Hi All,
I have a P4 3.06 with a brand new Zalman CNPS7000Cu, an enermax 450W PSU (2 fan version), noisy-ass HDD's and a Radeon 9000 PRO (with a fan). Whenever i start to put my machine under load, and i mean IMMEDIATELY, i get a change in the tone of my system. It seems that whenever something cpu intensive happens, the noise of my system lowers in pitch, as though its 'gearing down' while the CPU works harder. Now, i know it isnt the zalman fan, because it isnt temperature controlled. I am wondering whether it could be the video card, or the PSU? It is noticable even when picking a brush in photoshop, and painting - when u paint, the machine's pitch grows deeper, when u stop painting, it returns to its higher, normal pitch.
Has anyone else experienced this? Its really annoying -- personally, i'd prefer a CONSISTENT level of noise as opposed to a fluctuating one.
thanks guys!
koninc
What is this noise!!!
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Mr_Smartepants
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I'd hazard a guess and say it's probably your power supply. The CPU is probably sucking all the Amps it can from the 3.3V line which is causing a sag on the other rails. Maybe switching to an Antec TruePower series (with isolated volt rails) would help.
To check, try disconnecting/unpluging un-needed devices (ie; modem, cd/dvd, extra hard drives, etc.) to alleviate the power draw.
Also try disconnecting your speakers to see if it's your audio subsystem.
These are just some thoughts. I could be wrong (more than likely).
To check, try disconnecting/unpluging un-needed devices (ie; modem, cd/dvd, extra hard drives, etc.) to alleviate the power draw.
Also try disconnecting your speakers to see if it's your audio subsystem.
These are just some thoughts. I could be wrong (more than likely).
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dukla2000
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I vote with Smartepants, although your P4 takes power from the +12V. And when it gets loaded (together with the average stuff loading the +12V) your psu is struggling, the 12V sags, and all your fans (even the Zalman) dependant on +12V also slow down slightly. (Then again, you can check if we are both wrong by running MBM and checking the high/low +12V after a while. The average should be +-2% and doesn't make much difference if it is + or -. However, ideally the high/low should be no more than 0.1V from the average and definately 0.2V or more from average indicates we are on track.)
I have never owned an Enermax so speak with complete insight (
): from what I have read about them I am glad have never owned one, and have no plans to change.
If you are planning a new psu then because your P4 needs 12V power, look for one that has plenty available on +12V: 15A seems to be average, you are probably better with 18-20.
I have never owned an Enermax so speak with complete insight (
): from what I have read about them I am glad have never owned one, and have no plans to change.If you are planning a new psu then because your P4 needs 12V power, look for one that has plenty available on +12V: 15A seems to be average, you are probably better with 18-20.
dukla, smartie, thanks for the replies.
I must confes that i really know nothing about these +12, -12, etc etc voltages in my machine. I have convieniently ignored them and now it seems that some knowledge in that area would be useful. Could anyone briefly give me the low-down on these?
Anyway!
I run MBM and here are the hi/low/av values for the +12 line are
Average: 12.20 V
Low: 11.98 (!) V
Hi: 12.46 V
currently at 12.04 V
This seems like the sort of large deviations you mentioned dukla! What can i do about this? New PSU? I am only running the zalman, a cd rom drive, 2 hard disks, and of course the mobo/cpu off this thing... Whats going on!!
Tia!
koninc
I must confes that i really know nothing about these +12, -12, etc etc voltages in my machine. I have convieniently ignored them and now it seems that some knowledge in that area would be useful. Could anyone briefly give me the low-down on these?
Anyway!
I run MBM and here are the hi/low/av values for the +12 line are
Average: 12.20 V
Low: 11.98 (!) V
Hi: 12.46 V
currently at 12.04 V
This seems like the sort of large deviations you mentioned dukla! What can i do about this? New PSU? I am only running the zalman, a cd rom drive, 2 hard disks, and of course the mobo/cpu off this thing... Whats going on!!
