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 Post subject: What are your points per [day per] watt (PP[DP]W)?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 4:32 am 
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Coming from the other thread, I think it would be great if everyone could post his ppdw.
Edit: I should have been a bit more accurate. I posted my points per day per watt, not the points per watt.

aristide1 wrote:
Excellent, I would love to know everyone's ppw. That would be great green race.


I just checked my folding machines and did a few calculations.
E6300@2,5Ghz@1,024V Linux SMP through VMware:
115W power consumption

2604: 14,8 PPDW
2605: 14,8 PPDW
2608: 9,3 PPDW
2609: 10,4 PPDW
2610: 8,7 PPDW
avg.: 11,6 PPDW

QX6700 2x Linux SMP through VMware:
290W power consumption

2604: 10,3 PPDW
2605: 10,0 PPDW
2608: 7,5 PPDW
2609: 7,4 PPDW
avg.: 8,8 PPDW

QX6700 Windows SMP
290W

2610: 8,9 PPDW
2652: 6,4 PPDW
avg.: 7,7 PPDW

The E6300 is doing quite good in the ppdw area.


Last edited by Webfire on Sat Jul 21, 2007 3:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 7:40 am 
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I ordered a Seasonic Kill-A-Watt, so I will know sometime next week. I do know my E6400 system is putting out the most heat.

This thread could discourage some of the low count members, but it shouldn't. We all recognize their sacrifice.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 3:03 am 
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Hello,

I have a question: how are you figuring the Points per Watt? Shouldn't it be points per day per watt, or something? If you do not have a period of time, then you can't know how many points it earns... :o

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 3:30 am 
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NeilBlanchard wrote:
Hello,

I have a question: how are you figuring the Points per Watt? Shouldn't it be points per day per watt, or something? If you do not have a period of time, then you can't know how many points it earns... :o


Yeah you're right, it should be points per day per watt (PPDW).

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 2:15 pm 
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Hello,

Okay PPDPW -- I'll nominate my brother's 17" iMac CoreDuo as (likely) tops:

It can average over 1,000PPD (with those 1760 pointers) and it maxes out at 63watts (a lot of which is the screen backlight, which is not needed for Folding, but even counting that) it is 15.87PPWPD!

Can anybody top that?

(BTW, his machine is back Folding again -- I had to install the next Beta (#5) because the previous one had expired. We should be seeing points sometime tomorrow, Sunday. http://folding.extremeoverclocking.com/user_summary.php?s=&u=189150)

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 3:04 pm 
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NeilBlanchard wrote:
Hello,

Okay PPDPW -- I'll nominate my brother's 17" iMac CoreDuo as (likely) tops:.......


You're going to do that before my X2 4000+ does the SMP dance with Feisty Fawn?

I've never been so humiliated. :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

I do sympathize, as I also expired under the last beta and was clueless why it stopped. It gave no error message of any kind.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2007 8:49 pm 
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For my Opteron 170 @ 2.2 ghz using 124W from the wall I can only calculate the current project PPDPW at this time,

2651 - 6.8ppdpw

I'm not sure if I'll be able to measure the draw from my friends Q6600 that he has folding for me, or the Dual Opteron machine I have in the lab. Hopefully I'll upgrade to an efficient AMD quad within a years time. I'll post some numbers for other WU's as soon as I can.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:39 am 
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ryboto wrote:
For my Opteron 170 @ 2.2 ghz using 124W from the wall I can only calculate the current project PPDPW at this time,

2651 - 6.8ppdpw

I'm not sure if I'll be able to measure the draw from my friends Q6600 that he has folding for me, or the Dual Opteron machine I have in the lab. Hopefully I'll upgrade to an efficient AMD quad within a years time. I'll post some numbers for other WU's as soon as I can.


