It is currently Fri Jul 20, 2018 12:10 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 8:18 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
it's march 2018

any updates SPCR in terms of new content?


is SPCR dead due to technology advances?

in the early days of 2000

silence required lots of research

in 2018

for a silent pc build

buy a seasonic fanless psu
amd ryzen apu cool with nofan 95 (not sure if it is am4 compatible)
use ssd

voila
a silent pc


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 4:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
Yes, more or less. Plus the plethora of PWM fans that can run at speeds around 300 rpm at idle, the improvement in motherboard fan controls and so on. However in my opinion at least there is still a shortage of the detailed information and sound measurements that were a hallmark of SPCR reviews.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 4:38 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
Yes, more or less. Plus the plethora of PWM fans that can run at speeds around 300 rpm at idle, the improvement in motherboard fan controls and so on. However in my opinion at least there is still a shortage of the detailed information and sound measurements that were a hallmark of SPCR reviews.


maybe i should post this on fans but i never really got pwm fans and 3 pin vs 4 pin.

the fans i buy panasonic i bought at spcr recommendation were all 3 pins.

i'd imagine a fan that uses magnetic levitation would be most silent.

the 5 volt trick sometimes works sometimes doesn't work.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2018 4:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
Most PWM fans running at around 300 rpm are effectively silent, depending on the background noise level and how sensitive you personally are to noise. Getting 3 pin fans down to these levels is not so easy, particularly because it normally involves limiting top speed to less than 1000 rpm and maybe less than 800 rpm.

On the issue of 3 pin v 4 pin PWM fans I don't think it ever showed up on the SPCR radar but there was, probably still is a dual PWM/voltage fan made by Sharkoon. Called the Silent Eagle SE it had a modular cable system, that is a PWM cable and three different voltage cables - 7V, 9V and 12V. I tried the 120mm version in a gaming build for one of my family members, it worked OK. None of the voltage cables seemed to drop its idle speed by anything like the amount that the PWM cable could, so I just used it as a PWM fan. The only drawback was that it lacked a decent quality bearing. I think it also slightly missed the point that any PWM fan can be used in voltage mode if required without needing special cable systems.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:12 am 
Offline
*Lifetime Patron*

Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 6:28 pm
Posts: 435
Location: CT, USA
I sure miss the hard drive and heatsink testing. I'd love to get a larger drive than my 3TB Red but most posts here complain the higher capacity ones are noisy now... would love to see testing on higher capacity drives. And no one else out there seems to test heatsinks with low airflow like MikeC does... the most powerful heatsinks aren't necessarily the best when using slower fans, it was nice to have that data.

_________________
main: athlon II 240e + Dark Knight, MSI 785GM-E65, Dell RM112, 4GB G-Skill, HVR-2250, 256GB Samsung 830 & 3TB WD Red, CM Elite 341
laptop (backup): IBM Thinkpad X60s, LV CoreDuo 1.66, Samsung 840 120GB
laptop (main): Dell XPS13 9343 FHD i5, 128GB SSD, blissfully silent almost all the time


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 1:07 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
Most PWM fans running at around 300 rpm are effectively silent, depending on the background noise level and how sensitive you personally are to noise. Getting 3 pin fans down to these levels is not so easy, particularly because it normally involves limiting top speed to less than 1000 rpm and maybe less than 800 rpm.

On the issue of 3 pin v 4 pin PWM fans I don't think it ever showed up on the SPCR radar but there was, probably still is a dual PWM/voltage fan made by Sharkoon. Called the Silent Eagle SE it had a modular cable system, that is a PWM cable and three different voltage cables - 7V, 9V and 12V. I tried the 120mm version in a gaming build for one of my family members, it worked OK. None of the voltage cables seemed to drop its idle speed by anything like the amount that the PWM cable could, so I just used it as a PWM fan. The only drawback was that it lacked a decent quality bearing. I think it also slightly missed the point that any PWM fan can be used in voltage mode if required without needing special cable systems.


the intel stock cooler came with a 4-pin PWM fan which i put in the cpu fan of a gigabyte UD p35-dsr3

strangely speedfan wouldn't let me spin down that fan

but the panasonic 3-pin panaflo worked :roll:


imo i think i want fans with led lights bc i light led lights in my case :) not sure if they are pwm or not though


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 1:08 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
flyingsherpa wrote:
I sure miss the hard drive and heatsink testing. I'd love to get a larger drive than my 3TB Red but most posts here complain the higher capacity ones are noisy now... would love to see testing on higher capacity drives. And no one else out there seems to test heatsinks with low airflow like MikeC does... the most powerful heatsinks aren't necessarily the best when using slower fans, it was nice to have that data.



