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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:32 pm 
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Posts: 47
treacle wrote:
Hey Ice thanks for finding that info as i have been wondering what that light was as well though you can't see it when the speakers are plugged in. :lol:


I'm running the board as download box so i don't have any speakers plugged in. :)

It doesn't bother me now i know what it is as i was only concerned it was some error light reflecting from the board.

Hopefully now i can get on with installing an OS and sorting out Intel intel amt kvm. I've never owned a board like the DQ77KB as it seems to be continually one step forward two steps back as i was going to install Windows 2012 and it turns out it's yet another thing that is not supported and you have to piddle about manually extracting the bits you need from the windows 8 drivers.

Sigh :shock:


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:59 am 
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Location: Londinium
I just assembled a DQ77KB + Akasa Euler system over the weekend (in large part thanks to Mike's review and this forum topic), and I have very mixed feelings about the Euler. On the one hand, it has a nice appearance, feels well made, and it does seem to do the job (the case gets notably warm after a period of "activity" -- installing ESXi and building a few VMs). However, I am very un-impressed with the engineering. There are 10 points of contact between the case and the motherboard (4 screws in the corners of the motherboard, 4 nuts around the heatsink, the heatsink itself with the CPU, and the rear edge of the motherboard with the I/O shield), and the alignment is just not even close! It is essential for the CPU to be absolutely square with the heatsink, and if you try to screw down the corners of the motherboard, or if you use the I/O shield, then the CPU is *not* square with the heatsink, and that is a catastrophic design/manufacturing fault. The only way of getting the CPU perfectly aligned with the heatsink is to *only* use the 4 nuts around the heatsink, and to *not* use either the corner screws or the rear I/O shield.

User Regis reported this same problem, and provided a diagram that perfectly illustrates the problem: viewtopic.php?p=569291#p569291

Other user reports:

- MikeC never installed the I/O shield
- piglover says I/O shield lines up fine
- Aluminum has two of these, with no fit problems

My theory is that both piglover and Aluminum might be a little bit shocked if they check how much contact there is between the CPU and the heatsink block on their systems. If you use a bright torch, you can roughly see what the alignment is by peering through one of the side holes (the one furthest from the heatsink).

As long as you don't have TIM (heatsink goop) applied, it's easy to rock the motherboard on the different contact points (without any screws) to get a good idea of what touches where. Without the I/O shield, if you ensure the CPU is square with the heatsink (you can rock the motherboard and feel when the CPU is flat against the heatsink), the 4 corners of the board still don't come up flat against the posts; in most cases you have to push down on the corner of the board to get it to touch the post. As soon as you install the I/O shield, alignment goes completely out the window, and to get everything to touch you have to seriously distort the motherboard, and even then I don't think the contact between the CPU and the heatsink block is great (because at this point the board is twisted horribly).

In summary, the only way of getting the CPU square to the heatsink block is to:

a) Use only the heatsink nuts
b) Don't use the screws in the corners of the board
c) Don't use the I/O shield

a) and b) I can live with, but c) is what I'm struggling with. It looks ghetto, and if you aren't careful you could short something out by accidentally touching metal when plugging something in; unlikely but possible. It also lets in more dust than otherwise necessary, and in general is just poor practice. And at the end of the day, for a premium case (I paid £75), it is a fundamental flaw.

I'm posting this in the hope that others will see it and have another look at their setup. The problem is that I haven't been able to find any other passive cases. My options (none of them great), are:

- Live without the I/O shield
- Distort the motherboard and hope for the best
- Find another fanless case (haven't been successful so far)
- Find a case with a fan

Would be greatly interested to get feedback on other people's experiences.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:30 pm 
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Still considering building a euler setup. I'm also looking for a new and affordable 23 inch led screen to go with it. The LG Flatron IPS234V-PN looks like it would fit the bill. However, it has 75x75mm vesa hole positions and the euler needs 100x100. Any ideas on how to fix this? All standard vesa adapters work the other way.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 7:57 pm 
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Posts: 220
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
Yikes. I just measured my Samsung monitor, and it too has 75x75 VESA holes. So I am interested in adaptors too. Anyone?


