My current configuration is a mid-level Abit P4 3.2c, 1GB memory, 74G Raptor, dvd drive, and Radeon 9550 video in a Sonata case. Existing mods are a Zalman 7000AlCu cpu fan and a passive copper heatsink on the chipset.
What would be the best bang for the buck from here? It seems like the case fan is the biggest noise component. I have read various postings and reviews without being sure what would work best. I am wondering what you have tried and would recommend. I am considering:
* Nexus 120mm real quiet case fan or fans
* Seasonic 430W power supply
* Case damping
Thanks for any ideas or comments you have.
-Terry
Best for quieter Sonata
Moderators: NeilBlanchard, Ralf Hutter, sthayashi, Lawrence Lee
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Aleksi
- Friend of SPCR
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- Location: Finland -- Folding For SPCR
Hi,
You have the Sonata I with the original PSU? There's quite a few threads here on SPCR about opening up the front bezel, making a PSU duct etc. It all depends on your level of interest towards modding your current setup versus buying new components that are quiet.
Personally I think Nexus fans are not the best bang for the buck, simply because the price they sell for is quite ridiculous. I'd go for a Yate Loon (basicly the same fan as the Nexus. Same manufacturer, different top speeds, 1350RPM vs 1000RPM) or a similar "cheap" solution.
Buying a S12 vs fan swapping and ducting the original PSU is a tough one. If I would look at it from the financial point of view, I would go for the swap and duct. But please try ducting the PSU for fresh air from the front drive bays before going out and buying a new PSU. You might be surprised at what a difference it can make.
Soundproofing mat is something people somewhat disagree on. Do you need it or not. Many people see it as a finishing touch to an already quiet computer. Personally after using different acoustic mats like the Acoustipack I think I will not soundproof my next build.
HTH.
PS. Look around (if you haven't) the General Gallery, Power Supply and Fan forums for different things you can do with your computer. There's quite a few stickies that provide good reading.
PS2. WELCOME TO SPCR!!
You have the Sonata I with the original PSU? There's quite a few threads here on SPCR about opening up the front bezel, making a PSU duct etc. It all depends on your level of interest towards modding your current setup versus buying new components that are quiet.
Personally I think Nexus fans are not the best bang for the buck, simply because the price they sell for is quite ridiculous. I'd go for a Yate Loon (basicly the same fan as the Nexus. Same manufacturer, different top speeds, 1350RPM vs 1000RPM) or a similar "cheap" solution.
Buying a S12 vs fan swapping and ducting the original PSU is a tough one. If I would look at it from the financial point of view, I would go for the swap and duct. But please try ducting the PSU for fresh air from the front drive bays before going out and buying a new PSU. You might be surprised at what a difference it can make.
Soundproofing mat is something people somewhat disagree on. Do you need it or not. Many people see it as a finishing touch to an already quiet computer. Personally after using different acoustic mats like the Acoustipack I think I will not soundproof my next build.
HTH.
PS. Look around (if you haven't) the General Gallery, Power Supply and Fan forums for different things you can do with your computer. There's quite a few stickies that provide good reading.
PS2. WELCOME TO SPCR!!
Aleksi, thanks for the reply. You are right according to what I read, that the Nexus *are* Yate Loon, but cherry-picked and with a resistor added to slow the fan. I would rather decrease the input voltage, if feasible for my system, than create waste heat with a resistor.
Ducting may be a little intense for my skills, but I am considering replacing the attractive perforated fan cover with a plain but effective wire grill. First I will test whether the significant decrease in obstruction makes any difference by simply pointing the fan out the case door and listening.
Previously I tried putting carpet samples on the wall behind my system to see if there was some external acoustical interaction. While I expected improvement based upon how quiet my system runs when downstairs (in the summer), the difference was negligible in my bedroom office. Maybe the difference is that the room itself is quieter, so the PC noise is more obvious.
Systems get noisier over time. What seemed so quiet right after replacing my Squealencer ps is no longer so.
