New Solo build; component advice needed.

[Edro]

Hi, I’ve been lurking for some time and have been inspired by you guys to do my first PC build.

Any advice you can offer would be much appreciated.

This PC box will sit on the desk next to my monitor and I want it to be somewhat quite. Absolute silence is not necessary though.

The use of this system will be:

- Web browsing (heavy)
- Watch network episodes from websites (moderate) (i.e. NBC’s Heroes)
- Photo editing program (moderate); Photoshop Elements user.
- Photo management and storage (heavy); I take tons of pictures of my family and try to manage it. (download from camera, filter pictures, upload to website)
- Play music from iTunes library (moderate).
- Microsoft Office Suite will be installed and used (moderate).
- No strategy or FPS games at all. I’m not a gamer, but do fancy simple games, but gaming is not the intended purpose.
- Serve as the main PC for WiFi in the future. Not interested in this today but sometime in the future.
- I really want fast. Whether I’m browsing sites or managing my tons of pictures, I would like quick response.
- I would like to have this PC for minimum of 3 years. Upgrading components is doable but the bones of it should stay in place for some time.
- I’d like to keep it simple.
- Not sure if I’ll be running Windows XP or Vista yet.

Here's the list I have in mind:

Case: Antec Solo (already picked one up at a great price)
Power supply: Corsair 450VX
RAM: 4GB SDRAM, G.Skill DDR2 800
CPU: Intel E8400, Core 2 Duo, 3.0GHz
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard
Video card: no idea. $100 budget (HD3870??)
HD: Western Digital 320 GB HD, Caviar SE16 SATA
DVD Burner
Case Fan: Scythe S-FLEX SFF21E (1200rpm) 120mm
CPU Cooler: Thermalright Ultra-120 or Scythe Ninja or Mini Ninja
Cooler fan: Scythe S-FLEX SFF 21D 120mm (800rpm)

I’m considering two (2) WD 320 HD’s (1 system, 1 storage), or one 320GB (system) and one 640GB (storage). Not sure yet.

- Please comment and feel free to provide any feedback.

- I’m at a total loss for video card. I won’t be gaming but would like a solid and stable video card. I’ve budgeted about $100 for the video card. If you know one that would work well please point me in a direction.

- Not totally decided on the heatsink … but I need one that fits the Solo case. The Mini will fit but not sure about the TRU-120? Or is the TRU-120 overkill?

- Any recommendations of one over the other: XP or Vista?

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Ed

[CA_Steve]

Case: Antec Solo (already picked one up at a great price)
Power supply: Corsair 450VX
- your system will draw 120-180W at full load, depending on the vid card.... Then again, your psu fan will never spool up.

RAM: 4GB SDRAM, G.Skill DDR2 800
CPU: Intel E8400, Core 2 Duo, 3.0GHz

Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX
- highly rated board, especially if you wish to overclock your CPU...

Video card: no idea. $100 budget (HD3870??)
- nearly anything will meet your needs. HD4650 would be a good choice. Low power, recent make, a couple of low noise/passive models for $50-75.

HD: Western Digital 320 GB HD, Caviar SE16 SATA
- go for the WD 640GB SE16 blue. Not much more $ and you can use the storage space.

DVD Burner
Case Fan: Scythe S-FLEX SFF21E (1200rpm) 120mm
- go 800rpm or get fan mate II's to adjust the fan rpm down to inaudible.
CPU Cooler: Thermalright Ultra-120 or Scythe Ninja or Mini Ninja
- consider the Xigmatek S1283 with the optional backplate. But any/all will work.

Cooler fan: Scythe S-FLEX SFF 21D 120mm (800rpm)

XP or Vista will meet your needs...until Wndows 7

[Edro]

Thanks CA_Steve.
I'll take a look at the HD4650, WD 640GB blue and Xigmatek.
Thanks so much for your comments.
Ed

[mackworth]

I have:
a Solo
e8400
GA-EP43-DS3L
a mini ninja with stock fan running at 5V
WD 320 gb drive
1 120mm nexus real silent exhaust running at full speed
2 nexus real silent 92mm intakes running at 5V
Asus ATI radeon 4850 running a HR-03 GT with 120MM antec tricool running at low

A similar build to what you are looking at building.

