Star's Crucis

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waterstar
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Star's Crucis

Post by waterstar » Mon Jan 03, 2005 7:27 pm

I've been lurking in the forums for around a month now. The people who post have truly impressed me with your wisdom. I hope to add something as I venture to build a quiet pc.

I'm in no real hurry to build my new machine and will take the time to purchase the best quiet parts that meet my computing needs. I'm not one to push a machine hard on a regular basis — I just like to have the horsepower and ram to support me when I get that whim to create a short film or play some crazy game at a LAN party. Fortunately those habits are not common. :roll:

After reading the primer on sound, noise and computers and a number of forum posts here is what I've decided on thus far. Note: Not all decisions are made. A * indicates the items is already owned / purchased.
  • Case: Antec SLK3000B *
  • Dampening: Acoustipack Deluxe v2 *
  • PSU: Seasonic S12-430
  • Fans: Nexus 120mm D12SL-12 *
  • CPU: AMD 64 3200+ *
  • Heatsink: Thermalright XP 120 *
  • DVD R/RW: Pioneer DVR-A08XLB *
  • Hard Disk: Samsung Spinpoint SP1614C
  • Mainboard: ASUS A8N-E Premium, if it is ever really made.
  • Memory: Corsair 1GB TwinX
  • GPU: Gigabyte X800-XL Silent-pipe edition
  • Soundcard: Audigy 2 ZS
  • Speakers: Logitech Z5500
  • Keyboard/Mouse: Logitech MX700... maybe
  • Monitor: Viewsonic 17", the one on my desk already.
Airflow Design
Before I mention anything about airflow, I'd like to say that I have been so inspired by Thor's Hammer. Most of my airflow ideas are blatant copies of that systems negative pressure design. Ingenious.

I plan to seal the front of the case up tight. I'll check the heat on the disk drive and dvd r/rw but I doubt they will need active cooling of any kind.

In doing so I will utilize the side intake duct which will come in right over the XP 120 and from there go one of two routes. Up through the PSU or out the back via the cases 120mm Nexus fan.

PSU Modifications
Can I just say that I know very little about circuit boards, electronics, etc. That said I'd like to try to mod the PSU with a lower voltage Nexus fan at around 5-7v. Anyone willing to teach me how?

Drive Suspension Method
I've ordered some sorbothane from McMaster. Man alive is the stuff expensive. I got a few different thicknesses... is that a word? Anyway, I haven't tried any of it out yet since I haven't ordered the hard drive yet. It seems very compressed, solid, thick compared to a lightweight foam.

Not yet sure how to mount it in the 3000B.

Closing
Morning comes early so I'd best get to sleep. I'm open to ideas, suggestions or just plain feedback. My target goal is inaudible during normal use. The only downside I see so far will be the loud clacking of the keys on my keyboard but hopefully I'll find a product or home remedy for that as well.

Thank you,

Waterstar [Ray]

[edit] updated the system spec list
Last edited by waterstar on Tue Mar 01, 2005 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

waterstar
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Re: Star's Crucis

Post by waterstar » Tue Jan 11, 2005 9:13 pm

Well I've dremmeled out the back hex grill in the 3000B and am waiting on some rubber molding to line it before installing the nexus fan. I was surprised by how easy of a modification cutting a grill out was. It took some time and a bit of guts to attempt it but the improved asthetics and air flow will definately be worth the risk.

I have ordered a few other... how shall I say, aesthetic improvement items which I will be using to modify the somewhat bland 3000B into an improved looking and performing (silence) machine.

I'll try to post some pictures as I make modifications, but it is slow going as of yet. Has anyone figured out which is the best method for suspending multiple hard drives in this case?


Waterstar [Ray]

meglamaniac
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Post by meglamaniac » Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:44 am

Your choices so far seem to be right down the line.
The only thing I'd hold off on is the Acoustipak - you may find you don't need it.

