cooler, but soon as I find a satisfying frequency I'm going to install the NB47J.

BTW, there will be a Zalman VF700 AlCu on an X800XL right next to the NB47J, which should provide some extra airflow. The case has one 80mm fan in the front and a 120mm fan in the back. Don't know how fast they spin, but I'm guessing 1500-1800RPM at the moment. The motherboard is an Asus A8N-E.

Gerbil · Post by **Gerbil** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 4:45 am

Yes, you can OC with the NB47J, but I only recommend it if you also use a fan. Either attach a 40mm Papst, or aim a large fan directly at the northbridge. I have the front 120mm fan in my Sonata II angled slightly to blow air around my NB47J. I'm not overclocking though. These solutions should actually be more effective than the stock Asus hsf's.

Mikael · Post by **Mikael** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 7:23 am

Gerbil wrote:Yes, you can OC with the NB47J, but I only recommend it if you also use a fan. Either attach a 40mm Papst, or aim a large fan directly at the northbridge. I have the front 120mm fan in my Sonata II angled slightly to blow air around my NB47J. I'm not overclocking though. These solutions should actually be more effective than the stock Asus hsf's.

So, you don't think that the VF700 fan at 7V will provide enough airflow around the NB47? By the way, I'm aiming for 250MHz HTT frequency... I don't know how much the extra 50MHz affects the power consumption of the Nforce4 chipset, but it might not be that much of a diff.

I am at 270MHz right now (with the stock HSF), but my friend is willing to back down slightly if it means getting a considerably less noisy PC.

Gerbil · Post by **Gerbil** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 7:44 am

I have my VF700 set to 5V and it doesn't move very much air towards the NB47J. The front 120mm fan cools the northbridge much better. Maybe the VF700 at 7V would cool a bit better. I still recommend having a fan other than the VF700 to cool the NB47J.

jamesm · Post by **jamesm** » Mon Aug 15, 2005 1:31 pm

the arctic silencer provides lots of airflow for a nb32j

Mikael · Post by **Mikael** » Tue Aug 16, 2005 2:11 am

Okay, the NB47J is installed now. To be honest, I've never encountered such a flaming hot chipset as this damn Nforce4. I've put the VF700 on 7V, plus installed a 92mm 1500RPM fan 10cm from the chipset. It still gets so hot that it hurts to hold the finger on the heatsink base for more than 10 seconds. I don't know how hot that is, but I'm guessing it translates into a 65-70C chipset temp. What do you think? Should I worry? I'm pretty sure that this temp actually is quite okay.

EDIT: BTW, this was when overclocked to 250MHz. I just tried stock 200MHz and then 250MHz again, trying to estimate the difference in temp by using my finger (

). Result? Well, at stock 200MHz, I can hold the finger on the base indefinately, but just barely. At 250MHz I could probably push it and keep the finger pressed to the base, but I'm no masochist...

So, the difference in temp when overclocked isn't very large. I'd say maybe 3 degrees Celsius, or something close to it.

Gerbil · Post by **Gerbil** » Tue Aug 16, 2005 4:38 am

Those temp. estimates sound about right to me. The nF4 can handle up to 90C. 60-70C is normal.

Sooty · Post by **Sooty** » Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:40 am

Is it likley the NF4-Ultra chip runs significantly cooler than the NF4-SLI?

fjf · Post by **fjf** » Thu Aug 18, 2005 8:12 am

I have my zalman cooled with a 40 mm papst fan t-balanced. Now running at 40% keeps it at 45ºC. It may not matter, but I feel better

Regards

jackylman · Post by **jackylman** » Thu Aug 18, 2005 1:05 pm

Sooty wrote:Is it likley the NF4-Ultra chip runs significantly cooler than the NF4-SLI?

I used to think this was true, but everything I've read lately has convinced me they consume about the same amount of power (at least with one graphics card).

Stjopatron · Post by **Stjopatron** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:20 am

Hi folks,
The poor little chip set fan on my new motherboard (Asus A8N-E) got removed before it even had time to say 'hello‘. Following the tips on this forum I installed the passive Zalman NBJ47 (blue) instead.

