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 Post subject: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 10:10 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:15 pm
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Location: belgium
I am building a second system for browsing/photoshop & some gaming.

Basicly I can not decide if I should go ATX route or mATX and a good case.

For ATX I have been thinking about getting the R4 or 550D.

For mATX I only saw the fractal mini.

System specs: I5 3570K , Corsair 8GB ram, Asus GTX660/670 (havent decided yet), PSU Kingwin LZP 550, Samsung 830 256GB, I bought these parts already besides the GPU.

Anyone that can advice something? Cons/pro's for the atx/matx? I want to make the system as quiet as possible. Also still need to decide what CPU cooler im going to use, I guess for later upgrades/cooling an ATX case would be the smartest thing or?


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 1:12 pm 
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It really comes down to:
- How big of a footprint do you like for your PC/does the footprint matter?
- Is the case easy to work with? Can you fit the components in without being a contortionist/feeding it your skin?
- Will the CPU cooler/PSU/GPU fit?
- Does it have good airflow/cooling solution?
- Do you like the way it looks/does it have the features you want?

Any of the three can make for a quiet PC.

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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 5:13 am 
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Location: Finland
Quote:
I am building a second system for browsing/photoshop & some gaming.

[1] Basicly I can not decide if I should go ATX route or mATX and a good case.

[2] System specs: I5 3570K , Corsair 8GB ram, Asus GTX660/670 (havent decided yet), PSU Kingwin LZP 550, Samsung 830 256GB, I bought these parts already besides the GPU.

[3] Also still need to decide what CPU cooler im going to use, I guess for later upgrades/cooling an ATX case would be the smartest thing or?

1) mATX. Smaller footprint, easier initial assembly, possibly cheaper, smaller space arguably easier to get airflow in (less dead space). ATX you only need if you want more than 3 cards in your setup, no other advantage to the form factor. I like my Define Mini.

2) 660 Ti. 670 only if it has a proven advantage in Photoshop or you need megalomaniac resolution or multiple monitors, for single-monitor Full HD the 660 Ti is plenty. Less power means less heat.

3) A good mATX case will fit any cooler you could need with the 3570K.

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Case: Define Mini
Parts: P8Z77-M Pro µATX, i5-3570K, N650Ti-1GD5/OC, 8 GB G.Skill DDR3U, Xonar DX, WD G 1 TB, mx100 256 GB SSD, RX-5300 PSU
Cooling: Noctua NH-U12P SE2 + Scythe SS PWM, 2x Noctua NF-P12
Extras: Eaton UPS, Dell 24" EIPS, Ducky TKL, SteelSeries Sensei Raw, Synology DS213j 6 TB NAS
idle-load: CPU 32-44 °C @ 300/600-600/800 RPM, GPU 35-65 °C @ 1200-1650 RPM


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 9:06 pm 
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do more than a handful of people even have a PC that actually uses all the slots on an ATX? :shock:

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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:56 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:15 pm
Posts: 176
Location: belgium
What case would you recommend? So far I only have the Fractal Mini in mind.

Hmm on the 660TI vs 670, when I check the temps on techtowerup they are kinda the same... so are the noise levels. Does the 660TI require alot less power?

Also if I would go for the GTX 670, should I go for the normal or TOP? Any diffrence in heat/noise here?


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 5:08 am 
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The Define Mini is too good for me to have considered alternatives. At the time it was pretty much the Temjin or this. If you want more features or a different look or even smaller dimensions, then feel free to check out SPCR reviews. Silverstone has the most variety and some SPCR approved models. If you want SMALL, though, you want mini-ITX, not micro-ATX.

