Silverstone Decathlon DA700 Super Silent review

PSUs: The source of DC power for all components in the PC & often a big noise source.

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burebista
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Silverstone Decathlon DA700 Super Silent review

Post by burebista » Tue Apr 22, 2008 12:22 am

@Anandtech.
It was only one day after we released the Enermax Pro82+ and Modu82+ review that we received an e-mail from Silverstone Taiwan telling us we were wrong about the assumption that Enermax offers the quietest power supplies at the moment. Silverstone told us about their new Decathlon DA700 that is supposed to be even quieter.
I don't understand what's so complicated on the label. :shock:
The rail specification is rather obfuscated, requiring several perusals and the use of a calculator before you actually understand what you're reading. We have no idea why Silverstone makes it so complicated, but that's how the company does it, dating back to their beginnings.
All of the rails performed within specification and the 12V rail had just a little over 20mV ripple at higher loads.
But no graphics for ripple...
The efficiency didn't get above 85%, which is strange as we expected a little more than that.
Expected 90% or what?
Silverstone mentioned their results should be much better than the new Modu82+ and Pro82+ series from Enermax. After looking at the charts, we can definitely say Silverstone is telling the truth and not just blowing hot air.
Hmm, Protechnic fan at ~700 RPM vs. Enermax fan ~500 RPM. :roll:

vick1000
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Post by vick1000 » Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:46 am

Regardless, you would have trouble squeezing that beast into a P180 or other tight case. And why would you make the ATX/motherboard cables modular? 25c ambient, what is that exactly?

I think the build quality is suspect as well, from the caps used to the choice of not using a PCB for the modular connections.

rjhythloday
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Post by rjhythloday » Tue Apr 22, 2008 5:01 am

First glance I expected single rail 58amps. It 4 rails? Too many things I don't like about this psu in the review. I have liked the earlier decathlons and will probably keep them high on my list next time I am purchasing a psu, but this one doesn't seem ready for prime time.

SST Guy
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Post by SST Guy » Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:29 pm

vick1000 wrote:Regardless, you would have trouble squeezing that beast into a P180 or other tight case. And why would you make the ATX/motherboard cables modular? 25c ambient, what is that exactly?

I think the build quality is suspect as well, from the caps used to the choice of not using a PCB for the modular connections.
I am sorry to see that you are unfamiliar with our product and brand to make those comments.

The DA700 is 180mm long, which is the same depth as Antec own Quattro series of PSUs so it should fit in the P180 without too much trouble.

The article explained why we made the ATX/motherboard cables modular (so users have option to use shorter cables in SFF and small HTPC cases).

25C ambient is an industry standard for MTBF rating. However, the DA700 is rated to output full 700W continuously at 50C.

The Decathlon series PSUs (DA650, DA700, DA800, etc...) are manufactured to the highest quality at the best of our ability on either robot assembly lines in Taiwan or in server PSU factory in China. I think many users on this forum can attest to our quality of design and manufacturer with their experiences of silent PSUs such as ST50EF-Plus and the fanless ST30NF.

SST Guy
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Post by SST Guy » Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:31 pm

rjhythloday wrote:First glance I expected single rail 58amps. It 4 rails? Too many things I don't like about this psu in the review. I have liked the earlier decathlons and will probably keep them high on my list next time I am purchasing a psu, but this one doesn't seem ready for prime time.
The DA700 is indeed configured from the factory as a single +12V rail PSU.

vick1000
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Post by vick1000 » Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:46 am

SST Guy wrote:
vick1000 wrote:Regardless, you would have trouble squeezing that beast into a P180 or other tight case. And why would you make the ATX/motherboard cables modular? 25c ambient, what is that exactly?

I think the build quality is suspect as well, from the caps used to the choice of not using a PCB for the modular connections.
I am sorry to see that you are unfamiliar with our product and brand to make those comments.

The DA700 is 180mm long, which is the same depth as Antec own Quattro series of PSUs so it should fit in the P180 without too much trouble.

The article explained why we made the ATX/motherboard cables modular (so users have option to use shorter cables in SFF and small HTPC cases).

25C ambient is an industry standard for MTBF rating. However, the DA700 is rated to output full 700W continuously at 50C.

The Decathlon series PSUs (DA650, DA700, DA800, etc...) are manufactured to the highest quality at the best of our ability on either robot assembly lines in Taiwan or in server PSU factory in China. I think many users on this forum can attest to our quality of design and manufacturer with their experiences of silent PSUs such as ST50EF-Plus and the fanless ST30NF.
I'm sorry to see you don't have much experience with a P180 enclosure. I would not want to try and squeeze in a Quattro either.