The case has a front mounted 120 mm fan that blows over the two hard-drives and then onto the chip set. So, the question we have been asking us: Can the NF4 be passively cooled in this way? Well, I ran a thermometer (included in the Antec P160 case) into the NBJ47 and experimented with a 40 mm fan that I attached to it. Also, there is a second thermometer in the air a bit higher up in the case.

Nevermind Bios readings, because I can now present the real hard facts to you:

W/o chip fan - Case fan 7V
Chip temp: 81°C - Case air temp: 30°C

Chip fan 7V - Case fan 5V
Chip temp: 48°C - Case air temp: 34°C

Chip fan 7V - Case fan 7V
Chip temp: 46°C - Case air temp: 28°C

The chip set thermometer is sitting a bit on the edge of the Zalman and not in its core, why I believe that the actual NF4 temperature is much higher. The difference in temperature is so magnificent that I would not rely on a passive solution, as some people in this thread seem to be doing. I doubt that a front intake fan should be enough to cool the blue Zalman heat sink.
Bad news on my first posting… oh what a good start.

hyperq · Post by **hyperq** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 11:36 am

I am able to achieve 35C-36C on NB47J by putting a Panaflo 80L on it and using SpeedFan 4.25 to lower the fan speed to 70%. Click the url below for more details.

http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=24846

Pooh-Bah · Post by **Pooh-Bah** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:17 pm

IMHO, when passively cooled, the NF4 heatsink needs some airflow to keep the temps reasonable. This can be accomplished by good passive airflow in a non-overclocked system, or active airflow in an overclocked system. Either way, it is my opinion that the NF4 should not be passively cooled except in systems with good airflow in the chipset area. Sure, the manufacturers say up to 90c is fine...but would you run a system with a chipset always at 70c or higher?

It doesn't take much airflow to make a huge difference. Grab any old tiny fan laying around and place it anywhere near the chipset and you should be fine. I use an old 25mm or 30mm fan with a zalman speed control set to a very low speed and it works perfectly with almost no noise.

And remember - YOUR CHIPSET TEMP IS NOT REPORTED IN YOUR BIOS OR BY ANY TEMPERATURE MONITORING PROGRAM. I started a whole thread about this, only to be bashed by some idiot (who will remain nameless) that kept arguing that you don't need airflow. Funny thing is, if you search his own posts, he is constantly talking about the need for airflow. Uhhh, what was his point again?

sockeye · Post by **sockeye** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 9:36 am

I'm reviving this old thread because I have been asking this same question as I prepare to upgrade my rig.

I will have the following:

mobo: MSI K8N Neo4-F Socket 939 nForce4
CPU: Athlon 64 3000+ (Venice core)
RAM: 1GB CORSAIR ValueSelect DRAM (2 sticks)
GPU: Connect 3D Radeon X700 Pro / 128MB DDR / PCI Express

I'm planning on a CompuCase LX-6A19 with 120mm fans fore and aft, a Thermalright XP-90 on the CPU, and a Zalman VF700-AlCu on the GPU. I have ordered a NB47J chipset cooler for the NF4. It would be easier to install it on the mobo as I build the system up, but I am a wee bit concerned about frying the board. I doubt this will be a problem as I will have a lot of airflow through the case, plus a bit of wind coming off the Zalman VF700.

I do have a Zalman fan mounting bracket from my current rig that I could use to hold a quiet 80mm Panaflo -- not sure if it will reach to the NF4, and even if it did, it will be pretty far above the heastsink.

I'm not planning to do any overclocking. What do folks think -- I think a few of you have a MSI K8N Neo4 board -- does the chipset get very hot? Given that I'll have a lot of airflow, do you think I'll be alright with the NB47J instead of the stock chipset HSF?

Thanks in advance,

John

Stjopatron · Post by **Stjopatron** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:45 pm

sockeye wrote: I'm not planning to do any overclocking. What do folks think -- I think a few of you have a MSI K8N Neo4 board -- does the chipset get very hot? Given that I'll have a lot of airflow, do you think I'll be alright with the NB47J instead of the stock chipset HSF?

Good aeration keeps my passive Zalman cooler at 70°C, but then my PC becomes rather noisy with its case fans swirling at 12V. When I undervolt them to realistic sound levels, the temperature shoots over 80°C where I interfere and ask the computer to stop (how hot can it get?).

