Help with first build - Ncase M1
Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2016 6:30 pm
tl;dr: What parts should I get for my first PC build? Would like to use an Ncase M1 and use air cooling. Any advice would be appreciated!
Hi, I'm looking to put together my first PC. My priorities with the build are 1) Small; 2) Quiet; 3) Powerful, roughly in that order (though this isn't a "strict" ordering - all three are important). As I haven't done this before, it's safe to assume that I generally don't know what I'm doing Apologies for the large number of questions!
In terms of usage, 90% of the usage will be general productivity - web browsing, excel, powerpoint etc with some fairly heavy multitasking. It's quite normal for me to have 50-200 Chrome tabs open and some of the spreadsheets I work with are quite beastly (enough to choke my core i7 work computer). I looked at task manager a few times recently while working and my RAM usage seems to range between 6GB and 10GB. While I don't really game per se, and any gaming is pretty casual, I would like to have a PC that could game, and it would be nice to be able to play modern titles and have things look good. I do have an old 1080p screen lying around somewhere, but I am tempted to buy a nice new monitor (though I haven't really looked into this or thought about it). I would also like to be able to run at least 2 monitors - 3 would be nice (I use two 24-inch monitors at work and it would be tough to downgrade). While overclocking isn't something I'm seriously considering, as I assume it would mean a noisier PC given the small case I want to go with, I wouldn't mind having a motherboard and CPU that could be overclocked to have the option to fool around
I should note that this is more of a "want" project than a "need" project - the idea of building a PC has intrigued me for a while and PC/laptop fans drive me up the wall. My current laptop and work PC can realistically meet most of my needs (except being able to game), but I've decided to indulge myself.
The PC will sit on a desk near me, so I would like something small, that looks nice and is as quiet as possible. I'm not a particularly noise sensitive person, but I find loud computers quite bothersome. Ideally I would like 'silent' or close to it (to my ears) when not gaming (so 90%+ of the time) and pretty darn quiet while gaming (silent would be great).
I'm quite smitten by the Ncase M1 and would like to use that as a case. I do realize that this means a few big compromises: 1) its pretty darn expensive; 2) from the SPCR reviews it looks tough to silence; 3) apparently it has no manual, which doesn't sound great for someone who hasn't built a PC before. I did think about other cases and the Lian-Li Q10 seems like it would be a more sensible choice (though it does have more limited GPU options)... but I really like the Ncase M1 and I'm willing to deal with the fact that it may not be as quiet as other larger cases and it's going to cost me more. If the case choice is a really terrible idea I guess I could reconsider it.
In terms of budget, I'm naturally a cheapskate and like 'value for money' options. That being said, as this is an indulgence I'm pretty flexible with the budget. I was originally thinking $1k-$2k, though given the cost of the Ncase M1 I expect I'll end up in the $1.5k-$2k range. I live in Canada and everything costs more here + Canadian dollar is weak. In C$ terms, going above C$2.5k would make me wince.
I would strongly prefer an air-cooled PC. As a noob I have a fear that water cooled means one more thing to go wrong (a leak sounds like it would be a disaster) and I may travel with the PC at some point. Pumps also sound like they may be loud and it seems like water cooling may raise the noise level when not gaming (which is 90%+ of the time). That being said, if water-cooling (with an AIO) is the only way to silence the Ncase I guess I could do it.
Below are my thoughts on parts, any advice on parts or in general would be appreciated:
PCPartPicker part list: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/nyKBZ8
Price breakdown by merchant: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/nyKBZ8/by_merchant/
Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty Z170 Gaming-ITX/ac Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard ($245.00 @ Vuugo)
I have no idea about motherboards Any advice here would be great. I figured I'd go with Z170 as it could overclock. From looking at the various ITX z170 motherboards (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0) it seemed to be that this Asrock and the ASUS Z170i Pro Gaming looked to be the best ones. I looked for motherboards with M.2 SSD slot and eliminated Gigabyte boards as I saw here that they apparently have bad fan control. I picked the Asrock randomly (actually because it had a USB C port) but I saw here that Asus apparently has better fan control? I'm open to switching to the Asus if that's a better option.
CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($304.95 @ Vuugo)
I figured i5 might be the right balance. I don't know how much of a different HT would really add. The "K" processor seemed to be a $50 premium which didn't seem too unreasonable given the Z170 mobo. Apparently K processor doesn't draw much more power than non-K despite TDP. If heat is expected to be a serious issue I guess there is a 35W slower core i5 (6500T) but I'm assuming it shouldn't be an issue.