Some observations on my build:

The e8400 is pretty cool. Running the mini ninja with the fan (80mm) at 5v, I could probably just remove it. Computers idles in the 20s and load is in the 50s. It was a bitch to install. There wasn't much room since I installed it with the mobo already in the case. I bought the bolt through kit for it, and plan to install that at some point. Def seems to be handle the e8400.

I wish I had bought a modular power supply! I have a corsair too, and there isn't much room for all that extra power wires. All the extra is just chilling in 5.25 drive bay.

My Vid card gets hot so I need the tricool on low. Will probably replace at some point with a nexus or something. You won't have to worry about this. Just get something single slot, passive, and doesn't sure a lot of power on idle.

Nut sure how much it helped, but I cut out all my fan grills. I also made sure they were all soft mounted. The nexus 120mm seems to do a pretty god job at keeping the case cool. Haven't tried running it lower than 12V. I bought some fan mates before, but with shipping, they just didn't seem like a good value, not to mention you need to open the case to adjust them. I ended up buying,

http://www.performance-pcs.com/catalog/ ... ts_id=4550

It fits in the 3.5inch bay and controls 3 fans from 5V to 12V. The fanmates only go up to 11V, not that that is a huge deal, just FYI. It also comes with a PCI bracket if you don't want it on the front of the case. The reason I picked that one is that it wasn't too expensive, wasn't hideous, and didn't have any LEDs on it. The only downside is that there is no way to monitor fan RPM.

I wish I had just bought 1 large HD, instead of possibly adding a second 320 later. Hard drives are noisy. The solo is nice because it has the suspended drives, but HDs still make a lot of noise. So get 1 large one instead of the 2.

[Asulc]

if you can stretch your budget to a 4670 you will see big improvements. i am not sure how this will affect movie watching activities though...

[CA_Steve]

if you can stretch your budget to a 4670 you will see big improvements. i am not sure how this will affect movie watching activities though...

big improvements over what? movies? his 2D activities? <shrugs>

[Plekto]

viewtopic.php?t=52467

Read my reply at the bottom concerning PAE and extra memory. If you have a 1GB video card, only a bit over 2 GB will be usable out of that 4GB. Also, you are SOL with an Intel chip as the memory controller won't support PAE correctly(despite the chip's core itself being fine with it). Neither will any 32 bit Windows OS(disabled thanks to Microsoft in SP2 for XP) This also affects Vista.

I'd first off recommend an AMD processor as it will handle more memory if the OS will - and properly. But that leaves you with a problem for the OS. You need a 32 bit Windows OS that supports more than 4GB. Only a couple of choices other than going to Linux or similar.

I just have 2GB installed on my windows machine for this exact reason. There's no need to install 4 unless you are planning to purposely kludge/hack your way around the mess to enable PAE under Windows.

[CA_Steve]

His usage is light and he won't have a high RAM video card. This means he'll see maybe 3 to 3.2GB of the 4GB. Good enough for now. If this PC's primary use was professional Photoshop use, the story would be different.

[Edro]

mackworth, thanks for the great feedback on your build.
The thought of installing a CPU cooler while the MB is in the case is not my idea of a good time...you're brave for taking on that headache.

I had thought about a modular power supply but the extra money didn't really seem worth it. I read reviews and thought the modular was more of a luxury. Now that I hear your experience I am seriously thinking about reconsidering.

Thanks for the link for the fan controller. I had been thinking about a controller but wasn't sure I could do one.

Another recommendation for 1 HD. My thoughts were my system would run a bit faster (more efficient) if the pictures sat on their own drive. This way the pics wouldn't be slowing down the main HD. For my use, I guess this isn't really an issue? and wouldn't make that much difference?