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 8:51 pm 
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75*75 to 100*100 adapters are cheap and simple. It can go either way, if u know what I mean. Basically a square plate slightly bigger than 100 square with a rim, and 2 set of 4 holes - for 75 and for 100. Try a search for VESA adapter.

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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 12:24 am 
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Posts: 47
@ rotor

The only way i can get mine to align was firstly to move the sata plug lead to the blue one on the outer edge otherwise the inner blue one lifts the corner of the board making it slope even when it's pushed down so the CPU posts are uneven.

Then to get mine to align i have to push down on the CPU backplate while pulling the board back hard against the backplate then the board sits even on the CPU pins and the outer board mounting holes are close enough in alignment to drop the screws in.

But yes nothing aligns as standard and it's a complete pain that i have no desire to keep taking it apart to upgrade anything. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:34 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 11:59 am
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Location: Vancouver, B.C.
MikeC wrote:
75*75 to 100*100 adapters are cheap and simple. It can go either way, if u know what I mean. Basically a square plate slightly bigger than 100 square with a rim, and 2 set of 4 holes - for 75 and for 100. Try a search for VESA adapter.


Thanks. I found this at NCIX:
http://ncix.com/products/?sku=44022


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 10:55 am 
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Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
ist.martin wrote:
MikeC wrote:
75*75 to 100*100 adapters are cheap and simple. It can go either way, if u know what I mean. Basically a square plate slightly bigger than 100 square with a rim, and 2 set of 4 holes - for 75 and for 100. Try a search for VESA adapter.


Thanks. I found this at NCIX:
http://ncix.com/products/?sku=44022

Yeah that's the type of thing... tho I recall seeing one at Lin Haw (in Burnaby now) for $5, not $18. They also come as part of typical wall/desk extension articulated arm stands for monitors. (I use a couple in my lab & can say they're so nice & convenient... but of course, such devices require the use of the VESA mounts, so hanging the computer off the back of the monitor becomes much more challenging. lol!)

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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 9:43 pm 
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Posts: 47
Ice Tea wrote:
Anyone using the thermal paste that came with the Euler?


Well to answer my own question i've not noticed any real difference in load and idle temps between Arctic Silver 5 and the White stuff that comes with the Euler.

Maybe it's because i've only used 35w CPUs and would need more heat to notice?


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2013 9:59 pm 
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Ice Tea wrote:
Hopefully now i can get on with installing an OS and sorting out Intel intel amt kvm.


Intel's documentation for AMT is like trying to decipher a cryptic message. :|


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:28 pm 
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Posts: 47
LOL yeah. :mrgreen:

The only step by step guide i can find is this one.

http://www.howtogeek.com/56538/how-to-r ... it-crashes

Though i'm abut unsure about the part that suggests leaving all ports open. :shock:


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:04 am 
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Posts: 5
Thanks Ice I'll check it out. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:19 pm 
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Posts: 4
Ice Tea wrote:
Anybody else have a glowing red LED at car dvd players the back of the green output jack on the back when you look down it?

it is very hard to tell about the led. Might be an indicator


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:12 pm 
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Has anyone tried a thin-itx board other than the 2 officially supported intel boards?

I have been looking with much interest at the euler until I took the time to read this thread.

I'm curious if the alignment issue is with the case itself or if the intel board was a bit off spec.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 5:29 am 
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Posts: 37
Location: Londinium
tojoski wrote:
I'm curious if the alignment issue is with the case itself or if the intel board was a bit off spec.

The problem is with the vertical alignment; different parts of the case have different heights.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:50 am 
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Regis wrote:
Actually you are entirely right Mike! I did not notice the the short threads - I admit I just assumed lookig on how bulged the CPU was.

I am starting to think the I/O shield is the sole culprit. Check this out:

Image

I fitted the shield from the outside so it is reversed left-to-right but it is the correct side up. You can see on the USB ports how much it is off.