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-C14 CPU Cooler ($89.99 @ Memory Express)
Hardforum users seem to say that this is the best air cooler for the Ncase so I picked it. I saw here that the fans on this are '3 pin' fans that need to be undervolted vs the '4 pin' 'PWM' fans on newer coolers. I assume this means these fans are more of a pain to control? If so could I buy a 4 pin fan to use with this? Which fan would you recommend? I assume swapping fans should be pretty easy?
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-2133 Memory ($143.98 @ Newegg Canada)
I just picked the cheapest RAM I could find =P I suppose 16GB would be more sensible
Storage: Sandisk X400 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($309.00 @ Canada Computers)
I'm quite undecided here. I don't have large amounts of media so I could live with 512GB. Below are the options as I see it:
1) Get the cheapest possible ~512GB SSD. However, I know crappy flash drives can be MUCH slower than good ones so I wonder if there is a similar risk with getting a cheap SSD? There's a 480 GB Mushkin for C$135
2) Get a brand I know ~512GB SSD. Sandisk X400 seems like a reasonable midrange SSD? Maybe this guarantees reasonable performance? Or would I not notice a difference over a cheap SSD? C$168 for it.
3) Everyone likes Samsung EVO 850. Would this have a noticable performance gain over the X400? Worth the extra C$50? Price is C$210
4) Get Samsung SM961 (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/sam ... ,4608.html). This is apparently the best consumer SSD around (NVMe etc) and in theory is super fast. Would one notice the difference over the EVO 850? I would guess the theoretical performance gain this has over the EVO 850 is probably more than the EVO 850 over the X400. Probably about a C$115 premium over the EVO 850. ~C$325 (converting RAMcity prices)
5) If the performance gains won't have a major real world impact, then maybe its worth spending extra money on more capacity instead. 1TB prices:
- A-Data SP550 Premier C$270
- Sandisk X400 C$310
- Samsung EVO 850 C$400
- Samsung SM961 ~C$645
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 1060 6GB GAMING Video Card
GTX 1060 seemed to be low power high performance at a not too unreasonable price. I like that many of the cards are passive at low temps. The MSI Gaming one seemed to be the quietest but sadly apparently it doesn't appear to fit in the Ncase. The ASUS STRIX 1060 sounds like it does just about fit but its price seems nuts! Apparently the EVGA has a firmware update that makes it semi-passive? Am I being too optimistic in hoping the EVGA will be quiet at load? It only has one fan. Does the fact that it is a small PCB affect heat/noise (i.e. would a smaller PCB heat up more than a big one)? If EVGA will likely be noisy, would it be better to pay the premium and get a ASUS Strix or is it better to buy the cheapest 1060 and put an aftermarket cooler on it? Something like the Arctic Accelero Extreme 3 (or 4 though I doubt the backplate woudl fit)? I assume I would need a full size PCB for this. If this, then should one replace the fans with quieter fans (if so which?)? Can one set up the fans to turn on with GPU temperature? Or is this air cooled approach likely to fail and should I go with the Arctic Accelero Hybrid the AIO used in the Ncase SPCR build)? For this one does size of PCB matter (can I stick to the short EVGA card to have more room for PSU)? Any views on Hybrid version 2 vs 3? Should I replace the fan on the hybrid with a quieter one (if so which one?)?
EVGA 1060 Gaming (mini, not OC): C$350
ASUS STRIX 1060 (not OC): C$420
Gigabyte GTX 1070 Mini: C$540
I realise advice here is probably mostly guesswork but your guesses are far more likely to make sense than mine. I don't know a VRAM from a VRM and I didn't know either of them heated up before reading the Ncase build article.
Power Supply: Silverstone 700W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply
Picked this because fan in this seems to stay off for longer than other SFX PSUs. However, this is SFX-L so is apparently a very tight fit with long graphics cards (like ASUS Strix). with EVGA short card I assume won't be an issue. Silverstone and Corsair both make regular SFX PSUs which are cheaper but I've seen people complain on forums about noise issues and the fans rarely being passive. One risk with this PSU is apparently the fan goes on based on load, so if the case heats up but PC is on low load then PSU can overheat and turn off. I'm hoping that won't be an issue as hopefully the cooling in the case will be reasonable.
Case Fan: Noctua NF-S12A PWM 120mm Fan ($22.99 @ Amazon Canada)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-S12A PWM 120mm Fan ($22.99 @ Amazon Canada)
These are placeholders as I have no idea what fans to buy. I picked these fans randomly (and apparently they are too weak). The Ncase SPCR build used 3 different fans and listed 5 others as alternatives (though I get that the radiator fan is probably a different type than a case fan). I would have assumed that there would have been a consensus view on what the best case fan to get would be?
Thanks and sorry for the long post!
