Canadians Beware, Don't Use UPS for Shipping !!

marc999 · Post by **marc999** » Fri Jun 13, 2003 9:40 am

I ordered some computer stuff from PC Mods.com in the US

My order came to $95.16 US (approx $133 CAD at the time)

UPS shipping was $20.00 US (UPS Ground for 3lbs package)
Now here's the best part. Brokerage fees:
Entry prep fee $26.50
Disbursement fee $5.75
Additional tarrif lines $15.00
Total UPS Brokerage Charges: $47.25 UPS.
(note this does not include GST)

So to ship this package and figure out what the GST was (a mathmatical operation a 12 year old could do) they charged me approx $28 CAD shipping plus $47 CAD brokerage fees!! That's $75 CAD total

I called them twice and even asked for a manager once and got the same brick wall. They don't care at all. They said it may have been cheaper to ship it via Air because then brokerage fees are included. Great. That's exactly what I need to hear to make me feel better. And of course it's not a rule, it all depends on shipping weight and if the moon is full and all that $hit !! So just take a day off and figure out what the cheapest shipping method is before you use UPS !!

Anyway, I'm very angry about this and am determined not to let these crooks get away with this. I will contact PCmods and see if they can do anything (like perhaps threaten to ship with another company, but I doubt they would do that just for little me).

If anyone has any suggestions for me, please let me know. And in the mean time, BEWARE !!

P.S. - Free Trade / NAFTA my a$$ !!

bmod · Post by **bmod** » Fri Jun 13, 2003 10:08 am

Hi,

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it is not UPS's fault. Blame on the Candian government. I work for a company in the US thats ships everyday to Canada and those charges are inline.

We use FedEx, but the rates are about the same as UPS. Yes if it was sent priority the shipping rate would be better, but the brokerage fees are not always included. There seems to be no set standard when they let the shipment go or add fees to the shipper later down the road which they could not charge to you because the transaction is already down.

The only way our company has found a loop hole is to use the US Mail. This works great for small packages, but tracking is terrible.

Sorry, for being so winded. In the future try to order it priority because odds are that customs will not add any fees, but some shippers may not use it. I check at lunch, a 1lb package to Ontario runs 22.38(our discounted FedEx rate), so the dollar amount goes up pretty quickly.

Bmod

marc999 · Post by **marc999** » Fri Jun 13, 2003 10:36 am

Hi Bmod.
Thanks for your response but I don't think we should let UPS (or perhaps FedEX) off the hook that easily. The fact still remains that they charged me $47 bucks just to collect the GST and pass it on to the Canadian Government. That $47 all goes to UPS, not the Canadian Government I'm sure 90% of that $47 is pure profit if not more (plus let's not forget that they made a profit from the shipping as well). This is just blatant greediness and talking advantage of the customer. I have no problem with the Canadian Government wanting to get paid their GST (FYI it was $11.92 not including the GST of the UPS Brokerage charges).

There seems to be no set standard when they let the shipment go or add fees to the shipper later down the road which they could not charge to you because the transaction is already down

I'm not quite sure what you mean by this. I'm pretty sure that every time you buy something from the US and ship it to Canada you have to pay brokerage fees UNLESS ......

The only way our company has found a loop hole is to use the US Mail. This works great for small packages, but tracking is terrible.

you use US Mail or Canada Post. I think it may have to do with the fact that Canada Post is owned by the Canadian Government and they must have some arrangement for US Mail to collect the GST for them or something. Bottom line, US Mail and Canada Post is the best for sure !!

dago · Post by **dago** » Fri Jun 13, 2003 12:11 pm

Just to drop my .02 CHF, for all packages sent to Switzerland, from either the EU or US, in addition to the 'normal' VAT taxes. each of the carrier add their cost which is, by pure coincidence strictly equal.

