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 Post subject: ZOTAC H55-ITX WiFi
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 8:41 am 
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Anyone else excited about this new board?
It looks like a perfect HTPC i5 combo. Hopefully SPCR will do a review on it.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Clarkdale-Ready-Mini-ITX-Motherboard-from-Zotac-Unleashed-131626.shtml


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 Post subject: Re: ZOTAC H55-ITX WiFi
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:17 am 
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AlexNC wrote:
Anyone else excited about this new board?
It looks like a perfect HTPC i5 combo. Hopefully SPCR will do a review on it.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Clarkdale-Ready-Mini-ITX-Motherboard-from-Zotac-Unleashed-131626.shtml

Lol, still waiting for that to hit the shelves. :P

I'm currently considering either the Intel DH57JG or the Zotac H55-ITX. The ECS one is a maybe... Not too sure about their build quality. Whoever gets the first one to market at a reasonable price ($100~$150) will get my money. :wink:


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 Post subject: Re: ZOTAC H55-ITX WiFi
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:49 am 
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ilovejedd wrote:
Whoever gets the first one to market at a reasonable price ($100~$150) will get my money. :wink:


You just jinxed it, after the oems read this thread it will surely be $159. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: ZOTAC H55-ITX WiFi
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2010 10:59 am 
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xan_user wrote:
You just jinxed it, after the oems read this thread it will surely be $159. :lol:

Lol, saw the BOXDH57JG for $136 on Google Products (Bottom Line Telecommunications). I'm just waiting for it to hit Newegg or Amazon. If Zotac is considerably more expensive, then I already know which one I'm buying. :P


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 6:51 am 
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Just read an article on Tech Report and it seems MSRP for the Zotac H55-ITX is $129 and is supposed to be released this month. Unfortunately, I think I'll already be on vacation by then so I'd have to wait until end of February to build. :(


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 4:39 pm 
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Good to hear about it being available soon.

What chip are you planning on going with?
What would you suggest for blueray playback?
What box are you going to use?
What fan?

I am planning on using this board as long as I can put it in a small enclosure and keep it cool. Though I am very new to building PC's. So I need to make sure all my ducks are in a row.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 6:23 pm 
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AlexNC wrote:
Good to hear about it being available soon.

What chip are you planning on going with?
What would you suggest for blueray playback?
What box are you going to use?
What fan?

I am planning on using this board as long as I can put it in a small enclosure and keep it cool. Though I am very new to building PC's. So I need to make sure all my ducks are in a row.

I'm going with the Core i3-530 2.93GHz. For me, that's the sweet spot for the current batch of Clarkdales. The lowest end Pentium G6950 only has 3MB cache, a 533MHz graphics core and doesn't support HD audio bitstreaming. I don't think it has hyperthreading either.

The Core i3's only differ from the Core i5 Clarkdales in that they have slower clocks and they don't support Turbo Boost. On dual cores, Turbo Boost doesn't seem to have as much effect as they have on quads so I'm fine giving up that feature.

Alas, I don't think the case I'm planning to use (Mini-Box M350, 7.6" x 2.5" x 8.3") would pass SPCR's rigorous requirements :P. Add to that the fact that I'm going with the stock cooler as no other cooler would fit. I'm hiding it behind the TV so that should take care of most of the noise. Well, even if I didn't, living in the city, the noise floor is probably higher than SPCRers and will be enough to drown out the sound coming from the would-be HTPC. I'll be pairing the case with a PicoPSU-120-WI-25 and 19V 120W AC-DC adapter.

SPCR has favorably reviewed both the Apex MI-008 and Antec ISK300-65 so you may want to consider those cases. Alas, the power supply on the Antec might have some trouble when the rig's on full load.


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 Post subject: Re: ZOTAC H55-ITX WiFi
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:59 pm 
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ilovejedd wrote:
I'm currently considering either the Intel DH57JG or the Zotac H55-ITX. The ECS one is a maybe... Not too sure about their build quality. Whoever gets the first one to market at a reasonable price ($100~$150) will get my money. :wink:
To me it's counter intuitive to pay more for mini-ITX than microATX. I'll pay more for the smaller size but don't like the loss of features. Not heard of a mini-ITX that will support undervolting.

