Any MATX case interest? & Newbie case advice?

KJ · Post by KJ » Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:04 am

As a newbie to the site, I must first say that SPCR is excellent. The quality of this site is readily evident relative to many popular hardware review sites. I have gleaned a lot from reading both its articles and its forum.

However, there doesn't seem to be as much interest here in MATX. Is it because these cases are cheaper, more prone to vibration, less space for suspension? Other reasons; just coincidence? Do people use more than 4 slots on their mainboard? (On a related note, the articles about the LC11M et al. were very interesting)

Anyhow, anyone know anything about the Enermax CS10068 or its SFX PSU?

http://www.enermax.com.tw/products_case ... 29&Gid2=19

Its been reviewed positively at THG and elsewhere and has noise reduction features.

FWIW, I just bought an INWIN Z720T instead, so I'm hoping someone has some negative comments about the CS10068 that had also tempted me.

The Z720T is interesting because it is tiny (7x14x15), supports full ATX PSUs, costs only 45$ including shipping, and appears to provide good ventillation- or does it? (I am new to this.:^)). I'm hoping Z720T+S12-330 > CS10068 at nearly the same price.

http://www.in-win.com.tw/tw/in-win/inde ... fc636c8722

yeha · Post by **yeha** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:32 am

i'd love to hear your opinions on the z720t! i'm planning around that case myself when a socket-939 matx board i like comes out, i couldn't see much of anything not to like about it. it even has ample room for drive suspension in front of that nice intake.

KJ · Post by KJ » Wed Apr 27, 2005 12:19 pm

I'll let you know when I get it, but I need to actually buy the parts to go inside the case still. It's good to know someone else thought the Z720T looked pretty strong. Incidentally, Gigabyte seems to be on the edge of releasing a nice s939 MATX.

http://www.giga-byte.com/Motherboard/Pr ... 480M-9.htm

Chang · Post by **Chang** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 12:30 pm

I don't have first hand experience with either, but I'll give you my $0.02. First off, there's probably a little less buzz here about mATX because the smaller size makes silencing tougher. To get good temperatures quietly, you need extremely good airflow layout and larger fans. Neither of those tend to go with mATX cases, especially since many of them use 60mm fans. Mobo selection is also worse in mATX.

As for the cases, I like the Enermax Venus a lot. One of its major pluses is that it can take two rear 80mm fans. It's also an inch thinner than the other case you listed. The PSU is probably the best SFX PSUs out there. Of course there aren't many SFX sized PSUs. This PSU limitation is probably the largest drawback to the case.

The difference in thinness is mainly due to the orientation of the 5.25" drives. The Enermax will be "happier" with the laid on its side like a desktop case. The InWin is best standing up like a tower. They'll probably work either way, but it's hard to stand a tower into a home theater setup or sacrifice deskspace for a desktop (albeit a small desktop).

The InWin Z720T is a good case. It follows the basic mATX min-tower design. It only has room for a single 92mm fan in back. You have to step up to a cube to get a 120mm fan. The rear grille looks very nice -- not restrictive at all. The side duct is good if you have a heatsink that lines up perfectly (or close enough that you can duct the difference), but fairly useless with some of heatpipes-tower heatsinks that have become all the rage. I can't tell if you can fit a front intake fan on this case. The tool-less mounting mechanisms can be nice but you may run into trouble suspending your drives. I believe there are also a couple of Foxconn mATX cases that have a 92mm in back and a front fan cage. But I don't think the Foxconn stealths the drives for you.

With the right fans and PSU and the Z720T should quiet down nicely with little modding required. Assuming a decent build quality, it's definately a very good value.