I would also avoid tampering with the PSU until you've tried it - I am one of the privilaged few in the UK to own the 400w version of that same model (had to import it from the USA to get the Rev A3) and it is VERY quiet. Unless you have super sensitive hearing or sit with the PSU exhaust next to your ear, I doubt you'll notice it.
As you've stated you don't intend to stress the system often and you're going for a Winchester, I would expect the PSU fan to idle the majority of the time as those Winchesters don't kick out much heat at all, especially if you enable AMD's Cool'n'Quiet which by recent accounts can reduce the CPU power draw at idle to around about 20W - tiny! With your XP-120 you should have no problems, and the CPU fan may even stop at times (see my motherboard recommendations).

Now...

Mainboard:
Asus have some very good products with PCI-express. I would suggest the Asus K8V if you want it now. If you're prepared to wait, the Asus K8N-E Premium looks like being an excellent board and stock is expected sometime in February - just don't try finding it on the Asus website as it isn't listed yet! I'm holding out for that board myself at the moment. Importantly, it is one of the few Socket 939 boards to have passive chipset cooling out of the box, so no need to strip off an annoying 60mm fan.
Both boards incorperate thermal regulation of the CPU fan (Asus call it Q-fan) in addition to Cool'n'Quiet. When running with both enabled, it is quite possible for the processor to become so cool that the board will stop the CPU fan entirely - especially with a decent cooler such as yours.

Memory:
Crucial Ballistix has consistantly come out on top during reviews on the AMD64 platform, most noteably in an extensive test on Anandtech including many other premium brands. It is also a good deal cheaper than other premium brands such as Corsair.

GPU:
Easy: GeForce 6600GT. Good performance in all up-to-the minute games, and excellent price/performance comparison. The Zalman ZM80D-HP passive cooler fits the PCI-express version with no issues, so you can get rid of the GPU fan too.

Soundcard:
Both motherboards have good onboard surround sound (as do most now). If you're really into your gaming, a Soundblaster Audigy 2 will give you full hardware effects support so might free you up a few extra FPS in games, but otherwise stick with the onboard.

Speakers:
I'm thinking of getting Altec-Lansing's VS3151 set. I've not heard them in action, but they've got some decent reviews if you look with google.

Keyboard/Mouse:
No particular recommendations, but I would suggest a wireless optical set. There are plenty of manufacturers offering them, and you'll wonder why you ever put up with the cords in the first place once you've tried it.

Monitor:
This all depends on what you want to use the rig for.
Decent LCD panels are still very expensive, while CRT prices are falling all the time. It's up to you really.

waterstar
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Post by waterstar » Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:50 pm

Well a little over a month has passed and I'm still plugging along. Oh how I wish ASUS would release that A8N-E Premium board! Alas, the time spent waiting has been a good thing as a few new products have come out.

Sparks Flying
Well I asked one of the guys I worked with to help me modify the Rev. 3 Tornado with a Nexus fan hard-volted to 6 or 7 volts.

We were plugging along and had the solder in place, we powered up the unit but the fan did not start up (even if manually given a spin). We turned the main pcb on its side and powered up in order to use the multi-meter on the connection and we didn't notice the heatsink touching the input line. BAM! Sparks flew and we pulled the plug. Even after trying to recesitate it with a new fuse that sucker was gone. RIP Tornado.

I wasn't overly upset as part of the whole point of that was to learn about how to make such modifications. The downside was being out approx a hundred bucks. Fortunately I see that Seasonic is coming out with the S12 series which has the easier to handle molex connectors. I'm planning to put one on order on Wednesday if the shipment to the store I'm ordering from gets one.

Riding the Fence
Gigabyte has a new passive X800-XL card coming out (might have been out for awhile but I just noticed it) and it should be coming to the U.S. soon I hope. The few reviews I've read show it has lower power consumption than the 6800 and it performs in the same range. It's been a good long while since I've used an ATI product. Not sure if I want to swap from nVidia to ATI.

This Silly Nest
Take the words 'This Silly Nest' and re-arrange them... 'Silent Stylish' I've decided to make a few 'stylish' type mods to my case and also hope to keep the noise level to a minimum.

I posted the current modifications to the Gruntville forums which are very ... different than the silentpcreview forums. For those that might be interested in checking it out the link follows http://www.gruntville.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=12361.


Closing
I am antsy to see a review of the S12 series and the Giga-byte cards. If I get one before the review I'll post my results.