MikeC is the admin

but why not have end users offer their own articles?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 1:24 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
Yes, there's absolutely nothing to stop user reviews being posted. And there have always been a reasonable number of them. In addition some users have posted detailed factual information not generally available elsewhere. As an example there are the PWM fan profiles published by Abula. I despair of the number of web reviewers who still test PWM fans in voltage mode only and seem to be oblivious of PWM fan profiles. There are some notable exceptions such as the profile for the Scythe Kaze Flex 120mm PWM 300 to 1200 rpm fan reproduced below. This is from the Modders-Inc review of the Scythe Mugen 5 CPU cooler. For a long time PWM fan profiles like this were only found on SPCR.

Image

There are I think distinct limits as to what individual users can do. A PWM fan profile can tell you at what speeds a fan should run, and at what duty cycle settings. However without consistent sound measurements, and some evaluation of noise quality as well as levels it is still of limited value. So user reviews/articles cannot I think entirely replace the quality of the editorial content that largely ceased in 2016 (there was one article in 2017).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:22 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
you seem knowledgeable about PWM fans.

here's an issue i'd like to know if u can resolve

my msi 975x 775 motherboard died. caps blew. it died. the cost of labor to replace those caps $100 exceed cost of a new motherboard

i bought on ebay a new asus p5k motherboard

i transferred cpu gpu ddr2 to new

windows 7 install keeps breaking. simply uninstalling a program or whatever and windows 7 stops booting, on an asus

the slightest thing and i need to reinstall windows 7 :(

speedfan worked exactly correctly on the msi 975 platinum, both cpu and case fans can be spun down to 50% inaudible panasonic panaflo. i used xp.

i don't know if its pwm or what but it is 3-pin and it works exactly correct.

i use speed fan on asus. it doesn't work. not sure why. asus ai software doesn't work on windows 7

so fans run at full speed and are loud. ASUS Fan Xpert 3.00.01 doesn't work with asus p5k

one work around i tried is using the 5 volt reverse 4-pin molex, but now the asus refuses to boot it hangs on post

also asus refuses to post when there is no fan on the cpu fan 4-pin connector, but it doesn't slow down at all, not even going to bios and putting it on silent profile

i find windows 10 to be too confusing to use, too unfamiliar. i don't like the UI

i've wondered if windows xp and speed fan will work correctly with asus p5k

but newest mozilla firefox won't work on xp, nor opera nor the newer programs and peripheral drivers.

not sure if it is a hard drive program but the windows 7 keeps getting corrupted and refuses to boot and repair doesn't work the only solution that works is a complete reinstall. :(

since speed fan didn't work i uninstalled it. when i booted windows on asus it refused to boot says corrupted :(


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 10:44 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
I did some builds on the Asus P5xxx motherboards back in the day, must have been about ten years ago now.

From what I remember, the CPU fan header was PWM only with no option to change this in the BIOS. So you have to use a PWM 4-pin fan for this header. Using a 3 pin fan simply resulted in it running at full speed with no fan control. Reason, PWM fans are supplied with 12V and use an integrated circuit in the fan itself to turn this into controlled pulses.

Even plugging a PWM fan into the CPU header could still result in an error. First of all, QFan in the BIOS was set off by default. So to get any fan control this had to be set to Enabled. If the BIOS profile was set to Silent, you could then still get a CPU fan error on boot. Reason, the lower rpm limit in the BIOS was above the speed the fan would run at with the Silent profile. Solution, set to CPU Fan Speed to Ignored in the BIOS. This resulted in no CPU speed showing in the BIOS but software such as HWMonitor would show the CPU fan speed under Windows. The Silent Profile should hold the speed of a PWM fan down to around 20% duty cycle while the CPU temperature is less than 40C. At the time this was a big deal, most motherboards were running CPU fans by default at more like 35 to 40% duty cycle.

Chassis fan control on the Asus boards of this era if I recall it correctly only allowed a minimum of around 60%, or 7V. At this time most people would have been happy to plug in a 1000 rpm 3 pin fan and have thermal control from 700 to 1000 rpm without cable resistors etc.

As far as you other issues are concerned, they may stem from it being basically a new but in fact pretty old board. It might be worth replacing the battery on the motherboard. It might also be worth installing the latest BIOS from Asus.

