question about AM2 vs 939

tomplatz · Post by **tomplatz** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 2:47 pm

Would really appreciate y'alls help here. I presently have an AMD 2500+ on NF-S 2.0 with 2gb DDR1 ram and an AGP Radeon 9700AIW card. Want to upgrade without breaking the bank.

Overclocking = not important
Cool and quiet system = much more important
Keeping my existing ram = would be nice
X2 processor = a must

So - if I switch to AM2, I need to buy a new mobo, cpu, memory (giving up 2gb of DDR1) and vid card. That's like $800 or more.

If I go 939, there's no low wattage X2 processors available, are there? But I could keep the ram and potentially the video card too.

Any thoughts? Appreciate the help.

jaganath · Post by **jaganath** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 3:07 pm

So - if I switch to AM2, I need to buy a new mobo, cpu, memory (giving up 2gb of DDR1) and vid card. That's like $800 or more.

Yes, but you would have to buy the new mobo and CPU anyway, whether you choose 939 or AM2, so the only real saving is with the RAM, to get an obsolete platform (939). You can get AM2 motherboards that have an AGP slot, for example: Asrock AM2NF3-VSTA, so you can keep your current vid card. DDR2 RAM is pretty cheap, you can get 1GB for about $60-80 here in the UK. And of course you get the lower-power X2's.

My vote is for AM2.

Yeti · Post by **Yeti** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 6:42 pm

If it matters, DDR2 consumes less power than DDR1. It all contributes to less heat to move out of your system, which means less fan RPMs needed.

Arvo · Post by **Arvo** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 3:42 am

There are low wattage X2 s939 processors available (eg some dualcore s939 Opterons have 35W TDP, including one in my working PC

), but you cannot know that beforehand (official TDP for Opterons is about 89W or more) - only after buying expensive CPU.

Not counting on 35W Opteron, I'd go with AM2 either. If possible, I'd sell 9700ProAIW and buy new graphic card for PCI-Express and separate tuner card (Hauppauge PVR150, Sapphire Theatrix 550 or something similar).

Having AthlonXP 2800+ on NF7 and 9800ProAIW myself, I sometimes really hate that AIW

WDM driver hell or something.

My plans for upgrade are bound with 35W Opteron - if I can buy it out from my employer

If not, then AM2 for sure.

tomplatz · Post by **tomplatz** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 5:59 am

thanks guys.

Elixer · Post by **Elixer** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 7:05 am

Personally I don't see any real advantages to AM2 over 939. The performance difference is on the order of 1%. I've never made a cpu upgrade without also making a motherboard upgrade as well. As you're upgrading from a 2500+ I assume that your standard upgrade time is ~2-3 years so the arguement that the 939 is an outdated makes no sense because it's unlikely you'd buy a new processor even if you had AM2. It seems very simple to me to buy a 939 motherboard and a dual core processor for ~$300 then to have to spend the extra money for a new video card and ram. All of the 939 processors can easily be kept cool and quiet by the ninja with a low speed fan.

If your priority is gaming then I would say just upgrade your current video card and keep your current system. However if you have to have an X2 and want better gaming then I would still say go for a 939 board but with PCI express as reusing that ram will save you $150-250. Then buy a new video card as well and you're set. But if you're doing this then I would think about making the leap to a low end Conroe setup as that will give you better performance but of course at some extra cost.

What I wouldn't do is buy a 939 board now with AGP and then decide later to upgrade your video card. Although there are a couple of boards with both AGP and PCI-E so you could get one of those if this is in your future.

Arvo · Post by **Arvo** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 8:01 am

I would not recommend "hybrid" boards with both AGP and PCI-E - these boards have usually PCI-E compatibilty issues.

Anodyne · Post by **Anodyne** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 11:20 am

I've been mulling over this same issue as I think about an upgrade in the near future. My A64 2800+ S754 system is still running pretty well...but upgrading the CPU enough to make a significant difference doesn't seem worth it (the fastest upgrade, a 3700+ S754, is running about $180 on eBay).

If I go AM2 the best I can do on NewEgg is:
X2 3800+ AM2: $160 (the 65W version)
Gigabyte GA-M51GM-SG2 mATX mobo: $77
1 Gb OCZ Gold DDR2 800: $118
Total AM2 upgrade: $355

If I go Core 2 Duo, I can find:
C2D E6300: $183
Asus P5L-VM 1394 mobo: $95
1 Gb OCZ Gold DDR2 800: $118
Total C2D upgrade: $396

If I go S939, for less money I could get:
X2 4400+ S939: $249 (the 89W version)
Asus A8N-VM CSM mobo: $77
Reuse my existing 1Gb RAM: $0
Total S939 upgrade: $326

(I'd have to buy a new PCI-X video card no matter what direction I choose, so figure $150-200 for a card that can handle some gaming...unless the built-in nVidia 6150 video is equal or better to my current 128 Mb GeForce 6800, which I doubt)

So I'm not convinced yet it would be worth it to go AM2 or C2D, given that I only upgrade every 2-3 years (my last CPU upgrade was in August 2004). By the time I'm ready to upgrade again, AMD will probably be on Socket AM5 and Intel on Socket W!

ryboto · Post by **ryboto** » Sat Oct 21, 2006 4:32 pm

Anodyne wrote: So I'm not convinced yet it would be worth it to go AM2 or C2D, given that I only upgrade every 2-3 years (my last CPU upgrade was in August 2004). By the time I'm ready to upgrade again, AMD will probably be on Socket AM5 and Intel on Socket W!