KJ · Post by KJ » Wed Apr 27, 2005 12:44 pm

Thanks, .02c was what I was looking for. Incidentally, the orientation of the 5.25 was probably THE reason I did not end up purchasing the CS10068. That and a lack of credible reviews for a product that costs 50$ more than its competition.

yeha · Post by **yeha** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 9:43 pm

i posted my wish-list for matx boards here, all my hopes are pinned on the gigabyte board but i have a horrible feeling that there'll be no overclocking options. i don't think i'm after all that much, all i really want is a socket-939 matx board, good overclocking options and a fanless chipset. it just doesn't seem like anyone's looking to fill the niche

the msi rs480m2 would have been perfect - all it needs is a pci-e 1x slot, a better southbridge (the uli southbridge would've fixed ati's poor usb performance, given sata ii and ncq and high-def audio) and spending $0.08 more on the clock generator would've given overclocking abilities. the gigabyte board is looking good, but for who knows what reason lacks tv-out and firewire, and the manual isn't online so overclocking options aren't definite yet. fingers crossed here.

rei · Post by **rei** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 10:18 pm

I've just bought my third In-Win V523 case, I'm quite partial to the uncomplicated-yet-classy design. Just changed from G to a V523-T with extra vent in the side panel.

Can't attach a fan to the front for intake without special piece order from In-Win though.

Only thing I dislike is the fixed floppy bezel in one of the 3.5" bays.

cyberknight · Post by **cyberknight** » Wed Apr 27, 2005 11:51 pm

http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=21396

I recently inquired about the C720T (Mid-Tower version of the Z720T) and InWin emailed me saying that it purposely has no front fan support cuz a front fan is not recommended by AMD's official Cooling Guide.

There is some interesting results though... and I don't think it is entirely false. From personal experience, I have a 900RPM fan as the front fan of my Sonata, and it does not really have an effect on my case temps. It does keep my HDD cooler by 4-6 degrees though.

Of course, there still is airflow coming in from the front, and with the removable hard drive cage, I wouldn't be too difficult to creatively stick a fan in the front.

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Sat Apr 30, 2005 2:26 am

Besides In-win, are there other decent mATX cases that can fit a ATX psu?

How about Aspire X-QPACK Aluminum Mini Case w/ 3 Windows

Doesn't look cheap though.

alglove · Post by **alglove** » Sat Apr 30, 2005 7:15 am

I put together a case with an Enlight mATX case a few years back. That could fit a standard ATX power supply and also had space in the back for a 92mm fan. Its construction was pretty sturdy, and at the time I thought it was a pretty quiet computer. That was a few years back, though, so I do not know how well it would compare with the cases mentioned here.

http://us.enlightcorp.com/products/pc/d ... &serial=83

Jack5000 · Post by **Jack5000** » Tue May 03, 2005 12:34 pm

Apple has it right with the Mac Mini, small and close to silent most of the time. The size of it is amazing! Makes the Aria look very large indeed.

We need something similar for a PC?

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Wed May 04, 2005 9:53 pm

Guys, what about hec (compucase) 6K series?
http://www.hecgroupusa.com/product_t3.php?H_T=Tower

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Thu May 05, 2005 5:15 am

winguy wrote:Guys, what about hec (compucase) 6K series?
http://www.hecgroupusa.com/product_t3.php?H_T=Tower

Those aren't m-ATX cases. You see them referred to as "mid-towers". That's the same exact chassis that Antec uses for the ubiquitous SLK3x00 series of cases.

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Thu May 05, 2005 5:36 am

Ralf Hutter wrote:
winguy wrote:Guys, what about hec (compucase) 6K series?
http://www.hecgroupusa.com/product_t3.php?H_T=Tower
Those aren't m-ATX cases. You see them referred to as "mid-towers". That's the same exact chassis that Antec uses for the ubiquitous SLK3x00 series of cases.

Those aren't being referred to as "mid-towers", all "vertical" (tower) cases were just put under the same page.

Clicking on the 6K cases review Micro ATX Form Factor. Also, the SLK3x00 (SLK3700AMB at least) is based on 6A series if I'm not wrong.

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Thu May 05, 2005 5:56 am

winguy wrote:
Ralf Hutter wrote:
winguy wrote:Guys, what about hec (compucase) 6K series?
http://www.hecgroupusa.com/product_t3.php?H_T=Tower
Those aren't m-ATX cases. You see them referred to as "mid-towers". That's the same exact chassis that Antec uses for the ubiquitous SLK3x00 series of cases.
Those aren't being referred to as "mid-towers", all "vertical" (tower) cases were just put under the same page. Clicking on the 6K cases review Micro ATX Form Factor.

