Antec NeoHE "High-Efficiency"

[Hellspawn]

I should clarify that our Smartpower 2.0 article applies to the 450W model. The 500W model has modular cables which are quite a bit longer than the ones on the 450W model. There are successful reports of people using the SP2.0 500W in the P180.

Just out of curiosity, why is everyone replacing the PSU and not the motherboard? That ASUS board can't be that special, can it? There's plenty of other SLI boards out there...

Well, for one thing it's easier to replace a PSU than a mobo. Especially a mobo that works with oh say 95%+ of PSU's on the market. Also, I didn't pay 160USD for an empty case, I paid for a working combo of a psu AND a nice case.

Nice case indeed, but I'm not paying for a PSU then chucking it. They either produce a working Neo430 for this case , or back it goes.

[Devonavar]

As far as I can tell, it's not clear yet which component is at fault. All I have seen evidence of is that the ASUS and Antec parts are incompatible. Yes, the motherboard works fine with other power supplies, but it's also true that the power supply works fine with other motherboards. The problem seems to be an incompatibility, not a straightforward case of a lemon product. If you look around, you'll find plenty of evidence that the NeoHE isn't the only power supply having problems with Asus boards. I don't think there's a clear case for who's at fault just yet.

Jvrobert, yours is the first problem I've heard not relating directly to one of three ASUS boards, and I'm still not clear what you're using anyway. So far you've mentioned three different power supplies:

Basically, the thing won't even power on with a NeoPower 430.

I had second thoughts and was fairly sure my replacement 430HE wouldn't work either, so I changed the return RMA to a refund

I have a brand new Biostar 6100 based MB, and it won't power up at all from a 480 HE

First, you mentioned a NeoPower430. I can find no record of this power supply on Antec's site, perhaps you mean the NeoHE 430?

Second, you mention that you had second thoughts about an RMA for a NeoHE 430, which means you never tested a second model.

Third, you mention a 480HE. This is another non-existent model. The Neo HE comes in 430W and 500W models, there is no 480W model. There was a 480W NeoPower, but it comes from a completely different line.

Can you clarify which unit you had problems with? If it was the NeoPower480, your experience isn't relevant to this thread, since it applies to an older model. If it was the NeoHE430, your claim that it's a problem with the power supply itself, not the motherboard becomes a little more credible.

[Hellspawn]

As far as I can tell, it's not clear yet which component is at fault. All I have seen evidence of is that the ASUS and Antec parts are incompatible. Yes, the motherboard works fine with other power supplies, but it's also true that the power supply works fine with other motherboards. The problem seems to be an incompatibility, not a straightforward case of a lemon product. If you look around, you'll find plenty of evidence that the NeoHE isn't the only power supply having problems with Asus boards. I don't think there's a clear case for who's at fault just yet.

Jvrobert, yours is the first problem I've heard not relating directly to one of three ASUS boards, and I'm still not clear what you're using anyway. So far you've mentioned three different power supplies:

Basically, the thing won't even power on with a NeoPower 430.

I had second thoughts and was fairly sure my replacement 430HE wouldn't work either, so I changed the return RMA to a refund

I have a brand new Biostar 6100 based MB, and it won't power up at all from a 480 HE

First, you mentioned a NeoPower430. I can find no record of this power supply on Antec's site, perhaps you mean the NeoHE 430?

Second, you mention that you had second thoughts about an RMA for a NeoHE 430, which means you never tested a second model.

Third, you mention a 480HE. This is another non-existent model. The Neo HE comes in 430W and 500W models, there is no 480W model. There was a 480W NeoPower, but it comes from a completely different line.

Can you clarify which unit you had problems with? If it was the NeoPower480, your experience isn't relevant to this thread, since it applies to an older model. If it was the NeoHE430, your claim that it's a problem with the power supply itself, not the motherboard becomes a little more credible.

Well, after talking with Antec support just now, they have a new revision of the PSU in testing (430), and they are willing to ship it to me for testing. Apparently they have the test version working quite well with the A8N-SLI with the latest BIOS in their testing facility. As far as the % of PSU's having problems with the Asus boards, there is definite proof that something in THAT Antec PSU is incompatible, as their other supplies seem to power my p5gdc just fine. They've apparently crossed a line in the design that makes it just a wee bit touchy with several asus boards.

