any Socket P MotD mobo's out yet?

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Aris
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any Socket P MotD mobo's out yet?

Post by Aris » Sun Jun 17, 2007 9:50 am

its in the title. New Core 2 Duo (still merom core?) use a new socket P, with bus speeds up to 800mhz. Ive heard its not pin compatible with socket M, though it has the same number of pins.

Need somthin in a micro-atx or a mini-itx.

mar2k
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Post by mar2k » Sun Jun 17, 2007 8:10 pm

I'm desperately waiting for a Socket P MoDT motherboard as well. Intel had clearly stated it intended to push smaller desktop form factors with the Santa Rosa release and the 965GM chipset and that it fully intended to push it as a desktop as well as mobile platform. In fact, I had thought Intel might even release their own mATX MoDT motherboard along with Santa Rosa.

At the very least, I expected some news from Taiwanese motherboard manufacturers at Computex 2007 regarding new Socket P MoDT boards but there was zero news on this. Aopen, who seems to really push MoDT announced a MiniPC based on 965GM but no sign of a Socket P motherboard from them yet. The Socket P C2D chips are readily available at this point but no desktop boards support them.

snowy
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Post by snowy » Wed Jun 20, 2007 11:48 pm

I currently have a ASUS N4L MB + T7200 cpu in a low power application. Would
I get reduced power usage with the newer socket p chips (T7300??).

Where can you buy the socket p cpus ??

Thanks

Aris
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Post by Aris » Thu Jun 21, 2007 2:43 pm

the new santa rosa chips are basically just the same as current merom's except with an 800mhz bus speed. not really any reduction in power, just increased performance.

newegg has the new socket P chips.

dvdmonster
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Post by dvdmonster » Sat Jun 23, 2007 10:51 pm

I'm waiting for the new motherboards as well, but it seems like it can be a long wait. :cry:

It's pretty hard to understand since Intel had clearly stated that they intended to push those new mobile chips for desktop use like mar2k wrote.

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Post by smilingcrow » Sun Jun 24, 2007 9:37 am

Aris wrote:the new santa rosa chips are basically just the same as current merom's except with an 800mhz bus speed. not really any reduction in power, just increased performance.
With the right chipset they are capable of reducing the FSB to 400MHz at idle which gives a speed of 600MHz, which should allow a lower VCore.
Hopefully by the time motherboards are released for these they will have a VRM that will support the next generation 45nm chips which probably use the same socket.

Surprisingly, these chips are listed starting at lower prices than for the 667 FSB versions; Intel are very aggressive with pricing these days.
The T7100 1.8GHz is £112 in the UK

Aris
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Post by Aris » Sun Jun 24, 2007 9:02 pm

im not holding my breath on the "it should support future 45nm chips" thing. every single time intel has put out a new mobile chip, its been with a new socket. and the last 3 times they did it is has had the exact same number of pins each time, just with slight physical differences to make them incompatible.

I get the clue intel, you dont want us upgrading your processors without a new board.

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Post by smilingcrow » Mon Jun 25, 2007 3:20 am

Aris wrote:im not holding my breath on the "it should support future 45nm chips" thing. every single time intel has put out a new mobile chip, its been with a new socket. and the last 3 times they did it is has had the exact same number of pins each time, just with slight physical differences to make them incompatible.
I get the clue intel, you dont want us upgrading your processors without a new board.
Surely these socket P chips would need a new chipset to support the dynamic FSB feature anyway (and possibly other changes) so whether the socket is compatible is then an irrelevance! Even if they fitted they would lose functionality.

Banias (130nm) and Dothan (90nm) were pin compatible and there’s a very good chance that the first generation 45nm chips will be compatible as the plan seems to be to introduce the 45nm CPUs for the current Santa Rosa platform and only upgrade the platform later; to Montevina. That introduces the new socket $ :D
Montevina supports 1066 FSB, so I imagine there will penyrns at multiple FSB speeds as is usual for Intel.

There are supposed to be issues with VRM support for Penryn so that’s worth looking into if you’re concerned about upgrade potential.

dvdmonster
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Post by dvdmonster » Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:30 pm

smilingcrow wrote: With the right chipset they are capable of reducing the FSB to 400MHz at idle which gives a speed of 600MHz, which should allow a lower VCore.
Can the 965M chipset do this or is this long into the future?