Two 120 fans and a Panaflo are likely to keep the heat below 70°C, but you'd end up with a noisy system. Which takes us back to the reason you removed the stock fan in the first place....

sockeye · Post by **sockeye** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 4:34 pm

Thanks, Stjopatron.

I don't have a temperature probe or any other real way of monitoring the NB temp -- how will I know when it gets too hot? Maybe I'll put an undervolted 40mm fan on the NB47J. If there's room that is. Have any of you done this? If so, how did you mount it?

thanks in advance...

Gerbil · Post by **Gerbil** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:34 pm

sockeye wrote:Thanks, Stjopatron.

I don't have a temperature probe or any other real way of monitoring the NB temp -- how will I know when it gets too hot? Maybe I'll put an undervolted 40mm fan on the NB47J. If there's room that is. Have any of you done this? If so, how did you mount it?

thanks in advance...

40mm fans already move so little air (~3.5cfm) at 12V that I don't consider them to do much good at lower voltages. If you're worried about heat, direct and undervolt an 80mm or larger fan at the northbridge.

Stjopatron · Post by **Stjopatron** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 1:53 am

Hi John
As already said, you can't rely on Bios values or monitoring programs. 70°C feels very hot, but you can still hold you fingers to it. When you are considering cooking your breakfast on the heat sink, then it probably has reached about 80°C. My guess is that the computer will stop working at temperatures above that. If you haven't go at temp probe, it is all about feeling really.

What I was trying to illustrate in my 'temperature table' a few postings above, is that the temperature was reduced from 81°C to 46-48°C by simply using an untervolted 40 mm fan (7V). (At the moment of writing it is actually only 36°C ). I did not bother to test it at 5V as there is no difference in noise. Note that these are the heat sink temperatures and not the chip set itself.

If you haven't bought the NB47J yet, I think you should get an NB cooler with silent fan already on it (depending on the size of your graphic card). In case you want to know, I attached my fan with elastic bands sliced off from a inner tube of a bicycle. I am a bit new to foruming, but if I can find out where to host a photo I will post one here.

nici · Post by **nici** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 2:06 am

www.photobucket.com is a reliable and easy picture hosting site, only limitation is 250kB size. Thats no problem though, you cant post bigger pictures on forums anyway..

www.imageshack.us is another that people sseem to use, never used that personally though as im happy with photobucket

sockeye · Post by **sockeye** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 5:06 am

40mm fans already move so little air (~3.5cfm) at 12V that I don't consider them to do much good at lower voltages.

You may well be right, but it's worth pointing out that the volume of the airspaces in this heatsink, measured in cubic feet, is very small indeed. 3.5 cu feet of air moving over a NB47J each minute seems to me like it would cool it tremendously.

merlin · Post by **merlin** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 2:49 pm

sockeye wrote:
40mm fans already move so little air (~3.5cfm) at 12V that I don't consider them to do much good at lower voltages.
You may well be right, but it's worth pointing out that the volume of the airspaces in this heatsink, measured in cubic feet, is very small indeed. 3.5 cu feet of air moving over a NB47J each minute seems to me like it would cool it tremendously.

I'm going to have to agree on that, I fanmated my neo4-f's northbridge fan down from 7000rpm to a much quieter 3800rpm and I've not had a single stability problem with it. Now my Psu is the loudest thing since it's a stock Truepower-380, but I'm waiting until my next upgrade before I buy myself a sexy seasonic.

All I can really hear now is the swooshing of air and no high pitched sounds from my system. It's far better than having a fanless nforce4 imho just for the lower temps.

Pooh-Bah · Post by **Pooh-Bah** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:01 pm

A 40mm fan running so that it is completely silent is plenty of airflow. I laugh when I see a setup with an 80mm fan on the chipset heatsink.

The cooling difference between no fan and a 40mm fan (barely spinning) is much more than you may imagine.

Gerbil · Post by **Gerbil** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:54 pm

Pooh-Bah wrote:A 40mm fan running so that it is completely silent is plenty of airflow. I laugh when I see a setup with an 80mm fan on the chipset heatsink.

