Given the name of the PSU is Pico, has anyone else thought of "pika-pika?" PSUs, gotta catch 'em all!

What do you mean? Did I do it wrong? Last time i checked it was P = U x I (which was discovered in 1840), and if I get a value that's too low then there's no need to include other values like efficency and such, you'd better move on to another model. I mean, I don't know much about electrics, mechanics and materials is my thing. I just wondered how you could narrow it down to those two models without knowing what you were doing.

They were linked to as "related items" on the page for the PW200M:

PW200M

Normally the "related items" stuff on websites is what people normally buy with the main item, but obviously most of the people buying the PW200M must be running mini-ITX setups (sub-120W). I just assumed that the ones that most people bought would be the right ones for me, but most people probably aren't trying to use it to power an ATX PC.

I see your problem, it seems so hard to find components that will work well together without any bottlenecks, just because "everybody else" uses VIA systems. As I said before, you'd better look for a 12 V transformer at an electronics store. The one I mentioned, Elfa, does shipping to the UK, but I think you have better alternatives where you live.

Does anyone know what the efficiency is for the 220 Watt Delta power brick?

I believe these power bricks are linear regulators, which I don't think go above 65% efficiency. But they can handle a lot of heat, and that heat doesn't have to be evacuated from your case.

Are you sure about that? Maybe the smaller ones, but I'm pretty sure anything over 50w or so is probably switching. I used to own a Lex 110w DC-DC kit with an external brick and efficiency was slightly higher than with my Seasonic S12 (probably thanks to the flatter efficiency curve at very low loads). No way a linear regulator could have done that.

I can't speak to this particular product, but I know most wall-warts are linear regulators and the HAM radio crowd uses linear regulators that go up to 30A or more (see this thread: Experience with brick PSU for ATX board?).

Delta's webpage says this about their AC/DC power supplies:

No idea what their idea of high efficiency is, though. Someone email them (not it!).

FWIW, the bricks for sale at Mini-Box are listed as switching.

Anyways, here's a review of the PicoPSU. Looks really good under the 100w resistor load, I have no doubts this would be able to power a low-end to mid-range ATX system. You'd just need to find a 4-pin adapter and probably extend the length of the peripheral connectors.

The trick would be to build a system that never exceeds ca. 110W under maximum load. This should be possible with for example a Geode NX 1750-based system:

CPU: 14W max
mobo: 20W?
3.5" HDD: ~15W max
CD/DVD: 20W max
GFX card: 20W max

that's still comfortably under 100W. It's not going to be the most powerful PC on the block, but certainly the quietest.

Heck, you don't need a Geode. My old Turion64 MT-34 / Radeon 9600 computer only pulled around 70w from the wall under heavy load. Should be able to handle an undervolted Athlon64 and low/mid-range video card no problem.

My current dual-core / X800GTO system only uses around 140w at the wall (probably ~110w DC) with both CPUs and the video card being stressed, so it could be possible to use this PSU on it. Although I have done a lot to decrease power consumption, such as undervolting the CPU and GPU. In it's default configuration power consumption was quite a bit higher.

Good point. I currently have my A64 3000 running on 0.85V @ 1GHz with a bargain basement graphics card; I really should measure how much power it uses under load. How would I do this? Do I need one of those Kill-A-Watt meters?



Is a dual-core as easy to undervolt as a single core (providing the mobo BIOS allows it)?

Yes, a Kill-a-watt like apparatus is the easiest way to measure that.

The computer I am surfing with now:
MSI RS480M2-IL (with integrated graphics) | A64 3000+ | AC Freezer 64 | Seasonic SS-301HT | Seagate 7200.7 PATA 40GB | Nexus 120mm | CoolerMate Silver Leo (Fan controller/Temp monitor)

Overclocked to 1980 MHz, undervolted to 1.25V and running Folding@Home is pulling only 62W from the wall right now.

Wow, an MSI board that allows undervolting! Can I ask what is the lowest Vcore option allowed in the BIOS? 0.8375V?

There is no undervolting possible with that board via the BIOS. But as with all (most?) boards that support C'n'Q, it can be done with CrystalCPUID.

Yup, dual core seems to undervolt just as well. My X2 3800+ actually undervolted to basically the same voltage as my 3200+ Venice single core.

may I ask what voltage you are running?

1.23V.

Just a clarification (may well be a dump) question:

If I manage to get the external brick from Dell (in Germany), can I power a normal ATX board with this? Or do I need another converter? If I need a second converter, where to get one?

And a second question: Is this the same with the Shuttle PSUs?

Bye egghat.

Just thought I'd express my interest in doing this (dell psu + pw200). First of all, has anyone even done this, or was everyone just talking about it? Reason I ask is I was about to pull the trigger and noticed that the connector for the dell PSU is rectangular, and the connector for the pw200 and related bricks is circular. Seems like this might be a huge problem. Thoughts?

http://www.pcsurplusonline.com/viewpic. ... -3R160.jpg

PS to Aris.
In an earlier post you mentioned the dell sx270 being the 220w power supply. I'm pretty sure after some research that this is not so. The sx260 and sx270 use a 12v/12.5a (150w) delta version. The one you want is 12v/18a (220w) which is used on the sx280. Here's a pic of that beast.

http://www.pcsurplusonline.com/viewpic. ... 811_sm.jpg

And scroll down on this link to see the connector this uses

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 6851610738

EDIT: Ok, so I read on some old thread where frostedflakes mentions that you would have to cut and solder to make them compatible. Now all we need is a how-to...

