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 Post subject: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions welcome
PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 10:15 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:32 am
Posts: 5
Location: London, UK
Hi everyone.

I am building a silent mid-sized rig mostly for photo-video editing. I have started researches about two weeks ago to broaden my knowledge but I may need your opinions about PSU and CASE anyway.

Till now I've been decided to get:

CPU: Xeon E3-1231 V3
Cooling: Noctua NH-D14
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B002VKVZ1A
GPU: Gigabyte GeForce GT640
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0089AGH9G
PSU: Seasonic S12G-450 450W 80+ Gold Certified PSU with 12cm Silent Fan
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00GSJRDRK
CASE: SilverStone SST-FT03B
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B004KZH9TQ
MOBO: Not sure yet as it will be somehow case dependant, I am thinking of Z97 chipset, possibly from Gigabyte
RAM: Corsair CML8GX3M2A1600C9B Vengeance Low Profile 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 1600 Mhz CL9 XMP
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00569K7LM

but after reading several articles from this and others websites I may rethink CASE and PSU. I could confirm the Silverstone FT03 case looks poorly made, with lots of cheep plastic without solid frame - simply is not what I wanted.
Now I will be looking at Antec or Fractal Design cases - suggestions appreciated
As a PSU I am thinking about efficient possibly fanless solution but I am not sure about wattage I will need.
The power supplies calculator (http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp) showed 296W as minimum and 346W as recommended for this config. Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient and worth ~$160?

Thanks in advance for quick responds.


Last edited by fostel on Wed Nov 12, 2014 3:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 11:59 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:36 am
Posts: 4865
Location: Monterey Bay, CA
Welcome to SPCR.

The Xeon CPU without integrated gfx plus the GT 640 is a little odd. What's the driver for going this route rather than either:
- Xeon with integrated gfx
- Xeon w/o gfx + something like the GTX 750? (more than twice the horsepower of the GT 640, less power used, and only £10-15 more)

Photoshop makes use of the GPU for accelerating the display functions....but I think the HD gfx on a Xeon would handle it ok. Does your video editing s/w utilize the gpu for hardware acceleration?

case: Are you aiming for a mATX sized case?

cooler: dependant on case and mobo selection.

mobo: Gigabyte is fine. If you prefer BIOS based fan control, Asus, Asrock and MSI are much better. If you like s/w based fan control, Gigabyte's is similar to Asus.

PSU: stress load = CPU TDP + GPU TDP + ~ 50W = 80 + 65 + 50 = 195W. More likely video editing load of 150W. So, a 400W PSU is fine.

RAM: You have one of the few use cases for 16GB of RAM. Check out your current system's use...or, make sure to get a mobo with 4 RAM slots. You could go with 2x4GB now and add more later, if saving $'s.

storage: What are your plans? Highly recommend SSD(s) for OS/Apps/scratch disk and a slow rotating disk for finished media storage.

_________________
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, MSI Z87-G45, MSI GTX 760 2GB Gaming, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung Evo 250GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic X-560. 35-40W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 200-230W Rift, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Support SPCR through these links: NCIX, Amazon and Newegg


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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 2:17 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:12 am
Posts: 3358
Location: ITALY
fostel wrote:
I may rethink CASE and PSU...
...snipped out...
Thanks in advance for quick responds.

CASE: http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00JBBH93K
PSU: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00NC4I90E

_________________
Regards,
Luca

Support SPCR, use these links when you buy: NCIX, Amazon and Newegg


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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 3:16 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:32 am
Posts: 5
Location: London, UK
CA_Steve wrote:
Welcome to SPCR.
Thanks, appreciate quick reply too.
CA_Steve wrote:
The Xeon CPU without integrated gfx plus the GT 640 is a little odd.
Basically, I've started to follow this video to build low-noise hackintosh:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_S9ve7IIew
but after a little research I found out that small Silverstone PSU may be too noisy, water cooling pump could fail, spill etc., so decided to modify suggested config to meet my needs better.

First I decided to swap to bigger SilverStone SST-FT03B to get more ATX PSU options and Noctua NH-D14 as many recommends. I received case today and I am disappointed, will return it and now I am on the beginning again - that’s why I am looking to get feedback from SPCR society.

