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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 4:28 pm 
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ces wrote:
What I wrote was intentionally in the nature of a list of belief systems.

I left it for people to form their own opinions about what talking points might cause an observer to form an opinion that anyone might knowingly or unknowingly ascribe to any of them.

All of those belief systems are ones that I disagree with, but there are many people who self identify with one or more of them and stand up for them.

For me to apologize I would have to assert that you ascribe to at least one them. I decline to do that. I in fact don't know what your personal belief systems are other than what you have posted under m0002a, and I don't know how serious you are about even that... or whether you are posting contrary opinions under other logins.

Your m0002a postings have consistently maintained a disbelief in the birther belief system. What about the others? Do you accept any of the other belief systems that I listed as your own? Do you reject them all? It isn't for me to say. You tell us.
First you claim you didn't call me those despicable things, then in the last paragraph you ask me if I am a believer or practitioner in those despicable things. This sounds a lot like a round-about way of accusing me of them again. I am not going to dignify your personal attacks or accusations any further.


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 4:38 pm 
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CNN gives birther Donald Trump more air time.
In addition to being on CNN "Anderson Cooper 360" on Tuesday, today Trump appeared in an interview airing Wednesday on CNN's "John King, USA".
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/20 ... le/?hpt=C1

What's with all those birthers at CNN?


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 4:46 pm 
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m0002a wrote:
Freedom of the press and speech does infact mean you can say what you want,.

Some places better understand the vagueness of certain provisions:

http://bankofamericasuck.com/tag/stephe ... -radio-act

http://www.themidnightreview.com/2011/0 ... -news.html

http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2 ... -of-canada

http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=1 ... 10111a218a

http://www.asiantribune.com/news/2011/0 ... maging-lie

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:26 pm 
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aristide1 wrote:
I will stand by earlier claim that liberals are no longer the protectors of freedom of speech and freedom of the press. This is in spite of organizations like the ACLU, which still defends the right of even those who they disagree with to say what the want (so long as they don't violate libel, slander, and other similar laws). In the USA, there are no political parties that are illegal, unlike almost all EU countries.

Pretty soon, the liberals are going to ban lying in poker (but I guess since Obama put them all in jail a few weeks ago, its pretty much the same thing).


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:34 pm 
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Big Pimp Daddy wrote:

judge56988, I realise your post was meant to be a joke that you have copied and pasted from some hilarious website/email, but parroting it just makes you come across as a prejudiced ill-informed twat. Sorry.

lol

Big Pimp Daddy wrote:
"I've got some shit I'm conservative about, I've got some shit I'm liberal about. Anyone who makes up their mind before they hear the issue is a fucking fool".

Well, that part you got right.

This thread was getting so dire.
Ces vs M0002a, like a few other threads. Two diametrically opposed viewpoints, two people who will never agree.
Like Aristide said, close it.


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:43 pm 
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Quote:
Pretty soon, the liberals are going to ban lying in poker

Have you ever offered anything to a conversation that is not extremist?

You can pretend Canada looks foolish, but your claim has zero validity. Meanwhile Faux is not there, and the situation speaks for itself.

I'm actually thankful for people like you, there are too few in the world so easily dismissed.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 7:05 pm 
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judge56988 wrote:
Like Aristide said, close it.

6 pages of nonsense has changed nothing, Andy's OP still stands alone.
That's certainly reason to close it.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 9:22 pm 
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aristide1 wrote:
Quote:
Pretty soon, the liberals are going to ban lying in poker

Have you ever offered anything to a conversation that is not extremist?

You can pretend Canada looks foolish, but your claim has zero validity. Meanwhile Faux is not there, and the situation speaks for itself.

I'm actually thankful for people like you, there are too few in the world so easily dismissed.
I never claimed that Canada is foolish. There are very few countries in the world (even in the most developed liberal democracies) that have the same degree of freedom of speech and freedom of the press as in the US. I respect their right to choose their own laws on these matters, and I do have some appreciation as to why (for instance) the Nazi Party is banned in Germany, and why the Communist Party is banned in some former Soviet satellites.