Thanks again for your input. It really helped me.

[Edro]

plekto,
thanks for your input. I had read that I wouldn't be able to use all 4GB of the RAM due to the OS. I went back and forth between 2GB and 4GB (but only using about 3GB). I was not sure if the extra GB would make a difference; would it?
I come from the old school of thought that more RAM is better, not sure it applies here though. From a value stand point I thought of it as a wash... the 2GB are $32 ($16/GB) at Newegg, and the 4GB are $46 ($11.50/GB); For the extra $14 I get 3GB and be really paying a unit cost $15.33/GB...pretty much the same as 2GB.

Hence why I'm here...not sure what is worthwhile and what isn't.

[SebRad]

Hi, I have a couple of thoughts:
For video card low-end ATI 4350 or something like that will play movies great and drive any 2D res (check the card has the connector(s) you need, VGA/DVI/HDMI depending on monitor(s)) These's quite a few passive ones around £30 here in UK. They will play games on low settings and modest resolutions and older games just fine. Upgrading the video card in the future if you feel the need isn't difficult.
With the saved money I would suggest 640GB boot drive and 1000+GB data drive. I just checked and 320GB=£40, 640GB=£55 and 1000GB=£75, photos and video just guzzle space!
If you're buying the OS I would suggest looking hard at Vista 64bit. It can support 4GB of RAM properly and more in the future. Most of the compatibility stuff is worked out unless using old unsupported hardware.
I built a Photoshop PC for a friend, Solo, E8400, Gigabyte G35 board, 2x2GB RAM, ATI 3450, WD 640GB + Samsung 1000GB, Vista 64bit and it really flies. (Well it's quicker than the old cruded up P4 2.8 he had before!) Very few problems, low power and quiet (~100w DC load).
Regards, Seb

[Aris]

if your not gamming at all, other than little 2d type games, then you dont need a dedicated video card. Unless your motherboard doesnt have built in video. Anything will work. Get the cheapest passively cooled card you can get. I'd suggest something with a DVI connector though for better picture quality on an LCD monitor.

1 HDD will be less noise and less vibration than 2, even if the one HDD has more platters than the 2 others. Only because with more than one drive, especially if their the same model, where the frequency is ALMOST the same, but just a little off and it creates a horrible noise. So i'd say go with 1 large 5400rpm 1TB western digital GP drive. If you want something faster, get a small SSD for the OS, and then have the 1TB drive for mass storage.

[mackworth]

I had thought about a modular power supply but the extra money didn't really seem worth it. I read reviews and thought the modular was more of a luxury. Now that I hear your experience I am seriously thinking about reconsidering.

I mean its not a huge deal, I am just kind of a neat freak, and it kills me having all that extra power supply wire sitting there in the way. I had built a PC before, but in a much larger case, and I didn't even think of it this time.

I also think that power supplies seem to have a lot more wires with them than they used to, but maybe I am just imagining things. Maybe because they have the PCIe cables, and the sata power, and the molex when before all they had was molex.

[ListysDad]

Hi

FWIW, I'd def go for more than 1 hard drive if, that is, you value your images and videos. Regardless of how long a guarantee, is your hard drive WILL fail.

As a min I'd go for 3. One as a boot, and two (min of 500GB) as a RAID 1 (mirrored). The reason I say this is because I recently lost over 500GB of pictures and videos of my daughter and the WD disk was just 9 months old!

It cost me over £300 to get 'em all back. The recovery people told me that WD drives are notoriously unreliable and that they only use Maxtor/Seagate or Samsung.

I'm just about to build a similar setup and plan to have 6 HDs - 2 in a Raid 1 config, 2 independent copy disks, 1 boot and 1 working data. I also back up business data online at Mozyhome...

I plan to photograph the build and mods (especially PSU mods) to post later.

[Plekto]

I second the raid 1 for important data. WD makes great drives made for raid - their enterprise models - and these are reliable. But they also will die eventually. My record for new drives in the last decade is a bit over two years. Brand seems to make little difference if they are 7200rpm drives.

