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 Post subject: Is Panaflo even available in europe?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 21, 2002 11:04 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2002 7:36 am
Posts: 29
Location: Linköping, Sweden, EU
I sure envy you americans, with access to quiet cheap fans (panaflo fans for 3$, right?).

I live in Sweden and I haven't seen Panaflos available anywhere. If I want a quiet fan I have to buy a Papst, which will cost me 17-18$, approx converted from swedish kronor. And thats the best price I can find for a Papst in sweden!! :(

I guess what i'm wondering is does anyone know of a good online vendor that is shipping to sweden and carries Panaflos or other cheap (but good quality) fans?
I sure have looked, but i haven't found anything like that. Are these panaflo fans exclusive for northern america?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2002 1:25 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 262
Location: Worcester, UK
Yeah, tell me about it! I cant believe you can get panaflos for 3$, panaflos are about £12 and papst about £15 in the UK. Not sure about shipping to Sweden Jolt, but try,

www.overclockers.co.uk
www.theoverclockingstore.co.uk
www.chillblast.co.uk
www.overclock.co.uk
www.kustompcs.co.uk
www.tekheads.co.uk
www.over-clock.co.uk


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2002 1:55 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 11830
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Maybe some generous member on the East coast can take an order for a big batch of Panaflos & have them shipped in bulk the cheapest way to some central point in the UK or Europe... nah, I bet it comes out the same kind of $ with all the shipping costs. Surely Papst must be cheaper than that -- it's the same price in the US & Canada, more or less.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2002 9:57 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2002 9:07 am
Posts: 42
Location: Sunnyvale, CA, USA
Hypothetically....

Say you're buying 10 from BG Micro. That's 10 x US$2.75 + US$6 (shipping) = US$33.50.

If you ship global priority mail I think you can fit 10 fans in 2 of the large sized flat rate envelopes. That's US$9 x 2 = US$18.00. (I don't know how fast it will get to Europe, but it's not the fastest or the slowest option.) At least it has a tracking number...

Throw in a some extra incidental costs (padding material, time, etc) at say... an extra $10.

That's a total of US$61.50. That's just over US$6 per fan.

However, I don't know if you have to pay customs taxes, etc. Also, I'm not sure how you would pay the person in the US. (Paypal? Money Order?) There might be extra costs for that too.

Would it still be comparable to what other fans cost in Europe? Is that a good deal still for you'all?

I dunno, I (perhaps foolishly) think in Europe you'd be able to get great deals on Papst fans. Find any good surplus electronics stores?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2002 10:31 am 
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Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
deeseeel wrote:
If you ship global priority mail I think you can fit 10 fans in 2 of the large sized flat rate envelopes. That's US$9 x 2 = US$18.00..... I dunno, I (perhaps foolishly) think in Europe you'd be able to get great deals on Papst fans. Find any good surplus electronics stores?

20 fans from California to Vancouver BC by US Post air parcel cost $17. I can't imagine it would be the same cost to Europe. Think more like $30.

I also agree that Papst should cost less in Europe than over here.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2002 11:28 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 262
Location: Worcester, UK
They should cost less over here if they're made here, but in the UK we get ripped off with practically everything, look at the papst prices from chillblast.co.uk...

Papst Case Fan 120mm
£29.99

Papst Case Fan 120mm (temp. controlled)
£35.99

Papst Case Fan 40mm
£13.99

Papst Case Fan 60mm
£13.99

Papst Case Fan 60mm (temp. controlled)
£19.99

Papst Case Fan 80mm 8412 NGL
£13.99

Papst Case Fan 80mm 8412 NGM
£13.99

Papst Case Fan 80mm 8412 NGML
£13.99

Papst Case Fan 80mm 8412 NGML(temp. controlled)
£19.99

Papst Case Fan 92mm
£27.99

Papst Case Fan 92mm (temp. controlled)
£33.99


:cry:
Its ridiculous... £35 for a fan, thats gotta be over $50!, its just a bit of plastic and a motor :?

They're a bit cheaper here: http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/ ... ns_61.html

and heres some panaflo prices:
http://www.theoverclockingstore.co.uk/b ... egoryid=20

but then theres P&P on that too.
The fact that you could get em over here from the US for about $6~7 is insane, thats about £4 vs £12 from a UK store!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2002 12:53 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2002 9:07 am
Posts: 42
Location: Sunnyvale, CA, USA
MikeC wrote:
20 fans from California to Vancouver BC by US Post air parcel cost $17. I can't imagine it would be the same cost to Europe. Think more like $30.


Well, according to the info at the USPS website, global priority mail for all countries except Canada and Mexico is $9 for the large flat rate envelope.