Tia!
koninc
It really isn't. Your rails are doing just fine. In fact, the figure is great. It might be something else that is interfering with your PSU. By default, enermax PSUs are really good at giving consistant power... now quietness in the other hand....koninc wrote:dukla, smartie, thanks for the replies.
I must confes that i really know nothing about these +12, -12, etc etc voltages in my machine. I have convieniently ignored them and now it seems that some knowledge in that area would be useful. Could anyone briefly give me the low-down on these?
Anyway!
I run MBM and here are the hi/low/av values for the +12 line are
Average: 12.20 V
Low: 11.98 (!) V
Hi: 12.46 V
currently at 12.04 V
This seems like the sort of large deviations you mentioned dukla! What can i do about this? New PSU? I am only running the zalman, a cd rom drive, 2 hard disks, and of course the mobo/cpu off this thing... Whats going on!!
Tia!
koninc
What I am thinking more likely is your PSU has active fan control and it changes speed based on load as well as temp. Your load under heavy usage might be kicking the PSU fan speed up/down. Since the Fan in PSU isn't quite, it should be very noticeble. I suggest you do fan swap with something quieter.
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dukla2000
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I'm not sure I agree with jinu that your readings are 'great' - they are +2%, -2% after all, but certainly they are not catastrophic. From a reliability point of view, those readings probably have a long life in front of them.
So comes back to your variable noise issue. To prove the theory (or me wrong) swap the MBM interval to 1 second, and leave the display visible. Hopefully at idle most of your 'current' readings are very close to 12.20V. Then pick a brush and paint (and watch the voltage) - probably drops to around 12.00V. If so, that 2% fall is also happening to your fans, which is what I figure you are hearing. (Also watch if the volts stay at 12 the whole time you are painting or if they climb back quickly, and if they climb back as soon as you stop painting and the noise reverts?)
I doubt the Enermax fan is immediately linked to the psu load: only indirectly via temp, which takes 10s of seconds to have an effect. But if that is the noisiest fan, then the 2% swing will be most noticable on it. (You can do a slightly more fun test to prove this: try stop the fan by putting a finger on the central hub. Then stick a pen in it to stop it restarting, and repeat the load test in para 2. If your noise is constant you have located the fan worst affected by the voltage drop. Note fan specs say the fan should withstand being locked for hours and still be able to restart so as long as you dont physically damage the fan when stopping it this test is OK).
3.3V - AGP cards, DDR RAM voltage regulator, maybe some other mobo bits (northbridge?)
5V - all drive electronics, most mobo electronics, most PCI cards, AMD CPU regulators to VCore of say 1.60V, old RAM regulators
12V - all drive motors, most fans, Intel CPU regulator
The ATX spec says these voltages must be +-5% maximum. In practice you want them to be as stable as possible, so in my opinion a 12V line that sits at 11.50V the whole time is more desirable than one that averages 12.00V but fluctuates from 11.50 to 12.50V. The difficulty is especially processor power draw fluctuates wildly: at idle a modern CPU may only need 5W, under full load closer to 80W, and the change can be in a fraction of a second. It is very hard to design a psu that remains 100% stable with these fluctuations, but also bear in mind the on mobo regulation for the CPU also can smooth these fluctuations slightly.
So comes back to your variable noise issue. To prove the theory (or me wrong) swap the MBM interval to 1 second, and leave the display visible. Hopefully at idle most of your 'current' readings are very close to 12.20V. Then pick a brush and paint (and watch the voltage) - probably drops to around 12.00V. If so, that 2% fall is also happening to your fans, which is what I figure you are hearing. (Also watch if the volts stay at 12 the whole time you are painting or if they climb back quickly, and if they climb back as soon as you stop painting and the noise reverts?)