As far as your fan control issues are concerned, I would suggest you uninstall both SpeedFan and the Asus software and try BIOS controls only. Again you need to set QFan control to Enabled for both the CPU and chassis fans. You will need a PWM CPU fan. Selecting the Silent profile for both the CPU and chassis fans will give the lowest speeds. But as already stated this runs a 3 pin chassis fan at about 7V. I don't think there was any option at this time to run PWM chassis fans. For this reason PWM splitter cables became fairly common. This allowed PWM chassis fans to be run from the CPU fan control signal.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:31 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
I did some builds on the Asus P5xxx motherboards back in the day, must have been about ten years ago now.

From what I remember, the CPU fan header was PWM only with no option to change this in the BIOS. So you have to use a PWM 4-pin fan for this header. Using a 3 pin fan simply resulted in it running at full speed with no fan control. Reason, PWM fans are supplied with 12V and use an integrated circuit in the fan itself to turn this into controlled pulses.

Even plugging a PWM fan into the CPU header could still result in an error. First of all, QFan in the BIOS was set off by default. So to get any fan control this had to be set to Enabled. If the BIOS profile was set to Silent, you could then still get a CPU fan error on boot. Reason, the lower rpm limit in the BIOS was above the speed the fan would run at with the Silent profile. Solution, set to CPU Fan Speed to Ignored in the BIOS. This resulted in no CPU speed showing in the BIOS but software such as HWMonitor would show the CPU fan speed under Windows. The Silent Profile should hold the speed of a PWM fan down to around 20% duty cycle while the CPU temperature is less than 40C. At the time this was a big deal, most motherboards were running CPU fans by default at more like 35 to 40% duty cycle.

Chassis fan control on the Asus boards of this era if I recall it correctly only allowed a minimum of around 60%, or 7V. At this time most people would have been happy to plug in a 1000 rpm 3 pin fan and have thermal control from 700 to 1000 rpm without cable resistors etc.

As far as you other issues are concerned, they may stem from it being basically a new but in fact pretty old board. It might be worth replacing the battery on the motherboard. It might also be worth installing the latest BIOS from Asus.

As far as your fan control issues are concerned, I would suggest you uninstall both SpeedFan and the Asus software and try BIOS controls only. Again you need to set QFan control to Enabled for both the CPU and chassis fans. You will need a PWM CPU fan. Selecting the Silent profile for both the CPU and chassis fans will give the lowest speeds. But as already stated this runs a 3 pin chassis fan at about 7V. I don't think there was any option at this time to run PWM chassis fans. For this reason PWM splitter cables became fairly common. This allowed PWM chassis fans to be run from the CPU fan control signal.


you know what you're talking about :lol:

after my gigabyte and msi board both died i went and bought a asus p5k

everything you say matches up with what i'm having.

i notice when i don't have a fan in cpu fan asus refuses to boot.

the 3-pin panaflo does work in cpu fan header but it doesn't spin down :(

i've never heard of HWMonitor how does it compare with speed fan?

everything you say is correct. yes, it lists

2 chasis fans, cpu fan and "power fan"

yes correct that chassis fan only 60%

it came shipped with latest bios from asus

all my fans are panasonic panaflo 3-pin which i bought solely due to SPCR recommend AND microcenter carried it.

i actually bought the fan splitter you mention from microcenter i live nearby but it is 3-pin only

what happens when CPU temperature is above than 40C say during summer?

i think the only 4-pin fan i have is the stock intel cooler when i bought the box, not sure where it is.

speedfan doesn't work on asus the way it works on msi. i can't figure why

does HWMonitor work like speedfan?

i've set up the bios like u said, but all my fans are the 3-pin. what's the best i can do with this?

asus requires a fan in the cpu header or it won't boot. or it crashes


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 1:20 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
HWMonitor from CPUID is a Windows monitoring program which will show actual fan speeds (provided any 3 pin fans are three wire). It doesn't do any fan control. The issue of 3 pin fans running full speed when plugged into the CPU PWM header is an inherent feature of your motherboard. One way to solve it is to get a PWM fan for your existing CPU cooler.
dan wrote:
what happens when CPU temperature is above than 40C say during summer?
The motherboard sends an increasingly higher PWM duty cycle signal to the fan until the CPU temperature stabilises. So a balancing point is arrived at, and the hotter conditions are the higher that point, and fan speeds will be.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:08 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
HWMonitor from CPUID is a Windows monitoring program which will show actual fan speeds (provided any 3 pin fans are three wire). It doesn't do any fan control. The issue of 3 pin fans running full speed when plugged into the CPU PWM header is an inherent feature of your motherboard. One way to solve it is to get a PWM fan for your existing CPU cooler.
dan wrote:
what happens when CPU temperature is above than 40C say during summer?
The motherboard sends an increasingly higher PWM duty cycle signal to the fan until the CPU temperature stabilises. So a balancing point is arrived at, and the hotter conditions are the higher that point, and fan speeds will be.


