Quiet NMB 120mm fan bulk order

Katana Man · Post by **Katana Man** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 10:18 am

NMB has a sweet fan I have my eye on. Similar specs of Papst, but cheaper:

4710NL-04W-B10-P00
http://www.nmbtech.com/pdf/dcfans/dc4710nl.pdf
120mm x 25mm
27 dBA
59 CFM

Newark.com has them, but they need to be bought in quantity of 20

I can't find them anywhere else. If I ordered 20, I'd be keeping 4 for myself, and could sell the rest for somewhere around $17-20 shipped. That's about $10-15 cheaper each than Papst. I'd have 16 left to sell, anyone interested?

Or maybe some other storefront company reading this post will do the bulk purchase instead of me

twokatmew · Post by **twokatmew** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 12:22 pm

I'm interested, but I'd only need one.

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 12:56 pm

Katana Man - I've got one of those in the front of my case. As a micro-review:

It works as advertised, and was not a 'bad buy'. Having said that, it does have a slight buzz at both 7V and 5V (a long time since I had it at 12V, when I guess the airflow is louder than any buzz). At 7V I can hear the buzz from about 50cm, at 5V I need to get to about 20cm. Certainly the NMB at 7V is similar or quieter than an Evercool EC12025M12S at 5V.

Pros: 25mm deep (my case certainly doesn't have the space for a 38mm deep Panaflo)
Quiet (but not silent)
It starts at 5V (none of my Papst - 6, 8 & 9cm - do)
Really low power (1.44W) - can run off mobo header (unlike Evercool)

Cons: wish I'ld found a sleeve bearing fan with similar spec.
Gets real noisy if you try PWM speed control (but then so do my Papst)

Katana Man · Post by **Katana Man** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 2:15 pm

Hmmm... you may have persuaded me to not choose the NMB. I will definately be in the 5V-7V range. I don't want buzzing or clicking.
I'm thinking about a Papst then, although they are out of stock everywhere, and I don't know if they will start at 5V.

I don't think I'll have room in the D8000 case for a 120mm x 38mm although I know it can do a 120mm x 25mm. Unfortunately, the Panaflo L1A is 38mm I believe.

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 2:39 pm

I wasn't trying to put you off. I did a whole heap of paper research before buying mine and came to the same (high) expectation as you.

Fact is I really wanted to use my mobo (A7V333) PWM (all my Papsts sound asthmatic down around 3/16ths, the NMB is no better), and I still run my NMB today because I can't suggest anything better. I haven't got a 120mm Papst, but none of my others start at 5V so I wouldn't expect the 120mm will. And yeah, the Panaflo 120mm are 38mm deep.

The only alternatives I have from my research (except I could never find a UK/European supplier yet) are
EZ Fan/Commonwealth FP-108MS3 - 25Db(A), 54cfm (except 2100 rpm so I really suspect the Db(A) number)
Nidec D12T-12PL - is 1500 rpm compared to NMB 1550 and slightly lower cfm, but slightly higher Db(A) - 28. Except it is sleeve.

I am intrigued by the Comair/Rotron web site - while their Db(A) numbers are 'high' they do claim their electronics is designed to handle PWM without becoming noisy.

Katana Man · Post by **Katana Man** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 2:59 pm

If I use a rheostat, then I wouldn't have to worry about PWM noise right?

nocturnal · Post by **nocturnal** » Fri Mar 14, 2003 9:25 pm

I could be interested in 4 for two D8000 cases I'm looking at.
Would you imagine the shipped price might drop in the 4-6 pcs Qtty
Can always use a couple spare

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Sat Mar 15, 2003 2:03 am

Katana Man wrote:If I use a rheostat, then I wouldn't have to worry about PWM noise right?

Right. Plain setting a voltage different to 12V (7V trick, 5V, rheostat, wot have U) is OK. PWM pulses the +ve power rail and most fan electronics seem to get upset about this.

The Comair Rotron site has some interesting Engineering notes, including one that seems to explain this: "For instance, pulse width modulating the power lead of a standard fan will also PWM the fragile ASIC circuitry that makes the fan work. This circuitry is not designed for rapid switching of power on and off. Comair Rotron’s speed control fans are. " at http://www.comairrotron.com/Engineering ... nSpeed.htm

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Sat Mar 15, 2003 5:52 am

Katana Man wrote:I don't think I'll have room in the D8000 case for a 120mm x 38mm although I know it can do a 120mm x 25mm. Unfortunately, the Panaflo L1A is 38mm I believe.

There certainly is room in the SLK3700/D8000 for 38mm fans, you have to mount them without using the cheapo plastic holders. You'll need to drill a set of new mounting holes in the case wall and bolt it directly to the case (I used O-rings too). It's a better way to mount your fan anyway, plus then you can use the L1A Panaflo.

L1A in SLK3700:

Another 120mm x 25mm alternative is that JMC J120L from Coolcases.com. It's a ball-bearing 25mm fan that is actually quieter at 5V than the Panaflo L1A (although it has less airflow too, no free lunch!). I have some of these fans but I haven't tried them in my SLK3700. Maybe later I'll swap the JMC into my case and see what happens to the noise level/case temps.

dinde · Post by **dinde** » Sat Mar 15, 2003 6:25 am

hey ralf, it looks like a pretty tight fit back there for the 38mm fan (im getting 2 120mm lia's for my slk3700 as u already know..) anyways, it deosnt look like u used grommets. is it because there wasnt enough room?