But not surprisingly, the claim that the effort to repeal the Canadian regulation in question is being attempted to allow Fox News into Canada is itself a lie. First, there have been efforts to repeal the regulation for the last 10 years (having nothing to do with recent events). Second, the network in question is not Fox News, and has nothing to do with Fox News, other than being a conservative station in Canada and wanting to broadcast a talk show format.

Actually, in the US the FTC regulates broadcasts on the public airwaves, and has its own rules that do restrict freedom of speech (you can ask George Carlin about that). In the US, it does seem that all the political talk shows are on Fox, MSNBC, CNN, etc, which are cable networks and do not fall under the jurisdiction of the FCC. On the other hand, I think Jerry Springer is on broadcast TV.

So if you were a broadcast news journalist reporting the facts of this story on the airwaves in Canada, most likely such reporting would be in violation of the regulation about making false statements.

Lastly, you have a taken a joke about poker and gone ballistic. If you think my jokes are not funny, that is one thing. But to take them seriously is a different matter. I previously mentioned in another post that you may be taking all this stuff a little too seriously, and maybe you should lighten up for your own well-being.


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:42 am 
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Maybe you should find an appropriate place for humor. Nothing about the downfall of this country is funny.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:17 am 
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aristide1 wrote:
I don't believe the list that Judge posted, but I do believe in equal time to state opposing opinion.
I don't buy either list. Are you finding these as funny as the other list?

So then by standards already stated here this is the definition of a US conservative.

1. You have to be against abortion but pro-war (I've seen real life examples).
2. You have to believe that governments create oppression as their primary mission and all corporations have ethics. All those chemicals in your drinking water were placed there by the serpent hiding in Eden 4000 years ago.
3. You have to believe that guns in the hands of all citizens are not a threat and there no limit to the money to be spent on U.S. weapons technology to deter the Chinese and North Korean communists, but all other US spending is 100% inept and unimportant. See also #13.
4. You have to believe that there was no successful corn industry before federal funding. Or oil industry. or milk industry, or all the others that get annual corporate welfare.
5. You have to believe that earth's climate is totally unaffected by man and won't believe otherwise even if the planet becomes totally uninhabitable. To suggest otherwise means you give up personal safety and I get to kill you with full justification. I'm never wrong, I'm a conservative. That proves I'm right. Really, really, right.
6. You have to believe that but being homosexual requires stoning, like it says in the Bible, except for certain conservatives who mistakenly opted to be this way. They didn't know any better, and we're performing brainwashing techniques to correct their defects. We also neutered them when they weren't looking, we're justified in doing that, it's our right, really really right.
7. You have to believe that the AIDS virus is spread because God decided to punish the US for its gay rights. 9-11 was also punishment, but the US didn't take the hint, it needs to be repeated.
8. You have to believe that the same teacher who can't control her students because their whacko parents defend them regardless of what they do or who they shoot is somehow actually going to get through to these kids about anything. You also believe that if kids have no sex education from school they obviously won't be having any sex at all. It's not like hormones all of a sudden flood the body. Abstinence has worked well for Palin and her family, right? Really really right.
9. You have to believe that hunters care about nature, based on all the lead they leave everywhere and won't ever change to other materials, while you single PETA activists as the norm for the other party.
10. You have to believe that self-esteem through screwing another is more important than actually doing work. That is the current US definition of opportunity. Work is for fools, easy opportunity is for smart people like the CEO's of Goldman Sacs, Chase, BoA, and BP.
11. You have to believe that Mel Gibson spent $25 million of his own money to make "The Passion of the Christ" to have a leg to stand on during his drunken anti-Semitic remarks. As a conservative one extreme always justifies the other.
12. You have to believe the NRA is good because it railroads its stance and winning is all that counts, while the ACLU is bad because while it supports certain parts of the Constitution, they are the ones conservatives don't care about, which means they don't count for all citizens.
13. You have to believe that taxes are too high and only anarchy rules, but ATM fees are not too high, because we endorse reverse Robin Hood-ism, based on irrational paranoia of socialism, whose definition conservatives can't get right far too often, but blame the education system for that particular ignorance. See item #8.
14. You have to believe that the CEOs of Chase and Goldman Sacs are more important to American history than Thomas Jefferson, Gen. Robert E. Lee, and Thomas Edison. Ken Lay and the CEO of Tyco were simply misunderstood. Greed is good, everything else is socialism. We believe in Jesus too, just not his work. We're too righteous to be questioned, it automatically makes you unpatriotic.
15. You have to believe that calling Obama a monkey is not racist, and corporate racial and sexual discrimination don't exist in this country even after proven in a court of law.
16. You have to believe that the only reason capitalism has failed elsewhere is because they don't have the degree of nepotism we have.
17. You have to believe that this message is a part of a vast, left-wing conspiracy.