are pwm always 4 pin fans?

right now what i'm thinking is attaching my panasonic panaflo which i have 4 at $20 each, each 3-pin to a 4-pin molex reversed to 5 volts

maybe buying a 4-pin pwm fan only for the cpu and spin it to silent via bios.

btw does asus p5k allow undervolting? i can't seemingly adjust it in bios.

also there are 2 x16 pcie slots. one has a nvidia 7600gs card

the second is empty. is there any way i can add a nvme pci e card and then ad a m.2 samsung and make it bootable?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 3:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
dan wrote:
are pwm always 4 pin fans?
Yes, one 12V wire, one earth, one fan speed and one PWM control signal.
dan wrote:
...the second is empty. is there any way i can add a nvme pci e card and then ad a m.2 samsung and make it bootable?
I think this is unlikely to work because you need BIOS support which I suspect will be missing because of the age of the chipset. The board has conventional SATA ports, what would now be called SATA 2. So any current SSD should work but would be speed limited. Most SSDs are 2.5 inch so you would likely need a 2.5/3.5 inch convertor/tray to fit it to your existing case.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:21 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
dan wrote:
are pwm always 4 pin fans?
Yes, one 12V wire, one earth, one fan speed and one PWM control signal.
dan wrote:
...the second is empty. is there any way i can add a nvme pci e card and then ad a m.2 samsung and make it bootable?
I think this is unlikely to work because you need BIOS support which I suspect will be missing because of the age of the chipset. The board has conventional SATA ports, what would now be called SATA 2. So any current SSD should work but would be speed limited. Most SSDs are 2.5 inch so you would likely need a 2.5/3.5 inch convertor/tray to fit it to your existing case.


thanks for clarifying. what i've done is used the stock 4-pin intel cooler and stuck in.

re: how do i know if bios supports it nvme via pci-16x slot? does the card have any info?

i am sure i can use the sata ssd without problems


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:59 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
i had in mind a product similar to

StarTech.com PEX4M2E1 M.2 Adapter – x4 PCIe 3.0 NVMe – Low Profile and Full Profile – SSD PCIE M.2 Adapter – M2 SSD – PCI Express SSD

there are 2 pci 16x one of which has a nvidia 7600gs card.

the second pci 16x i'm not sure i think it is for a second nvidia card for dual sli
but i'm not sure if it can be made to use a StarTech.com PEX4M2E1 M.2 Adapter – x4 PCIe 3.0 NVMe

and how to configure bios to accept it for a storage bootable device, if its possible


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:50 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
The only issue is whether the drive will appear in the BIOS, in the list of boot devices and/or list of drives. The advice from Intel suggests that booting may be a problem, but StarTech don't seem to agree. Maybe you will have to try it and see.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 8:07 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
The only issue is whether the drive will appear in the BIOS, in the list of boot devices and/or list of drives. The advice from Intel suggests that booting may be a problem, but StarTech don't seem to agree. Maybe you will have to try it and see.


yeah, i would buy it at microcenter which is close and if it doesn't work i can easily return it.

for me the other issue is i greatly prefer windows 7 and office 2003

windows 10 and office 2016 ribbon means i have to re-learn everything

i know windows 7 doesn't have an nvme driver?

btw i set up the fans like u said. i used the intel 4-pin stock fan that comes with the cpu core2duo 3ghz
and used bios silent. asus will not work, boot, hang freeze if i don't have a cpu fan.

i then connected 3-pin panasonic panaflo and via bios set it to chassis fan 60%

when i bought asus p5k it was advertise as new but i notice the sticker with serial # was scratch off, not sure if intentional or not, i headed over to asus to ask about nvme pci startech but they require i enter serial #

how much difference in performance as a boot drive sata vs nvme m.2 ssd for a samsung ssd? how much performance do i lose by going sata ssd vs nvme?

