Quest for quiet + fast gaming system

trenchdiggerr · Post by **trenchdiggerr** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 9:46 am

Hey all,

I'm looking to build a new high performance gaming rig, and want to make it as quiet as possible. The basis for the system will be a Athlon64 3800+ (socket 939) and a GeForce 6800GT. Note that I'm not looking to overclock, just to get some good high performance equipment and run it quietly at stock speeds. Here's my measure of "quiet" - the computer will be on the floor under my desk in an ATX mid-tower case, top/front of the case about 30 inches from my ears, and ideally I don't want to hear it running.

First I looked into using quiet aircooling equipment. Seems I could silence the CPU fairly well with a massive HSF like a Zalman 7000-A Cu. However the 6800GT looks like a much more difficult problem. The stock 6800GT fan, while not deafening, is far from silent. And the early reviews of the new Arctic Cooling 6800 replacement cooler say that it is definitely quieter than the stock fan, but still audible. I have a Radeon 9800Pro now with stock fan, and it is much louder than what I'm looking for. It seems that high performance 3D and "quiet computing" just can't be done together with air cooling. (Or am I mistaken?)

So now I'm looking into liquid cooling. But in addition to quietness, I am looking for compactness and portability, so I'm not interested in a passive system like the Reserator, or a dedicated cooling case with huge radiators and pumps. After much investigation, here is the setup I am considering:

+ C-systems CSP750 Mark II pump (quiet, small, decent head and flow)
+ Swiftech MCW6002 CPU water block (excellent cooling even at low flow rates)
+ Swiftech MCW50 VGA water block w/6800 adapter (low flow resistance)
+ D-Tek ProCore heater core with shroud (discontinued, but I found it online), located at front case vent
+ Quiet 120mm fan (TBD) sucking fresh air into the case through heater core and shroud
+ No reservoir, just a T-line to fill and bleed
+ 1/2" Clearflex tubing throughout
+ Fluid XP+ as coolant (for corrosion and critter resistance)

My big question is - will I be able to run the heater core fan slowly enough for a quiet computer (by my definition above)? Again, I am not an extreme overclocker and don't need CPU temps of 25*C at full load. I am very willing to let the temps get into the higher end of the acceptable range, in exchange for quietness.

Another thought - I could air cool the CPU with a Zalman 7000-A Cu, and water cool the GPU only. Seems like this would allow for slower heater core fan speeds and an overall quieter system.

Thoughts? Criticisms? Appreciate the help!

Steve

Edit: corrected mini-tower to mid-tower

Blackeagle · Post by **Blackeagle** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:52 am

First thing I see with your planned for set up is that you want a mini-ATX case. Not exactly a top choice for a water rig.

I've a Antec midtower BQE3700 case with a planned water loop for both the CPU & GPU on the way.
I can't guess how I'd get it into a mini case.

My planned loop.

Pump 50Z from Cooltechnia
CPU block TDX from Danger Den
GPU block Fusion HL from Best PC mods
Thermochill 120.1 rad from Danger Den
Fan Evercool 120 80cfm with advertised 30dba

Now my choice of fan isn't what you'll want, not a issue to me, but you'll hear it some as a sort of whoosh sounding noise.

The 3700 case has 120mm front intake and rear exhaust locations in it. I've 120mm fans in both. I'm removing the hard drive cage and will put my HD in a 5.25" bay. Bolt the rad to the normal fan location then a Evercool fan in a pull configuration. Pump will set just inside the rad fan between the rad fan and motherboard location. Routiing will be Pump=>Rad=>CPU=>GPU=>Pump.

My hardware:
Motherboard DFI Infinity Ultra 400 NF2
CPU XP-M-2600 which uses only 1.45v
GPU is a 9800 Pro with 128 of memory
NB is cooled with a Swiftech 159, this isn't going to change.

I expect that I'll gain at least a 3/4+ drop in noise when I get the new cooling in. CPU is now cooled with a Thermaltake pipe 101 with a Tt streetfighter fan & GPU has a Vantec Pro 4 copper cooler. The CPU fan is the majore noise maker, drowns out everything else pretty much.

As you are concerned about noise reduction over temps and speed I'd suggest you should give some thought to the Black Ice Pro rad. Much smaller and easier to locate in a tight case. It's also a lot thinner and will offer much lower resistence to a low CFM/noise fan on the air side. This rad should be able to keep your system under 45C at load, even if you change your mind and do a mild O/C.

You've a great rig planned there man!

Blackeagle · Post by **Blackeagle** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:58 am

Thick heater cores work very well with fans that offer a high enough pressure rate, which no low noise fan does. You'll be better off with a smaller rad, which isn't so good on the water side, but will work far better with a low pressure/noise fan on the air side.

It's all a balancing act.

You may also wish to look into Danger Dens newest WB for the 6800 card. It cools not only the GPU, but also the cards 8 memory chips with water. That's the nice thing with the 6800, all the memory is on the same side as the GPU. Only down side to this water cooler for the whole 6800 card is it's price, it's expensive.

