Advice Needed For High Performance, Compact & Quiet Build

[Rasta_Cook]

Hi,
This is my first post on silentpcreview, i've done a lot of research and i would often land on this forum, so thought I should join in and ask for your advices.

I am going to order my computer next week, i'm having a hard time choosing some parts though and would appreciate your opinions. I will break down all the parts and the reason why I choose them along with alternatives :

Core Component
( those that im 100% sure about )

CPU :
i5 2500k which I will overclock a little.
Motherboard :
Asus P8P67 Deluxe
Memory :
G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) F3-12800CL8D-8GBXM, these are specifically designed for sandy bridge, low wattage high performance. I know that latency/speed doesnt make a noticable difference in gaming, however, I am a HEAVY multi-tasking user, and fast ram helps with multi-tasking. The height of this ram is not given on the spec page, however the heatspreaders are not too tall..
Storage :
1x Crucial ReallSSD C300 + My current WD Caviar Black

"Missing" Component :
(those that im really not sure which one to pick)

VIDEO CARD:
I dont plan on going with a SLI setup, ever. I want a GTX 570, the problem is choosing which one specifically. I have 3 basic options :
1. Asus GTX 570 DirectCU II :
Apparently the most quiet GTX 570 ... It is also quite a large card, measuring 292mm in lenght (11.5in) which gives me a hard time finding a suitable case. It also uses 3 expansion slot ( pci ) due to the large cooler.

2. MSI N570GTX Twin Frozr II :
This card also has a custom cooler, however i cant find any good reviews that looks at the noise, MSI claims it is quieter than stock reference GTX 570. This is my second pick, I had to find a card that was shorter than the asus, this msi measures 268mm and would fit any cases. However I'm not sure about its noise...

3. Any Reference Design GTX 570 :
The reason why I include these is that although these card might potentially be the most noisy, I think that unlike the 2 previous ones their cooling system is mostly closed, so the air gets exhausted outside the case. The asus and msi above have an open heatsink, so hot air would leak inside the case even if they have an exhaust at the back... im not 100% sure about this but i think thats how they are...

POWER SUPPLY:
1. Corsair AX750
OR
2. Corsair AX850
Both offer a nice long warranty so this is why im going with corsair, also their psu are apparently very quiet and quality. Now the only thing is that im not sure which wattage to get. I know the AX750 will be enough power, however, the way the PSU work is that whenever it is bellow 20% of max load, the fan doesnt spin at all, it is in silent mode. When the load is between 20-50% , the fan is in a constant speed "quiet" mode (low rpm), and then, when load is above 50% the fan speed will go up according to load/temps ( cooling mode ).

So the goal here with going with the 850 instead of the 750 would be to avoid reaching 50% load and possibly keep my system under the 20% load limit to be in complete silent mode, however im not sure that is even possible. If both system are going to be in "quiet" mode ( under 50% ) most of the time, then there is no point in paying an extra 20$-30$ or so for the 850...

CPU COOLER / HEATSINK:
1.Noctua NH-U12P SE2 (link):
This heatsink use a tower design. I was thinking I could use this cooler with only 1 fan, and use the other fan somewhere in my case. The noctua fan would probably be quieter than the stock fans coming with whatever case i choose, and with 1 fan i think the heatsink is good enough to keep the slightly overclocked cpu within acceptable temps. Problem with this cooler is that the clearance for the ram is only 40mm and i dont know if that is enough for the g.skill ripjaw x. The noctua fans come with 2 adapters to control speed. I plan on using the medium speed if possible ( LNA adaptor ). height of this cooler is 158mm

2. NH-C12P SE14 link:
This heatsink uses a top flow design. It sends air on the motherboard component which is good i guess. It doesnt come with 2 fans though but it is cheaper than the NH-U12P therefore I can purchase another noctua 120mm fan for my case if i want. This heatsink uses a 140mm fan instead of a 120mm fan, Therefore should be more quiet due to fan being bigger. The main problem with this heatsink is that it would disrupt the airflow in the case, im not sure if this is game-breaking or not, but I think the NH-U12P would be more effective at keeping warm air out of the case since it sends hot air directly at the case rear exhaust fan. Ram clearance is 44mm. so only 4mm more than the NH-U12P.

3. NH-C14 link :
so for maximum ram clearance this heatsink offers 65mm. It also comes with 2 140mm fans, but i will only use 1, the other one will be used in the case if the case has a 140mm fan to replace. This is only in my consideration only because of potential ram clearance issues. I think the NH-C12P is a better single fan top flow because the heatsink fins extend all the way to the bottom of the cpu heatspreader.

