Holy smokes... P D830 running 46 C at idle! Please help.

Groovealufagus · Post by **Groovealufagus** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:20 am

Hey now!

This forum is awsome and I'm hoping that someone here has some good advice for this issue:

I just did a new build around a Pentium D 830 here are the specs:

Pentium D830, Intel D945PVS Desktop Board(Intel 945P Express Chipset), Arctic Silver 5, Scythe Ninja w/ 120mm Nexus @ 12v, 2GB (4x512 dual channel) OCZ Gold DDR2 667 w/ gold heatspreaders.

P180 case w/ Nexus 120mm rear exhaust @ 12v, Top vent opened w/ filter screen and spoiler mounted, VGA duct removed, Nexus 80mm @ 12v mounted to VGA duct mount to cool chipset & VGA heatsink, upper drive cage removed, Plextor DVD-+RW & floppy drive mounted in upper chamber, Asus n6600 Extreme Silencer (PCI-E 16x) (Passive). Seasonic S-12 600w, 2x Seagate Barracuda 7200.9 SATA II.

The temperature reading I'm getting from the motherboard is 32C for the case, 46C for the processor at idle.

Initially I installed with a front intake fan and the top duct closed with HVAC tape. This gave me readings of 46C / 46C. Removing the front intake fan and opening the top duct for intake reduced the case temperature by 14C, but didn't reduce the CPU temperature at all.

This is the second board I've install the processor on. The first board was an MSI P4N SLI-FI. I got the same temperature readings from that board (it turned out to have faulty DIMM slots) with the front fan and the top vent closed, but nothing changed in the readings on that board when I removed the front fan and opened the top duct.

All of the fans are running at 12v, so they're all connected to standard 4-Pin molex connectors. The CPU fan is not connected to the mother board connector at all, but the case fan is. (Neither fan was connected to the motherboard in the initial configuration)

Whether I use 1, 2, 3, or 4 memory DIMM's I get the same temperatures.

My cabling couldn't be any less obtrusive to airflow. I spent hours working on it (twice, since I've installed two different mother boards).

The Ninja heatsink doesn't seem to be getting very hot to touch at all. Installing the Ninja is not the easiest task and every time I've tried to install it it has moved around slightly while trying to apply the clips.

Do I have an air bubble? Too much thermal paste? Not enough thermal paste? Do I need some other sort of sortware to monitor the temperature correctly (i.e., the performance software from Intel and NVIDIA, and the Award and Intel BIOS are all wrong? )

Is there some sort of algorithm that's run by cross referencing the readings the motherboard gets from the processor/case and the speed of the corresponding fan? Would that explain why my reading changed for the case temperature in the second build but not the first, because the case fan was not connected to the moboard in the first build but was in the second, and since I've never connected the processor fan to the moboard, I haven't seen a change in any configuration and am simply not getting a correct reading?

Please help. I know this processor runs hot, but I read an article from someone else who's OC'd to 3.7 GHz and runs at 37C using the Ninja. I'm terrified to run any sort of stress test on it.

Thanks for reading and for any suggestions,

Dan

(if you're only going to comment on why I shouldn't have bought the processor, please don't comment at all, that's not helpful, and what I really need is help).

IsaacKuo · Post by **IsaacKuo** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:29 am

To get maximum airflow through the CPU heatsink, maybe you can try installing exhaust fans in both the rear and top. You'll need to open up all of the PCI slots to maximize the available intake area.

If that doesn't improve your CPU temperatures even a little bit, then something funny is going on with the sensor.

Groovealufagus · Post by **Groovealufagus** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:40 am

"If that doesn't improve your CPU temperatures even a little bit, then something funny is going on with the sensor."

A sensor on the board (which would mean two boards) or a sensor on the CPU itself?

I've seen two instances of people running a set-up pretty much the same way as mine and neither has this problem. I can add an additional exhaust fan, but the purpose of opening the top duct was to create airflow from the top through the fins, as well as from the front of the case through the fins. I can't open all the slots on the back, the machine will get choked with dust and hair in two to three days.

Thanks.

jaganath · Post by **jaganath** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:43 am

Holy smokes... P D830 running 46 C at idle! Please help.

Well the max Tjunction temp for that proc is circa 70C, and the TDP is 130W, so IMHO that is not an unreasonable idle temp.

The Ninja heatsink doesn't seem to be getting very hot to touch at all.

How hot is "not very hot"? Are we talking the temperature of lukewarm water, or the back of a CRT monitor after being left on for a long time?

I know this processor runs hot, but I read an article from someone else who's OC'd to 3.7 GHz and runs at 37C using the Ninja.

Yes, but what kind of fan were they using. Even at 12V the Nexus doesn't push a lot of air compared to other fans on the market.

(if you're only going to comment on why I shouldn't have bought the processor, please don't comment at all, that's not helpful

Well.............OK then.

qviri · Post by **qviri** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:46 am

Groovealufagus wrote:I can add an additional exhaust fan, but the purpose of opening the top duct was to create airflow from the top through the fins, as well as from the front of the case through the fins.

Hmm, are you sure the rear fan isn't just pulling the air straight from the vent, bypassing most of the Ninja?

Maybe a cardboard partition to make sure most of the air *does* go through the Ninja would help.

IsaacKuo · Post by **IsaacKuo** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 11:58 am

You can try things out just temporarily to see if they help. If so, then you can think about a permanent fix.

I wasn't entirely clear--I meant to move the upper front intake fan to the top exhaust, leaving the front intake without a fan. Along with opening up the PCI slots, you can see if your CPU temperatures improve. If so, then maybe you can consider installing an air filter over the PCI slots.

AFAIK, there aren't any CPU temperature sensors on motherboards, the CPU has its own temperature sensor.