1) a) Yes b) While I reject the idea of being "pro-war" (never met someone who LIKES war), I am shocked that you can't differentiate between a military conflict and slaughtering helpless babies
2) a) the EPA certainly does, the IRS does to a degree b) not all but most c) what? The devil put chemicals in drinking water? never heard that one.
3) It IS good. The gov't should fear the people, not the other way around b) should be a limit, for sure c) we spend far too much on stuff that we never should have promised everyone. Handouts benefit the lazy.
4) Conservatives are against corn subsidies. Oil subsidies are not "corporate welfare", a tax break is not a tax refund. They still pay huge amounts of taxes. To call it "welfare" is blindly ignorant. Welfare is money given to lazy people who don't work. Subsidies are a reduction in tax rate to make something profitable. IE- instead of paying 1 billion in taxes, you only need to pay 500 million on taxes. You are still getting money. If you eliminate the subsidies, you might get 0 (if it's not profitable, they may shut it down).
5) true! Environmental factors totally dwarf anything we've been able to do thusfar to change the climate. See: Mt. Penetubo
6) False. I have never met a conservative or christian who wants to stone someone. We believe it is wrong, but it's not a capital offense.
7) a) I'm inclined to believe that. It's mainly a problem for homosexuals and drug users (not entirely, though) b) no
8) Lol- this is ridiculous. Conservatives believe children should be responsible for their actions. Shooting someone? Ridiculous. Palin? Who gives a crap. This might be your worst point in the whole list.
9) Ever heard of steel shot? I don't think a couple small copper-encased lead bullets are going to ruin nature. b) PETA people are whackos
10) That's a liberal ideal. Conservatives believe you should earn what you have. Liberals think if you can sue for it that's good enough. Fundamental christians believe you should avoid lawsuits as much as possible, and that screwing over someone isn't right (see: the golden rule). So on the one hand conservatives are religious zealots, and then they are completely devoid of religion? Which is it? Oh and the CEO of goldman sachs is in bed with the current (liberal) regime- how does that fit your theory?
11) Who cares about Mel Gibson?
12) NRA is good, ACLU is good in some cases but wrong in others (did you know they supported a womens right to do illegal drugs while pregnant?)
13) Uh... lol? Reverse robinhoodism? Taxes are too high, but that doesn't leave the only alternative as Anarchy.
14) No, I've never heard someone say this. Another ridiculous statement. Conservatives revere the constitution and the founding fathers, not people who are super rich.
15) Calling him a monkey is racist, for sure. b) huh? Quota systems are wrong.
16) Where has it failed?
17) No, it's more like a poorly written, ridiculous diatribe that is sadly confused and misguided. It's not even as catchy as the origional.

Look- saying taxes are too high and government is too large is not suggesting Anarchy. No on is suggesting Anarchy. Of course, most anarchists are extremely left-wing, not right- but you knew that, of course. Greed is bad. Conservatives do no seeminly support rich people because they admire their extreme wealth or sometimes greedy tactics. We don't support "seizing assets" or redistributing wealth from productive earners to often lazy non-productive bums. We don't believe the gov't should be responsible for providing health care for people who want to "explore art" or wander around aimlessly while they discover themselves.

I am amazed at the hatred and contempt on display by certain people here. I thought the "right" was supposed to be the hateful ones.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:27 am 
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Well then you can't read, for I clearly stated I don't agree with this list, and that it was made with the same techiniques the other list was made, the republican techniques, so you can keep the hatred crown, it's well earned and well deserved.