CASE:
I want a mid-tower, as compact as possible for carrying around to lan parties once in a while(about 4-6 time per year) :
1. Lian li PC-7FN :
I like the look of this case the most. It is small compact and light. It doesnt have a lot of fan option though ( 1x140mm in front, 1x120mm in back). I'm not sure how but if you look at the spec page, they claim this case can hold a video card up to 430mm in lenght, im not sure if this is a mistake, i find it odd since there is no removable hdd cage... Anyhow, if this is true, it means this is the only case that could definitively hold the asus gtx 570 directcuII. Lian li doesnt specify what is the maximum height for the CPU cooler...

2. Fractal Design Define R3 :
This case is not as nice looking as the first one, however it has some sound dampening material inside. The main problem with this case is that the manufacturer spec page says that the maximum video card size is 290mm, so the asus wouldnt fit in here, unless the manufacturer doesnt give the exact measurement and there is a little buffer... If I go with this case i need to pick either the reference gtx 570 or the MSI twin frozr. This case is probably the most quiet, however it doesnt allow me to get the most quiet hardware ( unless the frozr is as quiet as the asus ). The maximum cpu cooler height for this case is 165mm.

3. BitFenix Survivor :
This case is in third position but i like alot still because it has a collapsible carrying handle. It uses 2x200mm fans which are supposed to be very quiet due to low rpm. The front 200mm fan can be replaced by 2x120mm fans to create positive pressure case and better cooling. This case has a removable hdd cage so the fitting of the asus GTX is not a problem. The cpu cooler height max is 174mm so all coolers can fit.


So there you have it, as you can see im really having a hard time with these component, I hope you guys wont be discouraged by the lenght of this post, i'd really appreciate your help.
Thanks !

[quest_for_silence]

I dont plan on going with a SLI setup, ever. I want a GTX 570, the problem is choosing which one specifically. I have 3 basic options :
1. Asus GTX 570 DirectCU II :
Apparently the most quiet GTX 570 ... It is also quite a large card, measuring 292mm in lenght (11.5in) which gives me a hard time finding a suitable case. It also uses 3 expansion slot ( pci ) due to the large cooler.

I wouldn't rely onto TechPowerUp! findings, their noise floor is simply too high: those ~30dB are unreliable.
I don't know more grounded data about it, at anyway, IF they were plausible, making some ballpark guessworks upon the reference design and the somewhat similarly performing 6950 DCII, the ASUS GTX 570 DCII at best might go around 15-16dB at idle, and up to 17-20dB (or 18-19dB?) at gaming loads, some pretty good results (if they were true).
OTOH those supposed values would seem not fully compatible with the Reference's ones at load: the difference found by TPU! is around 9dB and so, providing the best recorded value for that figure is around 31-32dB, the DCII should go for 22-23dB, and not around the above mentioned 17-20dB (or 18-19dB).

2. MSI N570GTX Twin Frozr II :
This card also has a custom cooler, however i cant find any good reviews that looks at the noise, MSI claims it is quieter than stock reference GTX 570. This is my second pick, I had to find a card that was shorter than the asus, this msi measures 268mm and would fit any cases. However I'm not sure about its noise...

It might be louder than the ASUS: the Twin Frozr II is accounted for 15-16dB at idle, 28-29dB at gaming load for the GTX 580, while for the GTX 560 it should give around 11-13dB at idle and 23-24dB at gaming load (take also note that the TFII even on the 6950 is louder than the DCII).

3. Any Reference Design GTX 570 :
The reason why I include these is that although these card might potentially be the most noisy, I think that unlike the 2 previous ones their cooling system is mostly closed, so the air gets exhausted outside the case. The asus and msi above have an open heatsink, so hot air would leak inside the case even if they have an exhaust at the back... im not 100% sure about this but i think thats how they are...

I think that a reference design coupled with an Arctic Cooling Accelero Xtreme Pro should give substantially better results than any of the above mentioned cards (I suppose around 14-16dB at load when properly dialed down).
Other possible alternative I see are two Gainwards: the oc'ed "Goes Like Hell" at idle should be very quiet (but fairly louder than Reference at load), and their Phantom seems an intriguing design (there's a UK forumer who has just bought it, maybe you might ask to him).

