Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

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PeaceMachine
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Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by PeaceMachine » Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:20 pm

Construction of a silent desktop size entertainment centre for siting on a shelf

Given that it is not sensible to fit a TV tuner card and a sound card into the Streacom FC10 due to the inside of the FC10 not having a case fan (see thread titled "Recipe for HTPC . . . . ):

How about using the large 'Powercool HTPC-002' HTPC case, which has a case fan, and attaching a fanless CPU cooler? The question is, is there a fanless CPU cooler which will fit inside that case?

This is the case: http://www.box.co.uk/Powercool_Htpc-002 ... 66140.html

Does anybody know if there is a fanless CPU cooler which will fit this Powercool case and still leave room for a TV tuner and a sound card ??

I was thinking of using an ASUS P8Z77-V motherboard.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Andrew

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by CA_Steve » Thu Feb 14, 2013 7:26 pm

I can't tell from that link (and couldn't find the mfgr's site) - isn't there any side/bottom/top venting? Is there only the rear fan? If so, I think this case might be all looks and no cooling performance...

Some people like to build fanless PCs just to see if it can be done / to get their inner geek going. I'd rather build a silent, well cooled PC. You can do that with a decent case and low rpm fans and it'll be silent - especially if it's located on a shelf in an entertainment center and not a foot or two from your ears. If you are looking for a good looking horizontal form factor case, take a look at the Antec Fusion models or the Silverstone Grandia models or Fractal's Node 605.
1080p Gaming build: i5-4670K, Mugen 4, Asrock Z97 Anniversary, MSI GTX 1660 Gaming X, 8GB 1866 RAM, Samsung 860 Evo 500GB, Crucial MX100 256GB, WD Red 2TB, Samsung DVD burner, Fractal Define R4, Antec True Quiet 140 (2 front + rear) case fans, Seasonic SSR-550FX. 35W idle, 45-55W video streaming, 170-200W WoW, 318W stress test (Prime95 + Furmark)

Pappnaas
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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Pappnaas » Thu Feb 14, 2013 11:17 pm

http://www.aone.co.uk/LI.asp?ProductID= ... ageID=6028


Image

Pretty cramped interior and 2 x 40mm case fans. Fanless cpu? Can't see enough airflow inside this case. Add a TV card and it will really get warm inside.

Vicotnik
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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Vicotnik » Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:29 am

Aren't there any external TV tuners? It's trivial to build a system with no moving parts, if no hot expansion cards are used. If you need hot stuff inside the case and want silent cooling, then a case that fits a 120mm fan somewhere is needed. Lots of heat, small size, silent. Pick two.
Main: ASRock B85M-ITX | i3-4330 | 16GB DDR3 | Intel 730 240GB | HDPLEX H1-S | picoPSU | No moving parts | Idle 13.9W
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Scrooge
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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Scrooge » Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:46 am

I know there's an external Ceton, so there are probably external version of more basic tuners as wel.

PeaceMachine
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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by PeaceMachine » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:08 pm

hauppauge.co.uk show external DVB-T and DVB-S cards
http://www.hauppauge.com/site/products/ ... r950q.html
but I would prefer to build a neat self contained unit with the cards inside.

arctic.ac have built a super slim HTPC (the MC001) with built-in DVB-T card
http://www.arctic.ac/en/p/living/entert ... 1-dvd.html
but, as I would rather enjoy building one rather than buying one, I thought that SPCR would be the place to come to find out how.

However, from the information provided here it looks like TV cards run hot and could "cook" the inside of a HTPC case. But then, on the other hand, maybe a look at which card Arctic use in their MC001 PC would be interesting - because one review of it shows it loaded up in a bench mark test and coming out the second coolest on test !

One point that seems to not be mentioned in replies is the advantage of not having a thick build-up of dust when you have a sealed system. Its OK putting in a slow moving 120mm fan, but it will still drag dust in and the layer of dust will insulate the MB and cards, significantly negating the benefit of the fan.

Just how hot do TV cards get - has anybody got a link to a comparison?

PeaceMachine
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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by PeaceMachine » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:17 pm

Thanks for the case suggestions - I'll look them up.

