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 Post subject: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:20 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
Posts: 183
Location: Seattle, WA
I moved out to Germany last month and had my file server/desktop shipped separately, had FedEX package it which may have been a bad decision. When it arrived the file server case was partially buckled at the bottom, filed a claim and they wrote me a check (rather my friend who shipped it) for $119.99. To speed things along I had my friend just buy me a Amazon.de gift card for the equivalent, about 88€.
The hardware did okay, had to reseat the heatsink (redid the paste) and everything worked fine for a couple weeks then I lost two drives in a raid 5 (at the same time). Replaced the drives and now I'm looking to replace the case. I'm going to reuse the case and stick my desktop it in (desktop case is a MI-100) so it's not a lost cause.

The original case is a PC-Q08 which has served me well over the years, finding a replacement will not be easy. My requirements are fairly straightforward, Mini-ITX case with good ventilation that can accommodate 6 3.5" Sata disks and one 2.5" Sata disk. I've been looking around and don't see a lot of options for six drives, I'd like to use hot swap if possible but that's not really required. Has anyone got a suggestion?

I spent some time going through the SPCR reviews and these seem like solid options:

Fractal Design Node 304
Lian Li PC-Q18


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:00 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:12 am
Posts: 3232
Location: ITALY
Ashex wrote:
Fractal Design Node 304
Lian Li PC-Q18


Lian Li's server chassis is the PC-Q25 (up to eight disks, no ODD), and if the smallest size is not mandatory, then the new Lian Li V358 may also suit (as well as a bigger, more traditional FD Define Mini fits your requirement for storage, quietness and airflow).

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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:32 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
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Location: Seattle, WA
Excellent suggestions, I saw the PC-Q25 but shied away because of the quick clip side panels. I'll go back and look again though as the hot swap is very attractive.

My main gripe when it comes to the PC-Q series is that the PSU sits right over the motherboard and make cable management very difficult. It doesn't look like it's changed much in these models either.


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 2:11 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
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Location: Seattle, WA
My final selections were poorly made:

Node 304

Pros: Very compact and efficient with the space
Cons: Only six disks, had to suspend the 2.5" disk to fit everything. Need to get shorter SATA cables and consider a modular PSU, cables screw with airflow.

I had been using the stock Intel heatsink for awhile but I decided to change it out, couldn't order the Samuel 17 on amazon.de so I decided to get the HR-02 Macho which was a terrible mistake.

Image

As you can see, it's so big I couldn't fit the sata card in the PCIE. Got a cable riser then mounted it in the second slot and slipped a peace of foam under for stability. Additionally I forgot just how tall the heatsinks on the RAM were, Corsair Vengeance was a terrible choice (came from my desktop) as I couldn't orient the heatsink to allow the case fan, had to remove that then it turned out the memory also blocked me from mounting the CPU fan. Running it passive for now.


Aside from the above I'm pleased with how it turned out, after monitoring the CPU temperature for the last 12 hours I can say it's stable at around 36-38C but I'll see how it really does when I put it to work.


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 2:35 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:22 pm
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Location: Guatemala
@Ashex have you tried rotating the Macho 90, to allow the Sata card to be installed?

Have you tried 180, like the back of the macho to the front to see if it fits with the hdds? if it does will allow you the back fan.

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms | Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 3:18 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
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Location: Seattle, WA
In the current orientation the fan doesn't fit due to the memory, if I rotate it 180 the heatsink doesn't fit due to the memory :(

In any orientation the tall memory heatsinks gets in the way, the current setup is the best option :/


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 5:23 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 10:12 am
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Location: ITALY
Ashex wrote:
Corsair Vengeance was a terrible choice


Gently take apart those pointless heatsinks: they do nothing.

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Luca


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 9:16 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
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Location: Seattle, WA
I took a look at removing them but I'm not sure how to go about it. Are they adhered with thermal pads or adhesive? Will I need to replace the heatsinks?