We're only talking about a difference of a couple or three dozen watts between the 660 Ti and the 670, but when you're talking over a 100 W, every watt starts to count. We all know how the summer months can be with hot components - and why pay for something you don't need, or could even be detrimental for your goals. 8)

_________________
Case: Define Mini
Parts: P8Z77-M Pro µATX, i5-3570K, N650Ti-1GD5/OC, 8 GB G.Skill DDR3U, Xonar DX, WD G 1 TB, mx100 256 GB SSD, RX-5300 PSU
Cooling: Noctua NH-U12P SE2 + Scythe SS PWM, 2x Noctua NF-P12
Extras: Eaton UPS, Dell 24" EIPS, Ducky TKL, SteelSeries Sensei Raw, Synology DS213j 6 TB NAS
idle-load: CPU 32-44 °C @ 300/600-600/800 RPM, GPU 35-65 °C @ 1200-1650 RPM


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 8:41 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:15 pm
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Location: belgium
Guess I will go for mATX then, The GTX 670 they have here at the local shop its not the TOP version. Thats also why I asked about the power usage between this one and the 660TI, according to me research they will get to the same temp levels.

As for case I still don't know, what I found weird is that the Fractal Mini isnt THAT much smaller than the R4...

If you have any other advice or case recommendations let me know please.


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:52 am 
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I emphasised the "small" in the last post precisely because a roomy µATX case is not necessarily that much smaller than a regular ATX case. It is, however, much less of a bother compared to big towers like the revered P180. The compact micro-ATX cases I have seen come with too many compromises in my opinion - you're better off with mITX for a truly small rig.

Regarding the cards, chip temperature is not the whole story: OF COURSE the cooling system is tweaked so the chip reaches a certain manufacturer-approved temperature. This does not chance the fact that a card consuming more power will convert more of that power into heat - if a higher-wattage card reaches the same temperature as a lower-wattage card, that just means the extra heat is getting dumped into the ambient air (case and room) and that the cooling is working harder or is more robust.

After going from a GTX 460 into a cardless system and now to a 650 Ti, I can say for sure that the watts do count, and, depending on your local HVAC, can even be felt. :wink:

_________________
Case: Define Mini
Parts: P8Z77-M Pro µATX, i5-3570K, N650Ti-1GD5/OC, 8 GB G.Skill DDR3U, Xonar DX, WD G 1 TB, mx100 256 GB SSD, RX-5300 PSU
Cooling: Noctua NH-U12P SE2 + Scythe SS PWM, 2x Noctua NF-P12
Extras: Eaton UPS, Dell 24" EIPS, Ducky TKL, SteelSeries Sensei Raw, Synology DS213j 6 TB NAS
idle-load: CPU 32-44 °C @ 300/600-600/800 RPM, GPU 35-65 °C @ 1200-1650 RPM


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:02 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:39 pm
Posts: 26
Das_Saunamies wrote:
The Define Mini is too good for me to have considered alternatives. At the time it was pretty much the Temjin or this. If you want more features or a different look or even smaller dimensions, then feel free to check out SPCR reviews. Silverstone has the most variety and some SPCR approved models. If you want SMALL, though, you want mini-ITX, not micro-ATX.


Is the Define Mini fairly cool and quiet despite the lack of sound damping material? Neither the Define Mini nor the Arc Mini mention damping material or quiet computing on their product pages, so I assumed there was none.


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:43 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:49 pm
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Location: UK
Yes, but you don't NEED dampening material if your components are quiet anyway. If the case is well enough designed to be cooled quietly, why add dampening material?

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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:18 pm 
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Location: Denmark
The Define Mini does have damping material where as the Arc Mini doesn't. Otherwise they look just the same to me. And I agree with edh. There's no need for damping material if the components are quiet to begin with. Simply take a look at my very quiet system that uses a well-ventilated case (see the signature).

The Antec Solo II, though ATX, is very compact. I think the size is similar to the Mini. It comes with the built-in hard drive suspension system which is a most for any serious silentPC geek. The out-of-the-box cooling performance is good too, and you can even add two 120 mm front fans. But it has its flaws, whereas the Mini seems flawless but unspectacular.

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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:48 pm 
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gdr wrote:
Das_Saunamies wrote:
The Define Mini is too good for me to have considered alternatives. At the time it was pretty much the Temjin or this. If you want more features or a different look or even smaller dimensions, then feel free to check out SPCR reviews. Silverstone has the most variety and some SPCR approved models. If you want SMALL, though, you want mini-ITX, not micro-ATX.


Is the Define Mini fairly cool and quiet despite the lack of sound damping material? Neither the Define Mini nor the Arc Mini mention damping material or quiet computing on their product pages, so I assumed there was none.