I wonder if this could be helped a little by squeezing the bottom bend on the I/O plate, while expanding the top out a bit with a screwdriver..
I know it would be hard to make up the entire difference, but even 1/2 might take some of the flex out.

I really want to build one of these boxes around one of these boards: http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4462#ov
I know Akasa only officially supports the Intel boards, but as I understand it, cpu placement is part of the AIO spec..,

In any case, I cant find any other passive case thats even close to that price range..


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2013 11:58 pm 
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Posts: 47
When i moved the sata plug from the inner blue socket to the outer blue socket the board no longer sloped as the inner one is on top of the HDD power and sata lead and lifts the edge of the board up with the lack of room from the sata lead bent back on itself.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 2:17 am 
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Thanks for that Ice :)

To be honest i didn't think it would make much difference but you are right as i just moved that sata lead to the outer edge blue socket and the board sits flatter without it bent under itself..

Now the CPU screws are all the same height and all the back sockets align with the blanking plate, Though my motherboard mounts are still out but it is a hell of a lot better than it was.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2013 6:04 am 
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Posts: 37
Location: Londinium
Ice Tea wrote:
When i moved the sata plug from the inner blue socket to the outer blue socket the board no longer sloped as the inner one is on top of the HDD power and sata lead and lifts the edge of the board up with the lack of room from the sata lead bent back on itself.

This must depend on what cables you use, and what orientation you place the drive. I used a round SATA cable (much more flexible and doesn't get in the way as much) and flipped the drive around so the SATA connector on the drive was further away from the motherboard connector. So from what I can see through the holes on the side of the case, nothing is touching except what should be (i.e. nothing is getting in the way of the motherboard).


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 3:17 am 
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Ice Tea wrote:
When i moved the sata plug from the inner blue socket to the outer blue socket the board no longer sloped as the inner one is on top of the HDD power and sata lead and lifts the edge of the board up with the lack of room from the sata lead bent back on itself.


I done exactly the same thing as stretching it out makes the board sit level unlike the inner socket that bends it into a stiff S shape and lift the board on a slope even when you try and screw it down.

rotor wrote:
This must depend on what cables you use, and what orientation you place the drive. I used a round SATA cable (much more flexible and doesn't get in the way as much) and flipped the drive around so the SATA connector on the drive was further away from the motherboard connector. So from what I can see through the holes on the side of the case, nothing is touching except what should be (i.e. nothing is getting in the way of the motherboard).


I would imagine most people would use the short Sata cable that comes with the Euler.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 10:41 pm 
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Yeah i'm using the short red one that came with the Euler as i assumed it was the best length.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:12 am 
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Posts: 220
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
A couple of things:

I bought the SPCR test Euler from Mike, and installed a DQ77KB with an i3-3225, 15GB of ram and a plextor SSD with Windows 8 Pro. Since the DQ77KB only has 4 USB ports, and the Euler adds none, I thought I'd free myself some ports by installing an Intel Advanced-N 6235 mini PCIe card for WiFi and Bluetooth. It is the same card that Mike used in his Intel NUC system review. One would think that it is pretty much designed for the DQ77KB.

Not so. The 6235 card didn't work at all. After much struggling, I discovered that Intel says that the 6235 is NOT FOR RETAIL SALE and will not work in desktop systems. It is meant only for custom OEM builds with special shielding and big antennaes. (I'm not sure why it works so well in the NUC unit that Mike tested). It was unable to find any WiFi networks, nor was it able to detect any Bluetooth devices.

Here is their comment:
http://communities.intel.com/message/185423#185423

I thought I'd warn anyone trying to do what I did. One thing I did do, which was easy because I am not using the shield for the rear ports, was to add a simple USB-header to USB connector cable. It is about 4" long and cost $5. It gives me an extra USB port, and works easily as there is a USB card header near the rear. (There is also an extra SATA connector back there, so I tried a SATA-header to eSATA cable, but it was too thick and stiff to bend 90% quickly from the board. It would be a great idea if it had a 90* connector to the board.)