I'm not going to debate it with you, all I know is the case is a great one, but until they cough up a revised neo 430 that works with my board (which works with numerous other psu units), I won't keep it. It's easier to rma a case/psu than it is to go through replacing a perfectly good mainboard/psu combo (either truepower 380s or seasonic s12-430) that is working quite well in my 3700bqe.

I'm weary of this subject at this point.

[Devonavar]

As far as the % of PSU's having problems with the Asus boards, there is definite proof that something in THAT Antec PSU is incompatible, as their other supplies seem to power my p5gdc just fine.

I agree, it is definite proof that THAT PSU is incompatible, but that's not the end of the story. It is also definite proof that THAT BOARD is incompatible. My question is why people are choosing to replace the PSU instead of the board. Both parts are equally at fault, but it looks to me like the majority of people are replacing the PSU, not the board. It would be just as feasible to replace the motherboard, since that PSU works just fine with the other 95% of the boards out there.

[klankymen]

I can only speak for myself, but that i will do.

As far as I can tell, both parts are at fault. both some great components, but don't like each other.

as my post history will tell you, I did consider replacing the mainboard, but it's just way too much effort. I'd have to reinstall windows and everything, and it's 2.5 times the price of a replacement PSU. plus, I really like the way the board fits into the p180, and the only real alternate I could think of was DFI, where the CPU doesn't line up with the fans as well, and I'd have to mount my own NBsink (more stuff to order is bad )

I was also considering switching my mobo, just because asus was kinda pissing me off, but making a point is not worth the effort. plus, i am a bit impatient, and i want to start on CoD2 i've had lying around for 2 weeks. not to mention BF2.

Optimally I'd like to use a NeoHE, but as long as it doesn't work I'll just stay away from it. If they make a version that works, I'll get it, but until that day, no antec for me.

[Tumlehund]

I agree, it is definite proof that THAT PSU is incompatible, but that's not the end of the story. It is also definite proof that THAT BOARD is incompatible. My question is why people are choosing to replace the PSU instead of the board. Both parts are equally at fault, but it looks to me like the majority of people are replacing the PSU, not the board. It would be just as feasible to replace the motherboard, since that PSU works just fine with the other 95% of the boards out there.

Well, I don't own a Neo HE and I'm not in a situation where I need to RMA anything. But let me explain why I would rather replace the PSU instead of the motherboard if I had to.

When I put together a new computer, I usually spend most of the time figuring out which motherboard I want. The reason is I'm looking for some quite specific features and I ususally end up with with only 1 choice. So, after I have chosen the motherboard it would take a lot of time to find a replacement. I also spend quite some time researching on every other component of the system, but I find they are easier to replace with similar parts.

The PSU is obviously one of the most important parts of a system, but I find that several PSU would be useful. At least they are not so different in features compared to motherboards in my opinion.

[Hellspawn]

I agree, it is definite proof that THAT PSU is incompatible, but that's not the end of the story. It is also definite proof that THAT BOARD is incompatible. My question is why people are choosing to replace the PSU instead of the board. Both parts are equally at fault, but it looks to me like the majority of people are replacing the PSU, not the board. It would be just as feasible to replace the motherboard, since that PSU works just fine with the other 95% of the boards out there.

Well, I don't own a Neo HE and I'm not in a situation where I need to RMA anything. But let me explain why I would rather replace the PSU instead of the motherboard if I had to.

When I put together a new computer, I usually spend most of the time figuring out which motherboard I want. The reason is I'm looking for some quite specific features and I ususally end up with with only 1 choice. So, after I have chosen the motherboard it would take a lot of time to find a replacement. I also spend quite some time researching on every other component of the system, but I find they are easier to replace with similar parts.

The PSU is obviously one of the most important parts of a system, but I find that several PSU would be useful. At least they are not so different in features compared to motherboards in my opinion.

I was going to post to clarify for some why I'd replace the PSU first, since it apparently was not clear for some the first time, but you guys said it well enough

p.s. for those who will continue this on, it might be that the asus board isn't 100% without incompatibilities, but when the vast majority of PSUs out there work with it, and one does'nt , it is easy to spot the larger handicap, isn't it?