My i3-530 + Gigabyte H55 MB ($105) arrive tomorrow, hope to have some power numbers by the weekend.

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 Post subject: Re: ZOTAC H55-ITX WiFi
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:33 pm 
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MtnHermit wrote:
To me it's counter intuitive to pay more for mini-ITX than microATX. I'll pay more for the smaller size but don't like the loss of features. Not heard of a mini-ITX that will support undervolting.

My i3-530 + Gigabyte H55 MB ($105) arrive tomorrow, hope to have some power numbers by the weekend.

If you have space where you can stash it, then it's fine. Unfortunately, I live in a small apartment and even a really tiny microATX case would be too big. Besides, it's not as if I'll miss the features. I don't undervolt nor overclock so it doesn't really bother me even if the motherboard doesn't support it. I tried overclocking (stock volts) before and the machine wasn't really stable for continuous 24/7 operation (no suspend, no hibernate). Iirc, it kept restarting every 3 weeks. I reckon I'd probably experience the same thing if I undervolted enough to get a noticeable lowering of power consumption. I don't think it'll be worth the effort particularly when the system will be spending most of its time idle.

I'm just glad we can now have very good performance even on such tiny machines. Also happy that the price premium has already decreased greatly. I remember the Jetway 780G mini-ITX motherboard was originally at $200 compared to slightly less than $100 for microATX boards. Now that much premium I wasn't willing to pay.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 12:46 am 
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How about the good old zotac 9300itx? I remember reading that the second revision can undervolt and most importantly has support for "wake up on usb".

A dual core i5 or a quad core c2? There is not much between them in terms of power consumption/ speed so why not go with the cheaper solution.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 5:58 am 
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ntavlas wrote:
How about the good old zotac 9300itx? I remember reading that the second revision can undervolt and most importantly has support for "wake up on usb".

A dual core i5 or a quad core c2? There is not much between them in terms of power consumption/ speed so why not go with the cheaper solution.

The layout on Zotac's GF9300 Mini-ITX boards have the heatsink directly underneath the hard drive in a Mini-Box M350 case. I've already read one review where it killed the hard drive so the guy had to mod his case so the hard drive wouldn't be sitting directly on the chipset heatsink.

Besides, if Zotac added the ability to undervolt on their rev 2 GF9300 boards, I think it likely that they'll have the foresight to include it on the outset with the Zotac H55-ITX.

Interestingly enough, going Core i3 isn't that much more expensive than LGA-775.

Zotac GF9300-G-E ($140) + C2D E7500 2.93GHz ($120) + 4GB DDR2 ($100) = $360

Zotac H55-ITX ($130) + Core i3-530 ($125) + 4 GB DDR3 ($100) = $355

The Core i5, though, I agree is overpriced... Oh well, that's always been the case with Intel's higher end processors. Huge jump in price for just a little boost in performance.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:51 am 
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It also has to do with local pricing. Over here the i3 & h55 will probably a bit more expensive. The 9300 c2 combo on the other hand is considerably cheaper. I would expect the difference between the two to be in the range of 60 (80$) in most of europe.

Of course with the prices you listed the h55/i3 looks like a no brainer.

I don`t know if the m350 case can be considered a typical scenario but I have to agree that moving the igp to the cpu is a good thing. Heat produced by it can be handled by the more robust cpu cooler.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:57 am 
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Had either of you considered the DFI LANParty MI P55-T36 P55 Mini ITX

P55 so you have to use discrete VGA but at $135, seems a contender.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 7:38 am 
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MtnHermit wrote:
Had either of you considered the DFI LANParty MI P55-T36 P55 Mini ITX

P55 so you have to use discrete VGA but at $135, seems a contender.

Nope.

Mini-Box M350 = 7.6" x 2.5" x 8.3" = no space for discrete graphics

Besides, the only reason I'm going with Clarkdale is the Intel GMA HD on-package GPU. If not, then I would've gone with Lynnfield instead. Yes, there are other cases but the only reason I'm willing to pay a premium for Mini-ITX is the form factor. That's why I choose the case first and then select components that will work well inside the case. If I can't get the form factor and size I want, why bother paying extra for Mini-ITX in the first place?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 8:07 am 
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I find HDD heat isn't really an issue if you run the m350 on its side, so heat doesn't get stuck under the drive.