My goals:
silent, solid, vibration free construction
efficient, reliable
budget ~$1000
case must fit this hardware comfortably with decent air flow but not many fans, rather minimalist design, one optical drive if any

CA_Steve wrote:
What's the driver for going this route rather than either:
- Xeon with integrated gfx
Integrated isn't hackintosh friendly. Nvidia's more likely are. This particular GT640 claim to be silent, comments were good for video editing and costs me $120 - the cheapest deal I've seen

CA_Steve wrote:
- Xeon w/o gfx + something like the GTX 750? (more than twice the horsepower of the GT 640, less power used, and only £10-15 more)
I am trying to cut costs of course but sensible. I didn't know 750 are more efficient in competitive prices (suggestions? - silence factor, ports - hdmi and/or display port) Are GTX versions for gamers?

CA_Steve wrote:
Photoshop makes use of the GPU for accelerating the display functions....but I think the HD gfx on a Xeon would handle it ok. Does your video editing s/w utilize the gpu for hardware acceleration?

Yes it does but not as much as CPU
CA_Steve wrote:
case: Are you aiming for a mATX sized case?

No, I am not
CA_Steve wrote:
cooler: dependant on case and mobo selection.


CA_Steve wrote:
mobo: Gigabyte is fine. If you prefer BIOS based fan control, Asus, Asrock and MSI are much better. If you like s/w based fan control, Gigabyte's is similar to Asus.

I am not sure if others are as hackintosh friendly as Gigabyte.
CA_Steve wrote:
PSU: stress load = CPU TDP + GPU TDP + ~ 50W = 80 + 65 + 50 = 195W. More likely video editing load of 150W. So, a 400W PSU is fine.

Really good to hear, so it looks like I know the first component, to build the system on :-)
CA_Steve wrote:
RAM: You have one of the few use cases for 16GB of RAM. Check out your current system's use...or, make sure to get a mobo with 4 RAM slots. You could go with 2x4GB now and add more later, if saving $'s.

I heard that not many users will need as much as 16GB, so decided to go with 8GB but mainly because of budget. Choosed 2x4GB as they are CL9 rather than 1x8GB CL10 or 11
CA_Steve wrote:
storage: What are your plans? Highly recommend SSD(s) for OS/Apps/scratch disk and a slow rotating disk for finished media storage.

I am using SSD as OS/Apps/scratch disk and HDD's as media storage. Currently, dual boot: Linux (for all daily tasks) - Windows (photo workflow), but trying to move workflow to OSX

I already own and will try to use in future set up:
SSD, Samsung 840pro 256GB (MZ-7PD256BW)
HDD, Samsung Spinpoint MP4 HM640JJ 640GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 2.5"
HDD, Samsung Spinpoint MP4 HM320HJ 320GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 2.5" (external usb3)
ASUS PA246Q 1900x1200 monitor (HDMI, Display Port)

In the future I will be glad to see some RAID with 3,5" HDD's (case should allow me) but I can't tell now if hackintosh will handle it. I never done it on Linux as well.


Many thanks.
Fostel

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Fostel


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 Post subject: Re: Hackintosh build help
PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2014 7:54 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:36 am
Posts: 4865
Location: Monterey Bay, CA
As they say, you buried the lead. :)

There's a whole load of Mac models (laptops, Mac Mini come to mind) that operate with Haswell's integrated gfx...so suprised that Hackintosh enthusiasts are pointing you to a discrete card. You ought to recheck that. You can always add a gfx card. Since Apple flips back and forth between AMD and NVidia in their model years, you really need to make sure any particular gfx card will work/ drivers are covered.

Hackintosh mobo: yep, go for Gigabyte.

Case: I'm fond of my Fractal Design Define R4. Build thread is in signature. If you want smaller, there's the Define Mini. There's many others...

_________________
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, MSI Z87-G45, MSI GTX 760 2GB Gaming, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung Evo 250GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic X-560. 35-40W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 200-230W Rift, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Support SPCR through these links: NCIX, Amazon and Newegg


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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 1:17 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 6:54 am
Posts: 3026
Location: Sweden
Go with Intel graphics first, then buy a card later if needed. OOB = Out Of Box, means that it worked without changing anything, just like installing on an Apple computer.
http://wiki.osx86project.org/wiki/index ... .0#INTEL_2


The i7 4770 has a GPU, is cheaper than the Xeon you picked, and runs at the same speed.
http://pricespy.co.uk/category.php?m=s1 ... #prodlista

The D14 is overpriced, The HR-02 cost £20 less and performes better at low fan speeds.
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1279-page6.html
http://pricespy.co.uk/product.php?p=1069729

No point in using a Z board if you're not overclocking.

Here's a list of parts I picked, you have to make sure everything fits of course:
http://pricespy.co.uk/list.php?l=11528&view=o

Edit: That didn't work. I'll post again.

