in NSK2400: asus 8600GT Silent or gigabyte 8600GT passive??

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Thu May 31, 2007 4:18 am

Hi again,

I've made my decision on building a ÂµATX system in the Antec NSK2400 case. I'm about to order the case and a VGA card, but I can't decide between the gigabyte 8600GT passive and the asus EN8600GT passive.

- The ASUS card needs two slots! Okay, I don't care I won't be using more than 1 PCI slot.DOES IT FIT into the SNK2400 case? Or onto this asrock s478 motherboard?
- I can't find reviews of the asus one. Which one runs hotter?

The calculated difference in price doesn't matter, they're both +/- â‚¬130 where I live. It's only a matter of choosing the right one

Help? Thanks!

klankymen · Post by **klankymen** » Thu May 31, 2007 4:20 am

I'm pretty sure the gigabyte doesn't even fit, only the asus.

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Thu May 31, 2007 4:29 am

Why would you think that? I'd rather say the asus doesn't fit, because it requires 2 slots?

But yeah, the gigabyte seems to be a bit HIGHER than the asus one

GIGABYTE

ASUS

I can't find any reviews of the asus one, weirdly enough....

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Thu May 31, 2007 4:51 am

Okay, here's a picture I took from the ÂµATX mobo and the setup.
This is my biggest fear with the asus 2slot video card: those transistors between the PCI-E and the first PCI slot have the same height as the PCI-E slot, meaning there can't be a piece of the passively cooled card in between there.

This pic makes it clear:

Is this normal and okay, or does this mean the ASUS one and other 2slot VGA cards won't fit either?

Height transistors: 11 mm
spacing between PCI-E and PCI: 10 mm

[Mod comment: those are capacitors.]

klankymen · Post by **klankymen** » Thu May 31, 2007 5:32 am

jefklak wrote:Why would you think that? I'd rather say the asus doesn't fit, because it requires 2 slots?

well obviously, you could use an addtional pci-card with the gigabyte. but the thing is you can't close the case lid, unless you saw a slot in the top for the heatpipe to hang out of.

yet I've never tested this, so I can't guarantee it won't fit in, but it looks to me as if it's too high.

EDIT: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductRe ... 6814125061
9th review says it doesn't fit.

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Thu May 31, 2007 5:50 am

Thanks for that.
I also read the other thread about the fusion case (which is the same as this one)

the ASUS fits as you can see in this picture, the heatpipes are at least a CM above the PCI-E conntector pins (thankfully)

Edit: well heh, I've gone ahead and ordered the case and the asus card

Thanks for the reply!

openwheelformula1 · Post by **openwheelformula1** » Thu May 31, 2007 10:05 am

For a HTPC, why would you choose the Gigabyte? It's not HDCP compliant. The Asus is.

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Thu May 31, 2007 10:27 am

No HTPC. Just my computer.
I chose for this case because it creates a lot of space

smithers · Post by **smithers** » Tue Jun 05, 2007 10:33 pm

Some further info on performance and temps for the Asus 8600GT Silent in the other thread here, incase anyone is googling this -

viewtopic.php?p=345802#345802

Oh and, "Yes, it will fit in a Fusion / NSK2400"

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 1:10 pm

Case and video card arrived & assembled today

MAJOR PROBLEM WITH HEATSINK: it's facing the wrong direction:

As you can see, the card itself blocks all the fan flow from/to the massive heatsink. And right now, my other 2 PCI slots aren't even used yet. this overheats the card: after playing age of empires 3 for ONLY 10 minutes, different benchmark tools show a GPU temperature of 91Â°C! Not good, I didn't even overclock or so.