After I purchased a Brisbane I asked myself why didn't I buy an Opteron, but them I saw the power use and decided I'm glad I didn't.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:10 am 
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aristide1 wrote:

After I purchased a Brisbane I asked myself why didn't I buy an Opteron, but them I saw the power use and decided I'm glad I didn't.


what's the system power draw from the wall with a brisbane at 2.2 ghz?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:18 am 
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Mac mini 1.83 GHz: 693.75 PPD @ 35 watts, 693.75/35=19.82
Currently doing 1523 point 2609s.

iMac 2.16 GHz: 1125.22 PPD @ 65 watts, 1125.22/65=17.31
Currently doing 1385 point 2608s.

Both Macs do much better ratios with 1760 WUs. PPD from qd-tools, watts from Kill-A-Watt.

PS3 does ~ 3 WU/day ranging from 287 to 401 points per WU and draws 205 watts. PPD/watt ~ 4.3 - 5.8

Current average 2,453 PPD/day.

Looking to build a silent rig, an even better at F@h than the Mac mini. Suggestions please.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:15 am 
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ryboto wrote:
aristide1 wrote:

After I purchased a Brisbane I asked myself why didn't I buy an Opteron, but them I saw the power use and decided I'm glad I didn't.


what's the system power draw from the wall with a brisbane at 2.2 ghz?


I'll let you know when I'm done setting it up, but the CPU is 65um manufacturing process.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:30 am 
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aristide1 wrote:
I'll let you know when I'm done setting it up, but the CPU is 65nm manufacturing process.


I'm sure if I got rid of my graphics card and full size hard drives I'd draw well below 100W from the wall. But I just can't part with either right now.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:40 am 
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stevew wrote:
Mac mini 1.83 GHz: 693.75 PPD @ 35 watts, 693.75/35=19.82
Currently doing 1523 point 2609s.

iMac 2.16 GHz: 1125.22 PPD @ 65 watts, 1125.22/65=17.31
Currently doing 1385 point 2608s.

Both Macs do much better ratios with 1760 WUs. PPD from qd-tools, watts from Kill-A-Watt.

PS3 does ~ 3 WU/day ranging from 287 to 401 points per WU and draws 205 watts. PPD/watt ~ 4.3 - 5.8

Current average 2,453 PPD/day.

Looking to build a silent rig, an even better at F@h than the Mac mini. Suggestions please.


Steve - Wow, may I ask what did the IMacs cost?

Hey Neil, I think he beat your bro'.

I think this thread is increasing sales of Kill-A-Watts.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:50 pm 
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The Mac mini was a refurb direct from Apple $699. Was suposed to have 512 MB RAM, came with 2 GB. Nice, but the Gromacs-SMP does not use the extra RAM. I run it headless and keyboardless 24/7 since March, just plug it in for updates and password entry. Monitored via ssh and qd-tools from other computers. Cpu temp ~150 F with air temp ~ 80 F.

The iMac 20" was purchased at a local Apple retailer for $1,649 with 2 GB RAM installed by Apple, not the retailer. 24/7 since 12/22/06. Its cpu runs about 162 F. The next generation of iMac will be quicker.

I'm dreaming about an Intel Q6600, 64-bit Linux on a pen drive (no HD), thermo-syphon rig like Jake von Slat built. Max PPD, min watts, zero noise.

F@h output (link with 2nd post) http://folding.extremeoverclocking.com/ ... =&u=204311


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 4:02 am 
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he's not even doing it for our team!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 4:43 am 
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ryboto wrote:
he's not even doing it for our team!


Sigh, I noticed that, but it's still pretty impressive. :?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:43 am 
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Hello,

aristide1 wrote:
Hey Neil, I think he beat your bro'.


Yes, I think because Steve's are Core 2 Duo's, and my brother's is just a CoreDuo.

And I have not managed to get it Folding again, still -- I think that it is going to sleep or something...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:53 am 
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Except for the monitor shut off why shut down anything else? All those power saving gizmos aren't applicable here.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 10:51 am 
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Hmmm, this thread makes me want to try to get my gf's iMac to start folding for us. I'll see if I can make that happen when I visit her place in a couple of weeks (yeah, long-distance relationships suck).