Edit: Searched around and did some reading, I'll try this soon.


Last edited by Ashex on Sun Jan 12, 2014 10:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 10:01 am 
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Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 4:39 pm
Posts: 172
Ashex wrote:
I took a look at removing them but I'm not sure how to go about it. Are they adhered with thermal pads or adhesive? Will I need to replace the heatsinks?


They're usually adhesive of some sort. You definitely don't need to replace them. DDR3 consumes much less power than DDR2, and doesn't need the heatsinks. They're only on there because people grew to expect them from older marketing ploys.


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 9:22 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2006 4:58 pm
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Location: Markham, Canada
Mankey wrote:
Ashex wrote:
I took a look at removing them but I'm not sure how to go about it. Are they adhered with thermal pads or adhesive? Will I need to replace the heatsinks?


They're usually adhesive of some sort. You definitely don't need to replace them. DDR3 consumes much less power than DDR2, and doesn't need the heatsinks. They're only on there because people grew to expect them from older marketing ploys.


I've popped off the sinks on one of my sticks as my Ninja didn't clear it, pretty easy, just pull them gently apart. Or you could stick them in the freezer to harden the adhesive then pry them apart.


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 3:46 am 
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Location: Seattle, WA
Took the heatsinks off today, pretty sure it was just double-stick tape as the pads were way too thick to be thermal. Flipped the hr-02 around and a case fan fits with it! New problem, need right-angle sata and power cables as they drives behind the heatsink don't fit with the cables attached. I actually damaged the connector on one of the drives, plastic bit behind the pins broke, gluing it back together now.

Pretty sure I'll need to replace the heatsink now as I'm going to have to purchase a modular PSU and new sata cables if I want to stick with it. Anyone have recommendations for a heatsink for an Ivy motherboard? The Samuel 17 is what I have on my desktop and doesn't block anything on it, couldn't find it on Amazon before but now it's available so I'm seriously considering picking that up. Was hoping to go passive though and I'm not entirely sure if this will work well for that setup. The Scythe Big Shuriken 2 Rev.B might be a better option (plus it's cheaper)

Edit: Been doing some reading, if I want to stay passive/fanless the Noctua NH-U12S may be the best option. Looks to be a little shorter and about 15mm thinner.


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 12:29 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
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Location: Seattle, WA
Went with the NH-U12S and I'm pretty happy with the decision, as you can see it's significantly smaller.

Image


I should have taken a picture of the HR02 in the case, but just imagine all the space around the heatsink taken up.


Image


I'm running it passive as the sata cables are in the way, will definitely need to replace the case fan as it's a bit noisy but otherwise I'm satisfied with the results.


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:26 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:07 am
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Location: Vienna - Austria
I read all from the beginning but could not find info about your CPU.
What are you using? (Cooled fanless)

It looks so small compared to the HR-02

Do you think some cardboard ducting could help, since your are only using the back fan?
How are the temps with all these drives inside?

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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:08 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
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Location: Seattle, WA
Should have mentioned the CPU, it's a i3-3220T.

Here's the idle temp compared with the HR02:

NH-U12S
CPU: ~30C
HDD: ~30C

HR02
CPU: ~40C
HDD: ~34C (low 30, high 37)


hard drive temperature varied a bit due to how many disks are in there. I considered adding some ducts in there but I need to vent the suspended 2.5" somehow, ducting would make that area a hot zone. I've got another fan (Thermaltake A2329) that I'm going to put in as the case fan is horribly loud.


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 3:47 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:07 am
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Location: Vienna - Austria
I was asking the CPU to have better picture of the installation.

I guess with the i3, you are fine without ducting. Especially with these temperature.

Some time ago, I was also considering the Node 304 for a recent i3, with HR02.
It's comforting to know it goes well with just the back fan.

(It's also interesting to know the possible problem with the too big HR02. But then, I looked at a vertical case and I won't have this issue.)