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Sun Mar 16, 2003 7:39 am

dinde wrote:hey ralf, it looks like a pretty tight fit back there for the 38mm fan (im getting 2 120mm lia's for my slk3700 as u already know..) anyways, it deosnt look like u used grommets. is it because there wasnt enough room?

I did use grommets (small O-rings) on both sides of the case and those self-tapping fan screws to mount that fan. I only put it in to see if it did clear because someone asked me to. There's about .050-.075" clearance between the fan and the drive cage. Not much but, like my old Grandpappy used to say, "a miss is as good as a mile".

Katana Man · Post by **Katana Man** » Wed Apr 23, 2003 8:42 am

dukla2000,
Is the Nidec D12T-12PL same as the Vantec Stealth? Look at this: http://2cooltek.safeshopper.com/61/378.htm?931

I'm also wondering if the EZ Fan FP108MS3 is a Papst. They look the same to me, and have similar specs, and same oil impregnated Sintered-Sleeve bearings.
It's actually 2100 RPM , not 2500RPM. I'm all over it. I've ordered 2 to see how it does.

lurker · Post by **lurker** » Wed Apr 23, 2003 9:53 am

I bought some 4710NL-04W-B20's from a surplus vendor on eBay. At 7 v these babies are so quiet. And less than $20 for a lot of 6!

The one thing you should be aware of is that (at least for the B20) the connector will not fit into a motherboard header, the holes are spaced too far apart. I had to remove the leads and stick them in 3 pronged connectors I scavenged from other fans.

Katana Man · Post by **Katana Man** » Wed Apr 23, 2003 10:02 am

Nice purchase! The B20's push more air than the B10's
http://www.eminebea.com/content/pdf/TMP ... 4710kl.pdf

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Wed Apr 23, 2003 11:58 am

Katana Man wrote:dukla2000, Is the Nidec D12T-12PL same as the Vantec Stealth?

Forgot to check 2cooltek link before replying, but I read a Vantec Stealth review (80mm) somewhere that said they are Nidec, and certainly seems so from my spec collection. {ps Checked the link now, and I am sure 2cooltek are correct: I used to think these Nidec/Vantec could be promising at 120mm but reviews say they are noisy - ball bearings - and a couple of others in these forums have also reported the Vantec Stealths of all sizes as disappointing }

Katana Man wrote:I'm also wondering if the EZ Fan FP108MS3 is a Papst. They look the same to me, and have similar specs, and same oil impregnated Sintered-Sleeve bearings. It's actually 2100 RPM , not 2500RPM. I'm all over it. I've ordered 2 to see how it does.

Now that EZ Fan is the one I've always coveted - will be really interested to hear what you think. I doubt it is Papst - it has only 5 blades. I believe it is made by Commonwealth: 6 months ago or so when I was researching 120mm fans I found a USA site for EZ Fan, and IIRC I googled the part number and came up with a site for Commonwealth.

I really figure that thing at 7V could be the holy grail: the 5 blade route seems to be a genuine search for quiet, sleeve bearings are as well, OK they have to crank the revs to get the airflow, but me personally I dont need 54cfm through my case.

Let me know how it goes: if it sounds good (i.e. doesn't sound!) I might try work a plan to get 1.

lurker · Post by **lurker** » Wed Apr 23, 2003 1:30 pm

Katana Man wrote:Nice purchase! The B20's are rated at 82CFM @ 39dBA.
Whereas the B10's are 56CFM @ 29dBA.

Actually, the stats for the B20 are on the page you linked in the first post: 72 cfm @ 30 dBa
and that .pdf also says the B10's are 59 cfm @ 27 dBa
gmjamez's fan spec sheet agrees (which is good since that's what I based my purchase on

)

fmah · Post by **fmah** » Wed Apr 23, 2003 4:55 pm

Let me see what surplus I can get from work, I have these fans, but the higher CFM version. If there are any lower CFM I can let you know.

Katana Man · Post by **Katana Man** » Wed Apr 23, 2003 7:01 pm

Thanks for the catch lurker. I'm not finding the 4710NL's on their web site anymore. They probably stopped making them.

The 4710KL's look nice!

4710KL-04W-B10 is 63.5 CFM at 27dBA, wow! Seems a bit too good to be true, but I'm willing to try. Where oh where can I buy some of these!

dan_hxff · Post by **dan_hxff** » Thu Apr 24, 2003 8:01 am

GIVE THIS TIME TO LOAD! This is a search for NMB + 4710 at Newark and it gives you ~20 fans. I think 4710 means inches as in 120mm.

http://www.newark.com/NewarkWebCommerce ... Search.y=0

Dan

Katana Man · Post by **Katana Man** » Thu Apr 24, 2003 8:12 am

Hi Dan,
Yes, this is what I posted in the original post. Newark has some. Most of these require a purchase of 20 or more fans. And unfortunately, they don't have the new 4710KL's

For long URL's like that, it's best to use this format:
[ url=http:/blah]Link text here[ /url]
Otherwise, it stretches out the width of everybody's posts.