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by PeaceMachine » Fri Feb 15, 2013 4:19 pm

Vicotnik wrote:. . . . . .
Vicotnic your systems don't have fans, including your HTPC system:
Main system: Intel DH77DF | i5 3570K | 8GB DDR3 | Intel 520 120GB | Streacom FC8 | picoPSU | No moving parts | Idle 14.9W AC
HTPC: Asus F1A75-I Deluxe | A6-3500 | 4GB DDR3 | X25-M G2 80GB | Streacom FC8 | picoPSU | No moving parts | Idle 18W AC
Have you any cards inside either and if so which? Could I ask, what do you use your systems for?

Andrew.

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Vicotnik » Sat Feb 16, 2013 8:12 am

No, no expansion cards in the Streacom FC8s. My main system is actually a bit different from the system in my signature right now. I wanted to add a graphics card (a passive Sapphire HD 7750) so my main system is now air cooled in a different case. Two low speed fans. Still pretty much silent at idle though.
But I want to go back to all passive. Another DH77DF is on it's way, and an i3-3225. The fanless i3 system will be my main system, and the other my gaming system. With the Streacom FC8 and the i5 I had to underclock just a little or else the temps would be a little too high for my taste, I expect the i3 to run cool enough at stock speed though.

My main system is mainly used for office stuff, light gaming, internet. The HTPC for movies, music, light gaming, emulators. Usually not so heavy tasks, but I sometimes run heavy calculations on both my main system and my file server, so they are stressed from time to time.
Main: ASRock B85M-ITX | i3-4330 | 16GB DDR3 | Intel 730 240GB | HDPLEX H1-S | picoPSU | No moving parts | Idle 13.9W
HTPC: ASRock H81M-ITX | Pentium G3420 | 4GB DDR3 | Intel 535 120GB | HDPLEX H1-S | picoPSU | No moving parts | Idle 11.2W
Gaming: Intel DH77EB | i5-3570K | GTX 1060 6GB | 16GB DDR3 | TJ08-E | RM750X
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PeaceMachine
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Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by PeaceMachine » Sun Feb 17, 2013 5:08 am

Thanks Vicotnik and everybody else.

Well, I came to SPCR thinking I could enjoy myself building a fan free HTPC with a sound card and a TV tuner card - and I have been told that if I do this then the TV card will heat up the inside and cause problems, despite the fact that it will not be used for games.

I can't see the point of having fan noise, even low level fan noise, and I can't see the point of having all the internal dust associated with fans

I also can't see the point of having a USB tuner sticking out of the back.

I can not understand that on the one hand Arctic show a slim HTPC with a built-in tuner (above link) and on the other hand I get told on the SPCR that I need a fan.

I have emailed Arctic to make sure that their tuner is actually inside the case and if it is then I will know it can definitely be done, and then I suppose I will have to abandon my hope of finding out on the SPCR how to build one myself.

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Cistron » Sun Feb 17, 2013 6:25 am

PeaceMachine wrote:Thanks Vicotnik and everybody else.

Well, I came to SPCR thinking I could enjoy myself building a fan free HTPC with a sound card and a TV tuner card - and I have been told that if I do this then the TV card will heat up the inside and cause problems, despite the fact that it will not be used for games.

I can't see the point of having fan noise, even low level fan noise, and I can't see the point of having all the internal dust associated with fans

I also can't see the point of having a USB tuner sticking out of the back.

I can not understand that on the one hand Arctic show a slim HTPC with a built-in tuner (above link) and on the other hand I get told on the SPCR that I need a fan.

I have emailed Arctic to make sure that their tuner is actually inside the case and if it is then I will know it can definitely be done, and then I suppose I will have to abandon my hope of finding out on the SPCR how to build one myself.
I don't think anyone has denied that it could work. It just would be easier/better for component longevity to build the system with a slow-running fan. If you look at the main page reviews, you will see that some slowed fans can actually only be heard when you are within inches of them.

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Pappnaas » Sun Feb 17, 2013 8:12 am

PeaceMachine wrote:Well, I came to SPCR thinking I could enjoy myself building a fan free HTPC with a sound card and a TV tuner card - and I have been told that if I do this then the TV card will heat up the inside and cause problems, despite the fact that it will not be used for games.
That's because how TV reception works. Lots of frequency and stuff.
PeaceMachine wrote:I can't see the point of having fan noise, even low level fan noise, and I can't see the point of having all the internal dust associated with fans
Will you finally stop screaming at us by stop using bold format?
PeaceMachine wrote:I also can't see the point of having a USB tuner sticking out of the back.