Now the only thing is that im not sure which wattage to get. I know the AX750 will be enough power, however, the way the PSU work is that whenever it is bellow 20% of max load, the fan doesnt spin at all, it is in silent mode. When the load is between 20-50% , the fan is in a constant speed "quiet" mode (low rpm), and then, when load is above 50% the fan speed will go up according to load/temps ( cooling mode ).

I doubt that might be the load to let the fan start: if you give a look to SPCR findings you may see that between 250W and 400W (your supposed wattage should be at most around 330-350W DC) the AX ramps up +10dB while it is in the hotbox (>40°C), while the very same fan stays substantially flat in the open air scenario.
So I argue it's (more) the internal temperature, and not the nominal load, to let the fan start.
At anyway, probably I would consider lower wattage (or even cheaper) units, but those Corsairs seem really fine.

CPU COOLER / HEATSINK:

I don't understand why you have considered just Noctuas: they come clearly at premium, but as for the Corsairs they are still among the best.
If you don't plan to have more than two sticks, you should be not worried about the ram clearance. If you're really worried, a tower design (maybe a slim one like some Thermalright or Prolimatech) may be best suited (my Dominators don't fit under my Orochi).
All Noctua fans deserve to be driven well under the nominal voltage: so you have to plan a very effective fan control (hardware or SpeedFan).
Eventually the C12 seem not on the same league, however, with reference to cooling power.

CASE:
I want a mid-tower, as compact as possible for carrying around to lan parties once in a while(about 4-6 time per year) :
1. Lian li PC-7FN :
I like the look of this case the most. It is small compact and light. It doesnt have a lot of fan option though ( 1x140mm in front, 1x120mm in back). I'm not sure how but if you look at the spec page, they claim this case can hold a video card up to 430mm in lenght, im not sure if this is a mistake, i find it odd since there is no removable hdd cage... Anyhow, if this is true, it means this is the only case that could definitively hold the asus gtx 570 directcuII. Lian li doesnt specify what is the maximum height for the CPU cooler...

The PC-A05N seems to me better suited for a lan party machine, or a compact, unobtrusive tower: it's smaller and lighter, it might also accomodate the ASUS DCII in the white slot. It should also offer a very good cooling with the optional top panel (or with some mods).
About the CPU heatsink, both those Lian-Li may fit cooler tall up to 180mm.
Give a look to Joseph Clemente's one in the General gallery.

2. Fractal Design Define R3 :

It isn't definitely a party tower, but it's also the most quiet for an oobe. Is it really preferable over the P183V3? Someone says it's much more easily workable than the Antec, but it's also less sturdy. Surely the R3 has better fans.

3. BitFenix Survivor :
This case is in third position but i like alot still because it has a collapsible carrying handle. It uses 2x200mm fans which are supposed to be very quiet due to low rpm. The front 200mm fan can be replaced by 2x120mm fans to create positive pressure case and better cooling. This case has a removable hdd cage so the fitting of the asus GTX is not a problem. The cpu cooler height max is 174mm so all coolers can fit.

It seems to me you might do a similar "mistake" to the one I've made with my Corsair 600T: I'm unable to really quietening its 200mm fans, but without them it isn't so good at cooling. Be careful with this enclosure.
Build quality is clearly inferior to Lian-Li and even FD.

Last but not least, if you don't use an ODD you may also give a look to Druneau's modded NSK3480 in the General gallery, it's probably the most compact option capable to fit the ASUS DCII.

[Rekonn]

No SLI, only two hard drives, and a need to be compact for lan parties... how about a PC-A04B? It's mATX, but Asus makes a P67 mATX mobo. For comparison:

PC-A04B Review Link
18.1 x 7.4 x 15.2
9 pounds

PC-7FN
19.3 x 8.3 x 18.5
12 pounds

The A04B has two 120mm intake fans in front, one 120mm top exhaust, so cooling shouldn't be an issue. Should be able to fit any vid card with 2nd hard drive cage removed. Only thing you'd need to check is the height of your cpu cooler.

[figment]

POWER SUPPLY:
1. Corsair AX750
OR
2. Corsair AX850

The Corsair AX-Series is just the re-badged Seasonic X-Series. The AX750 is the same as the Seasonic X750. Currently its about $5 cheaper than the X750, with a rebate. However, sometimes you can find the X750 cheaper.

However, for that, you might as well drop down to the Seasonic X650 (which Corsair doesn't seem to have a copy of) which should still meet your needs but is $15 cheaper. As other people have pointed out, the point that the fan kicks on seems to be triggered more by temperature than load percentage, and since temperature is driven more by raw wattage than load percentage, it won't really matter which wattage you pick, so long as it meets your minimum.