I doubt the Enermax fan is immediately linked to the psu load: only indirectly via temp, which takes 10s of seconds to have an effect. But if that is the noisiest fan, then the 2% swing will be most noticable on it. (You can do a slightly more fun test to prove this: try stop the fan by putting a finger on the central hub. Then stick a pen in it to stop it restarting, and repeat the load test in para 2. If your noise is constant you have located the fan worst affected by the voltage drop. Note fan specs say the fan should withstand being locked for hours and still be able to restart so as long as you dont physically damage the fan when stopping it this test is OK).
Your psu produces 3 voltages of interest (3.3V, 5V and 12V) 1 of side interest (+5VSB for powering stuff during standby) and 2 for historic compatibility (-5V, -12V). There is some debate about which voltages are used for which components (which can be settled by reading all the circuit diagrams!), but my rough guide is:I must confes that i really know nothing about these +12, -12, etc etc voltages in my machine. I have convieniently ignored them and now it seems that some knowledge in that area would be useful. Could anyone briefly give me the low-down on these?
3.3V - AGP cards, DDR RAM voltage regulator, maybe some other mobo bits (northbridge?)
5V - all drive electronics, most mobo electronics, most PCI cards, AMD CPU regulators to VCore of say 1.60V, old RAM regulators
12V - all drive motors, most fans, Intel CPU regulator
The ATX spec says these voltages must be +-5% maximum. In practice you want them to be as stable as possible, so in my opinion a 12V line that sits at 11.50V the whole time is more desirable than one that averages 12.00V but fluctuates from 11.50 to 12.50V. The difficulty is especially processor power draw fluctuates wildly: at idle a modern CPU may only need 5W, under full load closer to 80W, and the change can be in a fraction of a second. It is very hard to design a psu that remains 100% stable with these fluctuations, but also bear in mind the on mobo regulation for the CPU also can smooth these fluctuations slightly.
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ez2remember
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Re: What is this noise!!!
Your PSU is fairly noisy by SPCR standards, running a 3.06Ghz must consume quite a lot of power, and disppitate a lot of heat into your PSU. This is probably causing your PSU fans to speed up pretty quickly and hence the noise you describe.koninc wrote:Hi All,
I have a P4 3.06 with a brand new Zalman CNPS7000Cu, an enermax 450W PSU (2 fan version), noisy-ass HDD's and a Radeon 9000 PRO (with a fan). Whenever i start to put my machine under load, and i mean IMMEDIATELY, i get a change in the tone of my system.
Either replace the fans, or think about getting a quiet PSU.
Dukla2000,
Thanks for the reply, very informative! Here are my results.
(i tried the paintbrush test-- not the fan-stop test yet (i only just woke up and dont wanna rip my machine apart till i'm more lucid))
Okay,
at idle, with MBM 1sec delay, my +12 is flicking between 12.10, and 12.04. ie, it will be 12.04 one second, then next reading 12.10, then back to 12.04 etc... Not anywhere near to 12.20, but anyway.
When i grab a brush in photoshop and start to paint, 'that noise' happens and my +12 goes up to flicking between 12.28 and 12.34.
It actually INCREASES!? This is not making sense to me! Or is it just that the PSU is working harder to spit out voltage on that line to (over) compensate for the more work it has to do when i draw?
Im glad you said that thermal changes need 10's of seconds to have any affect on fan speed, i though that from the start, its too instantaneous a change to be caused by a change in temp. Glad to have that verified
I will try stopping that fan later on today and see what my results are. The other thing is that i noticed is that my +3.3V line is reading 2.50 volts. Is this normal? or is something dodgy going on here? It doesnt change when i paint and create 'the noise'...
cheers!
koninc
Thanks for the reply, very informative! Here are my results.
(i tried the paintbrush test-- not the fan-stop test yet (i only just woke up and dont wanna rip my machine apart till i'm more lucid))
Okay,
at idle, with MBM 1sec delay, my +12 is flicking between 12.10, and 12.04. ie, it will be 12.04 one second, then next reading 12.10, then back to 12.04 etc... Not anywhere near to 12.20, but anyway.