I can not understand that on the one hand Arctic show a slim HTPC with a built-in tuner (above link) and on the other hand I get told on the SPCR that I need a fan.
That's probably because you do not know enough about how pcs are build and why they and how they work.
PeaceMachine wrote:I have emailed Arctic to make sure that their tuner is actually inside the case and if it is then I will know it can definitely be done, and then I suppose I will have to abandon my hope of finding out on the SPCR how to build one myself.
I'm deeply sorry for not having spend my free time to spoonfed you all i've learned about IT in the last 20 years.

We did tell you everything you asked for, but apparently you do feel mistreated and i can't understand your reaction.

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Vicotnik » Sun Feb 17, 2013 2:20 pm

PeaceMachine, it's not like you move a HTPC around a lot. It's not hard to hide an external little something so that it doesn't stick out and ruin the aesthetics. I would prefer an internal device as well; PCI/PCIe is better than USB. And it's of course possible to cool an internal TV tuner, but it may require a bit of tinkering. What part of the tuner card gets hot anyway? Is there a way to cool it? Large heatsink? Heatpipe to the side of the case? Sounds like a fun project to me. :) Get to work!
Main: ASRock B85M-ITX | i3-4330 | 16GB DDR3 | Intel 730 240GB | HDPLEX H1-S | picoPSU | No moving parts | Idle 13.9W
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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by PeaceMachine » Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:00 pm

Vicotnic, thanks for your reply. I have no experience with regard to which part of a TV tuner card gets hot, or if indeed it does get hot. That is why I originally thought the Streacom FC10 with its incorporated heat pipe CPU cooler would have been OK. My trouble is that I am a total beginner and have not got any experience so, since writing my last post, I have decided to see if the Arctic MC001 is a self contained fan free box and if it is I will probably buy one. At the price they are selling at I would be surprised if they don't soon start appearing in TV shops!
If the MC001 and similar will happily run a large TFT monitor then for many people there would be no reason to buy standard TV's anymore - it will be interesting to see what happens in the TV market from that respect.

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Vicotnik » Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:30 pm

You think monitors will replace TVs? I don't understand. What is a modern TV if not a big monitor?
Main: ASRock B85M-ITX | i3-4330 | 16GB DDR3 | Intel 730 240GB | HDPLEX H1-S | picoPSU | No moving parts | Idle 13.9W
HTPC: ASRock H81M-ITX | Pentium G3420 | 4GB DDR3 | Intel 535 120GB | HDPLEX H1-S | picoPSU | No moving parts | Idle 11.2W
Gaming: Intel DH77EB | i5-3570K | GTX 1060 6GB | 16GB DDR3 | TJ08-E | RM750X
Server: ASRock N3150-ITX | ~30TB | G-360 | Idle ~25W

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by PeaceMachine » Tue Feb 19, 2013 1:28 am

I don't think that monitors will replace TV's for everyone. But, if you are happy with, say, a 27" TV (sorry to use the silly " (inches) as a measurement) and you want a DVD or Blu-ray player then you might as well not bother buying a TV because if you bought an entertainment centre like the MC001 then you just need a TFT monitor and you don't need a TV - because the entertainment centre will do the TV, record TV, play audio CD's and will put internet on the screen so you can watch movies, Youtube and general internet stuff.

Another point: TV's are low resolution. Even 1080p doesn't come close to the resolution of a good monitor.

Just musing :)

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Cistron » Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:33 am

PeaceMachine wrote:Another point: TV's are low resolution. Even 1080p doesn't come close to the resolution of a good monitor.
I wouldn't call that low. My 22 incher certainly has less resolution, but is a fine work monitor. Besides, until 4k video material is widely available there no gain from a higher resolution regarding media consumption.

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Re: Large HTPC case - but will a fanless CPU cooler fit?

Post by Happy Hopping » Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:45 pm

Vicotnik wrote:No, no expansion cards in the Streacom FC8s. My main system is actually a bit different from the system in my signature right now. I wanted to add a graphics card (a passive Sapphire HD 7750)
what's the equivalent passive on the Nvidia side? as the closest 1 I can find is the Zotac 610 GT

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