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 Post subject: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 5:47 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:02 pm
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Location: Florence, Italy
Hi! I'm new here in the forum but i've read for a long time the articles and reviews on this great website.

First of all i will sorry if my english is a little bad.. I hope you can understand me well :)

In the last years i've build a NAS/Web Server/DLNA Server with components i have except for HDDs. Now i have 5 HDD in Raid 6 plus 1 for the OS (Ubuntu server).
The result works well but it screams a lot :P
Now i want to slowly upgrade maybe all the components for quiet down the NAS and improve performances.

I've build a lot of PCs but this one is my fist silent build because this one have to stay on 24/7. I think i've already learn a lot reading SPCR and i want to thank you.

This is my actual config:

- Case Supermicro SC-750A
very old and sooo big case. I put my 5 HDDs in the 5.25" bays with this converters (it transmits all the vibrations of the HDDs to the case).

- CPU Intel Q6600 with Scythe Yasya CPU Cooler (Slip Stream 120 mm PWM Adj Fan)

- MotherBoard Asus P5KC

- 4GB RAM Corsair (a little old..)

- Sapphire HD2900 PRO
I've put it in the system only because the P5K dosn't have an integrated graphic card. When i change the Mobo i'll buy one with integrated graphic card both for the noise and for cool down all the system (is the hotter and one of the noisy thing in the build).

- 1x WD Caviar SE-16 500GB for the system
i'll replace it with an SSD for the OS

- 2x WD Red 2TB
- 1x WD RE4-GP 2TB
- 2x WD Caviar Black 2TB (i'll replace this two HDDs with WD Red or Seagate NAS HDD)
the project is to expand the storage up to about 10-11 HDDs depending on the case i'll buy.

- 1x Zalman ZM-SF3 120mm exhaust
- 1x Enermax Warp UC-12AEBS intake in front of the HDDs
- 1x Arctic Cooling F9 Pro PWM exhaust
- 1x Enermax TB Silence 80mm intake

- PSU Tecnoware 600W FAL600TYP
also this one is a little old. Maybe i have to change the fan of this PSU before change it. I'll change it when i think the new hardware to buy and so the power consumption.

Now the first thing i've decided to change is the case. My choice goes to the Fractal Design define R4 or to the Antec P280 because they have enough room for up to 11 HDDs (using backplates in the 5.25'' bays) PLUS 1 or 2 SSDs and are quiet cases. But I can't decide from one or the other.
I like more the aesthetics of the R4. But i like the fact that the P280 ha the PSU filter on the side of the case (move the case to take it out from behind will be difficult for the position of the case). I also like the front bezel of the P280 that has double-hinged door again for the position of the case.
One of my questions is if the windowed versions changes the noise.

Then i hope someone can say me something for let me choose the "better" case.

Sorry if my post is so long.. :)

Thanks a lot,
Zanatos


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:42 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:02 pm
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Location: Florence, Italy
I know.. I've written too much.. :)

But please help me.. I don't really know wich one to choose. Or if you have other models in mind i'm open to any advice from you.

Also my big doubt is how much the noise changes between the windowed one to the other without the window.

Thanks again,
Zanatos


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 6:46 am 
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Location: Monterey Bay, CA
Welcome to SPCR. The R4 will probably be the quieter case. The non-windowed version should be a little quieter.

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1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, MSI Z87-G45, MSI GTX 760 2GB Gaming, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung Evo 250GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic X-560. 35-40W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 200-230W Rift, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 3:59 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:02 pm
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Location: Florence, Italy
Thanks a lot Steve!

I've another question: which one has the better HDD vibration reduncing grommets?
Because when i get to have 11 HDDs, but probably also now with "only" 6, vibrations will be the bigger source of noise in the case.

In fact the question about the window was a little obvious but i don't really know which one to choose so i would like to consider all aspects of the two cases before make a choice.