Ducting may be a little intense for my skills, but I am considering replacing the attractive perforated fan cover with a plain but effective wire grill. First I will test whether the significant decrease in obstruction makes any difference by simply pointing the fan out the case door and listening.
Previously I tried putting carpet samples on the wall behind my system to see if there was some external acoustical interaction. While I expected improvement based upon how quiet my system runs when downstairs (in the summer), the difference was negligible in my bedroom office. Maybe the difference is that the room itself is quieter, so the PC noise is more obvious.
Systems get noisier over time. What seemed so quiet right after replacing my Squealencer ps is no longer so.
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Aleksi
- Friend of SPCR
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- Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 11:34 pm
- Location: Finland -- Folding For SPCR
Hi,
glad if it helped you.
I personally disagree on the general (?) opinion about Nexus fans. I have no idea where the "cherry picking Yate Loons for Nexus" started. Nexus sells quite a large amount of fans, if there is actual labour going through them... Well, lets just say that it would be expensive. And I highly doubt that is the reason why Nexus fans cost so much.
I also disagree on the inline resistor part. I must confess I was one of the people saying that, but apparently the logical way (atleast from a fan manufacturer's point of view) would be to switch the component values in the switching part of the fan electronics. This allows full control over a the usual 5-12V operating range but with different top speeds. Using an inline resistor would most likely make it unresponsive at the lower voltages, obviously because the resistor drops voltage.
glad if it helped you.
I personally disagree on the general (?) opinion about Nexus fans. I have no idea where the "cherry picking Yate Loons for Nexus" started. Nexus sells quite a large amount of fans, if there is actual labour going through them... Well, lets just say that it would be expensive. And I highly doubt that is the reason why Nexus fans cost so much.
I also disagree on the inline resistor part. I must confess I was one of the people saying that, but apparently the logical way (atleast from a fan manufacturer's point of view) would be to switch the component values in the switching part of the fan electronics. This allows full control over a the usual 5-12V operating range but with different top speeds. Using an inline resistor would most likely make it unresponsive at the lower voltages, obviously because the resistor drops voltage.
Well, Nexus are generally thought to be more consistent than YL noise-wise, and for the Nexus model which is a rebadged Nexus therefore it must be screened/picked somehow.I have no idea where the "cherry picking Yate Loons for Nexus" started
You are quite right, there is no inline resistor. Such a resistor would be obvious from a cursory examination of the fan tails; there is no telltale bulge or shrinkwrap.the Nexus *are* Yate Loon, but cherry-picked and with a resistor added to slow the fan. I would rather decrease the input voltage, if feasible for my system, than create waste heat with a resistor.
...I also disagree on the inline resistor part. I must confess I was one of the people saying that, but apparently the logical way (atleast from a fan manufacturer's point of view) would be to switch the component values in the switching part of the fan electronics
You might want to consider this drive mounting system for your Sonata drive trays:
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=10450
I would also consider using some kind of high density foam or similar material in the areas near the drive cage.
http://forums.silentpcreview.com/viewtopic.php?t=10450
I would also consider using some kind of high density foam or similar material in the areas near the drive cage.
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Aleksi
- Friend of SPCR
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- Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 11:34 pm
- Location: Finland -- Folding For SPCR
Jaganath,
the inline resistor can also be built inside the hub, so it actually wouldn't have to be similar to the "voltage reduction cables".
And yes I know why that is said about the Nexus, but I'm still very suspicious about cherry picking (atleast with my english I understand it as selecting from a bigger bunch). Although as the Nexus 120mm is made according to their specs (the lower top speed) it also may affect on other charateristics of the fan. I don't know, just my take on it. I know people diasgree on this matter.
the inline resistor can also be built inside the hub, so it actually wouldn't have to be similar to the "voltage reduction cables".
And yes I know why that is said about the Nexus, but I'm still very suspicious about cherry picking (atleast with my english I understand it as selecting from a bigger bunch). Although as the Nexus 120mm is made according to their specs (the lower top speed) it also may affect on other charateristics of the fan. I don't know, just my take on it. I know people diasgree on this matter.