[AntecRep]

So here's the new final answer. It took Asus awhile to get back to us about the changes they've made and what they could think of to help with the last remaining stability issues.

We would have been much happier if Asus had seen fit to make sure all their techs in their various locations knew about this completely to better help our mutual customers. As it stands it looks like in most cases a BIOS rev will solve the issue for many people, replacing the NeoHE is the final step.

Testing with Asus shows this:
Older Asus BIOS + original Neo HE, 80% had a compatibility problem
New Asus BIOS + original Neo HE, 20% had a compatibility problem
New Asus BIOS + updated Neo HE = no compatibility problem.
Any Neo HE + other premium brand boards = no problem.

For anyone who still has Neo HE + Asus A8n-SLI motherboard issues, please contact Antec at 1-800-222-6832 and ask for a replacement unit that has the Asus fix implemented. We'll set you up to get a replacement power supply that along with Asus's latest BIOS (1009 very important!) should fix the problem.

We've had no reports from other motherboard manufacturers like Abit, MSI, Gigabyte etc.

We're a little curious as why folks use the 430 with an SLI board (ie the P150) unless they're planning on adding the 2nd card later.

[klankymen]

first off I'd like to say, thank you, AntecRep, I think it's great that you post here on SPCR expecially, you definitely do a better job keeping up with your customers than asus.


Now. As for the PSU, i was planning on ordering the S12 today, but if you say the new version is available as of right now I'll definitely try it out, I am well satisfied with all aspects of the PSU, except the fact that it won't stay on (no irony here, if I had the same thing in working It would be awesome).

As for your SLI question... you mean you question the fact that I (and others) would use a "low" wattage, such as 430W with an SLI system, as opposed to the 500 or 600?

well for me the answer is simple. I don't have an SLI system, i have one video card, and I don't plan on getting a new one either, not in the next 12 months (unless i win the lotto ), and I doubt I will ever use the SLI function of the mobo. I just purchased it for its other additional features over other boards, including its passive northbridge design.

[Hellspawn]

So here's the new final answer. It took Asus awhile to get back to us about the changes they've made and what they could think of to help with the last remaining stability issues.

We would have been much happier if Asus had seen fit to make sure all their techs in their various locations knew about this completely to better help our mutual customers. As it stands it looks like in most cases a BIOS rev will solve the issue for many people, replacing the NeoHE is the final step.

Testing with Asus shows this:
Older Asus BIOS + original Neo HE, 80% had a compatibility problem
New Asus BIOS + original Neo HE, 20% had a compatibility problem
New Asus BIOS + updated Neo HE = no compatibility problem.
Any Neo HE + other premium brand boards = no problem.

For anyone who still has Neo HE + Asus A8n-SLI motherboard issues, please contact Antec at 1-800-222-6832 and ask for a replacement unit that has the Asus fix implemented. We'll set you up to get a replacement power supply that along with Asus's latest BIOS (1009 very important!) should fix the problem.

We've had no reports from other motherboard manufacturers like Abit, MSI, Gigabyte etc.

We're a little curious as why folks use the 430 with an SLI board (ie the P150) unless they're planning on adding the 2nd card later.

From what I heard from a tech at Antec, the revised/modified units should be in sometime next week, any more definite date? Also, what about the p5gdc that does not have a bios update available? Since we aren't a major population, are we just kind of stuck here? Asus tech support isn't much motivated towards the single end user..

[klankymen]

What I want to know is, how can i run my system for the time being? I have an old enermax, but it isn't 28 pin mobo, its just 20.

can i get a 20 to 24 pin adapter, and a molex to 4 pin adapter, and run it?

its not like the wires can mean anything else except ground, core, 3v, 5v and 12v, right? and all of those are on the 20pin, so why was there a need for the 24? and the 4 pin is just 2 12v lines and 2 grounds, or what?

well, I've found the 20 to 24 no problem, but does anyone know where to find a molex to atx12v adapter in germany (wainwra perhaps )?