Right you are.

winguy wrote:Also, the SLK3x00 (SLK3700AMB at least) is based on 6A series if I'm not wrong.

Correctamundo, and the "6A" cases are at the top two columns of your linked page. That was why I made the comment that I did. (memo to Ralf: scroll down next time, you lazy ass)

KJ · Post by KJ » Thu May 05, 2005 7:16 am

I have never before noticed HEC cases. They don't appear to be readily available in the US. HEC doesn't provide a very detailed picture of the case on their website either. Do they support full ATX PSU's? Now I wonder what percentage of MATX cases do support full ATX PSUs.

geckokarma · Post by **geckokarma** » Thu May 05, 2005 9:05 am

I have the Enermax CS 10068 and can recommend it. I'm building a music (not video) oriented AV box for the entertainment center. Some of its components:

* Soyo P4RC350 mobo -- got it mainly for the S-Video out. Downside is that getting the proprietary ATI Linux drivers to work with the TV has been an absolute pain.
* Celeron 2.0 GHz Northwood
* A Thermalright XP-90 and a 90mm Nexus fan. They fit quite nicely.
* The SPCR-recommended Samsung SP1604N HD, 160Gb.
* AT&T 6500G 802.11g PCI (works well with Madwifi & WPA-PSK using wpa_supplicant)

Upsides about the case:
* As mentioned, it has room for 2 rear 80mm fans.
* I think its plenty roomy compared to some other mATX cases. I don't think the airflow is overly restricted. A 5.25" cage does get a bit close to my HS/fan, but its workable for me.
* Airvents over the drive cages should help the thermal situation there significantly, esp when the system is on its side.
* One of the hard drive cages and the included rear fan have rubber mounts. They seem to do the job.
* I don't have any measurements nor much previous experience as a guide, but the PSU fan noise level seems low to me. I haven't undervolted the HS fan to 5 V yet, but when I do, my guess is that the PSU fan will be louder than the HS fan but still tolerable.
* THG is right about the cheap plastic doors on the front, but I couldn't care less. Mine haven't broken and I don't think the case would look too bad with them removed.

Downsides:
* Wasn't cheap -- nearly $100 including shipping from newegg.
* The paint scratches easily. The bottom of mine is ruined from moving it around on a table (I guess I should dust more!).

I haven't yet undervolted the case fan to 5 V, but of course at 12 its way too loud. I'm aiming for sub-20dbA overall... we shall see.

I considered but didn't opt for an Antec Aria b/c of comments on this site about its 120mm fan.

Thanks go to SPCR -- much of this system comes straight from these pages!

KJ · Post by KJ » Thu May 05, 2005 1:05 pm

Negative comments; I said I wanted negative comments about the CS10068

Looks like the CS10068 would have been a pretty good choice; hopefully the Z720T also is.

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Thu May 05, 2005 8:51 pm

KJ wrote:I have never before noticed HEC cases. They don't appear to be readily available in the US. HEC doesn't provide a very detailed picture of the case on their website either. Do they support full ATX PSU's? Now I wonder what percentage of MATX cases do support full ATX PSUs.

Yes the HEC 6K series do support ATX PSUs, that's why it was worth mentioning.

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Thu May 05, 2005 8:53 pm

KJ wrote:Negative comments; I said I wanted negative comments about the CS10068

Well, the CS10068 doesn't hold a ATX psu?

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Thu May 12, 2005 10:40 pm

Guys what about Asus TM-250 and TM-231 ?

http://www.asus.com/products3.aspx?l1=7 ... NI%20TOWER

pony-tail · Post by **pony-tail** » Sat May 14, 2005 9:38 pm

I have been using InWin s V series cases for years with a great deal of success .
Link:- http://www.in-win.us/in-win/index.php?cPath=7_15
They are not that loud out of the box and with a bit of modding (hard drive mounting in particular) and a fan or two (rubber mounted of course) they cool well and are very quiet .
They use (in Australia at least ) fortron PSUs.
But I am unsure of their latest models which have holes in the side doors (but these could be sealed )
I am perfectly happy with mine and will most likely buy another.