Oh yes, to annoy you even more, marc999, this extra UPS/Fedex charge is 12/11.50 CHF (around 9US$ -8 €, convert). With normal post, it's free (no additional tax, just VAT).

marc999 · Post by **marc999** » Mon Jun 16, 2003 9:36 am

Oh yes, to annoy you even more, marc999, this extra UPS/Fedex charge is 12/11.50 CHF (around 9US$ -8 €, convert). With normal post, it's free (no additional tax, just VAT).

Perfect !! It's "cheaper" (tax/additional charge wise) to buy something in the EU from the States, than it is in Canada, despite NAFTA. Thanks Mr. Mulroney !! Who's the real "Buffoon?" Jacka$$ !!

Anyway, PCmods.com wrote me this, which I would like to share with all of you. If a company sucks, I want everyone to know, but when a company goes that extra mile, likewise I think it's important to share:

We'll be offerring USPS shipping from our new Houston warehouse in a week
or two (yes we've been saying that for a week or two, so its not happening
quickly). Here is what we can do. UPS basically stonewalls us about
this, they feel that this is completely acceptable (of course).

While it pains us to pay for UPS's conduct (or misconduct) we never want
anyone to feel that shopping at PcMods is a risky thing to do. That
having been said, we have added USD$10 to your pcmods account to do with
as you please. While this doesn't completely counteract your "losses" it
will perhaps show our sincerity in wanting to serve you better.

Lithium · Post by **Lithium** » Mon Jun 16, 2003 10:24 am

The border is why I almost ALWAYS try to avoid ordering anything across the border. I'll be screwed like you far too many times in the past, and after awhile it really starts to sting.

dago · Post by **dago** » Mon Jun 16, 2003 11:59 am

Perfect !! It's "cheaper" (tax/additional charge wise) to buy something in the EU from the States, than it is in Canada, despite NAFTA. Thanks Mr. Mulroney !! Who's the real "Buffoon?" Jacka$$ !!

maybe you should ad 'rope' to EU. Switzerland is far from being in the union (look at this map : that's the hole in the middle), which allows me to beneficiate from buying things online with the local cheaper tax (7.6 instead of 20-21%

)

Don't be envious anyway, (almost) everything else is 30% more expensive

ajpaterson · Post by **ajpaterson** » Mon Jun 16, 2003 12:05 pm

There seems to be no set standard when they let the shipment go or add fees to the shipper later down the road which they could not charge to you because the transaction is already down

I'm not quite sure what you mean by this. I'm pretty sure that every time you buy something from the US and ship it to Canada you have to pay brokerage fees UNLESS ......

The only way our company has found a loop hole is to use the US Mail. This works great for small packages, but tracking is terrible.

you use US Mail or Canada Post. I think it may have to do with the fact that Canada Post is owned by the Canadian Government and they must have some arrangement for US Mail to collect the GST for them or something. Bottom line, US Mail and Canada Post is the best for sure !!

Actually if you use Fedex Air (International Priority) or UPS Air (Worldwide Express) brokerage charges are included in the shipping price. Also, if you are shipping to a business address, GST is generally not collected. As most computer products we mail-order are relatively small and light (except cases of course), air is actually a good alternative for time sensitive/expensive orders. I generally prefer Fedex becuase when they do collect GST, their handling fee for this is cheaper than UPS.

For cheaper orders, I'll use USMail. When Canada Post completes the delivery, they will charge you GST plus a handling fee (much lower than UPS of course).

-AJPaterson

marc999 · Post by **marc999** » Mon Jun 16, 2003 12:11 pm

ajpaterson,
Thanks for the tips. They will come in handy in the future !!

jgoff · Post by **jgoff** » Mon Jun 16, 2003 1:25 pm

guess only big corporations benefit from NAFTA

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Tue Jun 17, 2003 3:59 am

jgoff wrote:guess only big corporations benefit from NAFTA

Gee, that's sure a suprise.