Taken from the Define Mini product page:
Quote:
fitted with noise absorbing material on the inside

To me, soundproofing is the icing on the cake, fading out any last remnants of unpleasant sound. It's more of a perfection thing than an absolute necessity, but for my use I see no reason to forgo it. The Define Mini is certainly quiet, and there are no real issues with the case - my only quibble is the hopelessly small backplate cutout of the motherboard tray, but a cutout is not a necessity. You can see the temperatures I get in my sig, runs quite cool with relatively low fan RPM.

_________________
Case: Define Mini
Parts: P8Z77-M Pro µATX, i5-3570K, N650Ti-1GD5/OC, 8 GB G.Skill DDR3U, Xonar DX, WD G 1 TB, mx100 256 GB SSD, RX-5300 PSU
Cooling: Noctua NH-U12P SE2 + Scythe SS PWM, 2x Noctua NF-P12
Extras: Eaton UPS, Dell 24" EIPS, Ducky TKL, SteelSeries Sensei Raw, Synology DS213j 6 TB NAS
idle-load: CPU 32-44 °C @ 300/600-600/800 RPM, GPU 35-65 °C @ 1200-1650 RPM


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:08 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:15 pm
Posts: 176
Location: belgium
Hmm I still dont' know. Its not that I don't have room.

But a smaller compact case like the Mini does sound nice.. I mean all im gonna use is one GFX card.

On the other hand the R4 is not that much bigger? If it would get me a better silenced gaming PC, I don't mind the little bit bigger case.

So basicly thats what I have to decide on.


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:32 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:15 pm
Posts: 176
Location: belgium
I think I decided to go with the Mini, the R4 is a little to big for what I need... I will only use 1 gfx card and thats about it.

I have been looking at the TJ08-E also, it really looks nice but I don't know... so I have to decide on the Mini vs TJ08-E. Have not found any other good cases so far

Don't want to go for an ITX build, especially if I would want to add a card later on for audio and such.

Now I need to decide what PSU I am going to use.

So far I bought:

Fractal Define Mini
I5 3570K
Asus Gene V
2x8GB Corsair dominator
256GB Samsung 830 SSD
Asus GTX 660TI (recommend here, dno if anything has same performance/noise ratio)

So I pretty much need to decide on 3 fans/ CPU cooler / PSU.


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 9:34 pm 
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Location: Finland
For the Define Mini, you'll want a cooler around 160 mm tall and not much over, there's a slight height limitation.

What I did was buy the Noctua NH-U12P SE2, put the cooler fans on the case and then a PWM Slipstream on the cooler. Temps and RPMs in sig, can't hear them in idle, smooth and unintrusive under load (folding, 100% CPU use).

As for the PSU, check if you can find Nexus in Belgium (Nexus is from .nl). They're my personal favourite, very quiet and excellent value for money, older models SPCR-approved.

_________________
Case: Define Mini
Parts: P8Z77-M Pro µATX, i5-3570K, N650Ti-1GD5/OC, 8 GB G.Skill DDR3U, Xonar DX, WD G 1 TB, mx100 256 GB SSD, RX-5300 PSU
Cooling: Noctua NH-U12P SE2 + Scythe SS PWM, 2x Noctua NF-P12
Extras: Eaton UPS, Dell 24" EIPS, Ducky TKL, SteelSeries Sensei Raw, Synology DS213j 6 TB NAS
idle-load: CPU 32-44 °C @ 300/600-600/800 RPM, GPU 35-65 °C @ 1200-1650 RPM


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 Post subject: Re: Can't decide on new case & ATX/mATX
PostPosted: Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:23 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2008 1:15 pm
Posts: 176
Location: belgium
So I went to the store today.

So far I got the Asus Gene V board, fractal Mini, and a Noctua u12p se2, some dominator corsair ram (2X8GB). Everything fitted in kinda nice.

Looks really good in this little nifty case :) very happy happy at the moment.

Im browsing for GPU & PSU , fans at the moment.

Been thinking about getting GTX 660 ti, Kingwin 500w, and fans don't know yet.

Should be a nice quite little gaming machine!


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