It is true that the amount of packing material would have to bit a minimum (two bubble wrap mailers max), but I think it's doable.

The flat rate envelope is a great deal because you don't have to worry about weight. But even if you don't use the flat rate envelope, the rates for GB and Sweden would be US$21 for 3 lbs and US$26 for 4 lbs. I think 10 fans could be shipped for 3 lbs (3.5 max).

Canada would be cheaper still.

But this is all hypothetical...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2002 2:00 pm 
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Posts: 262
Location: Worcester, UK
Hi Jolt, i was just looking round and i saw a link for papst fans if you live in sweden - have you tried here: http://www.elfa.se/se/ ? Not panaflo i know, but maybe you could try papst?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 26, 2002 11:20 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Gothenburg, SWEDEN, EU
ChiefWeasel: Problem is that Elfa's prices are in the range of $30-$40 for a Papst...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 27, 2002 11:58 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 16
Location: Don Mills Canada
This is the shipping cost for 50 80mm fans, from Canada to the UK:

Canada Post
Surface takes 4-6 weeks. $32 USD
Air takes 7-10 days. $58 USD

Not sure if tracking number is provided.

I have 15 Panaflos that I don't need anymore.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2002 12:14 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 19
Location: Gothenburg, SWEDEN, EU
50 may be a bit high unless we can get together. Any more Swedes here? ;-)

Do you know what the shipping costs for 10 fans would be?

If I can find the Panaflos for around $3 and then ship 10 of them to EU for about $15 or so this would be feasible. Anyone have pointers to dealers in US/Canada with good prices? Anyone of them ship to EU?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2002 3:41 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2002 7:36 am
Posts: 29
Location: Linköping, Sweden, EU
I'm in sweden too, and I'd be intrested in buying a few panaflos too.

feldt> maybe we could get together and share shipping costs for say 20 fans or so?

Or even better, if there are more swedes here? ;)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2002 5:54 am 
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Location: Don Mills Canada
Don't know if you can find any more Swedes over there, we've got them all playing in the National Hockey League.
Just kidding, may be there are some Norwegians and Danes who are looking for Panaflos too ?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 28, 2002 10:01 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 29
Location: Hellsinki, Finland
Quote:
Don't know if you can find any more Swedes over there, we've got them all playing in the National Hockey League.
Just kidding, may be there are some Norwegians and Danes who are looking for Panaflos too ?


Or from Finland? :D I have also followed the situation with Panaflos and it feels quite absurd that a decent product like that is not marketed in the EU area. And that´s bad for noice and cost conscientous consumers like me.

manalainen


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2002 3:57 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2002 3:53 am
Posts: 46
Location: Linköping, Sweden
Overclockers.se carries the 80mm Panaflo. But at $13+.

If you guys are thinking about getting a bunch of them from the states I'm in. Just happen to be from the same city as Jolt, so that will make it a bit easier at least.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2002 6:28 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 16
Location: Don Mills Canada
If quiet PC parts are difficult to buy in Scandinavia, like it is in Canada, perhaps there could be a Scandinavia Corner - with threads like "where to buy quiet PC parts in [ City ] ?"


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2002 6:40 am 
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Location: Don Mills Canada
I am prepared to do a little experiment - try to mail Panaflos out to Europe in small batches - say 5 ?
If 20 is mailed to one point, it has to be re-shipped and that adds to cost.
Canada Post Surface mail is cheaper, takes about 6 weeks. I suspect it takes less time for small packages, and they are saying that to make people go for the more expensive Air rate - just my guess.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2002 9:44 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 32
I need some over here in the UK as well! The cheapest I've found 'em over here is £9.25 (inc. VAT), which seems absurd compared to the US prices some of you are talking about! Anyone else from the UK need any?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Aug 31, 2002 1:53 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2002 7:36 am
Posts: 29
Location: Linköping, Sweden, EU
Ok, here is a deal for you swedes.

I mailed bgmicro and asked about shipping costs for 20 and 30 fans to sweden.

Here is the reply:

"Hi,
I won't know the exact amount until the order is actually packed, but I can
come pretty close. 20 fans would be about 32.00 for airmail, or 42.00 for
express. 30 fans would be about 38.00 for airmail, or 50.00 for express."

Ok, so what would the actual price be?

here is a calculation for 30 fans:

$82,5 for the fans
+ $38 shipping
= a grand total of $120.5; thats 1130kr (in swedish currency)

except that we must also add toll(3,5%) and VAT(25%) and possibly some shipping cost that the swedish post office charges, ca. 100kr (info from www.tullverket.se)

which makes it something like this:

1130*1.035*1.25 = 1460kr
+ shipping cost (ca. 100kr)

and the total cost would be 1560kr for 30 fans.

