>85% Eff. Monster PSU from FSP! ;-D

peterson · Post by **peterson** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 6:48 am

Trustworthy?

High efficiency and power saving design >85%

jaganath · Post by **jaganath** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 7:31 am

Trustworthy?

I don't see why not; the SPCR review of the FSP Zen showed a maximum efficiency of almost 85% after the results had been corrected. FSP have shown they can do it; I wonder what the maximum theoretical efficiency of a PC power supply is? 99%?

Tibors · Post by **Tibors** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 7:47 am

That is the blingified and beefed up version of the FSP 400-60GLN, which SPCR tested at 81.4% max. efficiency. Add 3% for testing on 230V in stead of 121V and another percent or two for testing with air of 20°C in stead of 30°C. Yeah, they can probably show you proof of their claim.

StarfishChris · Post by **StarfishChris** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 8:39 am

jaganath wrote:I wonder what the maximum theoretical efficiency of a PC power supply is? 99%?

Theoretical, sure, but under what conditions? I remember a power supply mfr. saying that if only one voltage was required then efficiency could easily increase (in one of MikeC's posts?). Probably they could spend more on getting the power cleaner and tighter, too.

Oklahoma Wolf · Post by **Oklahoma Wolf** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 9:10 am

I have the 80mm fan version of this one coming sometime next week... there are internal pics of the 700W 120mm fan model on this page about 4 posts down: http://forum.ixbt.com/topic.cgi?id=49:6485-12

I don't really need the 600W for my upcoming build, but it was the only FSP model that met all my requirements. Being only $124 Cdn. didn't hurt either

Aris · Post by **Aris** » Sat Dec 31, 2005 11:18 am

85% at what power load though?

if its full load you'll never see it. the highest you could ever hope to achieve is MABEY 60% load, and even that would only effect a very slim percentage of the consumers using it. most people will probably only use 35-45% of those 600w in any real system.

also its obvious they got those effeciency results in 240v. so no one in the US will ever get that effeciency.

Doomer · Post by **Doomer** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 12:32 am

StarfishChris wrote:
jaganath wrote:I wonder what the maximum theoretical efficiency of a PC power supply is? 99%?
Theoretical, sure, but under what conditions? I remember a power supply mfr. saying that if only one voltage was required then efficiency could easily increase (in one of MikeC's posts?). Probably they could spend more on getting the power cleaner and tighter, too.

Higher voltage means it's easier to achieve better effiency. I remember MikeC talking about how PSU engineers had told him how power supplies would become 12V only over a year ago, but there hasn't been news on that front.

jaganath · Post by **jaganath** » Mon Jan 02, 2006 4:45 am

Higher voltage means it's easier to achieve better effiency.

Ahh, this makes more sense. I knew that higher voltage made it more efficient to transport electricity over long distances, and it seems this applies at shorter transport lengths as well.

stupid · Post by **stupid** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 6:46 am

The 85% efficiency claim is probably true because of the 80 PLUS program. The program is a standard created by Intel and Energy Star to promote energy savings because of the rising cost of energy and decreasing natural resources. The most aggressive experts in the oil industry state that the world's oil reserve will be depleted by 2060, while the most conservative estimates that all oil reserves will be depleted by 2020. In other words, natural oil is likely to become a mere memory within our lifetime.

Anywaste, I digress. In order to recieve the 80 PLUS seal of approval from Energy Star a PSU must be at least:

82% efficient @ 20% load
87% efficient @ 50% load
85% efficient @ 100% load

MikeC stated in one of his article about PSUs that Energy Star's testing methods are more stringent than SPCR's. So any current PSU reviewed which may seem to meet these standards, could actually fail to meet Energy Star's more rigorous testing methods.

Here's a link to 80PLUS.org for more info. Unfortunately, I can't seem to find a picture of the official Energy Star 80PLUS seal of approval.

Tibors · Post by **Tibors** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 9:37 am

Wow, you mixed up a lot of things.

