S12 430W Enough for this system? Overclocked?

FeRsHiZzLe · Post by **FeRsHiZzLe** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 7:36 pm

Antec NSK4400 with 1x120MM Fan, 1X82MM Fan
C2D E 4300 (will be overclocked)
Gigabyte S3
Sapphire X1950XT
2x1GB G.Skill DDR2 800 (slightly overclocked?)
Hitachi 160GB (SATA)
Samsung DVD Burner (SATA)

I want to make sure I have plenty of power for the possibility of adding/replacing components in the future (but it will never be anything top-of-the-line) Will the 430W S12 be enough power? If not I will have to get a Thermaltake or something, bound to be noisier

autoboy · Post by **autoboy** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 9:02 pm

Check it out for yourself. Apparently nobody listens to us here at SPCR anyways

viewtopic.php?t=39970

kater · Post by **kater** » Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:16 pm

This system, even OC'ed, will most probably take app. 200W DC from the PSU under serious load. The PSU won't even ramp up noticeably unless you push the system unrealistically.

Sylph-DS · Post by **Sylph-DS** » Tue Apr 24, 2007 3:22 am

430 will be plenty. In fact, unless you think you're going to upgrade, or use the PSU in a different system, I'd go for something more allong the lines of a 350w seasonic.

jhhoffma · Post by **jhhoffma** » Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:43 am

Sylph-DS wrote:430 will be plenty. In fact, unless you think you're going to upgrade, or use the PSU in a different system, I'd go for something more allong the lines of a 350w seasonic.

Meaning either the S12-333 (330W) or the S12-380 (380W). The 380 would be better, as it's larger heatsinks cool more effectively without ramping up the fan.

autoboy · Post by **autoboy** » Tue Apr 24, 2007 9:45 am

Come on you guys, he IS using a Sapphire X1950XT. they can use 130W at load. Then he is overclocking his processor so figure 100W and he is already at 230. Another 50W for the rest of the system and he is almost at 300W. I wouldn't recomed a 300W power supply for that system. I would recomend a 430W power supply for a little extra juice if needed. I wouldn't be mad if you even stepped up to 500W. Anything more is always major overkill except in very rare cases.

Now I know why people don't listen to us!

mantralord · Post by **mantralord** » Tue Apr 24, 2007 1:16 pm

The increase in power draw from overclocking is highly overrated.

autoboy · Post by **autoboy** » Fri Apr 27, 2007 8:53 am

Yeah, but we don't know how high an overclock he wants. He could run a 300W supply but that x1950 can hog serious power. A 430 is better.

wutang · Post by **wutang** » Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:18 am

i fully agree with autoboy

330 would probably be not enough

kater · Post by **kater** » Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:31 am

Driven with a Seasonic SS-350ET ATX PSU --

Intel Pentium D950, overclocked / overvolted 10% (Presler, 3.74GHz)
ATI Radeon X1950XTX-512 PCIe graphics
Asus P5LD2-VM motherboard
4 x 1024MB Corsair DDR2-6400 RAM
Hitachi Deskstar 7K80 80GB hard drive
WD Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB 10krpm HDD
1 x 120mm fan

Total AC power draw is an absolute max of 298W; estimated DC power draw is 256W. It could actually be driven by an honestly rated 300W PSU.

Taken from here. Even if you want to keep the same TDP for the two cards (tho XT will take slightly less than XTX) you need to remember that the TDP for Presler is 200% of C2D. Even if you OC the C2D it won't ever need more than 2/3 of what this P4 takes. Which means there'll be lotsa headroom, like well over 100 real DC watts. I myself have only once pushed my PSU beyond 50% so I won't be the one to preach, but it's just for the sake of, uhhhh, hmmmm, (help me!), say, clarification. Whatever

farns · Post by **farns** » Sun Apr 29, 2007 6:38 pm

kater wrote:Driven with a Seasonic SS-350ET ATX PSU --

Intel Pentium D950, overclocked / overvolted 10% (Presler, 3.74GHz)
ATI Radeon X1950XTX-512 PCIe graphics
Asus P5LD2-VM motherboard
4 x 1024MB Corsair DDR2-6400 RAM
Hitachi Deskstar 7K80 80GB hard drive
WD Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB 10krpm HDD
1 x 120mm fan

Total AC power draw is an absolute max of 298W; estimated DC power draw is 256W. It could actually be driven by an honestly rated 300W PSU.