I even added some tape to block off the open area around the cpu fan so it acts as more of an intake, and the heat exhausts out the top (normally the left side when flat). also sealed off the mesh under the front cover.

Drive and gpu are much happier now.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2010 4:13 pm 
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xan_user wrote:
I find HDD heat isn't really an issue if you run the m350 on its side, so heat doesn't get stuck under the drive.

I even added some tape to block off the open area around the cpu fan so it acts as more of an intake, and the heat exhausts out the top (normally the left side when flat). also sealed off the mesh under the front cover.

Drive and gpu are much happier now.

Interesting. Would you happen to have pictures of your set-up?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 8:41 am 
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I'm disappointed at that there is no USB 3.0 in Zotac H55-ITX. I will not buy any new boards without USB 3.0. Even though there aren't many devices that use USB 3.0 yet, I want a system that would last me 6 years. So the first generation of ZOTAC H55-ITX will not cut it since we will supposedly get many USB 3.0 devices by Christmas due to the high adoption rate.

As for SATA 3.0/6G, SSD cost is still too high. Even though speed would increase in standard HDD due to the RAM, it won't be much better. So I wouldn't mind having no SATA 3.0.

Have anyone heard anything about a H55/H57/P55 mini-itx with USB 3.0?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2010 10:21 am 
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ilovejedd wrote:
xan_user wrote:
I find HDD heat isn't really an issue if you run the m350 on its side, so heat doesn't get stuck under the drive.

I even added some tape to block off the open area around the cpu fan so it acts as more of an intake, and the heat exhausts out the top (normally the left side when flat). also sealed off the mesh under the front cover.

Drive and gpu are much happier now.

Interesting. Would you happen to have pictures of your set-up?


its clear tape, and its inside, nothing to see. :D
Image

Image

green is tape. its size is over exaggerated a bit too. Intake is actually a bit bigger than the graphic indicates.
lavender is where I wish there were more holes.
HDD is inside on mountplate/ semi suspended.
I also do not use the interior usb cables, or wifi to keep area 'above' (left side) chipset HS open for the least restriction possible for heat exhaust.

Ultimately the HDD will go in the external optical case thats next to it- or maybe a second drive...


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 Post subject: The MB is available
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 5:47 am 
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You can pre-order and even buy the MB here:
http://en.toppreise.ch/index.php?search ... 55&hp=true
http://skinflint.co.uk/at/a495899.html

Also, the specs. sheet is out from Zoatc
Web Version: http://pden.zotac.com/index.php?page=sh ... t&Itemid=1
PDF Version: http://www.zotac.com/httpdocs/brochures ... ifi_v1.pdf

-Chris


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 6:14 pm 
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dman wrote:
I'm disappointed at that there is no USB 3.0 in Zotac H55-ITX. I will not buy any new boards without USB 3.0. Even though there aren't many devices that use USB 3.0 yet, I want a system that would last me 6 years. So the first generation of ZOTAC H55-ITX will not cut it since we will supposedly get many USB 3.0 devices by Christmas due to the high adoption rate.

As for SATA 3.0/6G, SSD cost is still too high. Even though speed would increase in standard HDD due to the RAM, it won't be much better. So I wouldn't mind having no SATA 3.0.

Have anyone heard anything about a H55/H57/P55 mini-itx with USB 3.0?


Well, first of all, if you're not using the PCIe x16 slot, you can put a PCIe x1 card (low profile if necessary) in any of those motherboards.

Alternatively, if you won't be using wireless, the Zotac boards have a mini-PCIe slot for the wireless. You can probably take out the wireless card and put in a USB3 card (assuming that those are out; if not, I would imagine that they will come out soon).


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jan 29, 2010 2:02 am 
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ilovejedd wrote:
ntavlas wrote:
How about the good old zotac 9300itx? I remember reading that the second revision can undervolt and most importantly has support for "wake up on usb".

A dual core i5 or a quad core c2? There is not much between them in terms of power consumption/ speed so why not go with the cheaper solution.

The layout on Zotac's GF9300 Mini-ITX boards have the heatsink directly underneath the hard drive in a Mini-Box M350 case. I've already read one review where it killed the hard drive so the guy had to mod his case so the hard drive wouldn't be sitting directly on the chipset heatsink.

