Which board for a Core 2 Duo mobile model (T series) ?

[Kaoru]

For my combo HTPC+PVR system, have I finally chosen a CPU based on comments I got. As well as having read SPCRs articles on undervolting & underclocking and THGs articles on overclocking a Core 2 Duo.
I picked a Core 2 Duo T5500, due to its cost and 667FSB. It costs ~190 EUR (~$257 US). I expect to undervolt, and maybe underclock, it but aint ruling OC'ing out. Wether I UV, UC or OC it will depend on how well it preforms.

Next step is finding a motherboard, which is why Im posting this. HELP needed!
There is only a few MBs which are mATX or smaller available from stores in my area. Some are listed as using socket "478 (mobile)" and others "socket 479", but didnt they were a problem. Was I wrong ?
They are:

• ABIT IL-90MV MB @ Abit
• MSI 945GT Speedster-A4R (not sure it supports Core 2 Duo T-series) MB @ MSI
• AOpen I945GTm-VHL (not sure it supports Core 2 Duo T-series) MB @ AOpen
• ASUS N4L-VM DH (not sure it supports Core 2 Duo T-series) MB @ ASUS

Motherboads added since first post:

• GA-8I945GMMFY-RH specs here (suggest by Mats)
• MSI Fuzzy 945GM2 specs here (suggest by Mats) - however I find Fuzzy 945GM1 fits my needs better, but it does lack a PCIe x16 slot giving no option to add a dedicated GFX (with tuner features). Room for a dual-tuner PCI card might be problem. Specs here

What I need of the motherboard:

• Form size MUST be smaller than ATX (I only listed mATA boards. You can suggest others.)
• 667MHz FSB support (this implies that DDR2 is required which isnt a problem)
• 1x Tuner PCI/PCIe x1 (can be via riser card) OR 1x GFX with tuner features
• 1x HDMI/DVI from onboard GFX (or the GFX/Tuner card needs HDMI/DVI. which is better?)
• 1-2x SATA-150 support
• Support for DVD-burner (Is there any difference between a sata and ide/ata drive? ATA-100 is fine, but ATA-133 prefered as its faster)
• Onboard sound (optical out perfered) & LAN 100Mbit (1000Mbit w/jumbo frame support perfered)

I didnt list connectors for PS/2, USB or firewire on purpose as all MBs have something to cover this group.

ABIT IL-90MV matches best while not being costly (~161 EUR / ~$216 US), but is it the best choice ?

[Delta_42]

The Asus supports C2D with a Bios update and I would imagine that most i945 boards support it.

I'm running a T7200 on the Asus board.

The biggest drawbacks about the Asus board are the limited BIOS options and the proprietary HSF mount. Although it doesn't meet some of your other criteria (i.e DVI out from onboard GFX)

I've never seen a pci-e 16x tuner! All the tuners I've seen are either PCI or PCIe-x1. I wouldn't have thought they'd need any more bandwidth than that. Unless you are looking at an all-in-one ATI solution that is a GFX card as well.

[Kaoru]

The biggest drawbacks about the Asus board are the limited BIOS options and the proprietary HSF mount. Although it doesn't meet some of your other criteria (i.e DVI out from onboard GFX)

I looked at the asus forum, found here, and noticed it had quite alot OC and boot problems/topics as well as some other problems, which made me think that asus was still not out the early fase (hence less tested).

I've never seen a pci-e 16x tuner! All the tuners I've seen are either PCI or PCIe-x1. I wouldn't have thought they'd need any more bandwidth than that. Unless you are looking at an all-in-one ATI solution that is a GFX card as well.

You are right - I got confused and did infact mean a GFX card with tuner features, like a ATI MSI Theater 650 Pro (note: just an example. not stating it fits my needs). My error has been corrected, thanks.

[Mats]

First of all, where do you live?

I'd recommend buying a T5200 instead. It runs at 1600 MHz, but the FSB runs at 133 MHz. If you raise the FSB to 166 MHz (pin mod) you can run it at 2000 MHz.

If you want to keep the costs down and you don't need 64 bit functionality then get the T2250. It runs at 13 x 133 = 1733 MHz, and with the same trick as above you should get 13 x 166 = 2167 MHz.

Checkout Gigabyte GA-8I945GMMFY-RH. Maybe it doesn't have all the connectors you need, I dunno. More info here.

If you need a smaller MB then have a look at this, also here.

Both mobos have PCIe x16 slots, and P4 mounting holes for heatsinks, very important to me.

[audiojunk]

All the boards you mention are bad OC and under voltage in the bios is no option either,you can only change the fsb but you don't need to undervoltage because with Eist the mobo clocks the CPU automatically down.
I have the Asus with a T2600 and it runs most of the time at 1Ghz@1V(6*166) and if necessary it runs at 2,16Ghz@1,25V(13*166).
I have no problems with the Asus mobo but if you use and old bios it's a hell if you believe the forums.