I'd go for 16 GB, I just ran out of 7 GB RAM by running Opera and Spotify. :D


Last edited by Mats on Thu Nov 13, 2014 3:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 2:50 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:12 am
Posts: 3358
Location: ITALY
fostel wrote:
ASUS PA246Q 1900x1200 monitor (HDMI, Display Port)

You already have a good, wide gamut 10bit monitor, why don't you aim at an entry level 10bit graphics?

Anyway, look at the two reviews SPCR made onto the FT03: IMHO it's not that good, unless you felt in love with its design.

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Regards,
Luca

Support SPCR, use these links when you buy: NCIX, Amazon and Newegg


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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Thu Nov 13, 2014 3:13 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 6:54 am
Posts: 3026
Location: Sweden
My list included:

Intel Core i7 4770
http://pricespy.co.uk/product.php?p=1916694

Thermalright HR-02 Macho
http://pricespy.co.uk/product.php?p=1069729

Be-Quiet Straight Power 10 400W
http://pricespy.co.uk/product.php?p=2796595

Gigabyte GA-B85M-D3H
http://pricespy.co.uk/product.php?p=1953853

Corsair Vengeance LP DDR3 PC12800/1600MHz CL9 2x4GB
http://pricespy.co.uk/product.php?p=916997

Fractal Design Define Mini
http://pricespy.co.uk/product.php?p=807666


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 Post subject: Re: Hackintosh build help
PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 3:03 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:32 am
Posts: 5
Location: London, UK
Hi guys!
On the first place thanks for numerous answers.

CA_Steve wrote:
As they say, you buried the lead. :)
You are absolutely right :-)

CA_Steve wrote:
There's a whole load of Mac models (laptops, Mac Mini come to mind) that operate with Haswell's integrated gfx...
Correct, Intel integrated gfx is supported OOB according to http://osx86project.org/

CA_Steve wrote:
so suprised that Hackintosh enthusiasts are pointing you to a discrete card. You ought to recheck that. You can always add a gfx card. Since Apple flips back and forth between AMD and NVidia in their model years, you really need to make sure any particular gfx card will work/ drivers are covered.
We may guess, how so called "hackintosh enthusiasts" suggestions work being linked directly to amazon or/and newegg... I learnt a lot recently, specially I am glad to find sad truth about Hackintoshing:
http://prasys.info/2011/01/tonymac-seriously/
http://www.insanelymac.com/forum/topic/ ... eal-again/

and the real mine of knowledge at: http://osx86project.org/

CA_Steve wrote:
Hackintosh mobo: yep, go for Gigabyte.
Luckily, it appears not to be so true. I would opt for mobo with BIOS based fan control.

CA_Steve wrote:
Case: I'm fond of my Fractal Design Define R4. Build thread is in signature. If you want smaller, there's the Define Mini. There's many others...
Professionally looking case design (solid ~12kg!) and both USB2 and USB3 on top panel plus fan controller. Nice. If I will go with Fractal Design it will be Define R4 rather than mini as is not much wider and supports 140mm fans, and ATX standard mobo. Cost in UK:~£80 ~$125 - about right, still £23 less than Silverstone I returned.

_________________
Regards,
Fostel


Last edited by fostel on Sat Nov 15, 2014 3:39 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 3:35 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:32 am
Posts: 5
Location: London, UK
Mats wrote:
Go with Intel graphics first, then buy a card later if needed. OOB = Out Of Box, means that it worked without changing anything, just like installing on an Apple computer.
http://wiki.osx86project.org/wiki/index ... .0#INTEL_2
That's right, thanks for correcting me.

Mats wrote:
The i7 4770 has a GPU, is cheaper than the Xeon you picked, and runs at the same speed.
http://pricespy.co.uk/category.php?m=s1 ... #prodlista
I've checked offers from first two shops your linked and it appears to show different CPU's than listed - risky.

On the island Xeon's are now cheaper than i7 4770 (2013 - 3.4GHz) ~£230 (http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-cpu-bx80646i74770) appropriately:
E3 1230 v3 (2013 - 3.3GHz) ~ £195 (http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-c ... 46e31230v3)
E3 1231 v3 (2014 - 3.4GHz) ~ £215 (http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/intel-c ... 46e31231v3)


Mats wrote:
The D14 is overpriced, The HR-02 cost £20 less and performes better at low fan speeds.
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1279-page6.html
http://pricespy.co.uk/product.php?p=1069729
I will have a look, thanks. However don't forget Noctua is 2-fan cooler (fan cost ~£20 separately) and they provide extremely good warranty service.

Mats wrote:
No point in using a Z board if you're not overclocking.
Overclocking abilities are minor to me, that's right but I may like to see some expert options in BIOS anyway (undervolting rams, cpu, controlling fans etc.). Need help with mobo and chipset! Asus, MSI, AsRock, Gigabyte?