Hi, I'm looking to put together my first PC. My priorities with the build are 1) Small; 2) Quiet; 3) Powerful, roughly in that order (though this isn't a "strict" ordering - all three are important). As I haven't done this before, it's safe to assume that I generally don't know what I'm doing Apologies for the large number of questions!
In terms of usage, 90% of the usage will be general productivity - web browsing, excel, powerpoint etc with some fairly heavy multitasking. It's quite normal for me to have 50-200 Chrome tabs open and some of the spreadsheets I work with are quite beastly (enough to choke my core i7 work computer). I looked at task manager a few times recently while working and my RAM usage seems to range between 6GB and 10GB. While I don't really game per se, and any gaming is pretty casual, I would like to have a PC that could game, and it would be nice to be able to play modern titles and have things look good. I do have an old 1080p screen lying around somewhere, but I am tempted to buy a nice new monitor (though I haven't really looked into this or thought about it). I would also like to be able to run at least 2 monitors - 3 would be nice (I use two 24-inch monitors at work and it would be tough to downgrade). While overclocking isn't something I'm seriously considering, as I assume it would mean a noisier PC given the small case I want to go with, I wouldn't mind having a motherboard and CPU that could be overclocked to have the option to fool around
I should note that this is more of a "want" project than a "need" project - the idea of building a PC has intrigued me for a while and PC/laptop fans drive me up the wall. My current laptop and work PC can realistically meet most of my needs (except being able to game), but I've decided to indulge myself.
The PC will sit on a desk near me, so I would like something small, that looks nice and is as quiet as possible. I'm not a particularly noise sensitive person, but I find loud computers quite bothersome. Ideally I would like 'silent' or close to it (to my ears) when not gaming (so 90%+ of the time) and pretty darn quiet while gaming (silent would be great).
I'm quite smitten by the Ncase M1 and would like to use that as a case. I do realize that this means a few big compromises: 1) its pretty darn expensive; 2) from the SPCR reviews it looks tough to silence; 3) apparently it has no manual, which doesn't sound great for someone who hasn't built a PC before. I did think about other cases and the Lian-Li Q10 seems like it would be a more sensible choice (though it does have more limited GPU options)... but I really like the Ncase M1 and I'm willing to deal with the fact that it may not be as quiet as other larger cases and it's going to cost me more. If the case choice is a really terrible idea I guess I could reconsider it.
In terms of budget, I'm naturally a cheapskate and like 'value for money' options. That being said, as this is an indulgence I'm pretty flexible with the budget. I was originally thinking $1k-$2k, though given the cost of the Ncase M1 I expect I'll end up in the $1.5k-$2k range. I live in Canada and everything costs more here + Canadian dollar is weak. In C$ terms, going above C$2.5k would make me wince.
I would strongly prefer an air-cooled PC. As a noob I have a fear that water cooled means one more thing to go wrong (a leak sounds like it would be a disaster) and I may travel with the PC at some point. Pumps also sound like they may be loud and it seems like water cooling may raise the noise level when not gaming (which is 90%+ of the time). That being said, if water-cooling (with an AIO) is the only way to silence the Ncase I guess I could do it.
Below are my thoughts on parts, any advice on parts or in general would be appreciated:
PCPartPicker part list: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/nyKBZ8
Price breakdown by merchant: http://ca.pcpartpicker.com/list/nyKBZ8/by_merchant/
Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty Z170 Gaming-ITX/ac Mini ITX LGA1151 Motherboard ($245.00 @ Vuugo)
I have no idea about motherboards Any advice here would be great. I figured I'd go with Z170 as it could overclock. From looking at the various ITX z170 motherboards (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0) it seemed to be that this Asrock and the ASUS Z170i Pro Gaming looked to be the best ones. I looked for motherboards with M.2 SSD slot and eliminated Gigabyte boards as I saw here that they apparently have bad fan control. I picked the Asrock randomly (actually because it had a USB C port) but I saw here that Asus apparently has better fan control? I'm open to switching to the Asus if that's a better option.
CPU: Intel Core i5-6600K 3.5GHz Quad-Core Processor ($304.95 @ Vuugo)
I figured i5 might be the right balance. I don't know how much of a different HT would really add. The "K" processor seemed to be a $50 premium which didn't seem too unreasonable given the Z170 mobo. Apparently K processor doesn't draw much more power than non-K despite TDP. If heat is expected to be a serious issue I guess there is a 35W slower core i5 (6500T) but I'm assuming it shouldn't be an issue.