Followup: After considering the informative responses to the original post (thanks!!!), I examined my setup further and decided that the Zalman fan seemed like to be the largest single noise source. I got a couple of the Nexus 120mm Real Quiet fans and a Scythe Ninja cpu heatsink.
Thankfully, Antec provided a spare set of spongey fan mounts for replacing the case fan. Be careful not to hacksaw too deeply when removing the tunnels between the Nexus fan's front and back screw holes. (hello superglue!) The Ninja installed fairly easily- the Zalman had been a test of my sanity. Getting the fan on the Ninja was the toughest part- it had to offset to clear the memory sticks.
It was really quiet...until my ears adjusted. I know that my system is quieter because I can hear the drive chatter far more clearly.
My conclusion is that silencing a PC is like tuning an application; there will always be a noisiest or slowest part, what improvements do is change which part that is. The process is not futile, it just doesn't have a clearly defined end.
Thankfully, Antec provided a spare set of spongey fan mounts for replacing the case fan. Be careful not to hacksaw too deeply when removing the tunnels between the Nexus fan's front and back screw holes. (hello superglue!) The Ninja installed fairly easily- the Zalman had been a test of my sanity. Getting the fan on the Ninja was the toughest part- it had to offset to clear the memory sticks.
It was really quiet...until my ears adjusted. I know that my system is quieter because I can hear the drive chatter far more clearly.
My conclusion is that silencing a PC is like tuning an application; there will always be a noisiest or slowest part, what improvements do is change which part that is. The process is not futile, it just doesn't have a clearly defined end.
tameyer -
Did you do anything about the HDD mounting? I've got a Sonata too. After replacing the horrid OEM Pentium HSF w/ a Zalman 9500, the next most obnoxious item was the HDD. It spins quietly, but would send enuf energy into the case during seeks that the door would buzz. Entirely unacceptable.
I had some big fat shock cord (it's at least 1/4") left over from re-doing the deck lacing on my sea kayak. I had to pop loose the front bezel, and removed the front filter to accomodate the simplest method for routing the shock cord. Hung the HDD at an angle instead of the original horizontal orientation because the cavity just isn't quite large enuf. Made a huge improvement!
Did you do anything about the HDD mounting? I've got a Sonata too. After replacing the horrid OEM Pentium HSF w/ a Zalman 9500, the next most obnoxious item was the HDD. It spins quietly, but would send enuf energy into the case during seeks that the door would buzz. Entirely unacceptable.
I had some big fat shock cord (it's at least 1/4") left over from re-doing the deck lacing on my sea kayak. I had to pop loose the front bezel, and removed the front filter to accomodate the simplest method for routing the shock cord. Hung the HDD at an angle instead of the original horizontal orientation because the cavity just isn't quite large enuf. Made a huge improvement!
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OverTheTop
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 2:28 am
- Location: Brisbane, Australia
Bartender- thanks for the info. I didn't notice the drive making much noise, but now that you mention it, I can feel the case humming slightly.
In my case (literally), what seems most noticeable now is the power supply fan. I have wondered if the two Nexus Real Quiet fans would allow me to get by with using an Antec Phantom 500, or I should just go with the Seasonic instead.
A couple of side notes:
I wonder why Antec has not developed a cut-out case for the Phantoms so their cooling fins would be external rather than adding to internal case temperatures. Besides that it might look a bit odd. And since I am wishing, they should make a quiet mATX case that isn't as ugly, maybe a baby Sonota.
Then again, some days I add up what I have spent in various accessories, and realize I could have had a new laptop which would be quiet AND portable. Then I remember- faster drives are finally becoming available, but the keyboards have a way to go.
In my case (literally), what seems most noticeable now is the power supply fan. I have wondered if the two Nexus Real Quiet fans would allow me to get by with using an Antec Phantom 500, or I should just go with the Seasonic instead.
A couple of side notes:
I wonder why Antec has not developed a cut-out case for the Phantoms so their cooling fins would be external rather than adding to internal case temperatures. Besides that it might look a bit odd. And since I am wishing, they should make a quiet mATX case that isn't as ugly, maybe a baby Sonota.