So that would be 52kr/fan ($5.5), quite an ok price i would say! Considering that the same fan costs 125kr to buy online from a swedish vendor!

And consider that this is pretty much a worst case scenario, if we get lucky maybe the package could slip trough and we get away without paying the toll and VAT (probably not very likely(?)).

In that case the fans would cost 38kr a piece ($4), and thats the absolute best case scenario.

The only question that remains is, how fast is airmail to sweden really?
It sounds pretty fast to me, but what do I know? ;)

So Choy what do you say? :)

I have a friend who probably would be in too, and with you we would be 3, so an order for 30 fans could be apropriate perhaps?

Maybe you could doublecheck my calculations though? I'm not 100% sure that I got all the import rules right (I'm pretty sure though).


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2002 4:07 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 32
Otherwise, if no-one else from the UK is interested, perhaps I could join in the Swedish venture? I don't think it would cost much to send from Sweden to the UK (about 75kr I should think would do it). I only need around 4 fans. And there would be no customs to pay since it's in the EU. Just one question: are the fans from bgmicro tailed with 3-pin connectors or not? I couldn't make it out from their description!

Cheers,
Oz
:D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2002 4:34 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2002 3:53 am
Posts: 46
Location: Linköping, Sweden
I'm ok with it. 10 fans each?
It would be interesting to know about the tailing but guessing by the price I think they won't have connectors.

For my part Oz can participate. I can survive on 8 fans. I've checked and a 500g letter costs 42 kr (~£25) to send to the UK. The problem is how Oz wants to pay for it. It's a bit of a hassel to send money across borders.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2002 6:13 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 32
Do you have a PayPal account? Otherwise I have some friends in Sweden who could transfer the money to you. I'd really appreciate it since they're so expensive over here. BTW, 42kr ~ £2.5, not £25. Had me worried there for a second :).


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2002 12:55 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2002 7:36 am
Posts: 29
Location: Linköping, Sweden, EU
Ok, good!

I just want to see if any more of my friends would be interested before we order. I guess we could order sometime in the beginning in a couple of days or so. Is that ok with you guys?

Oz> If it's possible for you I think the easiest way would be if one of your friends would transfer money within sweden.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2002 1:28 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 16
Location: Don Mills Canada
Can one of you become a reseller, now that you see a market void and know where to get the stuff ? Is a website that hard to do ? If the idea of making a little profit does not sit well with you, for some reason, use the sale to raise some money for Tinnitus and Hyperacousis (Hyperacusis) support or research.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2002 1:41 pm 
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Jolt wrote:
Is that ok with you guys?

Absolutely fine with me! ;)

Jolt wrote:
Oz> If it's possible for you I think the easiest way would be if one of your friends would transfer money within sweden.

Sure, that would be no problem!

As for becoming a reseller... that involves actual business doesn't it? So you'd have to start a registered company? Or perhaps not, I don't know much about these things.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2002 2:17 pm 
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Posts: 262
Location: Worcester, UK
No, it should be fine Oz, in the UK you can set up as a sole trader and dont have to register anywhere (until you making over something like £20K a year and you have to register for VAT). But since your just selling them to people you know (well, kind of ;)) i should imagine it just counts as selling them second hand.

PS: Ill take a couple off you if your reselling them from the UK.

In fact if your gonna start reselling them i'd be interested in helping with the website or something :D

_________________
Computers should be seen and not heard...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2002 4:00 pm 
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Posts: 32
I think I'll stick to trying to them out, at least to start off with ;). If this Scandinavian deal goes through, it'll be my first set! On the other hand, if you are interested in reselling them, I'll gladly help out with the website as well! :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2002 6:44 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2002 3:53 am
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Location: Linköping, Sweden
So how many do we want?
Split the original 30 to more people or order 40 instead?

Anyone got info about the connectors on the fans?

Another thing. I think the easiest way to send them is by ground mail. Takes a couple a weeks more but makes it even cheaper :D That's what we are after right?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2002 8:07 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2002 7:36 am
Posts: 29
Location: Linköping, Sweden, EU
I have a few more people who are interested, so if it's ok with you guys I'll order 40 fans soon.

10 fans (or would you rather want 8?) for Choy
4 fans for Oz
is that right?

As soon as I get your confirmations I'll order.


Choy> I don't think they ship by ground mail, else I think she would have given me a price for that also. And with so many fans the shipping will be just over $1/fan anyway, not that bad.

Maybe you guys should contact me on ICQ, 17798249, to finalize everything.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2002 9:27 am 
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I'll take a few of your hands if you're gonna resell in the UK...


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