Current stupid solution: placing a 60mm fan directly onto the heatpipe. This requires ANOTHER PCI slot to be used, so I only have 1 left (and it's only a couple of mm)! It's rather ridiculous. But with the extra fan, games play at 60Â° not overclocked, wchich is fairly good.

klankymen · Post by **klankymen** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:31 pm

see what happens if you tape of the whole rear intake (above the motherboard I/O panel) and open the 2 free pci slots so the air comes in from below the card and blows over it....

bad news for me since I just ordered the same video card for the same case (it's called NSK by the way, not SNK), hope I have better luck....

openwheelformula1 · Post by **openwheelformula1** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 6:44 pm

It looks good to me. Keep a negative airflow and close the case. Let the design of the heatsink do it's business.

smithers · Post by **smithers** » Wed Jun 06, 2007 11:00 pm

Your pic doesn't look anything unusual.

Pic below of my Fusion case with (left to right) Abit PCI-E x1 wi-fi, Dlink PCI wi-fi and the Asus 8600GT Silent. Double and triple checked my temps in RivaTuner, the 8600GT is idling at 49-51c, 65-68c under gaming load.

http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ebay003wz1.jpg

Speedfan lists ambient temp about 28-30, CPU temp with my old Arctic Freezer 64 Pro minus it's fan shoehorned in is 32-34c on idle/light use (web browsing etc).

Oh, one final relevant point since this is a global board - I'm in Scotland, our 'summer' is typically 20-25c... last few days it's been about 16-17c, so if you are somewhere much hotter with that NSK2400, maybe that's the prob? Or maybe you've a faulty card?

Think my heatsink needs a dust going by that picture <tsk>

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 12:04 am

I don't get it... And you have PCI slots used next to the heatsink, which I don't
Does this mean my card has gone "bad"? Should I ask for a replacement?
It's 25,5Â°C in my room in Belgium at the moment, outside it's quite hot.
But nothing extraordinary...

Klankymen: those free slots are already open!
I'll try measuring the temp. with rivatuner and edit this post here.
Edit: Yup, rivatunes gives me the same values as my initial findings. +88 load, 70 idle.

Edit2: I checked the cooling pasta, it seems to be where it needs to be...

Edit3: Placed the card inside another case (very large tower, very good cooling and flow)
Result: EXACTLY the same temps. 70min idle.

smithers · Post by **smithers** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 1:24 pm

In the other tower, I assume it's a different motherboard/cpu?

I can't believe that 7 degrees or so hotter room temp would make the gpu idle jump 20degrees from mine, so unless one of the other guys here has a (more informed) opinion, it may be worth getting a replacement.

Post by **NeilBlanchard** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 3:45 pm

Hello,

For a video card, those are ordinary temps. The card is designed for a case with negative pressure, to pull cooler outside air over the heatsink through the rear opening.

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Fri Jun 08, 2007 1:35 am

smithers: Yes ineed, a pentium core duo, I have a Pentium 4.

I sent the card back to the retailer after contacting them about it. They said they'll send a replacement. The shipping costs are on my account, unfortunately, but better a good vga card than a too hot one...

NeilBlanchard: I know GPU temps are a lot hotter than CPU ones. A friend of mine has a 8800GTS running at 82Â° under load. My card easily beats that temp, running +90 only after 10min of gaming. I won't call that ordinary, that's a little over the top... Especially considering smithers' statistics, since he has the same case and card!

andru_nl · Post by **andru_nl** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 10:53 am

I have just bought asus 8600 gt silent, it's idling at 75 and full load 105. I am going to return it.
The heatsink is a joke. It would work with a fan, otherwise it requires a sophisticated 200$ case for it's operation.
It's much cheaper to buy a 8600gt with a fan and replace it with Accelero.

Thanks for the link btw, smithers.