The point of that list? As a group, you can dish it out, but you can't take it. A very old saying.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:31 am 
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m0002a wrote:
ces wrote:
And a Black President, that is symbolic. That is the reason for much of the irrational hate.... and the UFO type of conspiracy arguments.
I respectfully disagree. Very few people care what Obama's ethnic background is (50% African and 50% European). I don't see hatred against Obama based on his race, just as I don't see it against black athletes or black entertainers because of their ethnic background. Sounds to me like you a little bit paranoid schizoid on this subject (as well as the Jesus stuff). But Obama is a very liberal politician (or at least he claimed to be during the campaign) and a lot of conservatives hate liberals (nothing to do with race).

If you think a lot of people hate Obama, you must not have been around when Clinton was president.
Race is definitely part of the opposition to Obama. People don't look at percentages. Black genes are more dominant, and Obama looks black. Whites will present another reason for opposing him, but race is often part of it. Similarly... blacks support Obama because he's... black. Are we supposed to pretend otherwise?

Similarly, Steele was chosen because he's black: to "prove" just how anti-racist the GOP is.

There's not much of a difference though to say Republicans oppose Obama because he's a Democrat. It's simply another group tie. Compare the policies of Clinton, Dubya, and Obama; and you find much of the same. Bush is quoted as warning against the "three isms" of nativism, protectionism (trade), and isolationism (war - though he ran as the anti-war candidate...). Similarly Bush is quoted as saying the GOP had to choose between opposing immigration (Buchanan I suppose?) and calling for more. In electing Bush, they chose more.

You won't hear Democrats admit this though.

It's just a game of pretend: people struggling to find meaning, purpose, belonging where no rational answer can exist (those insisting "reason" or "science" has answers that don't fall to relativity are the most deluded). The Dems and Repubs are the two big teams; people choose one and cheer. Those funding the party and mass media lead voters this way and that, and we all cheer - having a good ole time with our game. Why is Obama pro-war? He's told to be. Why is Obama pro- "free trade"? He's told to be. Why is Obama anything? It's the same with Dubya. And in 2012 "we" will elect another idiot, or perhaps some genius sell out like Clinton, who was admittedly a genius.

Similarly we pretend to cheer on Faux News or MSNBC or NPR (which I actually like regardless of the strong bias). Pick your team, and play your game of pretend. They'll give you a sense of belonging and purpose. When the US does develop major problems, we'll each blame our pet scapegoats in the manner directed.

Within our game, the Republicans are meant to be slowly losing. As a result, Bush is blamed for unpopular stances, and Obama is credited with the popular. That's how the game works. The bad guys are beaten by the good guys. Bush will be remembered badly, and Obama will be revered. In the future, what's labeled as Bush will have little electoral success outside shrinking pockets.

-

My purpose in posting this? I get annoyed by the game of pretend since I'm not in either group. That's not to say I'm "above" the Dems and Repubs - just outside.


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:31 am 
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aristide1 wrote:
People who put money and political ideology ahead of truth and ethics are neither patriots nor human beings.
Who are you calling unpatriotic and inhuman? Not any of the other posters on this forum I hope.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:45 am 
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aristide1 wrote:
The point of that list? As a group, you can dish it out, but you can't take it. A very old saying.
I have also noticed a highly reliable "tell" signal when listening to conservative talking heads (and empty heads for that matter). Whenever they accuse the "bad people" on the "other side" of any unethical conduct.... it is they who are the ones engaged in what they accuse others of doing.

For example, accusations of class warfare. That is the one that always sticks in my mind. It is one of the core values of the Republican party (they do it even against their own)... yet whenever a Democrat edges toward fairer taxation... they are accused of class warfare (attacking the rich).

Listen carefully to their accusations. Then stop and take a close look and you will seem them actively engaged in whatever they accuse others of doing. It is sort of like the magician's trick of distracting the eye from where the real action is.

Now I am not accusing the mopes of intentionally doing that. They are just aping the talking heads. But I do believe it is a calculated tactic when the talking heads do it.

Listen to them on Fox network some time very carefully. Then take a quick look at what their other "hand" is doing. It is not pretty.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:57 am 
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Trip wrote:
I get annoyed by the game of pretend since I'm not in either group.
I believe you are sincere when you say that. But from the content of your posting, in my personal opinion, that does not appear to be an accurate statement.