When i grab a brush in photoshop and start to paint, 'that noise' happens and my +12 goes up to flicking between 12.28 and 12.34.
It actually INCREASES!? This is not making sense to me! Or is it just that the PSU is working harder to spit out voltage on that line to (over) compensate for the more work it has to do when i draw?
Im glad you said that thermal changes need 10's of seconds to have any affect on fan speed, i though that from the start, its too instantaneous a change to be caused by a change in temp. Glad to have that verified
I will try stopping that fan later on today and see what my results are. The other thing is that i noticed is that my +3.3V line is reading 2.50 volts. Is this normal? or is something dodgy going on here? It doesnt change when i paint and create 'the noise'...
cheers!
koninc
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dukla2000
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OK - seems it is most likely it is voltage changes causing fan speed changes. Once you try the test with each fan stoppped (for a minute or so) you will know exactly where you stand.
The 12V rising under load is curious. I thought all P4 mobos used 12V to derive the CPU VCore, and normally it should sag. Do you have the extra 4 pin (square, 2*2, 2 yellow wires, 2 black wires) power connector going from your psu to your mobo? If not, does your mobo have a spare socket (like the main mobo power except 2*2)? And does your psu have a spare, unconnected cable that looks like it should fit?
If your mobo is NOT using 12V to derive the VCore then it should be using 5V - what happens to your 5V during the test? The point is normally I would expect the rail powering the CPU to sag under load, then as a side effect of psu design the other rails tend to rise. So if your 12V is rising, perhaps your 5V is sagging?
And your 3.3V - 2.50V is completely unacceptable. The ATX12V spec explicitly says 3.14, 3.47V min/max. In my opinion it is a miracle you are not having serious memory & graphic problems (up to BSODs, hangs, freezes, crashes etc). It may be a reporting problem as opposed to actual (i.e. a problem with the voltage sensor and/or MBM on your mobo but I would be surprised that it is that bad - do you have a digital multimeter?) I suspect this is a secondary issue though (i.e. not related to your noise changes) but a really good justification to swap the psu if you can find any other excuse to add to the evidence against it.
ps - just remembered some mobo voltage sensors also report the VDimm (memory voltage) which should be 2.50V - perhaps it is your MBM config that is the root of the 3.3V problem.
The 12V rising under load is curious. I thought all P4 mobos used 12V to derive the CPU VCore, and normally it should sag. Do you have the extra 4 pin (square, 2*2, 2 yellow wires, 2 black wires) power connector going from your psu to your mobo? If not, does your mobo have a spare socket (like the main mobo power except 2*2)? And does your psu have a spare, unconnected cable that looks like it should fit?
If your mobo is NOT using 12V to derive the VCore then it should be using 5V - what happens to your 5V during the test? The point is normally I would expect the rail powering the CPU to sag under load, then as a side effect of psu design the other rails tend to rise. So if your 12V is rising, perhaps your 5V is sagging?
And your 3.3V - 2.50V is completely unacceptable. The ATX12V spec explicitly says 3.14, 3.47V min/max. In my opinion it is a miracle you are not having serious memory & graphic problems (up to BSODs, hangs, freezes, crashes etc). It may be a reporting problem as opposed to actual (i.e. a problem with the voltage sensor and/or MBM on your mobo but I would be surprised that it is that bad - do you have a digital multimeter?) I suspect this is a secondary issue though (i.e. not related to your noise changes) but a really good justification to swap the psu if you can find any other excuse to add to the evidence against it.
ps - just remembered some mobo voltage sensors also report the VDimm (memory voltage) which should be 2.50V - perhaps it is your MBM config that is the root of the 3.3V problem.
Thanks for all the replies guys, you all rock.
RIGHT! Down to business...
Stuck my head inside my box, comandeered my girlfriend to paint in photoshop, and then went around stopping fans. And i found the bastard! Its the whiney little thing on my Radeon. Its a real screamer, which sags when i do anything CPU intensive. Need to sort that out. Any ideas? Its only a radeon 9000pro...