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 4:16 pm 
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Here are some results:

Stock BE-2350@2.1GHz Windows SMP (60W power consumption):
2610: 8.7 PPDW

OC'd Q6600 G0@3.0GHz 2x Linux SMP (176W power consumption):
2604 (1816PPDx2): 20.6 PPDW
2605 (1823PPDx2): 20.7 PPDW
2608 (1223PPDx2): 13.8 PPDW
2609 (1235PPDx2): 14.0 PPDW


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 2:21 pm 
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The OC'd Q6600 looks like a real flame thrower. May I ask what motherboard and PSU you use? I'm leaning towards an ASUS P5B Deluxe and a Seasonic S12 550.

When ordering a Q6600 or a Xeon 3220, how do you know that you'll get the G0 and not the B3 step spec cpu? I've been looking at Newegg and NCIXUS and there's no word about chip spec anywhere.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 3:12 pm 
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stevew wrote:
The OC'd Q6600 looks like a real flame thrower. May I ask what motherboard and PSU you use? I'm leaning towards an ASUS P5B Deluxe and a Seasonic S12 550.

When ordering a Q6600 or a Xeon 3220, how do you know that you'll get the G0 and not the B3 step spec cpu? I've been looking at Newegg and NCIXUS and there's no word about chip spec anywhere.


I purchased a Gigabyte P35-DS3R and used an older Corsair HX620w (overkill). The chip was purchased from NCIXUS when I first heard reports of G0 steppings being shipped. I lucked out and got a G0 instead of a B3.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 5:23 pm 
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vg30et, Thanks. I'll call NCIXUS tomorror and see what they have to say. I could turn off my 3 machines (sell 2), save 100 watts and make 1,000 more PPD by following you. :)


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2007 5:31 pm 
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NeilBlanchard wrote:
......
It can average over 1,000PPD (with those 1760 pointers) and it maxes out at 63watts (a lot of which is the screen backlight, which is not needed for Folding, but even counting that) it is 15.87PPWPD!


I'm having a mental block here, what's the formula being used here? At 63 watts a total of 1.512 KWH is used per day to earn 1000 points. Then what?

Oh wait, 1000/1512 * 24 = 15.87 OK.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 9:44 am 
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Had a Pentium 4 folding, used 60-90 watts, was lucky to get 100 PPD. My Penrium III probably used less electricity (APFC and lower power requirements) but did maybe 30 PPD.

Both are now retired.

So far the AMD X2 (3600+ 65 nm) and a 300 watt non-APFC PS uses about 60 watts. Will swap an APFC supply in there and see how it goes.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2007 12:18 am 
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I am glad you started this thread. With the advent of the computers and environment forum, I was wondering if the SPCR folding folks were looking at environmental impact of the project. (Just a little looking on the folding boards suggests they haven't considered it much.)

Some back of the envelope calculations based on the figures here -
If we assumed that 10 PPDPW was typical (probably overestimating efficiency - especially for older Folds).
Then the 64.5 million Points produced so far by the SPCR team (at the time of this writing) translate to 6.45MW-days (64.5M points/10PPDPW)

Converting to MW-Hours gives 155 MegaWatt-Hours (6.45MWdays * 24hrs/day)

Assuming electricity costs $0.15/KW-Hour (per Folding at Home site)

Team SPCRs contribution comes to something like $23,000
and about 100 Metric tons of CO2

A rough eyeball of the overall Folding statistics
suggests that overall total is currently about 6 billion points

(I didn't find where in the statistics they summarize total points - but I probably just didn't look in the right place).

Figuring that as about 100 times the
SPCR teams contribution - the total comes to
about 15GW-Hours, $2million, and 10,000 Metric tons CO2
(to say nothing of energy cost for communications, their servers, etc.)