I have observed that there are a large number of Republican voters who disparage both sides, claim to be independent.... but who reliably support and defend, with their votes, that vast redistribution of wealth that was led by Bush.

The Chinese and the Indians get it. A strong country requires a strong middle class. It is their policy to build a strong middle class. For whatever reason, greed maybe, the Republican party just isn't into the middle class... yet they rely on the vote of "independent" cynical middle class conservatives to enable their continued pillaging of the middle class.

I am not in the voting booth with you when you vote... but from what you say......

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Last edited by ces on Thu Apr 28, 2011 10:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 10:08 am 
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Trip wrote:
Race is definitely part of the opposition to Obama. People don't look at percentages. Black genes are more dominant, and Obama looks black. Whites will present another reason for opposing him, but race is often part of it. Similarly... blacks support Obama because he's... black. Are we supposed to pretend otherwise?

Similarly, Steele was chosen because he's black: to "prove" just how anti-racist the GOP is.
Black genes are more dominant? Not sure there is any scientific evidence to back that up, or that it is in any way relevant.

Although there will always be some who vote against Obama because of his 50% African racial background, I think it is a small number of people. I don't hear Republicans complaining about Clarence Thomas or Condoleezza Rice being black. Republicans don't like Obama because he is a liberal Democrat (duh!). If Obama gets impeached like Clinton, then we can start talking about a right-wing conspiracy.

I don't know much about the selection of Steele as (previous) GOP party chairman, but even if some chose him because of his race, is that any different than what Democrats do, or different than affirmative action?


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 10:20 am 
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ces wrote:
I have observed that there are a large number of Republican voters who disparage both sides, claim to be independent.... but who reliably support and defend, with their votes, that vast redistribution of wealth that was led by Bush.

The Chinese and the Indian's get it. A strong country requires a strong middle class. It is their policy to build a strong middle class. For whatever reason, greed maybe, the Republican party just isn't into the middle class... yet they rely on the vote of "independent" cynical conservatives to enable their continued pillaging of the middle class.

I am not in the voting booth with you when you vote... but from what you say......
1. Exactly what legislation did Bush sign into law that provides for a "vast redistribution of wealth"?

2. Strong middle class in India and China? Are you joking? Have you ever been to these places? India (besides having a caste system) has two of world's top 10 richest people according to Forbes 2011 rankings. The richest Chinese citizen ranks as number 11 on the list.


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:33 am 
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In a recent study, two groups of similar age range, etc., one group consisting of individuals self-identified as liberals while the other consisting of self-identified conservatives, underwent brain imaging (the study was done at University College London.) It was found that the liberals had a larger anterior cingulate cortex (a part of the brain associated with complex reasoning) while the conservatives had a larger amygdala (a part of the brain associated with fear and anxiety.)

None of this comes as any surprise, but it puts a starkly revealing material stamp on things.

Unfortunately, actions that are done out of fear tend to perpetuate fear. If one does not have the inclination to learn the facts of a situation or the powers of reasoning necessary to analyze them, then one is vulnerable to manipulation by all manner of wily and self-serving individuals.


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:40 am 
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Do you have a link or are you scared someone is watching you?

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:58 am 
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He has a functioning link, but I'm afraid he only has it in short form.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 12:06 pm 
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Quote:
Old Joke--Cannibal goes to butcher, sees lawyer brains @ 8.99/lb, doctors brains @ 10.59/lb and politicians brains @ 39.50/lb and asks why so high for politician's brains. Butcher replies "you know how many politicians I have to kill to get a pound of brains?"


http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_theticket ... uggests-no

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 12:22 pm 
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1.
aristide1 wrote:
Do you have a link

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504763_162- ... ?tag=strip
http://www.cell.com/current-biology/abs ... %2900289-2
2.
Reachable wrote:
Unfortunately, actions that are done out of fear tend to perpetuate fear. If one does not have the inclination to learn the facts of a situation or the powers of reasoning necessary to analyze them, then one is vulnerable to manipulation by all manner of wily and self-serving individuals.
Agreed

3. Someone asked a question about wealth redistribution and Bush and the Middle Class. It is part of the national policy of both India and China to grow the middle class. They are doing that. India's middle class is larger than all of the US. If you look at the auto industry's auto projections for China it is hard to come to any other conclusion but that they are well on the way to success there as well.