the bios does support bootable add-in card, but i'm unclear how to configure the second 16x pci-e
i tried adding a pci-e 1x usb card in it and computer refuses to post, it hangs on boot screen.

bios lets me configure it to 1x pci-e but nvme startech is 4x pci-e


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 10:46 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
The best source for a NVME drive is normally the manufacturer of the hardware. Samsung for example. It might be worth noting the content of the SPCR article on the Samsung 950 Pro NVME M.2 drive. And what Samsung say are the minimum system requirements needed for their NVME driver (from the PDF download from here). Both sources to me suggest that unless StarTech's adapter has a way of getting round this it is unlikely that you could boot a NVME drive with your motherboard.

The alternative is a 2.5 SATA SSD which would run at somewhat less than SATA 3 speeds due to your motherboard using the earlier SATA 2 standard. For example, the Samsung 860 Evo SSD benchmark tests give read and write speeds in the 500 MB/s plus range (see image below from the TechAdviser review). With your motherboard I would have thought with the same drive you would get around 300 MB/s. This I suspect would feel a lot faster than a hard disk drive. And using Windows 7 would be fine because as an operating system it supports the TRIM function needed for SSD drives.

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:40 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
thanks for info its helpful. i guess sata ssd it is :( do i need to load any additional drivers ?

i bought asus p5k from this guy

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Asus-P5K-Socke ... SwFnFV9anq

i decided to set it up as you suggested.

one thing i notice is bios has an option that says "plug and play operating system" disable, so i enable since windows 7 and 10 are plug and play

it doesn't boot at all. only when i click disable does it work.

i was able to transfer all my components from my old builds to this new one.

only has 4 main sata ports. apparently boot drive only 2 sata ports work as boot.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 8:50 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
dan wrote:
thanks for info its helpful. i guess sata ssd it is :( do i need to load any additional drivers ?
No, installing the SATA chipset drivers is all you need to do.
dan wrote:
one thing i notice is bios has an option that says "plug and play operating system" disable, so i enable since windows 7 and 10 are plug and play
Although it does not seem correct, as you have found this option need to be set to no or disable for Windows to work correctly.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
dan wrote:
thanks for info its helpful. i guess sata ssd it is :( do i need to load any additional drivers ?
No, installing the SATA chipset drivers is all you need to do.
dan wrote:
one thing i notice is bios has an option that says "plug and play operating system" disable, so i enable since windows 7 and 10 are plug and play
Although it does not seem correct, as you have found this option need to be set to no or disable for Windows to work correctly.


yeah its strange. windows 7 does have sata drivers. i think.

have you heard of clover EFI bootloader a program that lets you boot pci ssd on legacy bios? originally develop to let hackintoshes

Clover EFI bootloader download | SourceForge.net
https://sourceforge.net/projects/cloverefiboot/

apparently it might be possible to boot ssd pci nvme on a legacy bios, not sure how to configure the second 16x pci e though


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:17 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
This thread from win-raid.com may help. Agreed the benchmarks for NVME drives are impressive but I do wonder whether in actual use under Windows there is that much difference in speed between NVME and SATA SSDs. And if that's the case is all the potential hassle with Clover EFI really going to be worth it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:58 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
This thread from win-raid.com may help. Agreed the benchmarks for NVME drives are impressive but I do wonder whether in actual use under Windows there is that much difference in speed between NVME and SATA SSDs. And if that's the case is all the potential hassle with Clover EFI really going to be worth it.


another issue i'm not entirely clear about is obtaining and installing nvme drivers for windows 7.

do you have any experience with this or with Clover EFI?

btw do i have to worry about overheating if the only fans is a PSU fan 120mm, a cpu fan, and 1 case fan?

things like hard drive, chip set ddr memory overheating reducing lifespan?

on my original msi platinum 975x v2 the caps literally exploded. and i could smell it.

i was watching vids on my msi when it shut down, and i could smell a strong chemical smell akin to bleach.