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(sold in Dec. 2013) Temjin TJ08-E / Be Quiet Straight Power E9 400W / GA-B75M-D3H / i3-3225 / 8GB / SSD 120GB / HDD 1TB / running Mac OS - Hackintosh


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:08 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
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Location: Seattle, WA
Yep, these temperatures are pretty stable. With the HR02 since I didn't have a fan the temperature would rise rapidly under load. When I was doing heavy downloading/transcoding the temperature rose up to 58 fairly quickly. I'm not sure what I'll do with the HR02, I don't think I can put it on my desktop mainboard due to blocking PCIE so I'll probably sell it :(


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 7:22 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:22 pm
Posts: 2059
Location: Guatemala
Ashex wrote:
I'm not sure what I'll do with the HR02, I don't think I can put it on my desktop mainboard due to blocking PCIE so I'll probably sell it :(
The HR02 doesnt block the first PCIe slot, i used on an Micro ATX TJ08-E, that the 16x is on the first pcie e slot, its really close but i shouldnt even touch, specially on a standard desing, where the weight will help the videocard to go down, away from the hr02.

_________________
GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms | Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 7:57 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
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Location: Seattle, WA
In the first photo I posted it blocks the pcie slot, that's why I got the riser cable :) It depends on the orientation though, Since I'm putting the desktop in the PCQ08 I could rotate and have it exhaust upwards which should work.


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 8:10 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:22 pm
Posts: 2059
Location: Guatemala
Ashex wrote:
In the first photo I posted it blocks the pcie slot, that's why I got the riser cable :) It depends on the orientation though, Since I'm putting the desktop in the PCQ08 I could rotate and have it exhaust upwards which should work.
You are correct for mini itx mobos, depends on the socket, but i was refering that you were planning on using on a desktop motherboard, maybe i didn't understand it correctly.

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GameMi >> MSI Z87-GD65 | Intel Core i7-4790K | Thermalright Silver Arrow IBE + 3x Noctua NF-A15 PWM @500rpms | Crucial Ballistix Sport 32GB DDR3 1600 | nVidia GTX780 + ARCTIC Accelero Xtreme IV | Samsung SA850 27'' 2560x1440 | Samsung 840pro 512GB | Hitachi 7K1000 1TB | Fractal Design Define R4 + 4x Noctua NF-A14 PWM @450rpm | SeaSonic SS-860XP2
Other builds ---> ServeMi | CamMi | MiniMi | HTPCMi


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 8:33 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 6:54 am
Posts: 3024
Location: Sweden
Here a German hardware search engine, the only thing you need to know about it is that the customer reviews of the stores (Händler-Bewertung) works differently.
The closer to a 1 in review rating the better. That's why you see a lot of stores with a rating between 1 and 2.
Lots of filters, very useful.

http://geizhals.de/?cat=cpucooler&xf=10 ... tua#xf_top


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 Post subject: Re: FedEX damaged my ITX case, time for a new one
PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 9:20 am 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 11:51 am
Posts: 183
Location: Seattle, WA
Abula wrote:
You are correct for mini itx mobos, depends on the socket, but i was refering that you were planning on using on a desktop motherboard, maybe i didn't understand it correctly.


Ah, I see what you meant. I'm a SFF nut so all my stuff is mini itx :) I'm considering building a gaming machine in a year or so and going with micro if I can find the right case


Mats wrote:
Here a German hardware search engine, the only thing you need to know about it is that the customer reviews of the stores (Händler-Bewertung) works differently.
The closer to a 1 in review rating the better. That's why you see a lot of stores with a rating between 1 and 2.
Lots of filters, very useful.

http://geizhals.de/?cat=cpucooler&xf=10 ... tua#xf_top
.


Fantastic! Thanks for sharing, I was poking around and found some cheaper prices but I'm still figuring out how to setup online payments. I signed up for paypal and they immediately limited my account :(


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