Facts: Global warming is occurring. Wealth redistribution under Bush occurred. President Obama has a Hawaiian birth certificate.

If there is one theme the rends its way through pretty much of the laws passed by the Bush administration it is the they frequently shifted wealth... and only in one direction. Just sticking to tax laws. There was no tax law that he passed that didn't have such an impact. Capital gains is a good one. Which economic strata benefits the most from a reduction of capital gains. Why not decrease the fax burden of the middle class and shift that over to wealthier classes instead of vice versa????

And please don't give me this free market stuff. The only free market in the world is Somalia. You can go pollute and pirate to your heart's content. Every where else the allocation of wealth is controlled by rules, which by their very nature, favor certain groups over others. For most of human history those favored have been the wealthy and powerful and the children of the wealthy and powerful. That will always be so.

But Bush and the Republicans have not stopped there... and have gone on and have/are destroying the golden goose... the source of this wealth... the middle class. Why they have declared war on the middle class is beyond me. Why large swaths of the middle class support them in this endeavor is stranger still.

A poorly functioning anterior cingulate cortex is as good an explanation as any.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 1:58 pm 
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Capital gains are taxed at a lower rate because the money that is invested has ALREADY BEEN TAXED ONCE. If I take income from my paycheck and invest it, that money has already been taxed. When my investment gains value, this increased value is again taxed.

Yes, redistribution of wealth has occured during every presidency since FDR. From producers to the middle class/poor.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:00 pm 
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aristide1 wrote:
Well then you can't read, for I clearly stated I don't agree with this list, and that it was made with the same techiniques the other list was made, the republican techniques, so you can keep the hatred crown, it's well earned and well deserved.

The point of that list? As a group, you can dish it out, but you can't take it. A very old saying.


There have been 2 lists in the thread already. You could have not agreed with the first or the second list. I didn't think that you would make your own list that you didn't agree with- silly me. :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:11 pm 
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m0002a wrote:
Trip wrote:
Race is definitely part of the opposition to Obama. People don't look at percentages. Black genes are more dominant, and Obama looks black. Whites will present another reason for opposing him, but race is often part of it. Similarly... blacks support Obama because he's... black. Are we supposed to pretend otherwise?

Similarly, Steele was chosen because he's black: to "prove" just how anti-racist the GOP is.
Black genes are more dominant? Not sure there is any scientific evidence to back that up, or that it is in any way relevant.
Prove it? I know lots of mixed people. It's very significant because Obama appears and identifies as being black. How can you not get this? Blacks in the US on average I think are 1/4 white, but they identify as black because of appearance. I'm from the South... The poor whites and slaves mixed somewhat. It wasn't, as pop history has it, that plantation owners mixed with their slaves often.

You know no mulattoes?

Quote:
Although there will always be some who vote against Obama because of his 50% African racial background, I think it is a small number of people. I don't hear Republicans complaining about Clarence Thomas or Condoleezza Rice being black.
If they take the wrong side of a racially significant matter (like immigration), then race will flare up there too, yes. "Liberal" is often code for "not in white interests". I mean truly what does the word "liberal" mean? Originally it meant classical liberal, ie. libertarian. We'd call that "conservative" today because lower taxes tend to be in white interests, since whites tend to want lower taxes. Conservative originally meant preserving things, including environment but also tradition and hierarchy. It goes back to the French Revolution against the French monarchy. The liberals wanted change; the conservatives wanted to preserve the system. Today conservatives want creative destruction (war, trade, immigration): hardly "conservative" since their policies destroy everything, ah, as do the "liberals". The policies also make money for lobbyists; their purpose is money, not destruction.
Quote:
Republicans don't like Obama because he is a liberal Democrat (duh!). If Obama gets impeached like Clinton, then we can start talking about a right-wing conspiracy.