I suppose modular ATX/ mainboard power cables is no real drawback, just added cost and potential for failures.

25c is not real world though, and the second temp given is ambiguos bieng listed at 25c-50c.....which is it and when on the graph? And they don't give the exhaust temps, so we don't know how it performs at 50c do we? I'm not knocking the unit here as much as the review itself.

As far as build quality, maybe your guys could use a little less silicon goop, and some quality caps on the secondary side. Then use a PCB for the modular ports to cut some off of that 180mm. Just my personal opinion of course, I mean for $160 anyway.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6817256035

You might want to hit newegg with a email and get them to change that "Single Ball Bearing" under fans....if they indeed use rifle bearing fans.

antifro
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Post by antifro » Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:02 am

Why are people making assumptions on products they haven’t actually touched? Especially NEW products where few people have actual experience with them? The guys at Anandtech are good. Sure, the acoustics tests are not as complicated as SPCR but they're not just arbitrary numbers. How about we give SPCR a chance to take a look at this PSU and give their take on it! But looking at pictures and saying that a product is bad because you think so is simply not fair.

As for fitting the PSU in a P180, 1. lets not assume that everyone in this world owns a P180 and 2. The modular cabling will surely help.

One thing that I'm disappointed in: Enermax made sure SPCR had a chance to review their product as early as Anandtech because they wanted to emphasize the quiet characteristic of the PSU. If the intro to Anandtech's artice is accurate, then the first phone call Silverstone should have made should have been to SPCR. If this WAS the case but SPCR just didnt have a chance to review, then my apologies to Silverstone and shame on SPCR. Either way, PLEASE REVIEW SOON! :D

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Post by SST Guy » Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:08 am

Sure, we are familiar with the P180, since this is Mike Chin's creation. ;)
We have quite a few customers using our 180mm long modular PSUs in the P180 so we didn't think it was a difficult issue, especially since the fan bracket can be removed:

Image

We have inquired SPCR about the DA700 for a couple of weeks already and a sample should be on its way to them this week. Actually we did not target this model at the silent crowd initially (our upcoming fanless ST45NF would be though), but seeing that other PSU makers are touting their models as being silent, we thought we had a chance as well to join the bandwagon. We too are looking forward to the review here at SPCR.

jaganath
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Post by jaganath » Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:24 am

we did not target this model at the silent crowd initially (our upcoming fanless ST45NF would be though
hi, kind of off-topic, do you know yet what the recommended retail price of the ST45NF would be?

NyteOwl
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Post by NyteOwl » Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:38 pm

Just one comment to the "25C is not real world":

25 degrees C is 77 degrees F and is quite realistic to use as an average ambient temperature, and is indeed used a a standard test temperature in a number of industries. The higher the ambient, as most here know, usually the lower the efficiency one can expect so if an 80% efficiency can be maintained to an ambient of 50C (122F) I dare say the PSU is doing a lot better than I would be at that temperature :)

SST Guy
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Post by SST Guy » Wed Apr 23, 2008 5:53 pm

jaganath wrote: hi, kind of off-topic, do you know yet what the recommended retail price of the ST45NF would be?
The MSRP for that model will be $199

gb115b
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Post by gb115b » Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:18 am

i must say i'm very glad to have feedback from vendors on this site...well done to Silverstone...

now if they can just improve their cases from a silent perspective, i'd be set!!! :)

look forward to seeing this psu reviewed on here (though i imagine it will bear out the anandtech conclusions... though maybe not the numbers)

vick1000
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Post by vick1000 » Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:38 am

Nice pic, but what about the HDD cables on the other side of the fan, and if someone uses the 38mm version?

Why should someone NOT knock a product based on pics? Are you telling me you own and use every item you have an opinion on?

All I was doing was specualting on the info provided by the review. What other reason is there to have reviews?

The unit may be a great performer, I'm just saying based on those pics it looks like a lower end build, or at least not like a $199 unit.

antifro
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Post by antifro » Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:45 am

vick1000 wrote:Nice pic, but what about the HDD cables on the other side of the fan, and if someone uses the 38mm version?
That should not be a concern for the PSU maker. If HDD cables were hard to route, then it is the fault of CASE maker.
Why should someone NOT knock a product based on pics? Are you telling me you own and use every item you have an opinion on?


YES... I dont go putting down products that I never used because... well.. generally I like to know what I'm talking about.
All I was doing was specualting on the info provided by the review. What other reason is there to have reviews?