Thanks again!
Zanatos


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:55 am 
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Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
There's one very good thing about your old beast of a case: Since the drives are all in 5.25" bays, you have room to suspend them with elastic cord to eliminate all HDD vibration from going into the case. Leave the Reds, but with the 7200rpm drives, this would make a big difference.

You could then try identifying the noisiest sources of sound (ie, fans) and slow each one down one by one -- using whatever method you can use -- while still staying on the safe side of "too hot". Remove some fans -- I doubt all those are really necessary.

If the machine is only a file server, I'd ditch the video card and replace it with the cheapest passive VGA card possible. Used, someone's discard, whatever.

I would replace the PSU asap. It sounds like one of those $10 no name brands with false labeling that maybe can do half its rated power. Go with a good brand but no more than 500W. Check through the PSU reviews here -- there's lots of super quiet models. Your real power usage will be no more than ~250W even if you have 11 HDDs. But why do you need 11? Better to go with fewer & bigger -- ie, 4TB for now, bigger when they become available.

That will probably get you >80% of the way to a very quiet system.

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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 5:33 am 
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Location: Florence, Italy
MikeC wrote:
There's one very good thing about your old beast of a case: Since the drives are all in 5.25" bays, you have room to suspend them with elastic cord to eliminate all HDD vibration from going into the case. Leave the Reds, but with the 7200rpm drives, this would make a big difference.


It's a good idea to suspend the drives but anyway i've room for max other 2 or 3 drives (don't remember exactly now). And are not so many.
I've said 11 drives because is the max number that i can put in the cases i've speak about. And it's a good number. I don't think that in the next future i will need more space (considering 11x 2TB drives in RAID6 i'll have 18TB). When i've started to buid the system there was "only" 2TB disks at human price. So now i have to go on with this for put all in the same raid array. in the future, if i'll need more space, maybe i can create another raid array with ie 4TB drives.

So I think it would be better to change the case. I think i'll go on the Define R4.

This is what i think.. not sure it is the best way :)
What do you think about?

MikeC wrote:
You could then try identifying the noisiest sources of sound (ie, fans) and slow each one down one by one -- using whatever method you can use -- while still staying on the safe side of "too hot". Remove some fans -- I doubt all those are really necessary.


I've already downvolted all the fans. Yes.. sure that i can remove at least the 8cm one. I'll try. In that way (but also now) i'll have negative pressure. 2 exhaust and only one intake in front of the drives. But i think it will be ok..

MikeC wrote:
If the machine is only a file server, I'd ditch the video card and replace it with the cheapest passive VGA card possible. Used, someone's discard, whatever.


This is a good idea. I thought I would remove the card when I bought a new mobo with integrated graphic but (after reading your post) i've found on amazon a Sapphire HD 5450 at 26euros. For this price i can replace the card now and remove a very noisy and hot component!
Do you think it's a good card for this price?

MikeC wrote:
I would replace the PSU asap. It sounds like one of those $10 no name brands with false labeling that maybe can do half its rated power. Go with a good brand but no more than 500W. Check through the PSU reviews here -- there's lots of super quiet models. Your real power usage will be no more than ~250W even if you have 11 HDDs. But why do you need 11? Better to go with fewer & bigger -- ie, 4TB for now, bigger when they become available.

That will probably get you >80% of the way to a very quiet system.


Yes.. is a bad PSU but i had it when i build the system so i've used it for the moment. In this days i have to measure the power consumption of the system for choose a right powered PSU but i also think a 500W wil be fine. I think to go on a Seasonic but maybe not fanless. It's ok for you?

Thanks a lot for your help and for your advice!
Zanatos


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:23 am 
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Yes, the HD 5450 would work. It's TDP is ~19W vs your 2900 Pro's TDP of 150W :)

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1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, MSI Z87-G45, MSI GTX 760 2GB Gaming, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung Evo 250GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic X-560. 35-40W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 200-230W Rift, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:57 am 
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Location: Florence, Italy
hehe.. it's a really big difference! :D

And for the case? Do you think the Define R4 is a good choice?
I suppose that it'll be good enough with the stock fans and maybe another one as intake in front af the drives (the Zalman i have).

