Awesome New Thermaltake PSU!

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 5:03 am

http://www.thermaltake.com/purepower/W001920.htm

Isn't she a beaut!

I'll probably be buying a few of these to replace my SuperSilencer 400's.

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 5:50 am

Gee Ralf - what happened to you this weekend

? Full Frontal Lobotomy or Full Bottle in Front of me

?

I guess it is that passion for a -5V rail and >68% efficiency?

Riffer · Post by **Riffer** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 6:10 am

Hey Ralf Hutter, your supposed to put one of these

when you post a joke

Sledge · Post by **Sledge** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 6:48 am

Oh dear god, my eyes! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

ruprag · Post by **ruprag** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 8:06 am

I really like the no noise sticker

Noise : 17 dBA at 1300 rpm, 45 dB at 4800 rpm !!

hehehe

P.S. Ralf you should NOT listen to your neighbours(sp?) dog !!

Fabool · Post by **Fabool** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 10:10 am

Whoa! I can already imagine my computers arse flashing in pink, green and five other colors after getting one of these babies.. can hardly wait

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 11:32 am

Riffer wrote:Hey Ralf Hutter, your supposed to put one of these when you post a joke

Who says I was joking......

autoexec · Post by **autoexec** » Mon Nov 10, 2003 9:19 pm

he just HOPES that you were joking
as we all do

i will give you 1 piece of advice, and i dont usually give advice - DONT BUY ANYTHING FROM THERMALTAKE!

pingu666 · Post by **pingu666** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 7:30 am

autoexec
nail on head tbh

DryFire · Post by **DryFire** » Tue Nov 11, 2003 2:37 pm

anything thermal take makes A) Sucks and B) is butt ugly.

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 5:19 am

Well damn, damn, damn. I had my heart set on a couple of these and it gets a bad review here.

Of course he's oviously biased 'cause everyone knows how good TT products are.

dukla2000 · Post by **dukla2000** » Wed Nov 12, 2003 7:25 am

Ralf Hutter wrote:Well damn, damn, damn. I had my heart set on a couple of these and it gets a bad review here.

Now that is devastating: and I was going to suggest you use the Thermaltake for eye-candy but keep your Seasonic hidden away at the bottom of your case for ear-candy. If the TT paint job is iffy the whole plan falls apart!

OK - just in case anyone reading this thinks either this thread is an endorsement or we are prejudiced and not prepared to consider something new, thought it worth logging my 'paper' review of the thing. Or to put it another way, why I am not clamouring for SPCR to review it.

Basically I see nothing in the specs that would make me feel this is either a quality psu, or that it is a silent psu. In which case I figure it lands in the plain/cheapo category. If the bling-bling turns you on then so be it.

Comments to support "not a quality psu" claim:
1) No statement which (if any) ATX spec it is compliant with (Seasonic are compliant ATX 1.3 - dated April 2003)
2) No statement how sound is measured (and therefore this psu can not be ATX 1.3 compliant)
3) Claimed to be 480W. In fact that is the total of the rails and there is no statement if there is any limitation of the +3.3V and +5V combined maximum load. AFAIK only some Antec allow max +3.3V and +5V simultaneously - I would be surprised if this is true for the Thermaltake.)
4) No statement about maximum v peak loads on rails
5) Web page says +12V max is 18A, pdf says 17A. The Seasonic 300W matches this, and as the ATX 1.3 spec notes increased power on +12V is needed by recent developments I would expect more from a '480W' psu.
6) Claims efficiency >68%. Well the 'gold standard' is currently closer to 80%.
7) The 2 temperature graphs are a joke - well at least they appear to be marketing babble to me. The second curve (Voltage v Temp) says at Low Speed setting it is 11.7V at 90C. First, why is this data point different to what is plotted? But more confusingly, how come in the RPM vs Temp curve is the fan only at 1548 rpm at this voltage? Apart from which the writing claims "1300rpm at 25C - 4800rpm at 90C" which bears no resemblance to the curves.