Seems like the folding stats sites should also point out the financial and environmental impact of this affair.
(I am not saying it isn't worth while, but it should be more clearly addressed. They even try to disguise their electricity cost estimate of $130/year by breaking it down to a daily figure.

I can think of plenty of things with surer payofs for humanity than Folding to donate $130/year to.)


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:09 am 
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Thanks scdr for the upbeat message. :)

I am concerned about the environment, and am trying to do things in a more sustainable way, but I am not "OMG the sky is falling, global warming". There have always been big overhyped catastrophies, and if they were true, we should not be here. In the late 60's and early 70's, I remember that we should be out of oil by now, out of gas, and the whole country should have been buried in garbage 20 feet deep by now.

The planet warms up and cools down, and we might well be in a naturally occuring warming cycle. It is not clear how much of that can be attributed to humans. I believe that some small amount can, and we can do better, but we do not need to get too extreme. I see that even you turned on an evil power wasting device to be able to browse this thread and post a reply.

I am a computer engineer, have enjoyed computers most of my life, and am always doing something at home with computers. I have several in the house, and have several that run 24/7.

As long as I am going to have computers running 24/7 anyway, I thought that it would be good to donate some of my wasted CPU cycles to folding. Certainly folding is not the absolute optimal use of time or money to attack cancer, but it is a little bit that I can do and enjoy. And at least realistically for me, if I turned off folding, I would not then make the effort to research that optimal use of that time and money for charity, and instead, I would just pay a slightly lower electricity bill, and that would be the end of it.

Tuning my computers, and seeing the results of the point output, and a little friendly competition amongs the other folders is enjoyable. Certainly I could go hide in a cold dark cave for a hobby and do less impact to the environment, but I do not find that particularly appealing, and I think that as far as hobbies go, running a little extra power through my computers keeping them busy instead of idle is a pretty insignificant impact on the environment.


Last edited by VanWaGuy on Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:33 am 
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Quote:
In the late 60's and early 70's, I remember that we should be out of oil by now, out of gas,


you are of course referring to Limits to Growth. They never actually predicted that oil or gas would run out, merely calculated how long current (at that time) reserves of various commodities would last given exponential resource consumption growth and no new reserves being found. of course neither condition held and so here we are. note that oil is not exactly cheap at the moment however, and the forward curve indicates this is not a temporary thing.

Quote:
we might well be in a naturally occuring warming cycle.


well, yes, in as much are we are still coming out of the last ice age, but that is not the proximal cause of the current warming.

the best points per watt is undoubtedly the PS3, but seeing as your computers are going to be on anyway it seems like the least worst option.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:45 pm 
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Whoa, jaganath PS3s are amazing Folders but they are about the worst PPDW. You didn't read the earlier posts. From my examples: Mac mini = 19+ PPDW and PS3 = 4.3 - 5.8 PPDW

vg30et was getting 20+ PPDW from an OC'd Q6600! (and major points too)


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2007 12:54 pm 
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Jaganath, thanks to the reference to Limits to Growth. I was not exposed directly to that, but heard second or third hand from teachers that probably did get information directly from that, and by the time that it was presented to us in school, it had indeed been transformed into a sky is falling sort of prediction. It is interesting to be able to look back and see where some of that came from, so as I said, thanks for that reference.

Yes, there are long term heating/cooling cycles such as the ice ages, but there are smaller ones as well. I just read a brief mention of some recent modeling of ocean temps for example that was describing that different oceans warm and cool at different rates, and that we are now at a convergence where many are warm at the same time, and that model fits well with historical data, and would suggest that the human impact is much less than some of the higher estimates.

There is not consensus by all top scientists that humans are the major cause of recent warming. That said though, most if not all would acknowledge that we have had some impact, and we do need to behave in a more sustainable way.

PS - Isn't a PS3 about 900 PPD, and about 200 watts? Many in this thread do much better. (Calculations/watt might be in the PS3 favor though.) So, the de-rating of the PS3 contribution might be harming the environment by encouraging lessor contributing hardware to fold.


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