- Ray [Waterstar]

waterstar
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Post by waterstar » Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:05 pm

meglamaniac wrote:Your choices so far seem to be right down the line.
The only thing I'd hold off on is the Acoustipak - you may find you don't need it.
The Accoustipack was one of the first items I had ordered. I've already thought of plenty of uses for the stuff outside of my computer as I wait for other parts to come in... If it wasn't so expensive!
meglamaniac wrote:I would also avoid tampering with the PSU until you've tried it - I am one of the privilaged few in the UK to own the 400w version of that same model (had to import it from the USA to get the Rev A3) and it is VERY quiet. Unless you have super sensitive hearing or sit with the PSU exhaust next to your ear, I doubt you'll notice it.

As you've stated you don't intend to stress the system often and you're going for a Winchester, I would expect the PSU fan to idle the majority of the time as those Winchesters don't kick out much heat at all, especially if you enable AMD's Cool'n'Quiet which by recent accounts can reduce the CPU power draw at idle to around about 20W - tiny! With your XP-120 you should have no problems, and the CPU fan may even stop at times (see my motherboard recommendations).
My goal is to run it without a CPU fan. The only fans I hope to use are the one in the PSU and the exhaust fan, both undervolted or thermally controlled. And with the 3000B I think the airflow will be good enough to achieve it.
meglamaniac wrote: Mainboard:
Asus have some very good products with PCI-express. I would suggest the Asus K8V if you want it now. If you're prepared to wait, the Asus K8N-E Premium looks like being an excellent board and stock is expected sometime in February - just don't try finding it on the Asus website as it isn't listed yet! I'm holding out for that board myself at the moment. Importantly, it is one of the few Socket 939 boards to have passive chipset cooling out of the box, so no need to strip off an annoying 60mm fan.
Both boards incorperate thermal regulation of the CPU fan (Asus call it Q-fan) in addition to Cool'n'Quiet. When running with both enabled, it is quite possible for the processor to become so cool that the board will stop the CPU fan entirely - especially with a decent cooler such as yours.
ASUS is taking so long with their premium boards. I imagine they are having a hard time keeping the northbridges cool. It might just be beneficial for me to invest in a northbridge cooler and a non-premium board; although I'd rather just wait it out. I mean, the technology can only get cheaper right?
meglamaniac wrote: Memory:
Crucial Ballistix has consistantly come out on top during reviews on the AMD64 platform, most noteably in an extensive test on Anandtech including many other premium brands. It is also a good deal cheaper than other premium brands such as Corsair.
Corsair is a bit expensive but has those cool led lights. Ok, so they don't have any useful purpose other than the wow factor. Part of the reason I build computers and mod them myself is for the wow factor though. It's just nice when we can pull off something that people didn't know was possible (like a silent or near-silent pc)
meglamaniac wrote: GPU:
Easy: GeForce 6600GT. Good performance in all up-to-the minute games, and excellent price/performance comparison. The Zalman ZM80D-HP passive cooler fits the PCI-express version with no issues, so you can get rid of the GPU fan too.
The 6600GT by Gigabyte was my first thought. Now I'm torn between it and a X800-XL also passively cooled stock. Video cards are my nemisis in this new machine. So many choices and such hot components.
meglamaniac wrote: Soundcard:
Both motherboards have good onboard surround sound (as do most now). If you're really into your gaming, a Soundblaster Audigy 2 will give you full hardware effects support so might free you up a few extra FPS in games, but otherwise stick with the onboard.
Ended up getting the Audigy 2 ZS. Mixed together with the Z5500s it should make for an amazing DVD experience ... if my roomates don't kill me due to watching movies to loudly. (Just because I want my PC silent, doesn't mean I like my action flicks that way)

meglamaniac wrote: Speakers:
I'm thinking of getting Altec-Lansing's VS3151 set. I've not heard them in action, but they've got some decent reviews if you look with google.
Z5500, very impressive. Good clarity and a great price for the quality.
meglamaniac wrote: Keyboard/Mouse:
No particular recommendations, but I would suggest a wireless optical set. There are plenty of manufacturers offering them, and you'll wonder why you ever put up with the cords in the first place once you've tried it.
Do wireless input devices suffer from lack of control or lag? I'm a website designer/producer and do a lot of graphical work (photoshop). I already suffer from an optical mouse at work that occasionally jumps around.