I'm not surprised that the plugs & jacks don't match up. With this kind of specialty use, I expected some wire snipping and soldering to be necessary. All you would have to do is use a voltmeter to determine which wires were +12V and which were ground, and then do the same (or find a spec sheet) on the PicoPSU - shouldn't be all that difficult.

But no, I haven't actually tried it. Thinking ahead for my next build, which is probably at least a year in the future.

I got hold of the PicoPSU and also the larger PW200M and successfully tested them in a XPM desktop without any problems. Well the 12v 8.5A brick that came with it was defective on arrival, so I had to find a replacement brick and rewire it to the fit the Pico. Details and photos here.

this whole brick plus dc-dc deal seems like a good idea ... but unlike other people i have not been able to find 120W ac-dc adapters with decent prices.
I'd like to build a pentium-M board with a geforce 7600gs; does anybody think i could power something like that with 80 Watts?
how much do hdds and dvd-burners take?
...
or could i just plug two 60 Watt supplies in parallel?
thx

anton

The Delta 150w bricks are very cheap on eBay, I believe I picked mine up for about $25 including shipping. Search for part number 3R160, it should bring up the Dell/Delta bricks.

Only downside is they use a proprietary connector, you'll have to remove this and buy a 2.5mm ID, 5.5mm OD plug to use it with the PicoPSU. If you're in the US you can pick one up at RadioShack.

thanks, thats exactly what i am looking for!

Any updates?

So it is possible to get the 200W DC/DC to work by hooking it up to a brick that can provide the juice in an efficient and affordable way?

Has it worked for anybody yet?

I believe Bluefront is using a RadioShack brick and PW200M in one of his setups. And okon has a PicoPSU 120w and Delta/Dell 150w brick powering his Opteron 165. I personally have a Dell 150w brick sitting a few feet away from me, once the PicoPSU 120w shows up I plan to try them in my Core Duo box.

As far as a how-to, just snip off the proprietary Dell connector. The Dell 150w brick will have six wires total (two have a metallic wrapping around them, looks kind of like the paper/metallic wraping on sticks of chewing gum)...

Small white (w/metallic sheath): Future use
Green (w/metallic sheath): Remote
Red: +12V
Brown: +12V
Black: GND
Large white: GND

(I think the 220w brick has an extra +12V and GND, don't know about the 180w)

To turn on the brick, you'll have to ground the green wire. If you wanted to get really fancy, you could wire up an on-off switch (like on the back of a normal ATX power supply), but this isn't necessary. Now the brick should be outputting +12V.

I don't know what connector the PW200M uses, but the PicoPSU requires a 5.5mm OD 2.5mm ID (size N) coaxial DC power jack. Local RadioShack stores should have this item, part # is 274-1573. Now just solder it together, +12V goes to the inside terminal, GND to the outside. The plug and soldering points are very tiny, so I was only able to solder one of each wire and not both of the +12V and GND wires. This probably isn't ideal, but it should be fine. The PicoPSU only has one +12V and one GND anyways, so eventually it's going to be going through one wire. Then wrap it all up in electrical tape (make sure of course to tape off all of the individual wires from each other so nothing shorts out) and you're done.

Got an rep email reply, regarding finding a corresponding 200w brick for the 200w psu:

"Dear Sir,
Indeed, the 8.5amp unit is the highest AC/DC we have. You can still use it with the PW-200M if your computer won't need more then 110watts.
In case you will need more, you will have to find a suitable source that provides 16.5amps. I can't suggest a model / company because the higher they get, they are usually harder to find without beeing specialized in different areas (like supplying different voltages, beeing for industrial use and so on)."

I don't get it; why sell a 200w psu when you don't offer the right brick?!?!

www.mcubed-store.com has a 165W ATX psu ready for use incl AC/DC brick, no need for any soldering.
http://www.mcubed-store.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_44_50&products_id=157

The PW200M uses the same connector as the Pico, and for lower wattages connecting a DC plug to one set of wires should be fine. However for higher wattages I am guessing spreading the current over multiple wires will be safer (or using one very thick wire). Also take care that the DC plug is of high enough quality or rated for high current. I originally spliced on a DC plug from a dead LCD brick to one set of wires on a 150W Lite-On brick; this worked fine with both the PW200M and Pico during my initial testing.

Later I replaced it with a plug similar to the one from Radio Shack and even managed to attach both sets of wires (although that meant the plug casing would no longer fit and had to use electricians tape).

However after a week or so of use, I discovered that part of the plastic seperating the inner and outer connections of the plug had melted!! I was fortunate that enough plastic remained that it wasn't shorted. I suspect it happened when I was using it to power an Opteron 144 with a 7800GT (total system draw was around 150W AC under load). If you plan on a high wattage system then it might be best to replace both the plug and connector on the PW200M/Pico with something rated for these higher currents.

During my testing though, the PW200M had no problem running this system over several days of testing except for 12v rail sagging under full load (from 12.2v down to 11.4v). This didn't cause any stability issues and is within 5%, but the Lite-On brick was probably being pushed near it's limits (150W AC assuming 85% efficiency = 130W DC); probably a higher wattage brick would fare better. My experiences detailed here and here.

As for the wiring, I'd be sure to double-check the connections for each individual brick as there seems to be no industry standard. My Lite-On brick had five wires, similar colors but wired differently.
red and white wires : +12v
black, brown, shielding wires : ground


The brick is now paired with the Pico and has been powering my Nforce2 HTPC for about two months now. It draws around 55W AC most of the time, the only annoyance is occassionally it won't power up from standby (the PW200M didn't seem to have this problem). Also I noticed the Lite-On brick stays a little hot all the time. Frostedflakes, have you setup your Pico, does the Dell/Delta brick also run hot?