It looks like it'll be at least 2 weeks til i get the new PSU then, i think I'll just go and get a s12 anyway, I can always resell it to my dad, i think it would fit his sonata well anyway.

well, I'll just see, but answers on whether i can safely use an old 20pin psu to run my 28 pin mobo would be appreciated. thanks

[autoboy]

We're a little curious as why folks use the 430 with an SLI board (ie the P150) unless they're planning on adding the 2nd card

Users on this forum are a little more educated about power supplies due to the excelent reviews done buy the staff of this site. Around here, it is a known fact that even high powered SLI systems do not use more than 300 -350 watts of power at full load. We find it strange that a high efficiency, high quality, medium-high powered power supply cannot run a SLI system with one video card let alone two. We are a reasonable group here, and understand that it is a compatibility issue on both sides. We will not hold this against Antec or Asus as long as the problem gets fixed in a reasonable amount of time. Thanks for keeping us informed about the situation though. Despide this problem I am planning on getting a P150 with an Asus board as I write this.

However, if you find it odd that users would try to run an SLI system in a p150 with the bundled powersupply, then why don't you offer the case without a powersupply for people with SLI systems? If the NEO he 430 cannot run a SLI system, then you are limiting your customer base for no reason.

[Tumlehund]

So here's the new final answer. It took Asus awhile to get back to us about the changes they've made and what they could think of to help with the last remaining stability issues.

Better late than never! Thank you for posting an update here, I think alot of people appreciate this and you may have won back some customers.

We would have been much happier if Asus had seen fit to make sure all their techs in their various locations knew about this completely to better help our mutual customers. As it stands it looks like in most cases a BIOS rev will solve the issue for many people, replacing the NeoHE is the final step.

I'll just speak for myself and say that I was EXTREMELY frustrated that this problem existed for so long. The most frustrating thing was that I wasn't able to easily find official information about this problem on neither Antec's nor Asus's website.

I was very close to buying another PSU, but this piece of information may change my mind, if I see evidence that the problem has indeed gone away. However, if Antec had just made a public statement about the problem and posting information on how they progressed in fixing the problem, I would definately respect that and be patient instead of getting angry and almost ditching Antec. Being open and informing the customers usually pays off.

That being said, Asus can be blamed on the same things.

Testing with Asus shows this:
Older Asus BIOS + original Neo HE, 80% had a compatibility problem
New Asus BIOS + original Neo HE, 20% had a compatibility problem
New Asus BIOS + updated Neo HE = no compatibility problem.
Any Neo HE + other premium brand boards = no problem.

For anyone who still has Neo HE + Asus A8n-SLI motherboard issues, please contact Antec at 1-800-222-6832 and ask for a replacement unit that has the Asus fix implemented. We'll set you up to get a replacement power supply that along with Asus's latest BIOS (1009 very important!) should fix the problem.

This is great news, thanks!

I guess Antec Europe will do the same?

Also I would like to know how you can tell the new fixed Neo HE version from the earlier one? Is there a version number/revision number to look for?

We've had no reports from other motherboard manufacturers like Abit, MSI, Gigabyte etc.

Good stuff! This PSU might be a winner after all.

We're a little curious as why folks use the 430 with an SLI board (ie the P150) unless they're planning on adding the 2nd card later.

It seems that modern computers (even with SLI cards) do not need more than a 300-350W PSU, at least if you read these articles:
http://silentpcreview.com/article28-page3.html
http://silentpcreview.com/article265-page1.html
Of course this pertains to high quality PSUs only and not PSUs that are rated using their peak values.

[jvrobert]

As far as I can tell, it's not clear yet which component is at fault. All I have seen evidence of is that the ASUS and Antec parts are incompatible. Yes, the motherboard works fine with other power supplies, but it's also true that the power supply works fine with other motherboards. The problem seems to be an incompatibility, not a straightforward case of a lemon product. If you look around, you'll find plenty of evidence that the NeoHE isn't the only power supply having problems with Asus boards. I don't think there's a clear case for who's at fault just yet.

Jvrobert, yours is the first problem I've heard not relating directly to one of three ASUS boards, and I'm still not clear what you're using anyway. So far you've mentioned three different power supplies:

Basically, the thing won't even power on with a NeoPower 430.

I had second thoughts and was fairly sure my replacement 430HE wouldn't work either, so I changed the return RMA to a refund

I have a brand new Biostar 6100 based MB, and it won't power up at all from a 480 HE

First, you mentioned a NeoPower430. I can find no record of this power supply on Antec's site, perhaps you mean the NeoHE 430?