Besides, if Zotac added the ability to undervolt on their rev 2 GF9300 boards, I think it likely that they'll have the foresight to include it on the outset with the Zotac H55-ITX.

Interestingly enough, going Core i3 isn't that much more expensive than LGA-775.

Zotac GF9300-G-E ($140) + C2D E7500 2.93GHz ($120) + 4GB DDR2 ($100) = $360

Zotac H55-ITX ($130) + Core i3-530 ($125) + 4 GB DDR3 ($100) = $355

The Core i5, though, I agree is overpriced... Oh well, that's always been the case with Intel's higher end processors. Huge jump in price for just a little boost in performance.


I have already buyed Zotac I-E ~126€ (can undervolt -0.1V max)+ e5300 (the version with vt-x) + 4gb of ddr2, but I'm waiting picoPSU to get everything running ok. Why are you willing to have an e7xxx instead of e5xxx? The e5xxx is around ~52-55€ in Spain, for example and the e7xxx ~95-100€. You can see my reasoning here. Please, correct me if I am wrong but not only with e6xxx and e7xxx you are not going synchronous (1066 FSB) and the mobo is 667/800 FSB fo RAM, but also e5xxx might be a little bit overkill for 1080p (Atom 330+ION can move 1080p as some users have reported), so why going to e7xxx (furthermore, it has higher power consumptions than e5xxx)?

I can understand you want i3 for the integrated HD, its the new tech and so on, but it cost more than 100, around 110€, and the power savings between i3 530 + mobo VS e5xx + Zotac 9300 would be very close between the 2. So, is it really worth -providing that i3 530+mobo would consume less than e5xxx+Zotac 9300 and you could make the difference over the years by the bill of electricity?

Edit: note that if you want to go synch with zotac 9300 with an e6xxx/7xxx/8xxx you have to buy the rev K-E which is able to have DDR3 1066/1333 (so you'll go synch 1:2)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 4:20 am 
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Wouldn't an external 120W (or even 100W?) PSU be possible with this mobo? That would be the ultimate HTPC imo


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 5:17 am 
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Saosin wrote:
Wouldn't an external 120W (or even 100W?) PSU be possible with this mobo? That would be the ultimate HTPC imo


Hi, and Welcome to SCPR!!

Keep in mind the specs of picoPSUs (max load in Amperes, max Wattage, etc) if you are thinking of them:

some info:

article of picoPSU by SPCR

some stores:

http://www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=10
http://linitx.com/search.php?keywords=p ... mit=Search
http://www.mini-box.com/s.nl/sc.8/category.13/.f

specifcations:

150W specifications
120W specifications

Also, remember you have to attach the pico PSU to an AC-DC converter, which is also named "power brick"

Hope to have been helpfull :)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 5:38 am 
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Thanks for the reply, javitxi.

I'm not aware of what the max load in amperes are for the Core i3 CPUs are, but perhaps you could enlighten me? :D

I currently have a Zotac ION ITX-A, but it's a bit too slow in my book. I hate having to wait for the CPU to finish all the time. Even though I have a good SSD it's way too slow for my taste. In all other aspects it's pretty much the perfect HTPC for me. I run it without a case inside my TV cabinet and it only gets about 50ËšC under medium load with a Nexus Real Silent 92mm fan. I've become really interested in the i3 after looking at Anand's review, mainly the chart on the first page with the i3 530 only hitting 69.6W under full system load. (Sorry, can't post links yet)

So would it be possible? And would I be able to cool it with the standard fan inside my metal TV-cabinet?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 8:07 am 
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There are some reviews that shows the overall sys power consumption with:

- i3-540

82W idle/ 113W stress using these specs. Have they used only Intel mobo to do the measures in 540 and 661 case (IGP integrated)? I don't know, so I can't do the maths. (power sys - power graphics - mobo chipset - HDDs ~ CPU power consumption)

- A "funny" measure of e5200 (an i5-661 sys-based draw less power than e5200 sys-based?... don't think so using the whole components of the system).
Another funny numbers between e5300/7300 vs 661 Why didn't they showed the numbers of e5300/7300 whith a low-end graphics card as well they do with e8400 i.e?