In that test the only vidcard test was PCMark 2004 IIRC which perhaps doesnt use much power from the vidcard.
Maybe it would have been better to run Folding or Orthos (to stress both CPU cores) at the same time as 3Dmark'06?
I wouldnt run something as CPU-intensive as Folding or Orthos while gaming but I know many people who use mildly CPU intensive apps like media encoding etc while they game.
Perhaps the software suite used in that test is a little conservative, especially for "worst-case scenarios"

dhanson865 · Post by **dhanson865** » Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:56 pm

The S12-430 is a fine choice if you plan to use the system at low loads such as web browsing as well as high end gaming.

If high end gaming is the only thing the PC will ever do then you should consider the Corsair HX520W.

The big difference is efficiency below 200W vs efficiency above 200W. Sure noise, price, temp rise are different as well but the old S12 is designed for the majority of the market which idles below 100W. The Corsair is designed more for the system that idles above 100W. Both are quiet and efficient, just each has a slightly different focus.

If you don't know your idling wattage you should buy a Kill-a-watt or a PowerAngel and test your system. You'll learn a lot about what power supply is right for your usage by testing the draw at the AC outlet.

autoboy · Post by **autoboy** » Wed May 02, 2007 11:04 am

kater wrote:Driven with a Seasonic SS-350ET ATX PSU --

Intel Pentium D950, overclocked / overvolted 10% (Presler, 3.74GHz)
ATI Radeon X1950XTX-512 PCIe graphics
Asus P5LD2-VM motherboard
4 x 1024MB Corsair DDR2-6400 RAM
Hitachi Deskstar 7K80 80GB hard drive
WD Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB 10krpm HDD
1 x 120mm fan

Total AC power draw is an absolute max of 298W; estimated DC power draw is 256W. It could actually be driven by an honestly rated 300W PSU.

Taken from here. Even if you want to keep the same TDP for the two cards (tho XT will take slightly less than XTX) you need to remember that the TDP for Presler is 200% of C2D. Even if you OC the C2D it won't ever need more than 2/3 of what this P4 takes. Which means there'll be lotsa headroom, like well over 100 real DC watts. I myself have only once pushed my PSU beyond 50% so I won't be the one to preach, but it's just for the sake of, uhhhh, hmmmm, (help me!), say, clarification. Whatever

300W does not mean 300W. There are several different rails that are loaded on a power supply and if any one of those rails gets overloaded than you can have problems. Old 300W systems used mostly 5V and so the power supplies were strong on 5V. Usually, since the 12V line is now the main line, the other lines are not stressed to their fullest. If all lines on the 300W supply added up to 300W than your 12V line is probably going to get overloaded on that kind of system while other other lines are not overloaded. This is why people recomend you go a little higher than you need and is also another reason the recomended power supply wattage has gotten out of hand. A 430W supply would be perfect for him. I would not go lower.

kater · Post by **kater** » Wed May 02, 2007 12:18 pm

Autoboy
I know that and I agree with you on the 5V & 12V part & people not taking into consideration that 12V is the most important thing today.

But... Given the quoted setup drew 260W DC from the PSU, and assuming the 12V current amounted to, say, 70% (but probably more as 3.3V is only used by memory and 5V is needed for some circuitry and USB decives), that would mean the 12V rail is loaded with 182W. S12 330W can supply 264W on that rail, and S12 380W can supply as much as 300W there. The two remaining rails will not even be bothered by the SPCR tested setup. Even if we assume 80% of the load is one the 12V rail, it still is only 208W.

All that from a guy who has an S12 430W and idles at 80W and reaches 180W when gaming