Second, you mention that you had second thoughts about an RMA for a NeoHE 430, which means you never tested a second model.

Third, you mention a 480HE. This is another non-existent model. The Neo HE comes in 430W and 500W models, there is no 480W model. There was a 480W NeoPower, but it comes from a completely different line.

Can you clarify which unit you had problems with? If it was the NeoPower480, your experience isn't relevant to this thread, since it applies to an older model. If it was the NeoHE430, your claim that it's a problem with the power supply itself, not the motherboard becomes a little more credible.

Sorry, I confused myself with all the Neo(xx) supplies available.

I have a Biostar 6100-M7 board, and the power supply was most definitely a NeoPowerHE 430. Symptom was that motherboard wouldn't power up (as evidenced by CPU fan spinning). It did work fine with a TruePower 380, and I tried disconnecting everything else and other basic troubleshooting.

I wasn't willing to risk another RMA with what seems to be a problematic PS so went with the SmartPower 500 (also modular, fewer problem reports, similar pricing).

[jldet5]

Anyone think this will power an ABIT AS8? Is it only a certain chipset having problems?

[warriorpoet]

It seems to be an issue with Asus boards. I have an ABit AN8 Ultra and a NeoHE 500 and they play together just fine.

[jldet5]

It seems to be an issue with Asus boards. I have an ABit AN8 Ultra and a NeoHE 500 and they play together just fine.

Thanks!!!

[jldet5]

Hi,

From the review. Why is this? Is this related to how many 5 volt PCI cards? As I said I have a ABIT AS8 but I also have a GIGABYTE GA6CX I'd like it to work with. Both boards are PCI 2.2 or better.

The majority of the output capacity is available on the +12V rails. This closely matches the power distribution of the powerful systems that we tested recently. In contrast, the +3.3V rail and especially the +5V rail are rated lower than most other power supplies, as per the latest ATX12V 2.x standard. One drawback is that the Neo HE is not appropriate for systems older than a couple of years.

[Devonavar]

No, the issue is that old (really old) Athlon XP and P-III chipsets powered the CPU from the +5V line. I don't think I've ever come across one of these boards personally, since they were around before I played around with hardware much.

[jldet5]

No, the issue is that old (really old) Athlon XP and P-III chipsets powered the CPU from the +5V line. I don't think I've ever come across one of these boards personally, since they were around before I played around with hardware much.

Hi, the GA6CX machine is a PIII Slot 1 1000 CPU with an 820 chipset. So do I need to calculate the P III watts to fit the PSU?

Thanks for the info.

[jldet5]

No, the issue is that old (really old) Athlon XP and P-III chipsets powered the CPU from the +5V line. I don't think I've ever come across one of these boards personally, since they were around before I played around with hardware much.

From the Intel docs:

The Pentium II and Pentium III processors require approximately three times the average current of
the Pentium processor. The VCC_CORE maximum current requirements can range from 6.9 A to
nearly 18 A. In addition, these processors shut off unused units to conserve power, and include
features such as Stop Clock and AutoHALT, which create load-change transients as high as 30 A
per microsecond on VCC_CORE. In this document, a load-change transient is a change from one
current requirement (averaged over many clocks) to another. Future Pentium III processors may
require higher current and different voltages for the processor.

Looks like it won't work on a GA6CX PIII board?

[kesv]

Looks like it won't work on a GA6CX PIII board?

Note that they talk of amperage on VCC_CORE which does not directly translate to amperage on 5V line. VCC_CORE for a P3 is something like 1.6-1.7V ? Anyway while it does draw on the 5V line in old motherboards, it is transformed from 5V which means that the amperage drawn from 5V is something like (VCC_CORE/conversion efficiency)/5 * 30A.

While this means that the Neo HE might work you can look at my experience with Smart Power for reference. Note that I think this has more to do with the ATX12V v2.0 specification than the exact model of power supply. It seems a lot hangs on how the motherboard has been wired.

[jldet5]

Looks like it won't work on a GA6CX PIII board?

