XP-90 experiences

Cooling Processors quietly

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taviso
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XP-90 experiences

Post by taviso » Thu Oct 28, 2004 12:04 pm

Hey, I'm normally just a lurker here, but I thought I'd post about my experiences with the XP-90.

I've been in the market for a new HS for a few weeks, I havnt been totally satisfied with my existing Zalman 5700 model that I've had for a while, I was leaning towards the 7000B-AlCu (there's no way I could have fitted the XP-120 behemoth in my case!:)), but after the favourable XP-90 review, I decided I'd give it a shot.

Ordering it was a bit of a nightmare, I ordered it from Overclockers.co.uk and it arrived the next day, but the fins were warped at the top and there were parts missing, I think they sent me a returned unit...I'm not fussy about minor damage, so I said I'd keep the HS but needed the missing clips and rubber strips....:roll: They say they're going to mail them to me asap, I'm just putting up without them for now.

Anyway, it's an impressive looking thing, I gave my P4 a good clean with isopropyl alcohol and put some fresh arctic silver on there and fitted it with no problem. I was a bit worried about airflow at first, the layout of my machine and the huge size of the XP-90 meant that once I'd fitted the fan it was right in the centre of and just a few mm away from where I have a 120mm extracting fan...but thankfully it doesnt seem to matter.

I have a 92mm panaflo on there, wired up to a Zalman fan controller, im running it at around 1800RPM (about the mid setting on my fan controller) and I can only hear a gentle (not-annoying) hum, and the cooling is awesome, I havnt even given the arctic silver long to settle yet and I'm getting 28c idle, and 43c with load, and after a few hours of cpuburn it only hit 50c, which is pretty awesome. for comparison, my ducted 5700Cu was at about 38c idle and ~63c load.

Anyway, you can only really see the top of the fan, but here's a picture of my setup anyway, with the acoutic padding (amongst other things), it's pretty quiet.

Image Image
sorry for the poor quality photos, ignore the apple sticker..I can't get it off :) you can see the xp-90 and my 120mm extraction fan in the top left. It's a bit of a mess, but I don't have a window or anything, so nobody ever sees it :), I have a screenshot here, in case anyone is interested :)

Anyway, I'm totally pleased with the XP-90, it's an awesome design and great performer.

I'm running a P4 3.2Ghz on an asus P4C800-E, 2*SATA 64G drives using Linux software raid0, gentoo linux, 2*panaflo fans, XP-90 HS, Zalman PSU, amongst other things :)

jooppy
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Post by jooppy » Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:27 pm

Hi

I am also interested in getting one of these, but have a question:

I have an AMD 64 board, so I will have to remove the existing CPU heatsink retension bracket and replace it with the one provided. What are the dimensions of the retension bracket that is provided with the XP-90?

Reason I ask, is my motherboard has the CPU socket in the middle of the board, really close to the AGP slot, and I already have a Zalman 80C heatpipe heatsink on my graphics card, so don't have much space between the CPU and the Zalman 80C heatsink.

In fact, when I upgraded my system, I tried to fit my existing Zalman 7000Cu heatsink, but it it too wide and would not fit with the Zalman 80C installed.

I have measured the distance between my Zalman 80C and the centre of the CPU socket, and this measured 49mm, so the maximum CPU heatsink width can be around 98mm. My Zalman 7000Cu measures 110mm, hence it did not fit...

I see that the XP-90 specs show that it is 96mm wide and 116mm long. Looking at the orientation of the bracket and the installation pictures on the SPCR review, the XP-90 will be installed with the heatpipes facing my graphics card. Also, looking at the installation pictures, it seems that in this configuration, the heatsink heatpipes only extend as wide as the CPU retension bracket.

Hence my original question. If I can find out how wide the retension bracket is, I can determine if the XP-90 will fit or not...

Thanks
Jooppy

taviso
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Post by taviso » Thu Oct 28, 2004 1:38 pm

jooppy wrote:I have an AMD 64 board, so I will have to remove the existing CPU heatsink retension bracket and replace it with the one provided. What are the dimensions of the retension bracket that is provided with the XP-90?
Hi there, I've just measured it and it's exactly 90x75 mm :)
Reason I ask, is my motherboard has the CPU socket in the middle of the board, really close to the AGP slot, and I already have a Zalman 80C heatpipe heatsink on my graphics card, so don't have much space between the CPU and the Zalman 80C heatsink.
I was worried about this as well, but luckily the the heatsink doesnt mind which way it's facing. I couldnt fit it in with the overhang facing the agp slot (with the heatpipes facing the psu), but with the overhang facing the PSU it fits perfectly :)

jooppy
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Post by jooppy » Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:00 pm

That is very good news indeed! Thanks :lol:

Just one more question, where did you get your XP-90 from?

Cheapest I have found it is here:

https://www.komplett.co.uk/k/ki.asp?sku=303232&cks=SER

£25 + £5 p&p

They do not have stock, but the page says 173 are due 02/11/2004.

Cheers
Jooppy

taviso
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Post by taviso » Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:08 pm

jooppy wrote:That is very good news indeed! Thanks :lol:

Just one more question, where did you get your XP-90 from?
I saw that one as well, but couldnt wait for the stock :) I got mine from overclockers.co.uk, for £27.50 + £4 (I think) p&p, but I can't reccomend them as they sent me a package with missing parts, they were apologetic when I emailed them though!

jooppy
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Post by jooppy » Thu Oct 28, 2004 2:10 pm

Doh, sorry just seen in your original post that you got it from Overclockers.co.uk.