So then, I trust more on 661 SPCR numbers, imho (in my humble opinion, I've learnt new expressions in English by reading more articles/opinions over here! :P).

- Probably the best review with i3s, i5s vs Core2Duo vs AMD chips (although they don't show numbers for e5xx or AMD 240 -may it be this one the best low power consump/quality for HTPCs tasks as you have sayed? I can't remember because of my little knowledge of AMD)

Imho, their testing methodology is one very accurate (or at least intended to), so I would trust their numbers.

Some numbers from bittech about i3 530. Bit-tech has many common hardware components with Xbit, so I think these numbers also would be ok

So, lets use the numbers from Xbit. The i3-540 is ~29W at 100% load. I don't know if also i3s and i5s draw power from +5V and +3.3V lines as i7 seems to do. So, using the measure at +12V line of voltage regulator as Xbit says, 29/12 = 2.42 A (remember Wattage [Watts] = Voltage [Volts] x Intesity [Amperes] )

Now, lets see some numbers from e5300 from Anandtech It's 148W the complete sys at "load" x264 task. I haven't find the more or less power consumptions on gtx280, so lets see an user numbers on e5200 here on SPCR.

JamieG few post later, says his/her power consumption is 35W idle, 50W load. Also the thread is interesting. What is the power consumption of G31? Maybe 10W, 15W, less W at load? I don't know.

From this Xbit labs review, it resembles that the difference on its sys between load - dile is = 20W.

So, what would be the power consumption drawed for e5200? May it be 20-25W at idle and 40W at load?

So, if a difference between 10W at load providing you are using the sys 24/7 at full load, then go to your electrical bill and compare when you are going to have the 50€ (70$) difference (at least here in Spain), and then if buying today an i3-530/540 is a better option than e5xxx for example.

Notice that your sys will not be at 100% load 24/7, maybe 50% of the time might be idling/sleep mode, so what would be the idle of i3 530/540? Probably the same/5W less as/than e5xxx, so, it is worth?

At this point, if you can do the maths for me and post them it would be great =)

To finish, I would like you to think about your actual build: how much have cost you? how does it consume? And if buying a new sys, when does it comes worth: 4 years using 24/7, and so on?

Hope to have expressed myself clear :)

Edit: for G31 consumption and other chipset, here on SPCR.

G31 @idle 7,4W @load 15,5W, so as JamieG W => e5200 ~@load: 50-15.5 = 34.5W ~@idle: 35 - 7.4 = 27.6W

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 2:17 pm 
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javitxi wrote:
G31 @idle 7,4W @load 15,5W, so as JamieG W => e5200 ~@load: 50-15.5 = 34.5W ~@idle: 35 - 7.4 = 27.6W

You might have missed it, but my E5200 is undervolted and underclocked (2Ghz at 1.0V in BIOS / .96V in CPU-Z) so my power usage is not typical/stock power usage of the E5200.

Also, I've disabled EIST and C1 states so my E5200 doesn't downclock or downvolt further on idle, which may distort idle comparisons a little bit.

My power estimate was with CPU load only - no GPU load - so 50W was just with 100% CPU load using Prime95.

Sorry to mess with your figures!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 3:04 pm 
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javitxi wrote:
Why are you willing to have an e7xxx instead of e5xxx?

Purely for comparison purposes to show that a Core i3-based system can be had for around the same price as one that uses LGA-775. The Core i3 seems to be equivalent to the Core 2 E7000 series when it comes to pricing. The Pentium G6950 seems to be competitive with the Pentium E6500 but that one doesn't have features that make the Core i3 and i5 models perfect for HTPC use. There isn't an E5200 equivalent currently.

Heck, for me, even a Celeron E3200/E3300 would be sufficient and that's probably what I'd use given the lower power consumption and price point. There's also the advantage that all Celeron E3000 models have VT-x support while only some select Pentium E5000 processors have it.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 30, 2010 5:20 pm 
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Location: Madrid (Spain)
Many thanks for you reply JamieG. Yes, I've missed it before reading and searching articles in English, so sorry for it.

ilovejedd, I'll try to reply you of the HTPC issue with some maths on €/kWh. Saosin, please follow closer this post and think what I have asked you: does it worth to change? If you are not caring about money, well... no doubt about it! xD Instead, take a look closer to the reasoning. Also, ask yourself if anybody will buy your actual sys /try to sell your actual sys.