EDIT: Actually, looking at the components again, you could possibly even use the PSU I was planning to use for my 2500K build: The SS-560KM , with a $35 savings.

[ces]

Memory :G.SKILL Ripjaws X Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) F3-12800CL8D-8GBXM, these are specifically designed for sandy bridge, low wattage high performance. I know that latency/speed doesnt make a noticable difference in gaming, however, I am a HEAVY multi-tasking user, and fast ram helps with multi-tasking.

The issue of the importance of memory speed is one that has troubled me from time to time. I followed your link, and it seems like you have to really speed up the memory to get only a modest improvment in their benchmark performance.

I have an open question, how do the performance gains charted here actually translate into user experience. What exactly are they measuring... and what attribute of the multi-tasking experience is speed up with the faster memory? Does anyone know?

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/memory ... y-bridge/5

[ces]

POWER SUPPLY:
1. Corsair AX750
OR
2. Corsair AX850
Both offer a nice long warranty so this is why im going with corsair, also their psu are apparently very quiet and quality. Now the only thing is that im not sure which wattage to get. I know the AX750 will be enough power, however, the way the PSU work is that whenever it is bellow 20% of max load, the fan doesnt spin at all, it is in silent mode. When the load is between 20-50% , the fan is in a constant speed "quiet" mode (low rpm), and then, when load is above 50% the fan speed will go up according to load/temps ( cooling mode ).

So the goal here with going with the 850 instead of the 750 would be to avoid reaching 50% load and possibly keep my system under the 20% load limit to be in complete silent mode, however im not sure that is even possible. If both system are going to be in "quiet" mode ( under 50% ) most of the time, then there is no point in paying an extra 20$-30$ or so for the 850...

How much of your time are you going to spend gaming? Why not go with a seasonic x-750 which has enough horsepower and most of the time will be silent.

[ces]

2. NH-C12P SE14 link:
This heatsink uses a top flow design. It sends air on the motherboard component which is good i guess. It doesnt come with 2 fans though but it is cheaper than the NH-U12P therefore I can purchase another noctua 120mm fan for my case if i want. This heatsink uses a 140mm fan instead of a 120mm fan, Therefore should be more quiet due to fan being bigger. The main problem with this heatsink is that it would disrupt the airflow in the case, im not sure if this is game-breaking or not, but I think the NH-U12P would be more effective at keeping warm air out of the case since it sends hot air directly at the case rear exhaust fan. Ram clearance is 44mm. so only 4mm more than the NH-U12P.

It is pretty hard to predict airflow. It might help, it might hurt. It is too complicated to follow logic. It is an issue that exists, but if you can't predict it maybe you shouldn't use it.

[ces]

No SLI, only two hard drives, and a need to be compact for lan parties... how about a PC-A04B? It's mATX, but Asus makes a P67 mATX mobo. For comparison:

PC-A04B Review Link
18.1 x 7.4 x 15.2
9 pounds

PC-7FN
19.3 x 8.3 x 18.5
12 pounds

The A04B has two 120mm intake fans in front, one 120mm top exhaust, so cooling shouldn't be an issue. Should be able to fit any vid card with 2nd hard drive cage removed. Only thing you'd need to check is the height of your cpu cooler.

Lian Li A05 = W 8.27; H 15.00; D 19.29; It is smaller, lighter and takes either an ATX or micro-ATX. And it is relatively inexpensive.

[ces]

All Noctua fans deserve to be driven well under the nominal voltage: so you have to plan a very effective fan control (hardware or SpeedFan). Eventually the C12 seem not on the same league, however, with reference to cooling power.

You can just set their fans on low using their special power cables. They can pretty much handle any load OK and very quietly on low (excluding artificial benchmarking)... especially their new downdraft.

The PC-A05N seems to me better suited for a lan party machine, or a compact, unobtrusive tower: it's smaller and lighter, it might also accomodate the ASUS DCII in the white slot. It should also offer a very good cooling with the optional top panel (or with some mods).
About the CPU heatsink, both those Lian-Li may fit cooler tall up to 180mm.

Agreed.

[Rasta_Cook]

No SLI, only two hard drives, and a need to be compact for lan parties... how about a PC-A04B? It's mATX, but Asus makes a P67 mATX mobo. For comparison:

PC-A04B Review Link
18.1 x 7.4 x 15.2
9 pounds

The Lian-Li PC-A04B does look nice, but I'm not sure about going with a mATX... i used asus comparison tool to compare the p8p67-m pro (matx) and the p8p67 deluxe (atx) and i notice a lot of missing features on the smaller board. Although I dont know if all these missing features are really game-breaking, most of them i dont quite understand and I would have to do extensive research on each feature to know if i want it or not... At this point the thought of more research is just exasperating...