I don't know much about the selection of Steele as (previous) GOP party chairman, but even if some chose him because of his race, is that any different than what Democrats do, or different than affirmative action?
Well, the Democrats don't have to prove they're not racist. The GOP is largely the white party, so it has to prove it's not racist.

Since I'm a white Southerner, I'm not really allowed to speak much on this, and I don't want to make this site appear somehow bad. So, I probably oughtn't speak more. We often hear how race should be brought out, but that's only if educated white Southerners are gagged, lol. (The dumb ones are paraded out and declared the norm...).


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:22 pm 
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Trip wrote:
It's very significant because Obama appears and identifies as being black. How can you not get this?
The same way some people don't get the following: Global warming is occurring. Wealth redistribution under Bush occurred. President Obama has a Hawaiian birth certificate.

They don't want to get it.... For one other possible reason, see:
viewtopic.php?p=540190#p540190

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:40 pm 
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ces wrote:
Trip wrote:
It's very significant because Obama appears and identifies as being black. How can you not get this?
The same way some people don't get the following: Global warming is occurring. Wealth redistribution under Bush occurred. President Obama has a Hawaiian birth certificate.

They don't want to get it.... For one other possible reason, see:
viewtopic.php?p=540190#p540190
I'm very much a conservationist, but I'd thought global warming wasn't true? I do think it's significant that CO2 is being released; I was just under the impression the world is actually cooling now, not warming.

It seems to me that global warming is more political than scientific. I do like alternative energy research at least, though perhaps nuclear plants oughtn't be built on fault lines, especially (I've been told) poorly maintained ones. I'm told (and could be erroneous) privatisation was somehow to blame for the low nuclear standards in Japan (short term profits for long term risks).

I am anti-Faux News though at least! And yea, under Bush spending was higher than even under Clinton. If Bush was better than Clinton, then Obama must be better than Bush. It's a steady move in the same direction. If there's any variance, it's perhaps that Bush was worse with war. I'm opposed to mass murder in Libya btw, even if it's UN approved mass murder. Faux News seems to like Obama more now that he's killed some people though. (Admittedly, legally it's Congress who's at fault, even if it has shrugged off this power to declare war. Legally Obama may not. So Congress, including most of the GOP, is also guilty here.) I don't like Qaddafi, but there's not been enough cause.


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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:43 pm 
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djkest wrote:
Capital gains are taxed at a lower rate because the money that is invested has ALREADY BEEN TAXED ONCE. If I take income from my paycheck and invest it, that money has already been taxed. When my investment gains value, this increased value is again taxed. Yes, redistribution of wealth has occured during every presidency since FDR. From producers to the middle class/poor.
Where to start??? The middle class are the producers. That is why India and China are attempting to bulk up their middle class up. That is what any country with economic aspirations (and common sense) does.

"Capital gains are taxed at a lower rate because the money that is invested has ALREADY BEEN TAXED ONCE." You really don't have a clue about how the political system operates do you or the tax system for that matter? All money has already been taxed.... multiple times...and that never figures into the calculus of what gets taxed or for how much. Sheesh.

Are you middle class? Are you a producer? Ooops. :oops:

Get me Fox news.... I need booster shot.... they're trying to cornfuse me.... they are trying to get me to vote in my self interest, and that of my family.

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Last edited by ces on Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:53 pm 
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Trip wrote:
I'm very much a conservationist, but I'd thought global warming wasn't true? I do think it's significant that CO2 is being released; I was just under the impression the world is actually cooling now, not warming.
Trip wrote:
It seems to me that global warming is more political than scientific.
The talking head global warming deniers are political. There is some kind of a plausible argument that human kind is not contributing to the global warning. Fox news is famous for intentionally confusing the two.

After all the coal and oil that we have pulled up out of the ground and burned in the last two hundred years... (all that carbon being held out of the ecosystem for millions of years) I find it implausible to believe that it is not contributing. How could such a major shift of carbon not contribute to the global warming that is going on?

But when Fox news intentionally reports that global warming is not occurring... shame on them. They are intentionally confusing the public dialog for political purposes.

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 Post subject: Re: I have just discovered how horrible Fox News really is
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:04 pm 
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Quote:
They are intentionally confusing the public dialog for political purposes at any and all costs.

Fixed it for you.

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