MSI AM2 with an EE 5200+ AMD CPU an ok start?

[morkys]

Just wondering if the 65 watt 5200+ is a good CPU to start with. I currently have an older AMD64 3000+ at 89 watts. I figure an MSI motherboard with built-in video would be good. Also looking at the MSI K9AG Neo2-Digital for use in the system. It has HTPC capabilities which is handy for me, and also looks potentially quiet.

[loimlo]

Ok, but I would go for a cheaper cpu like 4400/4600/4800+ to save money for a good mainboard. Plus, a good cpu cooler is also important to silent HTPC.

[morkys]

Actually think the 35 watt AM2 X2 3800+ or the 45 watt BE2350 and the same Neo2 digital motherboard is good enough.

[jackylman]

morkys, I think you're putting way too much stock into the TDP rating of the chips. Remember, AMD uses TDP as a worst-case scenario. If you're building a system for gaming or some other heavy usage scenario, then you'd rely on those numbers to determine your power usage.

If you're building for lighter workloads, you have to consider the chip's ability to undervolt and how much wattage it draws at idle.

[morkys]

Fair enough. I actually don't want to save more power as much as I want more processing power, so I may go with the EE 5200+. It's the same or lower TDP as my 3000+ and I will do my best to run my system efficiently with C n Quiet etc. Using the MSI K9AG Neo2 is a good start as I see it's quite efficient with it's onboard graphics. It's worth a try. I don't game, so... it's good enough, and it's DVI and HDMI is handy for potential HTPC duty.

[Longbow]

Just wondering if the 65 watt 5200+ is a good CPU to start with. I currently have an older AMD64 3000+ at 89 watts. I figure an MSI motherboard with built-in video would be good. Also looking at the MSI K9AG Neo2-Digital for use in the system. It has HTPC capabilities which is handy for me, and also looks potentially quiet.

i had a similar plan

i ended up with a pentium e2140 & 965 mobo, and i'm happy. i wouldn't choose an amd x2 over intel at this stage. x2 is no longer cheaper, nor cooler, nor oc better.

[loimlo]

I guess you've made up your mind already, so there's nothing we can do for you. 5200+ is ok, but I would put more money on CPU Cooler rather than CPU itself.

[djkest]

i ended up with a pentium e2140 & 965 mobo, and i'm happy. i wouldn't choose an amd x2 over intel at this stage. x2 is no longer cheaper, nor cooler, nor oc better.

AMD is still a much better value than Intel. Show me an intel CPU that matches the speed of a same-priced athlon without overclocking. At any level the athlon offers more value. Low end, and mid range as well.

2140 is $87, runs 1.6 GHz. For $3 less, you can get an athlon 64 x2 4400+ @2.3 GHz which is much faster, especially in games.

Overclocking is no contest, the c2d will OC more.

As far as which runs cooler, AMD has been making a lot of reduced power CPUs lately, I've even seen a x2 2.3GHz/per core that runs on 45 watts.

5200 is I believe the first one to use the 1MB cache, may be the reason he wants it, but I don't believe there is a CPU with 1MB cache AND 65 watt rating in a 5200+... edit... here it is...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6819103767

I used to use only MSI motherboards, but I always had one problem or another with them, for whatever reason, so now I moved on to Gigabyte, which is treating me ok. Are you looking for an HTPC system, a gaming system, or what exactly? If you are using a small case the cpu heat is critically important, as is the cooler you choose.

I've seen some of these overclocking articles. One I looked at used $600 memory to get a $100 cpu to overclock... pretty backwards.

[thejamppa]

The MSI is very good and stable board. Also very quiet. No coil whine has appeared when I've used this board over a month. Only problems I find are: temperature diode for motherboard seems to be poorly confed / not working unless you set speedfan's offset like -84 degrees.

And like always in MSI's bios upgrade needs Dos boot-up floppy and floppy drive. I mean is MSI still heard that floppies haven't been supplied in package computers for like 2 or 3 years? And that is almost dead by now.