Then again, some days I add up what I have spent in various accessories, and realize I could have had a new laptop which would be quiet AND portable. Then I remember- faster drives are finally becoming available, but the keyboards have a way to go.
Is your Radeon 9550 video card already passively cooled? If not, there's considerable "bang for the silencing buck" by making that conversion. I really like the Aerocool VM-101on my 9600 Pro card.
The Seasonic S12-430 PSU (early Yate Loon fan version) was another of the better cooling mods for my Sonata-cased system, compared to the original TP380S PSU. Definitely quieter and much cooler, judging by the exhaust temperature. The S12-430 fan has never spun up beyond 900 rpm.
m0002a's suggestion previously for HDD isolation in the Sonata drive cages works great, too. Very secure and cheap!
The Seasonic S12-430 PSU (early Yate Loon fan version) was another of the better cooling mods for my Sonata-cased system, compared to the original TP380S PSU. Definitely quieter and much cooler, judging by the exhaust temperature. The S12-430 fan has never spun up beyond 900 rpm.
m0002a's suggestion previously for HDD isolation in the Sonata drive cages works great, too. Very secure and cheap!
Is your Radeon 9550 video card already passively cooled?
Yes, it always was. It may be an SE model, I got the hardware info from Windows as it's been a while. Not into high performance video, I just wanted DVI for clear text- it really makes a difference.
compared to the original TP380S PSU. Definitely quieter and much cooler,
Sounds like you approach this quantitatively. Kudos for that. As they say, You cannot manage what you cannot measure.
I believe you- the Antec PS has a subtle but annoying whine. It is quieter than most PS units, but definitely not silent. I look forward to upgrading.
m0002a's suggestion previously for HDD isolation
Yes, I like that idea a lot and will try it as soon as possible. I thought the Antec soft grommets were good, but it seems that eliminating other problems has promoted drive isolation much higher on the list.
Thank you for the information! It looks like we have similar systems. If you don't mind my asking, how did you get a MkII front? I have been thinking about pulling my filter to increase dust, er air flow. Just have to dust-off more often.
Yes, it always was. It may be an SE model, I got the hardware info from Windows as it's been a while. Not into high performance video, I just wanted DVI for clear text- it really makes a difference.
compared to the original TP380S PSU. Definitely quieter and much cooler,
Sounds like you approach this quantitatively. Kudos for that. As they say, You cannot manage what you cannot measure.
I believe you- the Antec PS has a subtle but annoying whine. It is quieter than most PS units, but definitely not silent. I look forward to upgrading.
m0002a's suggestion previously for HDD isolation
Yes, I like that idea a lot and will try it as soon as possible. I thought the Antec soft grommets were good, but it seems that eliminating other problems has promoted drive isolation much higher on the list.
Thank you for the information! It looks like we have similar systems. If you don't mind my asking, how did you get a MkII front? I have been thinking about pulling my filter to increase dust, er air flow. Just have to dust-off more often.
Yes, I've compiled a pretty extensive spreadsheet of temperature data under identical load conditions, including CPU, voltage regulator and case (as reported by the motherboard sensor), PSU exhaust and northbridge (measured with an infrared thermometer), fans speeds, and qualitative noise level. Just the test engineer in me coming to the surface.tameyer wrote:Sounds like you approach this quantitatively. Kudos for that. As they say, You cannot manage what you cannot measure.
I called Antec, originally just wanting the "full-swing" door. They sell the entire front panel assembly, including LED's (still just as bright), switches, front panel wiring, etc. for $19.95 (in mid-2005). It's a direct plug-in replacement for the Mk I front panel.tameyer wrote:how did you get a MkII front?
I was quite pleasantly surprised that the improved intake flow lowered my voltage regulator and northbridge load temps by 3-5C. Those are in comparison to temps with the typical SPCR Sonata I intake bezel mods (no mods required to the Sonata II bezel). No appreciable change to CPU temp with my XP-120/Papst CPU HSF.