Quote:
Heck, for me, even a Celeron E3200/E3300 would be sufficient and that's probably what I'd use given the lower power consumption and price point. There's also the advantage that all Celeron E3000 models have VT-x support while only some select Pentium E5000 processors have it.


I don't think there are many e5300 of the "old ones", because the one I've buyed has vt-x (BX80571E5300, SLGTL). When I was buying it, I hadn't looked on the model because I was not planning to run virtual machines on HTPC/Pc for every day as well as I do not run them actually on my Game/Pc for every day.

Then, I have found the post that Inigx said about unRAID forums (whose nickname is Romir). His/her mobo has the chipset G33, for which as sayed on motherboards SPCR forum:

G33: 14.5 W, 5.75 W, with 333 MHz FSB

So taking his/her measurements:

e5200 2.5ghz, 2MB L2, 800mhz FSB, 45nm Wolfdale.
1.15 VID @ min 6x multi (1.2ghz). 1.25 VID @ max 12.5 (2.5ghz). Poor idle vid sample.
36w idle with one core disabled in bios
50w prime95 load with one core disabled in bios
36w idle with both cores enabled
64w prime95 load with both cores enabled

@load 100%: 64-14,5 = ~50 Watts
@idle: 36-5,75 = ~30 Watss

which are almost JamieG ones, and resembles de 20W difference load-idle showed on Xbit labs.

So then, the difference at load between i3 530/540 with e5xxx will be around 20W.

Also, as sayed on mobos SPCR thread: "Max TDP for the latest Intel socket 1156 chipsets H55, H57 and Q57 is 5.2 / 5.2 / 5.1W". Then if you go for Zotac H55 it will be at load: CPU 28.8W + H55 5.2W = 34W. No more chips (IGP is on CPU, no northbridge), just we need to add the Watss from RAM and the peak Wattage of HDDs to have the total Watts at load.

Now, lets move to bit-tech Zotac 9300 review power consumption. It has an e5200.

The power is: 80W load / 55W idle, so if you substract the e5200, then for 9300 "all-in-one" chip: 80-50= 30W load / 55-30 = 25W idle.

Now that we have all the numbers, the difference between Zotac 9300+e5200+ etc / Zotac H55 + i3 530/540 +etc will be around 40-43W at load. About idle for the H55 sys maybe will have 25 Watss? So at idle we have 30 Watss of difference.

Then, running sys 24/7, 50% of the times load 50% times idle it will make a difference ~35 W.

If I am not wrong, all this measures are Watts per hour, and in Spain I think the Kilowatt/hour is around 0,10-0,11€ (1€ ~ 1,43$) => 0,10-0,11€/kWh. => 0,0001-0,00011€/Wh if I am not wrong.

One year has 365 days x24 hours/day = 8760 hours have a year

Lets suppose that you use the sys 24/7 at full load:
Zotac H55: ~37W/h x 0,11€ /kWh x8760 hours = 35,65 € per year
Zotac 9300: ~80W/h x 0,11€ /kWh x8760 hours = 77 € per year
difference = 41,35 €

1 year and some months to recover the money

Lets suppose that you use the sys 24/7 at idle:
Zotac H55: ~20W/h x 0,11€ /kWh x8760 hours = 19,27 € per year
Zotac H55: ~25W/h x 0,11€ /kWh x8760 hours = 24,09 € per year
Zotac 9300: ~55W/h x 0,11€ /kWh x8760 hours = 53 € per year
difference = 29€ - 34€

~ 2 years to recover the money

So, does it worth? The numbers have proven that I am wrong providing you are going to use the sys as described, so yes, as the numbers resembles it is worth.

4 hours/day at full load => 1460 hours/year

difference at load = 12,848 - 5.9422 = 6.9058 ~ 6.91€. The difference is 50€ between CPUs, so 50/6.91 = 7,23 years!!

6 hours/day at full load => 2190 hours/year

difference at load = 19,272 - 8,9133 = 10,3587 ~ 10,36€. The difference is 50€ between CPUs, so ~ 5 years.