My motherboard doesnt have the extra 4-pin power connector (even though my enermax has it) So its just the standard ATX power connector. So, i checked my +5v when i start painting, and Bam! Saggage. I guess that is what is dropping the rpm of the radeon fan.
Ive put up some screens of load and idle voltages,
http://room.anu.edu.au/~langdale/idle.jpg
http://room.anu.edu.au/~langdale/load.jpg
Check it out, it proves Im not lying about my +3.3 line I played with MBM's config, trying to get it to report something closer to 3.3, but i couldnt get it to change its mind at all. i guess its just going to lie forever.
Another question, those SilenX PSUs look awesome. The only thing is, i live in Australia, the land of sweeping plains, and 240volt power. Do these things work with 240 volts of juice? The only power supplies i can find with local distributors are shite Aopen ones, Enermax and Antecs. Can i just order from silenX and i'd be right? or they all american voltage.
Thanks again all
koninc
RIGHT! Down to business...
Stuck my head inside my box, comandeered my girlfriend to paint in photoshop, and then went around stopping fans. And i found the bastard! Its the whiney little thing on my Radeon. Its a real screamer, which sags when i do anything CPU intensive. Need to sort that out. Any ideas? Its only a radeon 9000pro...
My motherboard doesnt have the extra 4-pin power connector (even though my enermax has it) So its just the standard ATX power connector. So, i checked my +5v when i start painting, and Bam! Saggage. I guess that is what is dropping the rpm of the radeon fan.
Ive put up some screens of load and idle voltages,
http://room.anu.edu.au/~langdale/idle.jpg
http://room.anu.edu.au/~langdale/load.jpg
Check it out, it proves Im not lying about my +3.3 line
I played with MBM's config, trying to get it to report something closer to 3.3, but i couldnt get it to change its mind at all. i guess its just going to lie forever. Another question, those SilenX PSUs look awesome. The only thing is, i live in Australia, the land of sweeping plains, and 240volt power. Do these things work with 240 volts of juice? The only power supplies i can find with local distributors are shite Aopen ones, Enermax and Antecs. Can i just order from silenX and i'd be right? or they all american voltage.
Thanks again all
koninc
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dukla2000
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OK - in order what I would suggest:
'Fix' the cooling on your Radeon - a shotgun is excessive, I am no expert on these new fangled ATI cards but perhaps you can locate as well as fit one of those sexy Zalman heatpipe VGA coolers? (Any little fan is beyond redemption in terms of 'silent' PC.)
Next I actually feel your 3.3V reports are a problem with MBM and not with your psu. 99% chance this is actually the voltage your motherboard has regulated from the 3.3V to supply the memory, and 2.5V is a perfect number for DDR memory. If it was really that bad your machine should have crashed already!! In MBM settings, Voltages, Alarm, at the top if you select +3.3V as the voltage sensor, can you play with which board sensor it should display? (I can't as MBM is really sure about which mobo I have.)(Do you have MBM 5.3? Which mobo do you have: did it come with any monitoring software, and/or can you see your voltages reported in your BIOS?) Otherwise, if you have a multimeter then try measure your 3.3V directly. Easiest will be if you have another spare conector hanging out your psu - this time 6 pin in a line, 3 black, 2 orange & 1 red. The Orange are 3.3V, stick the +Ve from the multimeter on Orange, the -ve on Black. If you dont have this 6 pin connector, the only other place to find a 3.3V wire is the Orange cables in the main mobo power connector - you need something like a paperclip to 'extend' the power out of the plug long enough to measure. If your 3.3V really is 2.50V, then replace your psu before you do anything else, otherwise
the 5V sag and 12V rise are poor (as before not catastrophic) but to me signs of a cheap psu (e.g. Enermax) compared to a decent psu (e.g. FSP/Fortron/Sparkle). Right now it is not 'urgent' to change (assuming 3.3V is an MBM report problem), but you will feel better when you do. The good news - at least the latest AOpen psu are badge engineered FSP (see the psu threads here): if your local dealer has one of the latest 120mm jobs at a decent price then snap it up.