I thought our government made laws to benefit the people?

frodo · Post by **frodo** » Tue Jun 17, 2003 3:28 pm

Marc999,

When ordering something from the states as you have found out you need to stay away from FedEx or UPS. Purolator is (IMO) ALWAYS the better choice, they are cheaper. Of course as other poster's have said if you can have it shipped via US-Mail that is even a better option.

jgoff wrote:
guess only big corporations benefit from NAFTA

All I have to say to all the other ideas and opinions is remember there are always two sides to every story. I know some individuals (myself included) that have benefitted greatly from NAFTA. And that's the only statement I'm going to make on the topic, so no need to flame me about it.

limee · Post by **limee** » Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:02 pm

USPS is the cheapest (best

) when shipping from US to Canada. I haven't had to pay customs yet; just $12 (CDN) for shipping small packages and that's it. Sometimes takes a while though...

lazybum131 · Post by **lazybum131** » Fri Jun 20, 2003 3:59 pm

i live in Canada and had to RMA my motherboard to the US.
MSI sent the replacement through UPS, i got charged a $23.70 Brokerage Fee even though there wasn't any tax to collect!

I guess the fee is just for the hassle they go through crossing over the border?

lacsap · Post by **lacsap** » Sun Jun 22, 2003 4:33 am

Same here. But if the sender specifies "warranty return", UPS won't charge a fee. That's what they did and I had nothing to pay. Maybe MSI didn't know about that

Elliot · Post by **Elliot** » Mon Nov 17, 2003 8:14 pm

Bringing up old thread... want to add myself to the list of UPS victims.

Bought Matrox G550 at eBay: US$56
Requested shipping via USPS: US$5
Total: US$61

The seller, for reason unknown to me, shipped UPS.

Brokerage fee: CAD$42 - about 50% of the item's cost

PS: From now on, I will be telling anyone who is willing to listen: UPS is evil

mas92264 · Post by **mas92264** » Mon Nov 17, 2003 9:23 pm

Bon soir, ye chilly Canadians

So what's the answer? Either ups pockets the entire "brokerage fee" or they keep some and remit some to the Canadian govt. The latter seems most likely as would be indicated by the non brokerage fee collection by usps. Witness thusly: ups is a U.S. corporation. It collects its shipping fee from the U.S. shipper. How much of this does the Canadian govt get? $0. So, to compensate themselves for this funding deficit, the Canadian govt extracts a fee, collected by ups, from the helpless victim, the Canadian international shopper. Ups probably finds this a huge administrative pita, that's why they collect their portion of the loot.

A quick call to Canadian customs would probably clear up all the confusion.

Today's high, a balmy 74F/23C.

Traciatim · Post by **Traciatim** » Mon Nov 17, 2003 10:22 pm

For more information on importing of goods through the mail and fees involved visit:

http://www.ccra-adrc.gc.ca/customs/indi ... tal-e.html

The brokerage fees are charged to you to handle the importation of goods, sometimes they miss them, sometimes they don't. I got caught on a $1500(CAD) digital camera and found a bill for about 280CAD from UPS which I had to pay. I call it the 'penalty for shopping outside of canada tax'.

Traciatim

Tom Brown · Post by **Tom Brown** » Mon Nov 17, 2003 11:23 pm

Marc, use USPS air. It will get here about as quickly and at a fraction of the price. No brokerage, only tax and a $5 handling fee on arrival. With one exception, I do not deal with any US organization which ships UPS only (which is most of them).

The exception is TigerDirect.ca. They ship from a warehouse in the US but there are *NO* brokerage and no tax either. The packages are given to you with zero additional charges, due to a deal TigerDirect has with UPS. The government is only a very small part of the problem. The curriers are the major component in this oppression.

By the way, if you ship business to business, brokerage is only a few bucks and some of the other charges go away.

trinitrotoluene · Post by **trinitrotoluene** » Wed Nov 19, 2003 7:11 pm

UPS is crap even if shipping within the US. From what I've heard they treat their workers like crap and the workers treat the packages like crap.