The cooling difference between no fan and a 40mm fan (barely spinning) is much more than you may imagine.

The cooling difference between a silent 80mm fan and a silent 40mm fan is much, much more effective.

Stjopatron · Post by **Stjopatron** » Fri Aug 26, 2005 4:30 am

As requested, this is how I mounted an ordinary 40 mm fan on the Zalman heat sink

That cable in the side is the temperature probe. Above the graphic card (Nvidia 6200 TC)

Those rubber bands are made from an old bicycle inner tube. Grab the tube and slice it like a sausage. I chopped bands that are about 1 mm wide, but the fan sits rather loose. If you cut them broader, say 2-4 mm, they will have a stronger tension. You must get the Zalman out to be able to mount it this way. What you can't see in the photos is the cork disk between the fan and the heat sink.

Modding tip of the week: Two bands in each corner like on the pictures above improves your computer's DIY feel!

(Thanks Nici, I would not have known where to start looking)

Chaendler · Post by **Chaendler** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 5:09 pm

Stjopatron, wich pasive heatsink are you using in your graphic card?

I`m looking for something like that for my msi radeon x700pro.

Do you think that heatsink would be enough for my card?

Thank you!

Stjopatron · Post by **Stjopatron** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 12:48 am

The photo shows an Nvidia GeForce 6200 Turbo Cache card which is comparatively low spec and is always sold with a passive heatsink. I have not the slightest idea if this heatsink will help you or not, but this section of the forum definitely will Cool & Quiet VGA.
Stefan

jermaink · Post by **jermaink** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 3:51 am

I'm using a DFI Nforce 4 Ultra-D in an Antec P180. The way things are currently positioned, the chipset cooler is in the direct path of where a mounted in the front blows. If I replace the chipset fan (noisy, ESPECIALLY when starting up - mini siren) with a Zalman ZM-NB47J, will mounting a 120 mm fan in the front of the P180 provide enough airflow to the northbridge/chipset area? There are a chunk of wires impeding airflow, but I'm going to re-do the wiring to make airflow better (and to keep things tidy).

nici · Post by **nici** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 10:16 am

Well i have the P180 with a DFI mobo inside, a x800XL with zalman heatpipecooler and 80mm nexus fan blowing at it, NB47J on the chipset, one case fan wich is in the top hole, the rear hole is blocked and the VGA duct hole is open but the duct isnt in place. Anyway, doing the finger test on the chipset heatsink i am quite shure that the temps SmartGuardian reports are about correct, it showed 45c and touching the heatsink hurts but i can hold my finger on it for some seconds. If its down to under 40, it feels just warm. Its supposed to be OK for the chipset to run 60--70c, and the way its currently setup it will rise to 55c when i loop 3dMark05 for a few hours. I used Arctic Silver Ceramiqué on the chipset. Currently it idles at 47c.

Once i find it i will add a small fan to the heatsink and see how that works, though i havent had any chipset related stability issues even though its reached 67c without any airflow.

Are you going to put the graphics card in the lower slot to make room for the nb47j or bend the fins? I currently have the gpu in the lower slot, and thus the vga duct is useless. might have to make my own.

Answering your question, if you have the wirres wery tidy like i have(

), a fan in the front should keep it at acceptable temps. The good thing with the DFI mobo is that it reports the actual chipset temp, so its easy to test something. Just put a fan in the front and see if it works

jermaink · Post by **jermaink** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 8:11 pm

Where can I download SmartGuardian?

I'm already using the lower PCIe port because my Thermalright XP120 is blocking the higher port. As for the NB47J, I'll probably have to bend fins anyway to fit between the XP120 and my X800XL with an Arctic Cooling Silencer.

Atm, my wiring is very cluttered, but I'm thinking of getting an Antec Phantom 500 to replace my Neopower, as it's a bit too loud. I might have to get more case fans as 2-3 out of my 5 Nexus fans appear to be duds (making rippling noise).

nici · Post by **nici** » Sun Sep 04, 2005 8:46 am

SmartGuardian should come on the cd delivered with your DFI mobo. you can also find it by googling

nForce4 Chipset Fan Replacement Thread

nforce

One way of mounting a fan on Zalman NB47J to cool Nforce 4