I say that I dont want sli, but who knows maybe in 2-3 years when my system starts to get slow and choppy i might upgrade to sli, i doubt it but its nice to have this option. Lan parties isnt the main usage of this system either, I dont expect to be doing more than 4-6 lan parties per year, so as long as the computer is not too bulky ( such as the Silverstone FT02 which I considered at some point but discarded due to huge size ) then its fine.

However, for that, you might as well drop down to the Seasonic X650 (which Corsair doesn't seem to have a copy of) which should still meet your needs but is $15 cheaper. As other people have pointed out, the point that the fan kicks on seems to be triggered more by temperature than load percentage, and since temperature is driven more by raw wattage than load percentage, it won't really matter which wattage you pick, so long as it meets your minimum.

I decided, i will get the AX750, its overkill but it has 7year warranty, better than seasonic. The fan speed might be dictaged by a combinaison of temps and load, so in anycase, my system should be within the 50% load limit.

I don't understand why you have considered just Noctuas: they come clearly at premium, but as for the Corsairs they are still among the best. All Noctua fans deserve to be driven well under the nominal voltage: so you have to plan a very effective fan control (hardware or SpeedFan).
Eventually the C12 seem not on the same league, however, with reference to cooling power.

Noctua comes with 6 year warranty. Noctua comes with 2 speed adaptors, for adjusting speed... I've done a lot of research on CPU coolers, there are so many. During my research one brand CONSISTENTLY came back again and again : Noctua. I am open to other suggestions though, noctua's are really ugly anyways ( but i dont care i dont want a window on my case) ... which corsair model are you talking about ? I'd rather avoid watercooling... So what is the best heatsink you guys recommend, for quiet and efficient cooling of a slightly overclocked i5 2500k ?


How about the video card guys ? any recommendation ? ... Actually, I still need to decide on case, heatsink, and video card...

[ces]

I am open to other suggestions though, noctua's are really ugly anyways ( but i dont care i dont want a window on my case) ...

The Noctuas frequently perform better (quieter and cooler) with Nexus fans (source: SPCR Reviews). Those are pretty looking fans.

But there always perform well with the Noctua fans. And there is a certain simplicity and elegance in just setting the fans at low and forgetting them. Nexus fans you need to muck around with... you need to worry about startup voltage... you have to think.

And I believe that the Noctua fans are much longer lasting, especially when run horizontally. If you run them on slow there is very little to complain about them with respect to sound or cooling.... unless you are a compulsive overclocker.

[ces]

Noctua comes with 6 year warranty.

In some respects it is a lifetime warranty. So far with each new CPU they have provided free mounting kits to old customers. No one else does that. That alone is worth 3-5C in performance... maybe more.

And the fans have something like a 120,000 hour design life. What's that 10 to 12 years and then 1 of the 2 fans on your heat sink is still running? In 10 years computers won't even look like they look now.

[quest_for_silence]

which corsair model are you talking about ?

I'm sorry, I haven’t made myself clear, I was referring to the two Corsair AX PSUs, I meant that they were expensive and maybe overpriced but also among the current very best PSUs.

So what is the best heatsink you guys recommend, for quiet and efficient cooling of a slightly overclocked i5 2500k ?

A cheap Cooler Master Hyper 212+ paired with a good PWM fan (as some Scythes, or the Enermax Cluster) is already more than adequate for an oc'ed 2500k.
Noctuas U12, C14 or D14 are higher quality products, which are clearly better (they edge the CM up to 2-3°C at low noise levels), but for a steep price.
For other options, you may look at SPCR Reference/Recommended chart.

How about the video card guys ? any recommendation ? ... Actually, I still need to decide on case, heatsink, and video card...

If I would need the most quiet out-of-the-box high performance card, probably I would go for an ASUS HD-6950 DirectCU-II.
If I would need the most quiet out-of-the box card with some performance penalties, maybe I would go for the MSI R6870 Twin Frozr II.
If you are enough able to tweak fan curves and/or VGA BIOS, pick your favourite card and tweak it to reach lower noise levels: otherwise pick the Arctic Cooling Accelero Extreme Pro, slap on a compatible graphic card and enjoy its qualities.