8 hours/day at full load => 2920 hours/year

difference at load 2 x 6.91€ = 13,82€. The difference is 50€ between CPUs, so 50/13,82 ~ 3,62 years (more than 3 years and 6 months)

Notice that with idle loads the results are a ~25% more of the years calculated.

Summing up, for an average HTPC ussage like 8 hours per day providing you use it is always at full load, probably when 3,62 years have passed, maybe you have in mind to change your HTPC sys, so IMHO, I don't think now it would be a good idea to buy H55 + i3 530/540 as the numbers says. If the prices will go down in 6-8 months, well... maybe the maths resembles that yes, it will be worth, so by then, I'll be wrong :oops:

Hope to have been usefull :)

Javier

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 5:21 am 
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Location: in the depths of hell
javitxi wrote:
ilovejedd, I'll try to reply you of the HTPC issue with some maths on €/kWh. Saosin, please follow closer this post and think what I have asked you: does it worth to change? If you are not caring about money, well... no doubt about it! xD Instead, take a look closer to the reasoning. Also, ask yourself if anybody will buy your actual sys /try to sell your actual sys.

Quote:
Heck, for me, even a Celeron E3200/E3300 would be sufficient and that's probably what I'd use given the lower power consumption and price point. There's also the advantage that all Celeron E3000 models have VT-x support while only some select Pentium E5000 processors have it.

Actually, the power consumption difference is negligible when looking at the power bill. What matters more in a Mini-ITX system is the lower heat output. If I were planning on building an LGA775-based HTPC, I would've gone with a Celeron Wolfdale. For something like an HTPC, I don't really need a faster processor.

However, H55/H57+Core i3/i5 systems offer something that a GeForce9300+Wolfdale does not - HD audio bitstreaming. Unfortunately, from some of the reports I've seen, the Clarkdale chips still have some driver issues that need ironing out. Many people have reported tearing in 1080p24 mode. OpenGL2 isn't properly implemented. While the Clarkdales may seem better when running benchmarks, a GF9300+Wolfdale would still do better when it comes to gaming.

There are pros and cons to both systems. Eventually, it's up to the user to decide which system would suit their needs better.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:51 am 
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Posts: 64
Location: Madrid (Spain)
ilovejedd wrote:
However, H55/H57+Core i3/i5 systems offer something that a GeForce9300+Wolfdale does not - HD audio bitstreaming. Unfortunately, from some of the reports I've seen, the Clarkdale chips still have some driver issues that need ironing out. Many people have reported tearing in 1080p24 mode. OpenGL2 isn't properly implemented. While the Clarkdales may seem better when running benchmarks, a GF9300+Wolfdale would still do better when it comes to gaming.

There are pros and cons to both systems. Eventually, it's up to the user to decide which system would suit their needs better.


I've read on Zotac website that Zotac H55 miniITX supports HD audio 7,1 and Zotac 9300 hd audio 5,1. [Wiki link surround sound] Also both motherboards can handle S/PDIF & optical output, so the better choice is optical output for sound (the output which is under S/PDIF) + DVI-I or HDMI video only. HDMI is DVI-I dual link + sound, but the speakers on your TV aren't good quality as "good one" speakers, or is there any way that your TV can move the audio signal from its HDMI output to the "good ones"- speakers? Am I right about optical output?

Anyway, can you do HD audio bitstreaming through 5,1 or just only throug 7,1? I'm very confussed about all those standards, and the only difference I can see between 5.1 and 7.1 is 2 more channels for 2 more speakers on your back to improve the surround sys, but 5.1 and 7.1 are only the way you put your speakers to have surrounding sound, nothing more about more BW (bandwidth) or more SNR (signal to noise ratio).

On your motherboard 7,1 vs 5,1 means to have orange+black+grey outputs fruthermore green(sound)+red/kind of pink(microphone)+blue (line in), am I correct?

Also, is there any real difference using digital ouput by optical fiber VS white/red analog cables at short distances (like < 5m)? Obviously, the optical has more BW and better SNR , but is your digital audio signal (using HD audio bitstreaming) Mbps/Gbps so high that you have to use optical fiber? The human voice through telephone is around 64Kbps and the human ear max sensibility is 200-300Hz to 5KHz (max 20Hz - 20KHz) if I am not wrong.

Many thanks in advance for resolving my doubts :)

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