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 1:14 pm

I got a replacement and the result IS STILL THE SAME!
I was very angry and upset with this at first, but decided to do something about it myself...

andru_nl: I partially fixed the "problem" by manually removing the heatskink from the GPU and the card. The cooling pasta used while manufactering the product is a big mess. I removed everything, cleaned it up, used new and good pasta, rejoined both parts and retried it. Result: -15Â°C, but still (too) hot at load.

with 90mm fan aimed at the heatsink as test (not next to it, 5cm away from it)
> original cooling pasta: Ilde 56Â°C, Load 76Â°C
> new cooling pasta: Idle 47Â°C, Load 60Â°C

without 90mm fan
> original cooling pasta: Idle 71Â°C, Load 92Â°C
> new cooling pasta: Idle 56Â°C, Load 76Â°C

I noticed without the fan, from load to idle takes ages - too cool down the GPU. Of course, since there's no airflow to drive away the heat. Also, the PCI card next to the heatsink without the fan was EXTREMELY hot, my poor poor TV card. I really hope the thing still works as these cards aren't designed to take that much heat (yes, even 76Â°).

So far wasting $20 shipping costs... Good deal ASUS.

klankymen · Post by **klankymen** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:57 am

heres a question: Is your case open or closed? because if its open, your card is going to get very hot. make sure its closed.

jefklak · Post by **jefklak** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 4:58 am

I indeed tested it with open case, because my 2 120mm nexus fans to take care of the air in-outtake have not arrived yet, and there is no other fan active besides the CPU and the test fan.

klankymen · Post by **klankymen** » Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:10 am

then its no wonder. my card hits over 70 at idle with an open case. the logic behind this should be obvious, the card needs air flowing over it. why dont you, just for testing purposes, reinstall the antec fans (theyre fairly bearable at low speed) and try closing the case. your card will run colder under load than it idles now I would suspect.

P220ST · Post by **P220ST** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 7:59 am

jefklak wrote:MAJOR PROBLEM WITH HEATSINK: it's facing the wrong direction.

This being my first post, feel free to flog the skin off my back but I have almost the same query as the one discussed in this thread. But first, when I saw this, it reminded me of how confused I get when I listen to manufacturers articulate their newest innovations re heat. Competing silent 8600GTS developers have Asus using its Heatpipe X3 to swivel the heat toward the air-flow of the CPU fan, wheras Gigabyte has their Silent-pipe III taking the heat off of the graphics card and placing it elsewhere.

This is what gets me all mixed up. They discuss heat like it was a thing, a bag of marbles that you can take from here and move to there. I realize these design dudes are engineers and have likely forgotten more physics than I know, but as long as you maintain the air-pressure inside your chassis negative relative to the air-pressure outside of it, shouldn't you be fine regardless of the direction your heat sink is oriented? I'm not being rhetorical here; this confuses the heck out of me. I mean, if my computer's all closed up and I feel warm air blowing on my hand, isn't everything (heat-wise) going the way I want it to? Assuming I didn't screw my hand shut inside the case somehow

. He man, some of us are great with tools; others (me) hire computer builders.

Which brings me the long way 'round the horn to my dilemma. Same cards, different case: I have the CoolerMaster Wave Master TAC-T01 and the moderator won't let me post a picture of it, but just flank "coolermaster" with www and dot-com and you're there - the direct link is like 4000 characters long. Just so you know, I spent the past ten minutes manually removing the links and pictures from this post. BasicallyI am trying to decide between the same two cards as jefklak: Asus or Gigabyte's version of the passive 8600GT.

Does anyone have experience with this case/card combo? Long story, but it involves a fire, a divorce, a cat named Abigail and the game Texas Hold 'Em. And my computer is in pieces on a workbench 3000 miles away from me sooo

. . . I'm doing a lot of Q&A/research by remote. My gear list follows my signature. Should it look familiar and you have some thoughts, please let me know.

Either way, thanks for taking the time to read my first post!