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Post by smilingcrow » Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:17 pm

dvdmonster wrote:
smilingcrow wrote: With the right chipset they are capable of reducing the FSB to 400MHz at idle which gives a speed of 600MHz, which should allow a lower VCore.
Can the 965M chipset do this or is this long into the future?
The current mobile platform supports this feature; I don’t know which chipset is the latest.

zistu
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Post by zistu » Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:42 pm

MSI recently presented and announced a mainboard based on the Santa Rosa chipset. Though I haven't found any exact details on CPU supported by the board, I suspect it will support the new 800MHz FSB model Mobile CPUs.

MSI Fuzzy GM965 (Better Fuzzy than Furry I guess?)

MSI Press release (first board) with picture. The board has been shown on some trade shows, additional pictures and some other information can be dug up through Google.

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Post by smilingcrow » Fri Jun 29, 2007 2:20 am

zistu wrote:MSI recently presented and announced a mainboard based on the Santa Rosa chipset. Though I haven't found any exact details on CPU supported by the board, I suspect it will support the new 800MHz FSB model Mobile CPUs.

MSI Fuzzy GM965 (Better Fuzzy than Furry I guess?).
It's a mini-ITX board so a bit limited for some purposes.

For detailed info on the PM965 go here:
http://www.intel.com/design/mobile/datashts/316273.htm

Its replacement will support 1066 FSB and possibly DDR3 and no doubt other power management tweaks; maybe a new version of Turbo Memory also. It’s all about the platform, not the socket. :o

dvdmonster
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Post by dvdmonster » Fri Jul 06, 2007 2:22 am

Still no news of a socket-P motherboard i guess.

I wonder when we can expect one, since the much lower price on the new 800mhz CPU's are making the old socket 479 boards a terrible buy right now.

I'm almost giving up waiting on the MoDT Socket-P's and getting a Gigabyte P35-DS4 or Gigabyte P35-DQ6, but that would be a real shame for the environment :lol:

zistu
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Post by zistu » Fri Jul 06, 2007 11:06 am

I did the same unfortunately. My regular supplier no longer has the "old" Core 2 Duo mobile CPUs listed. For the new ones I haven't been able to find a mainboard that'd suit me for my needs or even become available soon.

I wanted to use the MoDT for a small development and media server which runs 24/7, nothing fancy really. But the reduced power use should have saved me some bucks, though I am not sure if it could use less than the Pentium III 500 I am using now.

For now I think I am going for a regular C2D setup (mb, cpu) that meets my needs. When new MoDT or similar solutions pop up I'll turn it into a media machine or a low end workstation, and build a new system again from scratch.

Sad really, I was looking forward to that build, it would have been good fun and I was hoping to use it as an example to convince other people that do not use their computers very intensively to go MoTD as well when they could see the performance and benefits. But sadly that has to wait now.

I really hope the industry will pick up on this again, but I'm not going to hold my breath.

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Post by smilingcrow » Fri Jul 06, 2007 11:34 am

dvdmonster wrote:Still no news of a socket-P motherboard i guess.
I wonder when we can expect one, since the much lower price on the new 800mhz CPU's are making the old socket 479 boards a terrible buy right now.
In the UK the S479 motherboards have really come down in price; I managed to pick up an Asus board as a clearance offer for £35 but that was a fluke.
The Core Duo CPUs are also very cheap on eBay if you don’t mind going that route; the low end Core 2 Duo mobile chips cost more and generally go for £40 to £70.

The socket P chips are a bit cheaper right now but you can expect the socket P motherboards to be expensive when they are first released which is the usual way of things. So I don’t think Socket P is going to be a cheap platform when it first arrives when compared to S479.

Juventas
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Post by Juventas » Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:04 pm

At work we're an Intel channel partner. They send us product roadmaps that have NDAs but anything exciting gets out on the internet the same day. As far as I can remember, Intel has never released a desktop motherboard themselves for mobile processors. I guess what's really important is how much they're working with other OEMs to get their mobile chipsets into other motherboards.

The Intel D201GLY was a complete surprise. It wasn't in their roadmaps, and they've never sold a cpu-soldered-to-motherboard package ever. It's not even their own chipset!

They also offer us "demo" models of select products, and just a couple weeks ago they added a T7300 (socket P). It's odd because I have no idea what they would want us to do with it. If anything it's probably a positive sign.

Fscp
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Post by Fscp » Wed Jul 25, 2007 12:08 pm

The whole Santa Rosa on Desktop situation has surprised me too, before the introduction Intel intended to push the platform. But so far the only consumer product adopting it is the Aopen MiniPC MP965, but it's a barebone, so not very flexible or suitable for everyone. Availability of that model is scarce too, at least here in the Netherlands, no distributor or shop carriers the product although it has been introduced in May.