A last thought/question for anyone else with a 'new' Radeon: does the graphics card have a floppy power connector to get extra power other than via the AGP slot? Do you have a floppy connector connected? Unlikely to change the world (I am sure the psu power is sagging 5V, boosting 12V under CPU load) but may reduce the immediate symptom on the graphics fan.
'Fix' the cooling on your Radeon - a shotgun is excessive, I am no expert on these new fangled ATI cards but perhaps you can locate as well as fit one of those sexy Zalman heatpipe VGA coolers? (Any little fan is beyond redemption in terms of 'silent' PC.)
Next I actually feel your 3.3V reports are a problem with MBM and not with your psu. 99% chance this is actually the voltage your motherboard has regulated from the 3.3V to supply the memory, and 2.5V is a perfect number for DDR memory. If it was really that bad your machine should have crashed already!! In MBM settings, Voltages, Alarm, at the top if you select +3.3V as the voltage sensor, can you play with which board sensor it should display? (I can't as MBM is really sure about which mobo I have.)(Do you have MBM 5.3? Which mobo do you have: did it come with any monitoring software, and/or can you see your voltages reported in your BIOS?) Otherwise, if you have a multimeter then try measure your 3.3V directly. Easiest will be if you have another spare conector hanging out your psu - this time 6 pin in a line, 3 black, 2 orange & 1 red. The Orange are 3.3V, stick the +Ve from the multimeter on Orange, the -ve on Black. If you dont have this 6 pin connector, the only other place to find a 3.3V wire is the Orange cables in the main mobo power connector - you need something like a paperclip to 'extend' the power out of the plug long enough to measure. If your 3.3V really is 2.50V, then replace your psu before you do anything else, otherwise
the 5V sag and 12V rise are poor (as before not catastrophic) but to me signs of a cheap psu (e.g. Enermax) compared to a decent psu (e.g. FSP/Fortron/Sparkle). Right now it is not 'urgent' to change (assuming 3.3V is an MBM report problem), but you will feel better when you do. The good news - at least the latest AOpen psu are badge engineered FSP (see the psu threads here): if your local dealer has one of the latest 120mm jobs at a decent price then snap it up.
A last thought/question for anyone else with a 'new' Radeon: does the graphics card have a floppy power connector to get extra power other than via the AGP slot? Do you have a floppy connector connected? Unlikely to change the world (I am sure the psu power is sagging 5V, boosting 12V under CPU load) but may reduce the immediate symptom on the graphics fan.
I've been running my Radeon 9000 Pro 128 with the fan unplugged for three weeks now and have had no problems with video artifacts. The meager heatsink remains reasonably cool to the touch even after hour long bouts of gaming. I've read in several places that on some of the "midrange" pricepoint graphics cards that the fan is more of a sales feature than a part required for cooling....And i found the bastard! Its the whiney little thing on my Radeon. Its a real screamer, which sags when i do anything CPU intensive. Need to sort that out. Any ideas? Its only a radeon 9000pro...
Will
Thanks again for the replies. Dukla, I have an epox 4g4a+ i845G motherboard. MBM allows me to change almost nothing. If i go to voltages and select +3.3, "Should display board sensor" is "MBM fixed" and i cant change it. "Voltage configuration" i can change between W83627HF Standard 1,2,3 and 4. These have no effect on my +3.3 reading. In my bios, the closest to 3.3 (it was about 3.4) was VBATT. Probably just my silly Epox board.
I will play with disconnecting the radeon fan altogether, Will35: what is your average case temp when you disconnect yours? I probably need to get some more airflow going before i get rid of mine (lose that scsi card, etc). My radeon doesnt have a separate power connector.