Finally, after taking the board out a few times while fighting with the 6235, my idle temps are 49-51* from SpeedFan. Does this mean that I need to take it apart again and add thermal paste? Do I wipe off the old stuff before applying new? What is the best paste product to get from NCIX locally? Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 10:27 am 
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Hey Ian,

Too bad about the Intel Advanced-N 6235 mini PCIe. Where did you it anyway? Out of a notebook or something like that?

As for the idle CPU temps -- yeah, that looks a bit high. We were getting readings nearly 20C lower (in a 22C room). Reusing the TIM is fine as long as its distributed nicely and you haven't let it get contaminated by too much dust, other foreign matter. You might be well advised to seek out better nuts to clamp the CPU to the heatblock. I mentioned how bad they are in the review and we discussed it when you picked up the Euler. It's probably a metric thread.

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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:46 am 
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Location: Vancouver, B.C.
When I use the Intel Desktop Utilities to look at temps, it says that the Voltage Regulator is what is measuring so high, and that my Processor Temperature is about 8* lower. Were your VR temps quite high?

I just when in to tighten the screws. The 4 around the CPU/heatsink were very tight, but curiously, the 4 around the motherboard standoffs had all worked themselves very very loose. I tightened them back up and will see if it makes a difference.

I bought that Intel 6235 mini PCIe card from NCIX. It is listed in stock all over the place. It never occurred to me that it wasn't intended for the DQ77KB. That's why I thought I'd post a warning here.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 6:29 am 
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Hi Chaps.

Firstly, thanks for a great thread, it's been very helpful whilst considering my custom build.

I have a question/proposal re. the Euler box:

Would one achieve greater the thermal transfer if one replaced the aluminium heatsink with a copper block?

My guess would be yes, but I'd be interested in anyone's thoughts on this.

Still looking for my ideal box...

P


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:28 pm 
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Location: California
Copper does have almost twice the thermal conductivity of aluminum, so clearly the results would be better. The question is how much better. The real heatsink is the rest of the case and and finned design. Yes - a copper block would potentially get more heat onto the case body, but the part that actually dissipates the heat into the air remains unchanged.

Also, that would be one heck of a block of copper ($$cost). You'd have to machine it pretty precisely to get the right fit into the case (note that most of the problems/issues discussed above have to do with very small - probably milometer sized or smaller - fit/finish issues).

I doubt the result would be enough better to justify the cost and trouble.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:15 pm 
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Posts: 47
piglover is there something wrong with your PM?


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:18 am 
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Posts: 39
Just wanted to let You know, I recently build over 50 systems using Akasa Euler. None of the problems reported in this thread appeared. No problems with alignment whatsoever. Used Dq77kb and Dh61Ag boards. Had two pcs. of early revisions of the case (You can tell the difference by number of the holes in the back panel, where I/O ports are: older has one hole, newer have 2) and did not have any problems as well.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 8:23 am 
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Location: Vancouver, B.C.
tramall wrote:
Just wanted to let You know, I recently build over 50 systems using Akasa Euler. None of the problems reported in this thread appeared. No problems with alignment whatsoever. Used Dq77kb and Dh61Ag boards. Had two pcs. of early revisions of the case (You can tell the difference by number of the holes in the back panel, where I/O ports are: older has one hole, newer have 2) and did not have any problems as well.


What temperatures are you getting from speedfan? With my i3-3225 in there, I am consistently at 50*. I am wondering if I have a contact problem with the alu block, and need to try to reseat it?

Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: Akasa Euler Fanless case
PostPosted: Thu Apr 18, 2013 10:20 am 
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For i3-3220T - 59*C (ambient 23*C-24*C)- 100% cpu - that's LinX at standard settings,we got similar temps when we put celeron g1610. Idle drops to about 39-40*C. Having 50 is not bad(assuming it is during heavy use). We also compared akasa's thermal compound given with the case and it was surprisingly good, compared to MX-2(1-2 degrees difference).


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