Fair enough. Pics were presented by Silvestone showing the PSU fits just fine. By the way, this might just be my opinion, but why on earth would you keep the bottom case fan if the PSU comes with a fan? With the sealed bottom chamber, air has to come from the front, thus cooling the hard drives and PSU only.
The unit may be a great performer, I'm just saying based on those pics it looks like a lower end build, or at least not like a $199 unit.
Lets not judge a book by its cover. On reliability it has 2 things going for it: 1) 3 year warranty (no, not as good as Corsair but not bad at all) 2) At 700W, you'll be hard pressed to max it out, even with spikes, and so if you dont use a product to 100% of its capability, longevity is improved.

PS - I dont really mean to flame here and I'm sorry if I came on too strong with my reply.

NyteOwl
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Post by NyteOwl » Thu Apr 24, 2008 8:10 am

By the way, this might just be my opinion, but why on earth would you keep the bottom case fan if the PSU comes with a fan? With the sealed bottom chamber, air has to come from the front, thus cooling the hard drives and PSU only.
One reason might be to increase the airflow from the front as it passes through the hard drives. This would yield better cooling for the drives and take a bit of strain off the PSU fan as well.

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Post by JazzJackRabbit » Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:24 pm

antifro wrote:
vick1000 wrote:Nice pic, but what about the HDD cables on the other side of the fan, and if someone uses the 38mm version?
That should not be a concern for the PSU maker. If HDD cables were hard to route, then it is the fault of CASE maker.
It should be in this particular cas because default fan position in P180 lower chamber is on PSU side. Sure, SST provided a nice picture or PSU fitted in the lower chamber, however they had to place fan on the HDD side to do it and as far as I remember spacing issues in P180 now you can't fit any HDDs in the lower chamber.

antifro wrote:
All I was doing was specualting on the info provided by the review. What other reason is there to have reviews?


Fair enough. Pics were presented by Silvestone showing the PSU fits just fine. By the way, this might just be my opinion, but why on earth would you keep the bottom case fan if the PSU comes with a fan? With the sealed bottom chamber, air has to come from the front, thus cooling the hard drives and PSU only.
That't the thing. PSU does not fit unless you're willing to either completely remove fan from the lower chamber or willing to put HDDs in the upper chamber. The former one is not a very good idea if you have more than 2 HDDs because they may not be getting enough air from PSU fan alone, the latter one negates most of the P180 advantages such as separate airflow paths.

vick1000
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Post by vick1000 » Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:01 pm

That should not be a concern for the PSU maker. If HDD cables were hard to route, then it is the fault of CASE maker.
I said nothing about it bieng anyone's fault, only it would be tough to squeeze it in to a P180. That is Antec's fault.
YES... I dont go putting down products that I never used because... well.. generally I like to know what I'm talking about.
So you don't make judgments on a product before you purchase it?
Lets not judge a book by its cover. On reliability it has 2 things going for it: 1) 3 year warranty (no, not as good as Corsair but not bad at all) 2) At 700W, you'll be hard pressed to max it out, even with spikes, and so if you dont use a product to 100% of its capability, longevity is improved.

PS - I dont really mean to flame here and I'm sorry if I came on too strong with my reply.
I'm not judging it by it's cover, I'm judging based on photos of it's insides and overall design. A 3 year warranty has nothing to do with it's reliability, neither does it's rated output. If you are not going to use most of the 700w at some point, you should buy something less powerful and in effect cheaper, all thing bieng equal of course.
Last edited by vick1000 on Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

rjhythloday
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Post by rjhythloday » Fri Apr 25, 2008 7:13 am

SST Guy wrote:
rjhythloday wrote:First glance I expected single rail 58amps. It 4 rails? Too many things I don't like about this psu in the review. I have liked the earlier decathlons and will probably keep them high on my list next time I am purchasing a psu, but this one doesn't seem ready for prime time.
The DA700 is indeed configured from the factory as a single +12V rail PSU.
From anandtech
The more important 12V rail, which was actually designed with four separated rails,
This leaves me confused.

Aris
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Post by Aris » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:20 am

NyteOwl wrote:Just one comment to the "25C is not real world":

25 degrees C is 77 degrees F and is quite realistic to use as an average ambient temperature
Sitting on your desk in your room, sure. Inside a computer while its on and your using it, no its not realistic at all.

it should be closer to 30-35c.

Rewdoalb
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Post by Rewdoalb » Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:12 am

1. Overall it looks like a good PSU (if you have a 300+W power draw while gaming...)

2. The Anandtech review was decent, enough of a teaser to make me interested, but SPCR needs to "prove" some things :P

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