Mats wrote:
I'd go for 16 GB, I just ran out of 7 GB RAM by running Opera and Spotify. :D
I've returned that 2x4GB and I'd go with 16GB so mobo may be 2 slots from now.



quest_for_silence wrote:
You already have a good, wide gamut 10bit monitor, why don't you aim at an entry level 10bit graphics?
Honestly, I thought any ~£100 card will be fine. Didn't check 10bit graphics before. Thanks for the tip!

Update: I found AMD FirePro™ V4900 Graphics http://www.amd.com/en-us/products/graph ... o-3d/4900# ~£130
or even cheaper V3900 http://www.amd.com/en-us/products/graph ... o-3d/3900# but definitely those small gpu-fans installed looks noisy


quest_for_silence wrote:
Anyway, look at the two reviews SPCR made onto the FT03: IMHO it's not that good, unless you felt in love with its design.
Absolutely right - is not that good! I've done my own organoleptic tests and could confirm what the reviews treat of.


Mats wrote:
Intel Core i7 4770
Better choice than i7 4770K which turned out to be castrated from functions/instructions:
http://ark.intel.com/compare/75054,80910,75122,75123

Mats wrote:
Thermalright HR-02 Macho
Pinned on to my shopping basket but not decided yet (will read SPCR review soon)

Mats wrote:
Be-Quiet Straight Power 10 400W
Anything worthy to swap from fan-less passive £100 Seasonic SS-400FL to £70 active Be-Quiet Straight Power 10 400W?

Mats wrote:
Gigabyte GA-B85M-D3H
I didn't even knew B85 chipset exist before you posted :-) Haven't been researching yet.

_________________
Regards,
Fostel


Last edited by fostel on Sat Nov 15, 2014 12:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 7:27 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:32 am
Posts: 5
Location: London, UK
Summary:
Build budget: £650 ~ $1000

Goals:
Silent, solid, vibration free construction
Efficient, reliable
Case must fit chosen hardware comfortably with decent air flow but not many fans, rather minimalist design, one optical drive if any
HDMI or/and Display Port, DVI-I
Linux Ubuntu (critical), Hackintosh (minor) compatibility


Final thoughts for today :

Most probably I would go with:
CASE: Fractal Design Define R4 (http://www.fractal-design.com/home/prod ... lack-pearl) £80
PSU: Seasonic SS-400FL (http://www.seasonicusa.com/Platinum_Series_FL2.htm) £100 or be quiet! Straight Power 10 400W (http://www.bequiet.com/en/powersupply/518) £70
and
RAM: 16GB £120

MOBO: ATX, mini-ATX

CPU:
Intel Xeon £195 or i7 £230 but after digging deeper I found that Intel-Cinebench scam and other real life reviews about AMD-Intel I could support AMD-ATI, especially when real enthusiasts successfully building AMD hackintoshes. If it will be impossible sill I've got Win7Pro 64bit to run Lightroom. So new challenge may be an AMD FX8350 Black Edition 8 Core Processor (4.0GHz, 125W) rig for example: http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B009O7YUF6 ~£125 or AMD A10 7850K Black Edition with Radeon R7 Series New FM2+ Kaveri HSA CPU http://www.amazon.co.uk/AMD-AD785KXBJAB ... B00H7Z7YMI ~£120 with some decent ATX mobo and AMD FirePro card?
What do you think guys?

Video card:
AMD FirePro™ V4900 Graphics http://www.amd.com/en-us/products/graph ... o-3d/4900# £130
AMD FirePro™ V3900 Professional Graphics http://www.amd.com/en-us/products/graph ... o-3d/3900# £85
other? Don't know yet but will try to choose 10bit pro versions to fit wide gamut 10bit monitor Asus PA246Q 1920x1200

Cooler:
Noctua NH-D14 £64 or Thermalright HR-02 Macho £40

_________________
Regards,
Fostel


Last edited by fostel on Sat Nov 15, 2014 12:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Will Seasonic SS-400FL be sufficient? All sugestions wel
PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2014 11:55 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:36 am
Posts: 4865
Location: Monterey Bay, CA
AMD is horribly inferior in performance and power use vs Intel Haswell. The only upside is price. Here's a comparion of the 8350 vs i7-4790.

_________________
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, MSI Z87-G45, MSI GTX 760 2GB Gaming, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung Evo 250GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic X-560. 35-40W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 200-230W Rift, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Support SPCR through these links: NCIX, Amazon and Newegg


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