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-C14 CPU Cooler ($89.99 @ Memory Express)
Hardforum users seem to say that this is the best air cooler for the Ncase so I picked it. I saw here that the fans on this are '3 pin' fans that need to be undervolted vs the '4 pin' 'PWM' fans on newer coolers. I assume this means these fans are more of a pain to control? If so could I buy a 4 pin fan to use with this? Which fan would you recommend? I assume swapping fans should be pretty easy?
Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4-2133 Memory ($143.98 @ Newegg Canada)
I just picked the cheapest RAM I could find =P I suppose 16GB would be more sensible
Storage: Sandisk X400 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($309.00 @ Canada Computers)
I'm quite undecided here. I don't have large amounts of media so I could live with 512GB. Below are the options as I see it:
1) Get the cheapest possible ~512GB SSD. However, I know crappy flash drives can be MUCH slower than good ones so I wonder if there is a similar risk with getting a cheap SSD? There's a 480 GB Mushkin for C$135
2) Get a brand I know ~512GB SSD. Sandisk X400 seems like a reasonable midrange SSD? Maybe this guarantees reasonable performance? Or would I not notice a difference over a cheap SSD? C$168 for it.
3) Everyone likes Samsung EVO 850. Would this have a noticable performance gain over the X400? Worth the extra C$50? Price is C$210
4) Get Samsung SM961 (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/sam ... ,4608.html). This is apparently the best consumer SSD around (NVMe etc) and in theory is super fast. Would one notice the difference over the EVO 850? I would guess the theoretical performance gain this has over the EVO 850 is probably more than the EVO 850 over the X400. Probably about a C$115 premium over the EVO 850. ~C$325 (converting RAMcity prices)
5) If the performance gains won't have a major real world impact, then maybe its worth spending extra money on more capacity instead. 1TB prices:
- A-Data SP550 Premier C$270
- Sandisk X400 C$310
- Samsung EVO 850 C$400
- Samsung SM961 ~C$645
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 1060 6GB GAMING Video Card
GTX 1060 seemed to be low power high performance at a not too unreasonable price. I like that many of the cards are passive at low temps. The MSI Gaming one seemed to be the quietest but sadly apparently it doesn't appear to fit in the Ncase. The ASUS STRIX 1060 sounds like it does just about fit but its price seems nuts! Apparently the EVGA has a firmware update that makes it semi-passive? Am I being too optimistic in hoping the EVGA will be quiet at load? It only has one fan. Does the fact that it is a small PCB affect heat/noise (i.e. would a smaller PCB heat up more than a big one)? If EVGA will likely be noisy, would it be better to pay the premium and get a ASUS Strix or is it better to buy the cheapest 1060 and put an aftermarket cooler on it? Something like the Arctic Accelero Extreme 3 (or 4 though I doubt the backplate woudl fit)? I assume I would need a full size PCB for this. If this, then should one replace the fans with quieter fans (if so which?)? Can one set up the fans to turn on with GPU temperature? Or is this air cooled approach likely to fail and should I go with the Arctic Accelero Hybrid the AIO used in the Ncase SPCR build)? For this one does size of PCB matter (can I stick to the short EVGA card to have more room for PSU)? Any views on Hybrid version 2 vs 3? Should I replace the fan on the hybrid with a quieter one (if so which one?)?
EVGA 1060 Gaming (mini, not OC): C$350
ASUS STRIX 1060 (not OC): C$420
Gigabyte GTX 1070 Mini: C$540
I realise advice here is probably mostly guesswork but your guesses are far more likely to make sense than mine. I don't know a VRAM from a VRM and I didn't know either of them heated up before reading the Ncase build article.
Power Supply: Silverstone 700W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully-Modular SFX Power Supply
Picked this because fan in this seems to stay off for longer than other SFX PSUs. However, this is SFX-L so is apparently a very tight fit with long graphics cards (like ASUS Strix). with EVGA short card I assume won't be an issue. Silverstone and Corsair both make regular SFX PSUs which are cheaper but I've seen people complain on forums about noise issues and the fans rarely being passive. One risk with this PSU is apparently the fan goes on based on load, so if the case heats up but PC is on low load then PSU can overheat and turn off. I'm hoping that won't be an issue as hopefully the cooling in the case will be reasonable.
Case Fan: Noctua NF-S12A PWM 120mm Fan ($22.99 @ Amazon Canada)
Case Fan: Noctua NF-S12A PWM 120mm Fan ($22.99 @ Amazon Canada)
These are placeholders as I have no idea what fans to buy. I picked these fans randomly (and apparently they are too weak). The Ncase SPCR build used 3 different fans and listed 5 others as alternatives (though I get that the radiator fan is probably a different type than a case fan). I would have assumed that there would have been a consensus view on what the best case fan to get would be?
Thanks and sorry for the long post!