I am not very tempted to buy the previous generation based on socket 479, as it's chipsets are pretty old and the socket will probably be dead within a year.

Still I would be interested to know why socket P is almost a complete failure from the start on the desktop. I knew adoption would be slow, but the introduction of 1 or 2 boards would have gathered enough early adopters i guess from the silent and low power front.

lunadesign
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May have found one

Post by lunadesign » Fri Jul 27, 2007 11:50 pm

If I'm not mistaken, I think I've just stumbled across the first Santa Rosa Socket P MODT motherboard:

PC Partner GM965IS4-AC5GM
http://www.pcpartner.com/product_detail ... 253-294128

I've never heard of this manufacturer before.....anybody have any experience with these guys?

The other thing that's odd is that it mentions the GM965 chipset but lists the GMA950 onboard graphics while I thought GM965 was supposed to come with GMA X3100. Could be a copy-n-paste error from an old 945GM mobo spec sheet.

Last note: if you Google the part number, you'll only find one hit - the URL above. Must be brand new.

Mats
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Post by Mats » Sat Jul 28, 2007 1:45 am

Found some more info about the MSI mobo. It must be the successor to this board.
One more RAM slot, one more mini PCI slot, but no PCIe slot and no P4 mounting holes, compared to the older model.

Larry
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Post by Larry » Sat Jul 28, 2007 8:58 am

Also interested in the MoDT concept and have only found the aOpen 965 systems so far. I do have a question regarding the Santa Rosa - Socket P systems. I remember once reading that they were also going to have some other features in addition to the faster FSB and FSB throttling. There was something about the system being able to shut down one core if it's a single threaded application and overclock the active core to a point where it still stays within the total thermal envelope as if both cores were working. Did this feature ever come to pass? If so I assume it would require explicit BIOS support and haven't seen any info if the aOpen miniPC 965 products have implemented the feature.

mar2k
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Re: May have found one

Post by mar2k » Sat Jul 28, 2007 7:09 pm

lunadesign wrote:If I'm not mistaken, I think I've just stumbled across the first Santa Rosa Socket P MODT motherboard:

PC Partner GM965IS4-AC5GM
http://www.pcpartner.com/product_detail ... 253-294128

I've never heard of this manufacturer before.....anybody have any experience with these guys?
Never heard of them. Not sure I would be dependent on them for BIOS updates. That info looks really conflicting. all GM965 chipsets have the X3100 graphics, not GMA 950, also shows DDR2-667 instead of 800 FSB supported by Santa Rosa. Another Mini-ITX as well, not much you can do with it.

Newegg has been out of the N4L-VM socket 479 board for weeks. Definitely seems the board may be discontinued...seem to be running out of MoDT options even for the Socket M CPUs......

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Re: May have found one

Post by hmsrolst » Sun Jul 29, 2007 2:11 am

mar2k wrote: Newegg has been out of the N4L-VM socket 479 board for weeks. Definitely seems the board may be discontinued...seem to be running out of MoDT options even for the Socket M CPUs......
AOpen i945GTm-VHL is available in several places now for less than $120. I have two and they've been just great--totally stable--just bought a third. Two big advantages over the ASUS board are that it has a standard S478 mounting bracket and it has onboard DVI output.

mar2k
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Post by mar2k » Wed Aug 01, 2007 7:21 pm

I'm tempted to pull the trigger on the i945GTm-VHL but I keep thinking that a Socket P motherboard will come out any day from Aopen. The retail boxed mobile CPUs maintain their price point unlike the desktop CPUs where there are massive price drops so this makes the decision harder.

Not sure what OS you are running but I plan on installing Vista so I am wondering how well the GMA 950 would keep up with the UI eye candy turned on (Aero Glass/Flip 3D/etc)

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Post by jessekopelman » Wed Aug 01, 2007 10:11 pm

mar2k wrote:Not sure what OS you are running but I plan on installing Vista so I am wondering how well the GMA 950 would keep up with the UI eye candy turned on (Aero Glass/Flip 3D/etc)
I've read several reports saying GMA950 runs Aero effects fine . . . I have a 945G based board, but my Vista upgrade DVD is sitting in it's case awaiting the release of SP1 before installation.