i open it up and 3 caps were all burned up.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:46 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
dan wrote:
btw do i have to worry about overheating if the only fans is a PSU fan 120mm, a cpu fan, and 1 case fan?
Using Asus motherboard thermal fan control there will be a set CPU temperature, normally around 70-75Cm, where all fans will be set to run at full speed. The Core 2 Duo CPU in your motherboard will also throttle if it overheats so in theory you should not get overheating. However it depends on the number of fans you are using, and their spec. If your case has additional fan positions you could consider filling them. Or replacing existing fans with higher speed ones.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:55 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
dan wrote:
btw do i have to worry about overheating if the only fans is a PSU fan 120mm, a cpu fan, and 1 case fan?
Using Asus motherboard thermal fan control there will be a set CPU temperature, normally around 70-75Cm, where all fans will be set to run at full speed. The Core 2 Duo CPU in your motherboard will also throttle if it overheats so in theory you should not get overheating. However it depends on the number of fans you are using, and their spec. If your case has additional fan positions you could consider filling them. Or replacing existing fans with higher speed ones.


i have a corsair carbide case from 2006 that has a top 160cm fan and 3 case fans all use the 4-pin molex

they have a switch that sets it to high low but even with low kinda loud :(

i don't want caps blowing though


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:06 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 1630
Location: UK
I am familiar with that type of case. The one change you could make is to fit a PWM exhaust fan using a PWM Y cable to run it from the CPU header. From your local PC store the cheapest PWM fan should be around $15 and a PWM Y cable around $5. So for $20 this setup will give an exhaust fan which will run in sync with the CPU header. In sync means at the same PWM duty cycle. This arrangement works essentially by pumping out hot air in proportion to how stressed the CPU is. Apart from removing heated air it also generates some case airflow to replace it. Using the Asus Silent profile in the BIOS the exhaust PWM fan could stay at its minimum speed during idle and low system stress. But under gaming conditions it would ramp up automatically. A low cost PWM fan typically has a range of about 600 to 2000 rpm. However the aim is not really to get anywhere near that top speed. What you should find is that under load it will reach a balancing point based on how hot the CPU is and ambient temperature. It will be much more of a safeguard against overheating than running a fixed speed exhaust fan.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:40 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
lodestar wrote:
I am familiar with that type of case. The one change you could make is to fit a PWM exhaust fan using a PWM Y cable to run it from the CPU header. From your local PC store the cheapest PWM fan should be around $15 and a PWM Y cable around $5. So for $20 this setup will give an exhaust fan which will run in sync with the CPU header. In sync means at the same PWM duty cycle. This arrangement works essentially by pumping out hot air in proportion to how stressed the CPU is. Apart from removing heated air it also generates some case airflow to replace it. Using the Asus Silent profile in the BIOS the exhaust PWM fan could stay at its minimum speed during idle and low system stress. But under gaming conditions it would ramp up automatically. A low cost PWM fan typically has a range of about 600 to 2000 rpm. However the aim is not really to get anywhere near that top speed. What you should find is that under load it will reach a balancing point based on how hot the CPU is and ambient temperature. It will be much more of a safeguard against overheating than running a fixed speed exhaust fan.


you know everything lol
both asus p5k and corsair carbide

my case is similar to the Corsair Carbide 400 but the usb ports are on top not the front face

Image

so i would need a 4-pin pwm connector.

my current setup i have is that i have a panasonic 3-pin panaflo connected to the chassis fan
and i use a the same split fan header for 3-pin and use the asus bios q-profile to spin it down to 60%

1 for corsair vx450 power supply the other as a side panel case fan that blows air directly over GPU
+ stock intel 4-pin pwm fan on scythe ninja


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2018 11:27 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Sep 23, 2017 6:49 am
Posts: 110
I think the decline of this site's popularity happened for several reasons:
1) Less people use desktops
2) Increased energy efficiency = less noise
3) Improvement in quality of PC parts (in aggregate)
4) Improvement of quality control of PC parts (the companies that offered inferior products went out of business)
5) Lack of strong social media involvement to bring in younger people
6) Youtube reviews that can give the viewer a clearer sense of the product than a written review alone.
7) Silent PC's are a very niche thing anyway.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: is SPCR dead due to technology advances?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2018 1:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2004 2:01 am
Posts: 1220
Derek Semeraro wrote:
I think the decline of this site's popularity happened for several reasons:
1) Less people use desktops
2) Increased energy efficiency = less noise
3) Improvement in quality of PC parts (in aggregate)
4) Improvement of quality control of PC parts (the companies that offered inferior products went out of business)
5) Lack of strong social media involvement to bring in younger people
6) Youtube reviews that can give the viewer a clearer sense of the product than a written review alone.
7) Silent PC's are a very niche thing anyway.


whatever became of

Aopen
SOYO
Soltec
DFI?

is there only 3 msi gigabyte and asus left?


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 42 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group