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 Post subject: Help finding quieter 60mm in SFF gaming rig
PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 5:29 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 4:47 am
Posts: 5
hi there! first post! =)

recently i began the process of quieting down my SFF gaming box. i feel i had been making good progress (swapped the heatsink and intake fan) but not i'm having a really hard time finding replacements for my 60mm exhaust fans. thus, i thought i'd seek out the experts and see what they have to say. =)

here's the current build:

Case: Thermaltake VF1000BWS
Intake Fan: MASSCOOL BLD-09025S1M 92mm
PSU: SILVERSTONE ST70F 700W
GPU: EVGA SuperClocked 012-P3-1572-AR GeForce GTX 570
CPU: Intel Core i7-920 Bloomfield 2.66GHz
Heatsink: COOLER MASTER GeminII S RR-CCH-PBU1-GP 120mm
Exhaust Fan x3: IPCQUEEN IPC-606015 60mm

i will eventually be replacing the HDD with a SSD so it will eventually become silent, so no concern for that here.

my primary point of concern right now are the 3 exhaust fans. it seems like they are currently the biggest offenders.
obviously this is a gaming rig, so it generates heat and is going to make noise. i'm not looking for silent, i just feel like i can do better (quieter) than what i have now, and accept a slight increase in temps. unfortunately i can't seem to find any good, comprehensive look at 60mm fans, so i feel like i'm shooting blind, which is how i picked these up in the first place.

i'd also be interested in feedback on the intake fan if you have any. it seems good to me though.

i'm using the stock fan on the heatsink, and that seems good and got a good recommendation from your site. i'm also already using AS5.

i know nothing about aftermarket GPU coolers, so that may be an option in the future. if you have any advice in that regard i'd love to hear it, but right now i'm most focused on replacing the exhaust fans.

any critique and suggestions are very welcome, and thanks so much for your time and assistance in this matter!

temps in my rig are about:
CPU Idle: 42c
CPU Load: 52c
System Idle: 52c
System Load: 60c-65c.

ambient noise: normal conversation, medium volume stereo TV. sorry i can't get more specific than that.
ambient temp: ~70f.


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 Post subject: Re: Help finding quieter 60mm in SFF gaming rig
PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 6:04 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:53 am
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Location: CT
Changing the case is my advice :)
Quiet 60mm fans exist (I tried a papst and it was decently quiet). However, a 60mm fan does not push much air at all, so a quiet one (that doesn't rotate at 5000rpm) is going to push even less air. Any way you can mod the case to fit an 80 mm or maybe a 92mm fan ?

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 Post subject: Re: Help finding quieter 60mm in SFF gaming rig
PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 6:15 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:26 pm
Posts: 12056
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
You have come to the right place, but finding quiet 60mm fans for a small gaming system is still a challenge. SPCR stopped looking at 60mm fans about 5 years ago -- just not worth the effort, the rpm needed for any kind of useful airflow would always result in too high noise w/ almost every fan. These days, we recommend no cases that use fans any smaller than 80mm diameter. That's your basic problem. No idea about your front fan -- but if it was any good, it would have been mentioned here already, so it's probably not great.

Still, there are some things you could try.

1. have you tried running your fans slower? Those 60mm ones are rated for 3300 rpm. At 2000rpm, they might be good enough for you -- and I bet the temps will not be that much higher.
2. the noise quality might get worse even if overall level drops when you slow the fans. if this happens, try to find a Scythe 60mm fan. The brand has an excellent rep for low noise, and they have at least one 60mm model. Worth a try if not too pricey.

If you are going to spend more than say $25 on fans/controllers, then I'd say just dump the case and get any cheap mATX tower which has at least one 120mm exhaust fan, preferably one in front too, and maybe a side GPU fan vent. Look for one with minimum blockage at the vents -- cut out heavy grills if you have to. Even one of those $30 Newegg/Rosewill cases will do -- and be a lot quieter than what you have now.... tho you might have to invest in at least one good 120mm fan for exhaust on the back panel.