80plus wrote:The 80 PLUS program is built around a very simple concept: Recognize and reward any desktop computer or low-end sever containing a power supply that meets the following specification:
80% or greater efficiency at 20%, 50% and 100% of rated load

True power factor of 0.9 or greater

The current requirements for the EPA's Energy Star label are much lower than this. The future Energy Star requirements are still "under construction", but will most likely be close to the 80 PLUS numbers. (See this .pdf from the EPA website.)

Intel has their own set of requirements, which are also lower than the 80 PLUS requirements. See page 20 of the ATX12V Power Supply Design Guide v2.2 (.pdf).

None of these sources have the efficiency numbers you wrote about in your post. Where did you get them?
______________

All the Fortron PSU models ending on GLN are more ore less drived from the same design as used in the FSP Green PS. If you read that review and the some other threads about it here at SPCR, then you can see this design is largely driven by some upcomming environmental regulation in the EU. In that regulation the weight of the PSU becomes important. To reduce the weight you want small heatsinks. For small heatsinks you need high efficiency.

The only PSU from Fortron that is 80 PLUS approved is the Fortron Zen (.pdf). Which has a different design.
______________

[slightly off-topic]
Computers run on electrical power. In the US only about 3% of the electrical power is generated by burning petroleum. Source (.pdf) This is fairly typical for most western countries. Petroleum is simply too expensive to use for generating electrical power. A large part of the petroleum that is used is actually waste/by products like petroleum coke and residual fuel oil.
[/slightly off-topic]

Tephras · Post by **Tephras** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 12:14 pm

Those efficiency numbers is in a table at the page that stupid linked to. However, they are not the 80 PLUS requirements, as I understood it they are derived from bench tests made by EPRI Solutions of some 80 PLUS approved PSU.

stupid · Post by **stupid** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 12:43 pm

Tibors wrote:Wow, you mixed up a lot of things.

Hmmm... Actually I think this is a case of conflicting information.

If you click here to a page at 80PLUS.org there is a table near the bottom call "Table 1 - Estimated Program Impacts" where I got my information from. I guess these could be the future requirements that exceeds the ones quoted in the PDF file that you linked to.

Sooty · Post by **Sooty** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 1:48 pm

Custom PC obtained 83% at full load. No doubt it’s peak efficiency, doesn’t coincide with full load, so 85% sounds a realistic claim. Very quiet too, according to CPC, but expensive.

Tephras · Post by **Tephras** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 2:25 pm

Hmmm... Actually I think this is a case of conflicting information.

If you click here to a page at 80PLUS.org there is a table near the bottom call "Table 1 - Estimated Program Impacts" where I got my information from. I guess these could be the future requirements that exceeds the ones quoted in the PDF file that you linked to.

I believe it's a case of information overload.

US Environmental Protection Agency has it's Energy Star specification for computers (a revision has been proposed).
Intel has their PC Design Guide Specification.
The 80 PLUS Program (started by Ecos Consulting) has their 80 PLUS requirements.

These specifications are separate from each other, what they have in common is a wish for higher PSU efficiency.

Tibors · Post by **Tibors** » Wed Jan 04, 2006 4:29 pm

Ah, I see where you got the numbers from now. That must be some possible future requirements, as the certification reports for the 80 PLUS approved PSU's all show the 80% at three power output levels line in their graph.

Right above the table you got the numbers from it says: "An 80 PLUS qualified power supply will likely exceed both Intel's requirements and ENERGY STAR requirements for some time." This further points out these are three completely separate programmes (like Tephras pointed out too) and not a single one like you implied in your post.

But the main reason I wrote my commentary on your post still stands: The efficiency of the Fortron GLN models has nothing to do with the 80 PLUS program. You don't design something with the express purpose to almost meet the requirements for a certification.

_________________
A whole thread about a PSU and it's name isn't mentioned once yet. That makes it hard to find using the search, so here it goes: We're talking about the FSP FX600-80GLN

peterson · Post by **peterson** » Thu Jan 05, 2006 12:51 am

I've totally missed that FSP have made a 400W Zen PSU.
Hopefully some other improvements too