In addition to low TDP, the thing that really intrigues me about the idea of MODT is that these mobile chips have such a high Thermal Specification -- 100C vs. 73C for even the newest steppings of Intel's desktop chips. Keeping the other items on the MB cool will be a bigger concern than the CPU.

GnatGoSplat
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Post by GnatGoSplat » Thu Aug 02, 2007 5:07 am

jessekopelman wrote:I've read several reports saying GMA950 runs Aero effects fine
It does. My wife's laptop has the GMA950 and is running Vista Ultimate. Aero theme works perfectly.
Shawn

derekva
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Yup...

Post by derekva » Tue Aug 07, 2007 8:40 pm

The GMA950 chipset is fine for Aero Glass...just not for gaming (case in point: my wife's Dell E1505 laptop).

I have 2GB of SODIMM DDR2-667 RAM and just won a T2300E on eBay, so as soon as I have about $160 of disposable income lying about I'm going to buy a Mini Ninja and an i945GTm-VHL and upgrade my HTPC from an Athlon64 3000+ running XP Media Center 2005 to Vista Home Premium on a Core Duo. Hard to argue with dual-core, faster performance and 20W less TDP at stock voltages.

-D

(crud...that means I'll have to change my .sig file...)
[size=75]Desktop: Antec P150|Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3R|Intel Xeon E3110|2x2048MB PC8500|HR-01|eVGA 8800GT SC|HR-03 GT|Scythe PWM 120mm|Scythe PWM 92mm|WD5000AAKS|Seasonic SS400-HT
HTPC: OrigenAE X11|Intel DG45ID|Intel E8400|2x2048MB PC6400|Scythe Big Shuriken|ATI HD4550|2xATI DCT|80mm Nexus|2TB WD 3.5" SATA + 100GB Seagate 2.5" SATA|NeoHE 430[/size]

Fscp
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Post by Fscp » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:31 am

I just spotted a Socket P motherboard:Portwell WADE-8066
Specifications:
1. Intel® Core™ 2 Duo processors
2. Intel® GME965 & ICH8ME Chipset Chipset
3. Max. DDR2 4GB Memory in Dual SO-DIMM Sockets
4. Dual PCI Express x1 interface Gigabit Ethernet ports
5. One PCI Express x4 and one PCI Expansion Slot Via Riser Card
Further technical specifications (PDF)

Quite an unknown manufacturer to me which seems to be focusing on industrial products. Their support page for bios updates/etc seems to be well hidden and once found not functional. I wouldn't consider buying anything from this company, but it's nice to know some products based on Santa Rosa are being made.

edit:
And another one appeared, this time a more well known company:
Commell introduces Intel GME965 based LV-679 motherboard

Specifications:
CPU: Core 2 Duo Mobile
Chipset: Intel 965GME
Memory: 2x SO-DIMM DDR2 400/533MHz (max. 3GB)
Graphics: i965GME integrated
Storage: 3x S-ATA, 1x P-ATA (44-pin), 1x CompactFlash
Expansion: 1x PCI-slot, 2x Mini-PCI
I/O ports: 2x PS/2, VGA, 7.1 audio, 4x USB2.0, 2x GigaBit LAN, 1x COM, 2x Firewire, onboard 2x DVI (!)

This board looks very interesting because of the dual dvi out.

lunadesign
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Post by lunadesign » Fri Aug 24, 2007 9:53 pm

Actually found a retailer selling the MSI Fuzzy GM965. Initially their site showed "coming soon" but I inquired and they said it was available and their site suddenly started showing pricing. Here's the link:

http://www.orbitmicro.com/global/fuzzyg ... -4187.html

It's a whopping $263. The other bummer is that it only has VGA, no DVI. There's some sort of jumper on the mobo for passing digital audio signals to an HDMI PCI-E card.

Additional notes:
- The MSI site lists a "Fuzzy GM965" using the GM965 chipset and a "Fuzzy GME965" using the GME965 chipset. The "E" stands for embedded. However, both boards are listed in the "industrial" section on the global site.
- The MSI site doesn't have any drivers or BIOS downloads.

Fscp
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Post by Fscp » Sat Aug 25, 2007 4:01 am

lunadesign wrote:The other bummer is that it only has VGA, no DVI.
VGA out for such boards in that price range and form factor is quite a show stopper for me. Especially because there is obviously only 1 PCI-E slot for a (dual) DVI video card.

deej
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Post by deej » Sat Sep 01, 2007 4:16 am

First post to get necessary count :lol:

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