Note that they talk of amperage on VCC_CORE which does not directly translate to amperage on 5V line. VCC_CORE for a P3 is something like 1.6-1.7V ? Anyway while it does draw on the 5V line in old motherboards, it is transformed from 5V which means that the amperage drawn from 5V is something like (VCC_CORE/conversion efficiency)/5 * 30A.

While this means that the Neo HE might work you can look at my experience with Smart Power for reference. Note that I think this has more to do with the ATX12V v2.0 specification than the exact model of power supply. It seems a lot hangs on how the motherboard has been wired.

Makes sense. So I should go with the 550W since it has higher amps on the 5V and cross my fingers?

[klankymen]

hmmm... well I called up Antec Tech support, and the man was real helpful, though his informations werent as much perhaps...

He said that the new Batch of compatible NeoHEs should be in in a week or two, maybe a month.

Now my PSU right now sounds like a lawnmower, I might still get a s12 for the next month, and then sell it to someone in need of a quiet PSU (I know several, thankfully). Well, I guess it turns out I'm giving Antec one last chance, but this one is their last. absolutely. but for the time being I'd still advise anyone not to get the NeoHE, just to be on the safe side.

[samash]

Like others, I also have problems with Antec HE power supplies. The first one NeoHE 430, which came with a P150 case, would not power up with a Asus A7N8X or with the Gigabyte 7VTXH. With Asus P5WD2 it powers up and freezes in 10 seconds. Updating BIOS didn't solve the problem, either. I have tested these motherboards with other power supplies and they work properly. After testing on all 3 motherboards, I'm convinced that it's a problem with the power supply. I thought I'd try with a NeoHE 550, and have the same problems. I called Antec to replace power supplies and they do not guaranty that replacements will work properly, either. Like many others, I've lost a lot of time and money and Antec will not replace these with other models. Now I am stuck with 2 unuseable power supplies. Antec should take the responsibility for the non-compatibility of thier products. Antec should take back the power supplies (at their cost) or at least be willing to replace them with other more compatible models.

[aqm consultant]

AntecRep's update is welcome news. I'm planning to build an Abit AN8 Ultra x2 4800+ system in a P150. I guess the question now is if I order a P150 in a week (or 2 or 3), how can I know whether it's the updated PSU or left-over inventory?

[hravn]

AFAIK there have been no problems with Abit AN8 boards.

[Suikakujyu]

AFAIK there have been no problems with Abit AN8 boards.

Ok just built my rig last week... not so bright deciding to go with the HE even knowing some people were having problems.

My rig is:

Athlon 64x2
OCZ Plat 1gig ram (ddr400?)
72gig raptor
ATI ??? GTO card (god i forgot everything)
Running 2 dvd burner drives
running a 150gig hd (7200rpm)

P180 case
Abit AN8 Ultra
Ninja heatsink with 120mm fan.

So initially the rig worked fine. Occationally it would just shut down though. But i would hit the power button and it would just power up again. Last night however, I was writing A VERY IMPORTANT PAPER, and the thing powered down (i saved everything of course), but when hitting the power button, nothing would power on. The lights on the mobo are still on, but when i hit the power all i see is the ati card's fan spin for a split sec and thats it.

I stripped down the machine till basically i had only the fan on the ninja, 1 hd, the ati card, and 1 stick of ram. Still, the pc is comatose.

Does this sound like a defective PSU?


edit: OH i did update the bios to version 18 the day before...

[hravn]

Could well be, since it starts but then powers down. Only one way to find out though, try it with another (cheap) PSU ($25 down the drain) or maybe with a different graphics card. I actually had a similar weird problem when I built my last rig, it was an Athlon XP, Abit NF7-S v2.0, ATI 9700 AIW and Antec TrueBlue 480W. There was some weird kind of incompatibility between the GFX, the PSU and the motherboard. If I switched any of those three compontens, it worked. I had exactly the same "fan twitch" as you have, which indicates that some kind of overload protection system is going off in the PSU.

[kesv]

Makes sense. So I should go with the 550W since it has higher amps on the 5V and cross my fingers?

Depends on if you are willing to experiment or not. While replacing the Smart Power I was told that the shop was aware of some issues with Epox motherboards and the PSU in question. My recommendation would be that if you want it to work the first time, get a PSU which has no known issues with compatibility.