[Kaoru]

First of all, where do you live?

Europe, which is also stated in the first thread.

I'd recommend buying a T5200 instead. It runs at 1600 MHz, but the FSB runs at 133 MHz. If you raise the FSB to 166 MHz (pin mod) you can run it at 2000 MHz.

If you want to keep the costs down and you don't need 64 bit functionality then get the T2250. It runs at 13 x 133 = 1733 MHz, and with the same trick as above you should get 13 x 166 = 2167 MHz.

Cost isnt an issue and I prefer not modding. Besides I would only be saving 4 EUR when switching from T5500 to T5200, so native/true 166MHz is worth that to me.

Both mobos have PCIe x16 slots, and P4 mounting holes for heatsinks, very important to me.

Why do you want P4 mounting holes (guessing you also have/want a Core 2 Duo) ?

@audiojunk: I have read, elsewhere on this forum, that even with undervolting EIST will reduce it further. Best of the two IMO.

[Mats]

I meant of course where in Europe.

I thought cost was an issue since you've choosen the cheapest C2D "due to it's cost", and you liked the Abit board since it's "not being costly".
For the same reason I recommended the T2250, an €120 CPU that gives you the performance of a €385 CPU with a simple mod.

You missed the point witt the T5200. It got a higher multiplier (x12), just like the T7200. So if you run the T5200 with a FSB = 166 MHz it runs at 2 GHz. The only difference then is L2 cache size. The T5500 have a multiplier of 10.

P4, or any kind of desktop CPU mounting holes, is very good to have when you're choosing heatsink, because you can choose from hundreds of models and just about any old oversized model will do just fine with this CPU, like a four year old Zalman CNPS7000. There's no standard for MoDT CPU's, and the mounting system on the Asus mobo for instance makes virtually impossible to change cooler.

[jaganath]

I have read, elsewhere on this forum, that even with undervolting EIST will reduce it further. Best of the two IMO.

Is it not the case if you undervolt in BIOS you lose EIST? This is the case w/ CnQ, but EIST may be different. Could you link to the thread where you read this?

[Delta_42]

the mounting system on the Asus mobo for instance makes virtually impossible to change cooler.

In a case with good airflow, all you need is one of these little beauties and the retention bracket off the Asus HSF.

However, I agree with the general point that with socket 478 mounts you have dozens of coolers to choose from, whereas with the Asus you have a few northbridge coolers to choose from and they have to be modded to fit.

[Kaoru]

Using Intels product finder, http://processorfinder.intel.com/List.aspx?ProcFam=2643, I didnt noticed any T5200. However I did notice that T5600 something Intel calls Virtualization Technology, http://www.intel.com/cd/channel/reselle ... 250640.htm, and I wonder its worth having. I dont plan on using virtual servers on my HTPC, but maybe it improves performence.
I did learn one thing - socket 479 is for OEMs only, as they dont have a boxed version.

@Mats:
Thought you meant in which part of the world, but I live in Denmark. Right next to Sweden

Im limited to buying from shops in my country, unless I can pay when recieving the item. About the cost - while its not an issue I see no point in paying the extra buck for something with none to minor performance gain. Common sense.

The only place I see a T5200 is in laptops, and not sold separately like the one you linked to at the german shop. All T5x00 have the same L2 cache size.
From reviews, the boxed heatsink/fan should provide enough cooling even if OC'ed some. So dont plan on buying another heatsink, unless it makes too much noise. I've always used the boxed stock, even my P4 prescott is using stock without heat or noise problems.

@jaganath: Couldnt find it, but found other statements that supports yours. So I stand corrected, once again

Too bad there isnt a good database with computer parts so you can find the items you want (based on wanted/unwanted features). Every shop uses its own

[jojo4u]

You can get DVI for the Gigabyte with an ADD2-card (I tried this). I own this board and it's a workhorse but no OC possible, except pin-modding a 533 MHz CPU. Power-consumption is not too great either, but that's because of the PEG. The only noteably thing is the P4 retention bracket, but keep in mind that the heigth of a mobile CPU is lower.

[nzimmers]

I use the MSI speedster 945GT, had it for about two months now and really like it alot. it has the advantage of having 4xSata (3gb/s) and also 2xGB lan and the PCI-E slot is 16X and of course the most important thing is that it has standard socket 478 holes for 3rd party heatsinks. you can adjust the FSB multiplier and the memory divider if necessary to get a good solid 20% over clock.

I am using mine as a HTPC/Server and it's great now that I have all the kinks worked out