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 Post subject: Re: Help finding quieter 60mm in SFF gaming rig
PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 6:32 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 4:47 am
Posts: 5
hmm, i see. thanks for the quick replies!

well, i'll definitely keep case design more in mind for my next build. not sure when i'll update the case again, as otherwise i do like this case. and i have no clue about case modding to that extent, but it might be possible. i'll see if anyone else has done any kind of work like that. if you have any pointers about doing this kind of case mod, or can point me to a good document, that would be great. =) i mean, do i just cut a big hole in the case and slap the biggest fan i can fit in there? =)

until then i'll see what i can do with speedfan to slow those exhaust fans down.

thanks!

also, i LOVE the article with the SG07! =) i plan on building a very similar build for my wife sometime next year, so that's very awesome! =)


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 Post subject: Re: Help finding a new case?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 8:12 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 4:47 am
Posts: 5
hi guys, me again! =)

so here and there i look into options for new cases, but i make it hard on myself because aesthetics are also important to me and i don't want to just buy a black cube. ;)

i see that Thermaltake, the guys that made my current case, just released a new model, the A30.

do you think this case would be good? it still has some of the same old problems from my current case (PSU right about the CPU, back panel takes up to 3 60mm fans) but the big difference is the 230mm exhaust fan on top (800rpm, 15dBA).

do you think that 230mm fan *alone* could service to vent air from the case (with a 92mm intake fan in front)? meaning, i would just opt to not install any 60mm fans in the back panel.

or should i just keep looking? (and any mATX SFF case suggestions are welcome!)

for now let's say that my thermals remains as they are in my first post, though i am also looking in water cooling options.

thanks again guys!


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 Post subject: Re: Help finding a new case?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:21 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:12 am
Posts: 3257
Location: ITALY
nicodemus wrote:
any mATX SFF case suggestions are welcome

Lan Gear Da Box.

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 Post subject: Re: Help finding a new case?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:26 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:06 pm
Posts: 3395
Location: US
nicodemus wrote:
do you think that 230mm fan *alone* could service to vent air from the case (with a 92mm intake fan in front)? meaning, i would just opt to not install any 60mm fans in the back panel.
Unlikely to be a good idea in my opinion. Best to stick to 120mm or maybe 140mm... but 230mm is far far far from the sweet spot.

Still looking for good 60mm fans? This is about is good as you will find for 60mm:
http://www.noiseblocker.de/en/BlackSilent60.php

http://www.noiseblocker.de/Datenblaette ... _de_en.pdf

noiseblocker is a reputable manufacturer of high end fans.

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 Post subject: Re: Help finding quieter 60mm in SFF gaming rig
PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 9:09 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2011 4:47 am
Posts: 5
thanks for the replies, guys!

i did see Da Box in my searching. yeah, it may very well be the best option for me. i just wish it didn't look so plain to my eyes. =/

i'll be sure to look over those fans!

oh, would you mind elaborating on why the 230mm fan is far from the sweet spot? i thought bigger = better. =) ie. slower rotation with more cfm.

thanks again!


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 Post subject: Re: Help finding quieter 60mm in SFF gaming rig
PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:33 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:39 am
Posts: 15
There is little selection over 140mm in size, and most tend to be power hogs for the air moved and just not as quiet. Just not many manufacturers investing the time and money to make good fans over 140mm.

Bigger is better to a point.

Frankly, 120mm is really the sweet spot as pretty much anyone worth their salt invests in trying to make better and better 120mm fans and it is fairly easy to make a quite fan in this size that flows well.


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 Post subject: Re: Help finding quieter 60mm in SFF gaming rig
PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 12:04 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:06 pm
Posts: 3395
Location: US
azazel1024 wrote:
There is little selection over 140mm in size, and most tend to be power hogs for the air moved and just not as quiet. Just not many manufacturers investing the time and money to make good fans over 140mm.
I have been wondering if there is another reason for this. Maybe, given the viscosity of air, 120mm is just the sweetspot and the physics of air mitigate against moving as much air, as quietly, with reasonable static pressure, at any other size. Just speculating.

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"Aristotle calls man the rational animal. All my life I have been seeking evidence to confirm this" Bertrand Russell
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 Post subject: Re: Help finding quieter 60mm in SFF gaming rig
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 12:33 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:39 am
Posts: 15
You do have an issue that a lot of the big fans (>140mm) I've seen tend not to have very good static pressures. So this probably contributes to poor case ventilation compared to something a little smaller with the same CFM rating.


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