Best of luck.

jamesavery22 · Post by **jamesavery22** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 12:54 pm

Blackeagle wrote:Thick heater cores work very well with fans that offer a high enough pressure rate, which no low noise fan does. You'll be better off with a smaller rad, which isn't so good on the water side, but will work far better with a low pressure/noise fan on the air side.

It's all a balancing act.

You may also wish to look into Danger Dens newest WB for the 6800 card. It cools not only the GPU, but also the cards 8 memory chips with water. That's the nice thing with the 6800, all the memory is on the same side as the GPU. Only down side to this water cooler for the whole 6800 card is it's price, it's expensive.

Best of luck.

fedco 2-770 H (without ends) 9.188 (width)6.875 (depth)1.625

Thinest single pass I know of. Doesnt have to be smaller, just thinner as you said.
Can easily fit two slow 120s on there and get a good C/W

If you find a place that sells it lemme know cause Id like to get my hands on a few

1911user · Post by **1911user** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 1:32 pm

trenchdiggerr,

I would suggest using 3/8ID tubing throughout the system; it will route easier and flow plenty of water for cooling. That would change the cpu block to a mcw6000. The heatercore you've identified will work well enough especially for a cramped case.

The easy way would be to use 3/8ID 1/2OD tubing with 3/8OD barbs on the heatercore, T-fitting, and pump. That'll route nicely at the expense of slightly restricted barbs.

The interesting way would be to use 2 types of tubing: 3/8ID 1/2OD for connections to the GPU block and 3/8ID 5/8OD for the rest. The thicker wall tubing can be heated and pushed onto 1/2OD barbs and that maintains a true 3/8ID flow passage. Use 1/2OD barbs for the heatercore, T-fitting, and the pump inlet. Route the system pump-gpu-cpu-heatercore-T-pump and it would work well. No adapters would be required for either block and that also helps routing.

trenchdiggerr · Post by **trenchdiggerr** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 7:36 pm

1911user wrote:I would suggest using 3/8ID tubing throughout the system; it will route easier and flow plenty of water for cooling.

1911user,

Thanks for the info. Since this is my first WC setup and I have no experience yet handling tubing, I'm not sure I know what you mean when you say 3/8ID tubing would route better. Are you suggesting that the 1/2ID tubing would be too stiff and bulky to route in a small case? Since 1/2ID tubing would flow better than 3/8ID tubing, I can't think of any other reason to use the 3/8 aside from usability.

trenchdiggerr · Post by **trenchdiggerr** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 7:45 pm

Blackeagle wrote:First thing I see with your planned for set up is that you want a mini-ATX case. Not exactly a top choice for a water rig.
I've a Antec midtower BQE3700 case with a planned water loop for both the CPU & GPU on the way.

Oops my fault. I meant mid-tower, not mini-tower. In fact I am considering using the same BQE3700 case with the hard drive cage removed.

As you are concerned about noise reduction over temps and speed I'd suggest you should give some thought to the Black Ice Pro rad. Much smaller and easier to locate in a tight case. It's also a lot thinner and will offer much lower resistence to a low CFM/noise fan on the air side. This rad should be able to keep your system under 45C at load, even if you change your mind and do a mild O/C.

Now that I've clarified that my case is not too tight to fit a heater core, should I really be worried that a low-noise fan will not be able to pull enough air through the heater core? Problem is, I already went and bought the damn thing online last night. I was thinking that due to the increased heat-transfer surface area of a heater core, even just a little airflow would be adequate.

Thanks!

1911user · Post by **1911user** » Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:06 pm

Yes, 1/2ID 3/4OD tubing is relatively stiff and bulky compared to 3/8ID 1/2OD. It has about a 3 inch bend radius and it takes some pressure to hold that bend. That bend pressure can easily become pressure on a waterblock and affect performance.

IMO 1/2ID tubing is best used by people with external radiator boxes where long tubing sections have more resistance than a typical water setup internal to the case. The other user of 1/2ID tubing is people who REALLY care about 1-2C temp differences in the cpu; performance is everything.

IMO with normal waterblocks, you'll have trouble measuring more than 1-2C temp difference between 1/2ID tubing and 3/8ID tubing when both are using 1/2OD barbs. Thicker tubing does have stronger sidewalls to help it be pushed and streched over a larger barb. My next water setup will be mostly 3/8ID tubing with maybe a 1/2ID section to feed the pump inlet.

jamesavery22 · Post by **jamesavery22** » Wed Sep 01, 2004 9:04 am

I wouldnt go with just one CSP750, flow is pretty low not to mention its aluminum... Head is ok but not going to give you good flow especially with a 6002 in series with another block...

If it were me Id water cool the CPU and the GPU. Get a 2-342 and put 2 slow 120s on it. Id also look for the older MCP600rev2. Swiftech discontinued it but it is quieter than their new MCP650. The blocks you picked are fine.

Goodluck