I've noticed on eBay that most people who insist on shipping through UPS do it so that they can overcharge on shipping, since UPS doesn't display shipping cost on the package. The best places I've bought from (online store or eBay) either use USPS or FedEx.

mas92264 · Post by **mas92264** » Wed Nov 19, 2003 8:03 pm

There are 2 magic words that poorly treated ups workers can use to solve their problems about working for ups "I quit."

If you feel like you're gonna be overcharged for shipping by an ebay seller, don't bid or email them for exact shipping/packing charges.

ez2remember · Post by **ez2remember** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 3:52 pm

I have one very bad experience with UPS.
I don’t want to go into it; it will just make my blood boil. Put it this way, the driver was too damn lazy to get off his ass and deliver the parcel to me. He also lied about what actually happened to the parcel. I made tons of calls (30min-1hr wait on the phone) to get to the bottom of this matter.

This driver claimed he tried to deliver the parcel but said there was no one at the house and claimed he left a note, which was completely false. I was waiting day after day without anyone knocking or posting any note. He was eventually found out and sacked, but I would never use UPS again.

wussboy · Post by **wussboy** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 9:04 pm

mas92264 wrote:Bon soir, ye chilly Canadians

Today's high, a balmy 74F/23C.

I hate you mas92264. Tonight in Calgary it's hitting -31C, pretty close to -30Farenheit. Toss in a little wind, and you got yourself some wind chill.

On another note, I was in Miami last winter and they issued a wind-chill warning. It was +15C. So, exposed flesh freezes...never?

I laughed and laughed.

marc999 · Post by **marc999** » Sat Nov 22, 2003 11:36 am

mas92264,

So what's the answer? Either ups pockets the entire "brokerage fee" or they keep some and remit some to the Canadian govt.

They just pocket this as extra profit. Yes, they have to do some paperwork for the Canadian Government, and pass on the GST (7%). So yes some work is involved and I'm sure it is a PITA. However, their charges are nothing short of criminal. The only thing I blame the Canadian government for is not instating laws that protect the Canadian Consumer from UPS brokerage fees. They should pass a special law just for UPS!! I'm sorry, but they are one of the most dishonest, un-consumer-centric a$$holes I've ever dealt with. Sorry, it's simply impossible for me to mention UPS in a sentence without some sort of slandering sentence following.

Everyone else,
Thanks for all your suggestions. I agree, USPS is the way to go, and FedEX while not as good, certainly is better than UPS!!

wussboy,
Yes, it certain is cold here. My cat finally decided to brave it outside. Being stuck inside for too many days makes him go crazy. Tough little bastard he is.

Gooserider · Post by **Gooserider** » Sun Nov 30, 2003 9:25 pm

I have had problems with both UPS and USPS mangling packages. However UPS is easier to deal with in terms of getting issues resolved. (Note, none of these packages involved computer bits, most were tools...)

However several years back I worked for a place that did sales on older model and refurbished computers. Our monitor repair people were always complaining about getting monitors that had internal damage, but no damage to the outer cases - a pattern consistent with severe handling abuse while in the shipping box. The boxes would show some damage, but not severe smashing, however with the styrofoam packing peices around the monitor, this was not conclusive.

We were able to convince the boss that handling was an issue however, the day we caught (on the newly installed security video system

)a UPS driver LOBBING a monitor FIFTEEN FEET (~5 meters) across our loading dock... When confronted with this, and having the large FRAGILE lables on the box pointed out to him the driver said he didn't think we'd care since the monitor was a warranty return, and we'd have to fix it anyway!!! (The monitor now had a cracked frame, in addition to the minor mobo flaw, and was non-repairable because of this...)

I Don't know about the tarrif issue, but will say UPS is not all that great about handling packages with large fragile lables on them.

Gooserider

Canadians Beware, Don't Use UPS for Shipping !!

Canadians Beware, Don't Use UPS for Shipping !!

so much for free trade

Re: so much for free trade

Don't know if this will help