Now, to PSU's. Like i said, im in Australia, are units like the SlienX 120V only jobs? If so, like i said, the choice is somewhat limited here, to enermax, antec, and aopen. What brand is "FSP"? Dukla, u mentioned that the new Aopen psus are FSP's... Actually, i should stop being lazy and look in the PSU forum myself
cheers
koninc
I will play with disconnecting the radeon fan altogether, Will35: what is your average case temp when you disconnect yours? I probably need to get some more airflow going before i get rid of mine (lose that scsi card, etc). My radeon doesnt have a separate power connector.
Now, to PSU's. Like i said, im in Australia, are units like the SlienX 120V only jobs? If so, like i said, the choice is somewhat limited here, to enermax, antec, and aopen. What brand is "FSP"? Dukla, u mentioned that the new Aopen psus are FSP's... Actually, i should stop being lazy and look in the PSU forum myself
cheers
koninc
I will play with disconnecting the radeon fan altogether, Will35: what is your average case temp when you disconnect yours? I probably need to get some more airflow going before i get rid of mine (lose that scsi card, etc). My radeon doesnt have a separate power connector.
Konic, here's where you can get the scoop on my system configuration, including case temps. Note that the front 120mm fan is contributing to the airflow around the graphics card.
Will
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dukla2000
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halcyon's post in this thread says it all.koninc wrote:What brand is "FSP"? Dukla, u mentioned that the new Aopen psus are FSP's
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Sportbilly
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According to http://www.silenx.com/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=2 the PSU's are 115/230V...koninc wrote:Now, to PSU's. Like i said, im in Australia, are units like the SlienX 120V only jobs?
Ouch!
Shipping to Australia from the states or canada, ive found, is horribly expensive. Its in the range of 40 USD, depending on how long I want to wait! I'll have to sit back and have a think about it when i get time.
Incidentally, i recently moved my machine from my place, to my girlfriends place, to work, and back home. In my car. No ill effects from having the 7000Cu strapped on. I made sure though to sit the case 'flat' (not vertical) when i carried it/put it in the car.
Slightly more cumbersome, but worth it i think... Just have to shut up my radeon, harddisks, and get a decent PSU!
Shipping to Australia from the states or canada, ive found, is horribly expensive. Its in the range of 40 USD, depending on how long I want to wait! I'll have to sit back and have a think about it when i get time.
Incidentally, i recently moved my machine from my place, to my girlfriends place, to work, and back home. In my car. No ill effects from having the 7000Cu strapped on. I made sure though to sit the case 'flat' (not vertical) when i carried it/put it in the car.
Slightly more cumbersome, but worth it i think... Just have to shut up my radeon, harddisks, and get a decent PSU!
The smaller the fan, the higher the rpm, and the higher the frequency
it emits. Fans can easily vary 5% with normal running and this can be
audible - along with coils either on motherboard or power supplies.
Since you are in Australia, realise unless you are air-conditioned that
the *assumed* ambient at which the PSU noise-specs are given may
not be applicable to you. Vis., it may not be so quiet :-)
Colleague found this with his 4312MV - they simply ran flat out vs UK!
You don't have to remote fit 80mm fans for video card cooling, you
can get quiet 50mm fans that do 7-10cfm which can be enough. The
QuietPC Delta 50x50x10mm is a real 18dB(A) for 7cfm, and NMB &
others do 50x50x15mm with 21dB(A) and 10cfm. Thinner than 25mm.
Since your environment may be hotter you may need to go further:
o Silicone rubber sheet or cork gasket between PSU & case
---- this should knock about 4dB(A) off the PSU noise
o Nylon fasteners to fix anything that vibrates a lot
---- ideally proper fan gaskets or acoustic mounts
---- these can allow higher airflow for same noise
-------- particularly useful on West facing PC/walls in Aus
---- of course they can allow lower noise for same airflow
o Re-orient the PC case itself
---- sound dissipates with distance in air quite effectively
---- Significant Others like this idea re co-locating PC to waste tip :-)
o Ensure the PC is on carpet, even if the floor isn't
---- put a fan on a desk and notice the noise
---- same thing occurs with a PC
Most graphics card fans are poorly engineered, it can help
to use rubber isolator fasteners with them to reduce noise,
and the slight improvement in airgap can reduce noise also.