KJ · Post by KJ » Tue May 17, 2005 2:34 pm

So I've now built a computer around the Z720T. I can give subjective impressions of the stock case.

GOOD:
Inexpensive.
Stock PSU is as quiet or quieter than the Arctic Cooling Silencer Ultra TC 64 recommended by SPCR (note that my heat generation consists only of 1 Samsung spinpoint, K8M800 NB, sempron 2600, and Asus FX5200 passively cooled; presumably the AC fan is running at near minimal speed).
Construction seems pretty solid, case is easy to work with
The front and back of the case are really quite well ventilated- the pictures don't lie
I, for one, think it looks pretty slick.
The fan locations and airflow lead me to believe that this case would be ideally suited for a fanless CPU heatsink. The back case fan and PSU fan are both practically touching the CPU heatsink.

BAD:
I haven't tried speedfanning it yet, but the fan at the back of the case is awfully loud. I have just plain disconnected it.
Without serious modding, I don't see any way to suspend a drive in that ideal spot at the front bottom of the case
The clips at the bottom front of the case are set up to hold a hard drive, not a fan.
The stealth setup for the 5.25" locations are not removable; if you want to put in any external device other than a CD/DVD, you are out of luck.
The screwless setup precludes any use of rubber grommets for the hard drive or CD/DVD. That said, I do believe the AC Silencer is the biggest noise maker in my case, not vibration. But, with a different HD, who knows...
<EDIT>No the hard drive IS the loudest component</EDIT>
I suspect, as Chang had mentioned, that the side bottom vents are indeed worthless, if not counterproductive to airflow.

--
I would hesitantly recommend the Z720T to those interested in getting a vertically oriented MATX case. Pricing is also quite competitive. If price is a major factor, this case definately deserves consideration.

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Sun May 22, 2005 12:00 pm

Compucase (or HEC ) 6K31
http://www.3dvelocity.com/reviews/6k31/case.htm

this any good?

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 5:00 am

You guys may like this.

http://www.coolermaster.com/product_com ... 40_541.pdf

Centurion Micro ATX 540

Centurion 541

EDIT BY ADMIN: Embed long URLs as done here for you. Your only warning -- any others will be deleted in future.

lucienrau · Post by **lucienrau** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 6:57 am

Winguy, thanks for the heads up on those cases. Those look like what I've been looking for for years.

I know there are a few of us around here who want what this case has:
M-atx small footprint
Room for suspension
Good cooling
Steel Chassis
Standard PSU

It looks like case manufacturers are finally waking up to the fact that there's a market out there for well cooled m-atx cases. Now if we could get the mobo makers to put voltage/clock control on....

winguy · Post by **winguy** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 7:14 am

Yes they are very good imo.

But I'm a little confused by some of the pics. I suppose the correct orientation is with the PCI slots higher up (as in the pdf), right?

lucienrau · Post by **lucienrau** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 7:19 am

It looks like it's the same pseudo-BTX configuration that is pretty popular right now (Lian-Li 1000 etc...) with the board flipped. Looks pretty good for CPU ducting though.

Too bad I just bought a new case

Post by **MikeC** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 7:32 am

lucienrau wrote:It looks like it's the same pseudo-BTX configuration that is pretty popular right now (Lian-Li 1000 etc...) with the board flipped.

I don't understand what the advantage is. Thermally, there is no difference compared to the board mounted normally. Nor is there any functionally. About the only thing I can thin of is that maybe it's possible to modifiy this more easily to one or another of the BTX form factors.

sundevil_1997 · Post by **sundevil_1997** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 8:26 am

KJ wrote:the Z720T looked pretty strong. Incidentally, Gigabyte seems to be on the edge of releasing a nice s939 MATX.

That board looks kinda nice...I'm definitely looking for an AMD64 board that has gigabit lan, and SATA, and there is a definite lack of those. However, aren't the ATI/ULI chipsets shown to be lacking in performance?

Any MATX case interest? & Newbie case advice?

Any MATX case interest? & Newbie case advice?

It'll be a while

Thanks.

Re: It'll be a while