For $60 for a second drive, raid 1 is a no-brainer. It won't protect you from a corrupted fat or other software issues, but if one drive dies, you can quite literally power down, yank the dead drive, then stick a replacement drive in the machine. It'll take all night, most likely, but it will restore the raid array pretty much seamlessly.(and if it fails/the replacement is bad, the original is still intact) Or you can yank the offending drive and run as a one drive system in a pinch.

[Edro]

Aris, thanks. The Gigabyte MB does not have onboard video so I'll need a card. Noise is a concern with 2 HDDs but I'm not requiring absolute silence..I say that now...I may be back on the HD forum to find ways to keep two HD's quite =). I like the idea of having a storage drive should the boot drive fail...and of course I would back up the storage drive.

I'll have to look into the raid options as I hadn't planned doing one...but my family pictures are very important.

I've looked at two video cards at Newegg, both HD 4650's:
Silent HIS HD 4650
with fan HIS HD 4650

Any feedback on one card over the other?

[TalkinHorse]

For video, the Radeon 4350 should be considered, since it's new, cheap, and fanless. It's the latest technology, and is presumably plenty fast for your intended use. It can also run the new games, but not at the high settings. Probably good enough for a non-gamer.

The Radeon 4550 and 4650 can also be found fanless (due to large heatsinks!), but make sure there's adequate airflow if you go that route.

For fans, the Noctua brand seems to have good real-world results in terms of moving air reliably and quietly. Some other brands turn out to be not as well respected in the field as their specs might indicate. Noctua makes 3 120mm fans.

For disk drives, the WD10EADS (WD Green 1 terabyte) might be worth a glance...not as fast, but maybe fast enough, and low-power and quiet. Yes, as others have suggested, consider RAID 1 if you're concerned about hard disk failures.

[Edro]

Thanks TalkinHorse.
The 4350's I see have 256MB memory with 64-bit memory interface.
The 4650's have 512MB with 128-bit.
Will I see a difference between the 4350 and 4650 video cards?
(There are 4350's with 512MB but are all 64-bit, and at about the same price as the 4650's.)

I'd like to go passive on video as it'll keep noise down but if the fan version is a bit better in the long run then I'll manage.

The Noctua fans get good press and I am considering them also. They are pricier than the Scythe's which is why I initially listed the Scythe's.

[swed]

This is my thoughts:

Maybe a quad, video/photo editing is one of few thing that realy uses the power a quad.

Regarding videocard, I agree with 4350, it's good enough if your not going to play havy games. Or a mobo with onboard grafic.

I also suggest 64-bits OS, and 4 Gb ram.
I've been using it for a year and it's no compatible problems anymore.

1 big storage disk, WD for exemple (back it up), and 1 small OS disk, SSD or as quick as you afford (30 Gb is enough for windows and some programs).

Fore cooling I suggest a tower (HR-01, TRUE, Ninja or 1283) with a Nexus PWM-fan.

Swap the Tricool fan in the Solo for an Noctua S12-1200 with ULNA-adapter.

And I would have taken a modular PSU.


Swed

[TalkinHorse]

This Noctua page comparing their 120mm fans is interesting: http://www.noctua.at/main.php?show=which_fan&lng=en

A Noctua fan costs about $20. That's certainly cheap enough if it's a better fan. But I'm not in a position to proclaim it the best; I'm just noting it gets good buzz.

Note that Noctua also makes CPU heat sinks, which are expensive, but people seem to like them.

The Radeon 4350 is fanless because it draws less than 20 watts under maximum load. The 4650, with 4 times the computing power, may draw as much as about 50 watts, so it needs a more potent cooling solution. My guess is you don't need the greater video power, but that's something to think about. You'll probably choose one of the 4350, 4550, or 4650, since the Radeon 4xxx boards are the newest line with the smallest transistors, so they give the most power per watt.