Impingement cooling is noisy when the fan is closer than about
1/2-fan-thickness from a heatsink re cavitation/turbulence etc.
--
Dorothy Bradbury
www.stores.ebay.co.uk/panaflofan - L1A back in stock[/code]
it emits. Fans can easily vary 5% with normal running and this can be
audible - along with coils either on motherboard or power supplies.
Since you are in Australia, realise unless you are air-conditioned that
the *assumed* ambient at which the PSU noise-specs are given may
not be applicable to you. Vis., it may not be so quiet :-)
Colleague found this with his 4312MV - they simply ran flat out vs UK!
You don't have to remote fit 80mm fans for video card cooling, you
can get quiet 50mm fans that do 7-10cfm which can be enough. The
QuietPC Delta 50x50x10mm is a real 18dB(A) for 7cfm, and NMB &
others do 50x50x15mm with 21dB(A) and 10cfm. Thinner than 25mm.
Since your environment may be hotter you may need to go further:
o Silicone rubber sheet or cork gasket between PSU & case
---- this should knock about 4dB(A) off the PSU noise
o Nylon fasteners to fix anything that vibrates a lot
---- ideally proper fan gaskets or acoustic mounts
---- these can allow higher airflow for same noise
-------- particularly useful on West facing PC/walls in Aus
---- of course they can allow lower noise for same airflow
o Re-orient the PC case itself
---- sound dissipates with distance in air quite effectively
---- Significant Others like this idea re co-locating PC to waste tip :-)
o Ensure the PC is on carpet, even if the floor isn't
---- put a fan on a desk and notice the noise
---- same thing occurs with a PC
Most graphics card fans are poorly engineered, it can help
to use rubber isolator fasteners with them to reduce noise,
and the slight improvement in airgap can reduce noise also.
Impingement cooling is noisy when the fan is closer than about
1/2-fan-thickness from a heatsink re cavitation/turbulence etc.
--
Dorothy Bradbury
www.stores.ebay.co.uk/panaflofan - L1A back in stock[/code]
-
DeadBySundown
- Friend of SPCR
- Posts: 55
- Joined: Mon May 05, 2003 6:16 pm
- Location: Burlington, Vermont, USA
Had a similar situation with my Radeon 9700 - the fan wasn't all that noisy in absolute terms, but the frequency was just grating to me. Seemed perfectly tuned to some aggression response in my hindbrain, definately had to go.
Replaced the factory job with a Zalman Z80A...ahhhhh, blessed silence. Well worth the money.
Of course, that precipitated the new Antec PlusView case for better airflow, then the Gladiator XP IDE cables (again, airflow), then the TruePower 430 PS with the variable-speed fan circuit...then the quieter fans, then the Zalman 7000Cu....
It's a slippery slope, my friend. Once you start down the silent path, forever will it dominate your destiny...consume you, it will....
Ah well, at least I haven't submerged the whole works in 0W Turbine oil like Rusty075; there's hope for a cure for me, at least.
Replaced the factory job with a Zalman Z80A...ahhhhh, blessed silence. Well worth the money.
Of course, that precipitated the new Antec PlusView case for better airflow, then the Gladiator XP IDE cables (again, airflow), then the TruePower 430 PS with the variable-speed fan circuit...then the quieter fans, then the Zalman 7000Cu....
It's a slippery slope, my friend. Once you start down the silent path, forever will it dominate your destiny...consume you, it will....
Ah well, at least I haven't submerged the whole works in 0W Turbine oil like Rusty075; there's hope for a cure for me, at least.
Last edited by DeadBySundown on Mon May 05, 2003 8:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.