Comments regarding "not a silent psu"
1) Claims 17dBA at 1300rpm. Well, as per 7 above it is not clear if/when/how a fan is at 1300rpm. It appears to me that the 25mm thick fan varies speed, the 15mm thick fan (presumably bottom intake) is fixed speed 2400rpm. Now JUST regarding the 15mm fan - at 2400rpm that will be way over 17dBA. So even if 17dBA is accurate for the 25mm fan at some setting, it is a meaningless headline number because it ignores ALL the noise from the psu.
2) With a modest efficiency (point 6 above) the psu itself needs more cooling => more fannage => more noise than better efficiency psus.

References:
Thermaltake 480W web page
Thermaltake glossy
SeaSonic Super Tornado web page
Super Tornado glossy

e_dawg · Post by **e_dawg** » Fri Nov 28, 2003 1:44 am

The Tt 420 and 480 W APD PSU's are actually decent and yes, very quiet. Not silent like Zalman or Seasonic, but better then most Antec and Enermaxes, and you can regulate the fan speed via a rheostat if desired. And, you can get them for a decent price as well, especially the 420 W APD model. You don't have to get the bling bling Butterfly LED/window/gold chain edition, ya know.

The Silverstone PSU is interesting in that it looks like a poor man's Super Tornado. The ADDA speed controlled fan is promising, although the use of more primitive circuitry compared to the efficient Seasonic stuff is a cause for concern. It could be as quiet as the Super Tornado if it wasn't for the inefficient circuitry that would cause the fan to spin a little faster to get rid of the extra heat.

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Fri Nov 28, 2003 6:18 am

e_dawg wrote:The Tt 420 and 480 W APD PSU's are actually decent and yes, very quiet. Not silent like Zalman or Seasonic, but better then most Antec and Enermaxes, and you can regulate the fan speed via a rheostat if desired. And, you can get them for a decent price as well, especially the 420 W APD model. You don't have to get the bling bling Butterfly LED/window/gold chain edition, ya know.

The TT PSU is not a particularly good quality PSU. See this post for details.

It may be quieter than an Antec or an Enermax but that's not saying much.

I originally started this thread to show an example of yet another piece of dubious marketing, something that's fairly common for Thermaltake. Their products are generally cheap generic crap gussied up with some extra bling. The specs on their "Silent PurePower" PSU line don't lead me to change my opinion either.

e_dawg · Post by **e_dawg** » Fri Nov 28, 2003 6:46 am

I agree with Thermaltake being one of the more marketing driven, style over substance companies out there along with Vantec. But they do make some good products that represent a good value. We shouldn't ignore their entire product line because they happen to crank up the bling-o-meter a little more than we'd like.

As for your statement that "their products are generally cheap generic crap gussied up with some extra bling", that is definitely not true across the board. Their cases are based on Antec/Chieftec fileserver cases (I have the Enermax version of the Antec SX1030B so I am familiar with the design) and the SilentBoost HSF is essentially a copy of the SLK-800A heatsink mated to a Panaflo ring cage fan.

The Tt SPP 420 APD (the plain no-bling version) is a decent PSU for a decent price. It may not be at the level of Seasonic and Zalman for silence or PC P&C for quality, but how many PSU's are? These are the cream of the crop, and to be a cut below is nothing to be ashamed of. It is still a good product and is far from being in the cheapo generic class. Not everyone has access to the various cheaper FSP based quiet PSU's. In those cases, the 420 APD fits the bill nicely.

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Fri Nov 28, 2003 7:39 am

e_dawg wrote:As for your statement that "their products are generally cheap generic crap gussied up with some extra bling", that is definitely not true across the board. Their cases are based on Antec/Chieftec fileserver cases (I have the Enermax version of the Antec SX1030B so I am familiar with the design)

The older Xaser II is actually the only case in their line that is closely based on the SX10x0/Dragon cases. It is a good example of TT taking a very good basic design and adding a bunch of cheap bling to it and reselling it. $80+ for a case that's functionally no better than the $60 "no-bling" version of the Chieftec case.