I was thinking of the MX700 duo. Tried playing with a set at BestBuy and thought it was pretty nice.
meglamaniac wrote: Monitor:
This all depends on what you want to use the rig for.
Decent LCD panels are still very expensive, while CRT prices are falling all the time. It's up to you really.
I've got a 17" Viewsonic that will do until my computer is quiet enough for me to hear the monitor. At that point I'm not quite sure what I'll do. LCD's are getting to be fairly nice but for graphical work nothing quite beats a CRT. The refurbished units are getting to be very inexpensive even at larger 21"+ sizes.

Thank you for the input!!!

meglamaniac
Posts: 380
Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2004 12:44 pm
Location: UK

Post by meglamaniac » Tue Mar 01, 2005 3:15 am

I've given up on the A8N-E Deluxe entirely.
There are increasing rumours that when it does eventually come out it will no longer have passive cooling. I have decided to go down the route of getting the A8N-SLI Deluxe and modifying the chipset cooling. There are plenty of examples I found with google of people saying it worked fine.
I ordered my board and most of the rest of the stuff I need today so fingers crossed.

Those are some serious (in terms of sound and price) speakers by the way!

waterstar
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Post by waterstar » Tue Mar 01, 2005 8:31 pm

meglamaniac wrote:I've given up on the A8N-E Deluxe entirely.
There are increasing rumours that when it does eventually come out it will no longer have passive cooling. I have decided to go down the route of getting the A8N-SLI Deluxe and modifying the chipset cooling. There are plenty of examples I found with google of people saying it worked fine.
I ordered my board and most of the rest of the stuff I need today so fingers crossed.

Those are some serious (in terms of sound and price) speakers by the way!
I've been following the thread on Anandtech and rumors are thick. I'm not sure when it will be out but since it was announced back in November, my hope is that they are simply doing the right thing and taking their time to correct issues that they have seen crop up with the A8N-SLI board.

The Z5500's are very nice. I didn't have a surround sound system in the entertainment room, but they work nicely. I'm really surprised by the clarity of such inexpensive speakers (thinking of what it would cost to do surround with non-pc speakers)

S12-430 / S12-600
The store I order from has the S12-600 listed as ordered to be added to inventory possibly tomorrow. 600 watts on a Seasonic-brand power supply seems excessive (if it were a non-efficient junker I might say otherwise). The 430 seems much more adequate to my needs, but I'm not “in the know” when it comes to knowing how much power I'll need.

Will the S12-430 supply enough power for the an AMD 3200+, Gigabyte X800-XL, possibly 2 Samsung Spinpoints, a Pioneer DVR-A08XL, a Nexus case fan and a CCFL light? I'm pretty sure it ought to be enough. The real kicker for me is whether or not I need the PCI-Express connector. It seems to be more of a pro-level card need rather than something the X800 XL would need. PCI-Express already sends a good deal of power down the connection... right? :?:

- Ray [Waterstar]

meglamaniac
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Post by meglamaniac » Wed Mar 02, 2005 1:40 am

Most PCI-e motherboards have a workaround for PSUs that don't have the 24 pin arrangement - either an ATX 20 - 24pin adaptor or a socket for an extra molex or the 2x12v plug etc.
I gave up on the A8N-E Deluxe when the one website that had it listed for preorder in the UK effectively dropped it. The board is still available for preorder but the expected arrival date has gone from "Feb 2005" to "Unknown" so I'd had enough. The issues with the A8N-SLI seem to be worked out now anyway as several BIOS revisions have been released.
I'll be sure to let you know anyway once I get to play with mine :)

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Post by waterstar » Wed Mar 02, 2005 9:07 pm

That'd be great to hear your experience with the A8N-SLI board. I think they will launch the A8N-E Deluxe soon though. The A8N has just launched and I hope this means the line will make it all the way to premium. Even if only to an A8N-E Deluxe it would be nice... although I really dig the black pcb of the premium line.

- Ray [Waterstar]

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