Groovealufagus · Post by **Groovealufagus** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 12:10 pm

How hot is "not very hot"? Are we talking the temperature of lukewarm water, or the back of a CRT monitor after being left on for a long time?

We're talking the temperature of lukewarm water.... not hot. It does get hot when loaded... almost too hot to touch at 62C, so I assume it's doing its job.

Yes, but what kind of fan were they using. Even at 12V the Nexus doesn't push a lot of air compared to other fans on the market.

I believe he was running the included Antec fans on Low, but using a bunch of ducting, too.

Groovealufagus · Post by **Groovealufagus** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 12:13 pm

Hmm, are you sure the rear fan isn't just pulling the air straight from the vent, bypassing most of the Ninja?

Maybe a cardboard partition to make sure most of the air *does* go through the Ninja would help.

It's definitely pulling, but I can't be sure. I'll try a partition and see if that helps.

Groovealufagus · Post by **Groovealufagus** » Fri Apr 07, 2006 12:21 pm

I meant to move the upper front intake fan to the top exhaust, leaving the front intake without a fan.

I removed the front fan when I opened the top duct. I'll try a top intake along with the suggested partition and see if that cools it down at all.

AFAIK, there aren't any CPU temperature sensors on motherboards, the CPU has its own temperature sensor.

Thanks, that's helpful, too.

cmthomson · Post by **cmthomson** » Sat Apr 08, 2006 7:15 am

jaganath wrote:
Holy smokes... P D830 running 46 C at idle! Please help.
Well the max Tjunction temp for that proc is circa 70C, and the TDP is 130W, so IMHO that is not an unreasonable idle temp.

Actually, it is the max Tcase that is 69C for the 830 D. The max Tjunction isn't published, but my 830 D throttles at 103C.

cmthomson · Post by **cmthomson** » Sat Apr 08, 2006 7:36 am

First of all, 46C idle is perfectly normal for this CPU with a Ninja and modest airflow. So don't worry, be happy.

That said, I'd like to understand your current fan/vent/duct arrangement. I think you have a fan bolted to the Ninja (Nexus@12), a rear case fan (Nexus@12), the P180 top fan hole open with a filter, and some kind of ducting for the VGA card.

Which side of the Ninja is its fan on? That is, does it blow up or back?

I'd strongly recommend that you not leave either the top or back fan hole open (as opposed to ducted or holding a fan) as this will definitely cause short-circuiting.

You might consider mounting the Ninja fan blowing up, moving the case fan to the top, and blocking the rear fan opening.

Also, you can easily remove the flip open door over the front inlet (open the door and press on the tab near the top hinge), and leave the filter installed. This will reduce impedance.

For entertainment, you might want to read my article documenting my 830 D adventure: Quiet DIY OC'd Pentium D 830 System. Since I wrote that, I've added some more ducting (to the VGA and around the VRM) and switched to Nexus fans to make things even quieter.

KnightRT · Post by **KnightRT** » Sun Apr 09, 2006 10:51 pm

Is it really? I wonder if the stock heatsink is even that bad.

DI

Groovealufagus · Post by **Groovealufagus** » Mon Apr 10, 2006 8:38 am

First of all, 46C idle is perfectly normal for this CPU with a Ninja and modest airflow. So don't worry, be happy.

That's good to know, thanks. It gives me some peace of mind.

That said, I'd like to understand your current fan/vent/duct arrangement. I think you have a fan bolted to the Ninja (Nexus@12), a rear case fan (Nexus@12), the P180 top fan hole open with a filter, and some kind of ducting for the VGA card.

That's exactly correct, except for the VGA ducting. I removed the VGA duct and positioned a Nexus 80mm fan (12v) to partially blow across the HS of the VGA card, and partially to blow across the NB heatsink. My assumption being that that air, too will get pulled out by the rear fan, since it's being pushed in that direction.

At present I'm not even sure the 80mm fan is making a difference (at 12v I'm sure it's making a difference in noise), any recommendations for software that will monitor the VGA and chipset temperature?

Which side of the Ninja is its fan on? That is, does it blow up or back?

The fan is on the front blowing back, creating a push-pull with the rear exhaust fan. With the top open the rear fan should be pulling the air through the HS from the top, while the fan on the Ninja pulls air from the front of the case.

I'd strongly recommend that you not leave either the top or back fan hole open (as opposed to ducted or holding a fan) as this will definitely cause short-circuiting.

When I had the top closed off, the case temperature was 46 C, with it open the temp dropped to 32 C. The temp of the CPU stayed exactly the same. Maybe the Ninja is not getting any of the air pulled from the top. Someone recommended a cardboard partition, which I thought I might try pior to full ducting.

You might consider mounting the Ninja fan blowing up, moving the case fan to the top, and blocking the rear fan opening.

The NB HS is too close to the Ninja for me to feel good about mounting the fan on the bottom to blow up. It would actually cover part of the HS which is likely to cause it to heat up more. Even if the fan pulled some of the air off of it, it would blow that hot air through the fins of the Ninja.

Would there be any reason to think this would be a cooler option than when I had the top vent closed with my current configuration, or my original configuration with the top vent closed and a front intake fan mounted, in addition to the fans at the rear and on the Ninja?

Also, you can easily remove the flip open door over the front inlet (open the door and press on the tab near the top hinge), and leave the filter installed. This will reduce impedance.

This I'll try for sure, it might even make a slight difference with the noise.

For entertainment, you might want to read my article documenting my 830 D adventure

I did read your article, and found it quite entertaining and informative. Graet ducting. I'm not terrific with constructing things like that, though, so I'm holding out until it's unavoidable.

Thank you for your help.