Take Care,
-P220ST

GEAR LIST
CoolerMaster WaveMaster TAC-T01 Mid-Tower, Intel D975XBX2KR "Bad Axe 2" Mobo, Thermaltake Toughpower 750W W0117RU Power, IntelÂ® Coreâ„¢2 Duo E6600 2.4GHz Desktop Processor, Corsair 4GB [2(2 x 1GB kit)] VS2GBKIT667D2 5300 DDR2 SDRAM, passive 8600GT Graphics Card, Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS Platinum Pro External sound card, PreSonus Firebox Firewire audio interface/sound card recording system, 4 Seagate 320GB 7200.10 16MB cache HDDs, Seagate ST3500601XS-RK eSATA 500-GB External Hard Drive. Zalman CNPS9700 NT CPU Cooler/3+1 Zalman ZM-F1 Fans.

Mikey · Post by **Mikey** » Wed Jun 20, 2007 4:20 pm

klankymen wrote:then its no wonder. my card hits over 70 at idle with an open case. the logic behind this should be obvious, the card needs air flowing over it. why dont you, just for testing purposes, reinstall the antec fans (theyre fairly bearable at low speed) and try closing the case. your card will run colder under load than it idles now I would suspect.

Sounds like you've hit the nail on the head, running a passive card with no airflow is always going to get hot.

Bugsi · Post by **Bugsi** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 4:26 pm

For those that say the MSI NX8600GT-T2D256EZ doesn't fit, I have this exact card in my NSK2400 with Asus M2NPV-VM motherboard, and it fits. The tops of the heat pipes that curve over to the backside of the card do touch the underside of the case lid, but it FITS. It also runs fine. The heatsink radiator on the backside puts it in the airflow path from the back of the case to the two fans on the side, *and* it keeps the adjacent PCI slots available. It does block the PCIe 1x slot under the heatsink radiator.

There might be some variation from card to card on how high the copper heat pipes rise over the top of the card. Also, there is some "give" to the height, as the radiator is not physically attached underneath, so it can be nudged down a millimeter or so if need be.

Not sure about HDCP support with this card tho. Dual DVI output, no HDMI.

Sizzle · Post by **Sizzle** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:47 pm

There is also the XFX Force 8600GT

http://www.xfxforce.com/web/product/lis ... Id=1162176

Bugsi · Post by **Bugsi** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:30 pm

Sizzle wrote:There is also the XFX Force 8600GT

http://www.xfxforce.com/web/product/lis ... Id=1162176

Do you know if that actually fits? The radiator on that model appears to extend much higher over the top of the card, and doesn't look like it will fit in an Antec Fusion / NSK2400.

CoolColJ · Post by **CoolColJ** » Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:31 pm

MSI passive 8600gt has the heatsink on the top of the card

vernonion · Post by **vernonion** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 2:19 pm

I have the NSK2400 with the EVGA 8800GS 640. This card has a fan that runs at 65% at default speed and at that it is nearly silent. My mobo is the MSI K8NGM2-FID and I have a TV Wonder tuner card. I had a couple of issues with this setup first being heat and second noise. I have solved the heat issue by switching to sata drives and routing my cabling away form the hole nearest the upper corner of the vid card and running it through the hole under the optical drive. That opened up some flow area but it is still pretty tight between the vid card and the tuner card but there is no help for that. The next thing is that the vid card was exhausting out the back and the case fans were pulling the heat right back in and heating up my CPU, so I turned the case fans around to blow in and immediatly saw a decrease in CPU temp of about 3 deg. C.
I have a dual core AMD 4400 that had the stock heatpipe type cooler but it created a resonant hum whenever the case cover was on so I changed it out for a Thermaltake Blue Orb II cooler and not only did I eliminate the hum I saw another 2 deg C. decrease in temps.
I could make this machine nearly silent by using speedfan but I Fold 24/7 and I am quite happy with the current settings.
Hope this helps some one else.

Max Slowik · Post by **Max Slowik** » Fri Jul 20, 2007 2:51 pm

Why don't you open the unused PCI slots (I think they already are) tape closed the opening above the motherboard's I/O plate, and force all the air coming in past the video card? Your CPU temperatures will climb a little, but it's probably going to be an overall improvement.

Also, even if the card is running at 90 degrees, as long as it's not crashing, you don't actually have a problem.