I'll have to agree with this statement. Right now, there isn't enough insentive to separate me from my existing 939 system. I can just keep throwing in new video cards. To obtain the same level of memory performace for an am2 ddr2 based system, I have to spend nearly $300 on the same quantity(2gb) of ram. There are 2gb ddr500 kits on newegg selling for ~$200 after rebate.

bobokiki · Post by **bobokiki** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:46 am

I'm building a brand new HTPC and was wondering if there's a major heat difference between the 65W X2 AM2 chips and the 89W X2 939 chips?

The AM2 motherboard I'm looking at doesn't have the features I want but there's a 939 board that does so I'm not sure what to choose. My priority would be silence (preferably passive CPU cooling).

paapaa · Post by **paapaa** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:13 am

Also consider resale value. Buying 939 now would be a very stupid thing to do. AMD will drop the support completely after this year. Nobody wants to buy your old computer. AM2 and 775 will live long (2 years maybe) from now one and there will be buyers at least if you buy a mobo that supports Kentsfield.

The total cost should always include the income you get from selling your old stuff.

Also, comparing 3800+ and E6300 is not very fair. E6300 is more like a 4600+ performance wise. And E6300 can easily be overclocked to...well, whatever you want. The performance potential is huge.

jaganath · Post by **jaganath** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:57 am

I'm building a brand new HTPC and was wondering if there's a major heat difference between the 65W X2 AM2 chips and the 89W X2 939 chips?

Not really, especially not if you undervolt the 939 chip. If you can't find an AM2 mobo that meets your requirements. by all means go for the 939 board, the performance difference is negligible.

stv · Post by **stv** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:53 pm

i do not see to much diference in price and in performance ...

socket 939 is a mature cpu ... but it works very cool
you can save money conserving your ram and can buy a good pasive video card like a gigabyte 7600 pci-e

the video card is one... if no the most loud component in a pc .... (taking away hard drives)

...

Anodyne · Post by **Anodyne** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 4:55 am

Also consider resale value. Buying 939 now would be a very stupid thing to do.

Ouch! Heyyyy......

Nobody wants to buy your old computer. AM2 and 775 will live long (2 years maybe) from now one and there will be buyers at least if you buy a mobo that supports Kentsfield.

Nobody wants to buy old computers around where I live anyway. My office tries to unload its old computers every year by allowing employees to buy them, and it's amazing how little go for. If you keep your computer two years or more before a major upgrade (as I do), then I don't see getting too much return on selling it. Usually I end up using the parts to build an extra machine for family. You can always donate a machine for a tax break but I've found that's often more trouble than it's worth.

Also, comparing 3800+ and E6300 is not very fair. E6300 is more like a 4600+ performance wise. And E6300 can easily be overclocked to...well, whatever you want. The performance potential is huge.

Depends on which benchmarks you look at, but definitely a E6300 is a faster processor that a 3800+. As for the second point, I've read that's very true, but I don't factor in overclocking...today's processors have so much power it doesn't seem worth the hassle. I suspect there are many others like me out there who get a vicarious thrill out of reading about overclocking potential, but never do it!

All that being said, AM2 or C2D are obviously a better long-term purchase. I read recently that the price of memory may begin dropping again soon, so maybe this whole issue will be moot anyway.

paapaa · Post by **paapaa** » Sat Oct 28, 2006 10:59 am

Anodyne wrote:Ouch! Heyyyy......

Ok, sorry if I offeneded anybody

The point is that IF you find a good deal on 939 system, go ahead. But the reasale value should be considered. Who knows if you wanted to upgrade a bit earlier than you initially thought. AM2/775 will be valuable then: you get new parts for them and people want to pay for used parts. At least I always sell my stuff when I buy something new.

Depends on which benchmarks you look at, but definitely a E6300 is a faster processor that a 3800+.

On average E6300 is faster than X2 4200+. Individual benchmarks will vary of course.

As for the second point, I've read that's very true, but I don't factor in overclocking...today's processors have so much power it doesn't seem worth the hassle. I suspect there are many others like me out there who get a vicarious thrill out of reading about overclocking potential, but never do it!

It really depends what you do. But E6300 can be overclocked almost by 100%! - to 3,6 GHz. That really shows in every imaginable application. 5% overclock means nothing but 50% does. This includes gaming, audio encoding, multitasking, photo editing, compiling etc.