In the first post i forgot to say that the server is in a little room about 3 meters away from the room where i study/work so i don't need a deadly silent build. But i think that with this changes (case, graphic card, psu) i can have a very silent server. No?

Thanks again!
Zanatos


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:29 pm 
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3m away in another room? Sure, it'll be very quiet. Nearly any case would, given those conditions....unless you have really bad vibration transmitted through the case to your floor. That said, the R4 is a nice case. Without the monster video card you really don't have a lot of heat load. Don't know if you need the 2nd front fan. As Mike mentioned, you ought to replace the PSU.

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1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, MSI Z87-G45, MSI GTX 760 2GB Gaming, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung Evo 250GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic X-560. 35-40W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 200-230W Rift, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:37 pm 
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Agreed w/ Steve's last comment. If it was me, I'd definitely keep the case, replace the PSU, replace necessary noisier fans with quieter ones, remove unnecessary fans, and tweak the fan speeds till there's a nice balance between quiet and not too hot.

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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:46 am 
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Location: Florence, Italy
CA_Steve wrote:
3m away in another room? Sure, it'll be very quiet. Nearly any case would, given those conditions....unless you have really bad vibration transmitted through the case to your floor. That said, the R4 is a nice case. Without the monster video card you really don't have a lot of heat load. Don't know if you need the 2nd front fan. As Mike mentioned, you ought to replace the PSU.


Not my monster case at the moment is so silent.. :) but sure, first, for the drives vibrations transmitted to the case, for the PSU and also for the graphic card.

So i'll change the card and the PSU first, remove the 80mm fan and try to undervolt a little more the remaining fans. But maybe then i also have to change the case for the drives vibrations and mostly for the room for other drives (also because is fairly difficult to work inside that case.. is big but there isn't so much space inside. Probably, i think, for the arrangement of components inside it).

Thanks a lot again to you both!
I will keep you updated on the progress. :)

Zanatos


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:09 am 
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That case doesn't have any bottom ventilation, does it? If you do happen to have hard flooring and the case does transmit vibration to the floor, you could isolate the case from the floor. Something simple, like an old rubber door mat would work. Or, a folded up floor rug. :)

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1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, MSI Z87-G45, MSI GTX 760 2GB Gaming, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung Evo 250GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic X-560. 35-40W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 200-230W Rift, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 2:44 am 
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Location: Florence, Italy
CA_Steve wrote:
That case doesn't have any bottom ventilation, does it? If you do happen to have hard flooring and the case does transmit vibration to the floor, you could isolate the case from the floor. Something simple, like an old rubber door mat would work. Or, a folded up floor rug. :)


no.. it has not any bottom ventilation. The case is not on the floor. I try to explain.. is inside a sort of closet. But is open. It has not doors. And it is at the bottom. Between the case and the (hard) floor there is a wooden board. The case is exactly located between two shelfs with few mm over it. I've put under the case some felts (i don't know if it is the right word) but doesn't work so well because the weight crushed them. So i have not many choices to isolate it. But i'll try something else..
I apologize if my explanation is a little confused :P I tried to explain as well as possible..

I've not yet measured the real power consumption but i start to search a PSU. I looked at the list of recommended PSUs and I thought to take the Seasonic X-650. But i can't find it. However i've found a Seasonic Platinum-660 (SS-660XP) that i think it will be good. Maybe a little much power than i need but i've fount it at a good price. It also has Hybrid Silent Fan Control that can also provide fanless operation mode under 30% load. And it's platinum.
What do you think about it? It will be ok for me? Have you try or tested it?

Thanks,
Zanatos


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 Post subject: Re: Quiet NAS build
PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 7:13 am 
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The SS-660XP is a well rated PSU.

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