And when you look at the hideous Xaser III V1000's things go downhill fast. It's not even an SX10x0/Dragon, it's some el-cheapo ripoff that's "dressed-up" with 7(!!!) fans and no PSU for around $115-125!!!. And if you add one of the generic TT PSUs to it you're looking at $140-190 for this POS!!

e_dawg wrote:and the SilentBoost HSF is essentially a copy of the SLK-800A heatsink mated to a Panaflo ring cage fan.

Yes, the Silent boost is a copy of the quite good SLK800 but TT's opted to put an M1A Panaflo on it.(read the posts starting here for more info) There's no way an M1A can be considered "silent", nor can most anything else that TT decides to market as "silent".

e_dawg wrote:The Tt SPP 420 APD (the plain no-bling version) is a decent PSU for a decent price. It may not be at the level of Seasonic and Zalman for silence or PC P&C for quality, but how many PSU's are? These are the cream of the crop, and to be a cut below is nothing to be ashamed of. It is still a good product and is far from being in the cheapo generic class. Not everyone has access to the various cheaper FSP based quiet PSU's. In those cases, the 420 APD fits the bill nicely.

I can't believe that someone who has access to this TT PSU doesn't also have access to one of the literally dozens of rebadged versions of the FSP PSU. Do a search here at SPCR for "FSP" and see how many different people resell these very nice PSUs under different names.

wussboy · Post by **wussboy** » Fri Nov 28, 2003 8:58 am

It's called the Butterfly. What the hell? What marketing guy thought up that one. "You know what kids like? Lights! And Butterflys! Damn I'm smart."

e_dawg · Post by **e_dawg** » Fri Nov 28, 2003 8:59 am

Ralf Hutter wrote:And when you look at the hideous Xaser III V1000's things go downhill fast. It's not even an SX10x0/Dragon, it's some el-cheapo ripoff that's "dressed-up" with 7(!!!) fans and no PSU for around $115-125!!!. And if you add one of the generic TT PSUs to it you're looking at $140-190 for this POS!!

LOL... that is quite the monstrosity! Hmm, they seem to have taken things to a whole new level that I didn't even know existed

Yes, the Silent boost is a copy of the quite good SLK800 but TT's opted to put an M1A Panaflo on it.(read the posts starting here for more info) There's no way an M1A can be considered "silent", nor can most anything else that TT decides to market as "silent".

Yes, yes. I know all about it. I have two SilentBoosts and find them to be excellent. Yes, the Panaflo is an M1A that runs around 2400 rpm if plugged in directly to the mobo, but I use a Zalman Fanmate to run it at around 1900 rpm. And at that speed, it is virtually silent and still cools well (the ring cage design allows you to push more air through with lower turbulence, so it's quieter than the normal Panaflo at the same rpm). So, you get basically the same thing as you would get with the SLK-800 + Panaflo L1A, but for 55% of the cost (70% if you include the Fanmate). What's not to like?

I can't believe that someone who has access to this TT PSU doesn't also have access to one of the literally dozens of rebadged versions of the FSP PSU. Do a search here at SPCR for "FSP" and see how many different people resell these very nice PSUs under different names.

Hey, not everyone lives in the USA, ya know. It's easy to get a lot of parts in the US that are actually very hard to find elsewhere. Most retailers like Newegg won't even ship to Canada. That being said, Tt has a huge retail presence in Canada. Any major computer parts shop is going to carry Tt here. Out of the "big 3" (Antec, Enermax, and Tt), Tt makes the quietest PSU's. If you can find a FSP, great, but if not, there is nothing wrong with getting a Tt.

moving shadow · Post by **moving shadow** » Fri Nov 28, 2003 9:30 am

who cares what the thermaltake sounds like when it looks that good!

[/sarcams mode off]

Post by **Ralf Hutter** » Fri Nov 28, 2003 11:20 am

moving shadow wrote:who cares what the thermaltake sounds like when it looks that good!

[/sarcams mode off]

I sure don't. Throw a couple of "Type R" stickers and a big aluminum wing on one of those babys and I'd buy 'em by the case.