[jaganath]

I've seen some of these overclocking articles. One I looked at used $600 memory to get a $100 cpu to overclock... pretty backwards

expensive memory is not required to OC E21X0 CPU.

http://www.techspot.com/review/53-penti ... page2.html

x2 1024MB Corsair XMS PC-6400 CAS4 Module(s)
page 6.
An example of this would be the overclocking capabilities of these new E2140 and E2160 processors. The E2160 was able to reach a stable 3.4GHz on the ASUS P5N-E SLI, while the E2140 managed 3.2GHz on this motherboard with third party cooling. Then when paired with the standard Intel box cooler a 3.0GHz overclock was possible without any added voltage.

CORSAIR XMS2 1GB (2 x 512MB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) CAS 4 $69

[Longbow]

AMD is still a much better value than Intel. Show me an intel CPU that matches the speed of a same-priced athlon without overclocking. At any level the athlon offers more value. Low end, and mid range as well.

2140 is $87, runs 1.6 GHz. For $3 less, you can get an athlon 64 x2 4400+ @2.3 GHz which is much faster, especially in games.

there is no reason not to overclock a CPU when you need the power and if it's capable, not to mention the e2140 would oc to 2.8GHz to 3.2GHz at stock or even lower voltage, at which point it performs better than x2 running at same or even higher frequencies.

intel probably had more experience on 65 nm process than amd had on its 90 nm. there are plenty of headroom on the intels, and not much on the amd. the 65nm brisbane x2 traded for longer cache delay. the x2s are pretty much squeezed and marked to their potential. they may have lower (claimed) tdp and idle power consumption, but the consumption increase real quick under load, end up not much better if not worse than intels at similar frequencies.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/sh ... =3112&p=14
"There's no simpler way of putting it: if you take overclocking into account, there's just no way to even consider the AMD CPUs. With the Pentium E2140 and 2160 boasting 65%+ overclocks, their performance reaches levels greater than the Athlon 64 X2 5000+ (and some of the faster Athlon X2 CPUs as well)."

I've seen some of these overclocking articles. One I looked at used $600 memory to get a $100 cpu to overclock... pretty backwards.

any memory would do, the only trick is the mobo support memory bus adjustment and the user pick the right settings.

[smilingcrow]

any memory would do, the only trick is the mobo support memory bus adjustment and the user pick the right settings.

e.g. Gigabyte P35 boards typically offer a minimum ratio of 1:1 for FSB/RAM but their G33 boards have a minimum of 1:1.66 which is very restrictive.
This is for the 200MHz FSB chips which means an E2140 requires DDR2-1000 just to reach 2.4GHz in a G33 board whereas in a P35 board you can hit 3.2GHz with DDR2-800. Ouch.

[jackylman]

And like always in MSI's bios upgrade needs Dos boot-up floppy and floppy drive. I mean is MSI still heard that floppies haven't been supplied in package computers for like 2 or 3 years? And that is almost dead by now.

They have a live update program that can be run (unfortunately, it requires Windows/IE). I've flashed the BIOS on my MSI 690G mobo a few times now without a floppy (right from within Windows). It's pretty easy.

[thejamppa]

And like always in MSI's bios upgrade needs Dos boot-up floppy and floppy drive. I mean is MSI still heard that floppies haven't been supplied in package computers for like 2 or 3 years? And that is almost dead by now.

They have a live update program that can be run (unfortunately, it requires Windows/IE). I've flashed the BIOS on my MSI 690G mobo a few times now without a floppy (right from within Windows). It's pretty easy.

Darn, you were right. I overlooked the LiveUpdate. I just looked the text file which came alongside new Bios... I just flashed my own motherboard.

[Jan Kivar]

And like always in MSI's bios upgrade needs Dos boot-up floppy and floppy drive. I mean is MSI still heard that floppies haven't been supplied in package computers for like 2 or 3 years? And that is almost dead by now.

They have a live update program that can be run (unfortunately, it requires Windows/IE). I've flashed the BIOS on my MSI 690G mobo a few times now without a floppy (right from within Windows). It's pretty easy.

Darn, you were right. I overlooked the LiveUpdate. I just looked the text file which came alongside new Bios... I just flashed my own motherboard.

One way is to create a bootable USB stick, which can be booted to Win9x dos prompt (link), so it's possible to flash from "native" dos prompt without a floppy drive. Finding a good diskette image for the stick could be a problem. The link to the HP USB disk storage tool is broken, but one can find it easily with Google. Most new sticks identify themselves as USB-HDD, so there are no space constraints either.

Cheers,

Jan