Think I will preorder it from Komplett, they seem to be slightly cheaper.

Cheers
Jooppy

BarCodeBlack
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Post by BarCodeBlack » Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:20 pm

"I'm getting 28c idle, and 43c with load, and after a few hours of cpuburn it only hit 50c"

WoW! 43c under load!!!

I'm running the exact same XP-90 but with a 2.8Ghz Prescott and I get 45c idle and 57c load!

Nice job.

pony-tail
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Post by pony-tail » Thu Oct 28, 2004 4:00 pm

but with a 2.8Ghz Prescott
Nuff said

Noizz
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Post by Noizz » Thu Oct 28, 2004 5:44 pm

yeah the xp-90 is great for users who can't fit the xp-120

my temps for northwood 2.4 OC to 3.0
idle at 27
load at 35

its great!

wyldwynd
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Post by wyldwynd » Thu Oct 28, 2004 7:04 pm

So what's a good fan to use with the XP-90?

I thought the 92mm L1As were supposed to be a bit whiney?

Is the Nexus 92mm fast enough?
(for an A64 FX-53 under full load (current uncalibrated temp I get is about 55 with CPUBurn))

I'd like a 92mm that's quiet at 5-7V (but aren't they all?) but at 11-12V is whooshy rather than whiney...?

Any tips?

Tibors
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Post by Tibors » Thu Oct 28, 2004 8:43 pm

See here
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article194-page3.html
as for how well a Panaflo or Nexus functions on a XP-90.

wyldwynd
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Post by wyldwynd » Thu Oct 28, 2004 10:49 pm

Tibors wrote:See here
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article194-page3.html
as for how well a Panaflo or Nexus functions on a XP-90.
Yes - naturally I read that before I posted. But I'm after any more practical in-case experience with other hot components - and an Athlon 64...?

Also, that specifically doesn't cover the 92mm L1A I'm talking about in noise terms, since they broke theirs... and I'm also kinda asking if OTHER 92mm are liked by anyone, that provide the CFM of the Panaflo but without the whiney buzz at high speeds (prefer a whooshyer sound, even if *relatively* loud)...

-J

Ralf Hutter
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Post by Ralf Hutter » Fri Oct 29, 2004 7:11 am

wyldwynd wrote:
Also, that specifically doesn't cover the 92mm L1A I'm talking about in noise terms, since they broke theirs... and I'm also kinda asking if OTHER 92mm are liked by anyone, that provide the CFM of the Panaflo but without the whiney buzz at high speeds (prefer a whooshyer sound, even if *relatively* loud)...

-J
Temp data in those tables comes from my fans. Pic of broken L1A is Mike's fan. My L1As are unbroken and function perfectly well so you can use those numbers to compare it to the Nexus numbers.

There are very few quiet 92mm fans that flow as much air as the L1A. Offhand, I can't think of any that are close. The Nexus is considerably quieter than the L1A, but it also flows less air.

wyldwynd
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Post by wyldwynd » Fri Oct 29, 2004 7:22 am

Ralf Hutter wrote:
wyldwynd wrote:
Tibors wrote:
Also, that specifically doesn't cover the 92mm L1A I'm talking about in noise terms, since they broke theirs... and I'm also kinda asking if OTHER 92mm are liked by anyone, that provide the CFM of the Panaflo but without the whiney buzz at high speeds (prefer a whooshyer sound, even if *relatively* loud)...

-J
Temp data in those tables comes from my fans. Pic of broken L1A is Mike's fan. My L1As are unbroken and function perfectly well so you can use those numbers to compare it to the Nexus numbers.

There are very few quiet 92mm fans that flow as much air as the L1A. Offhand, I can't think of any that are close. The Nexus is considerably quieter than the L1A, but it also flows less air.
I've ordered a Nexus now because I figure that my A64 must run cooler than the Pentiums being tested, especially at idle (cool'b'quiet). And I'm counting on the XP-90 being considerably more effective than the Akasa 855 I'm currently using.

I guess it's not the end of the world if I end up getting an L1A as well - just not a fan of their high speed buzzing :) - I presume when clocked down to 5V, the L1A is silent also?

-J

Ralf Hutter
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Post by Ralf Hutter » Fri Oct 29, 2004 7:45 am

wyldwynd wrote: I guess it's not the end of the world if I end up getting an L1A as well - just not a fan of their high speed buzzing :) - I presume when clocked down to 5V, the L1A is silent also?

-J
Well, they're pretty quiet at 5V, but I wouldn't call them silent.

jimmyfergus
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grills

Post by jimmyfergus » Fri Oct 29, 2004 9:16 am

Wouldn't it be a good idea to remove your fan grills? I think someone on SPCR staff worked out they reduced airflow 15-20%.

Not that you need your temps to go down, and you may already be running your fans at their lowest working voltage. Still, I would have thought it would only do good. I doubt cables would foul the blades.

jooppy
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Post by jooppy » Fri Oct 29, 2004 9:46 am

Hi

Me again, sorry to be a pain, but I have just one more question.

Here is a picture of my motherboard:

http://images.anandtech.com/reviews/mot ... 30full.jpg

When I install the XP-90, the heatpipes will be facing the graphics card. Looking at the layout of my motherboard, it looks like the heatsink fins will be protruding over my memory modules (I have two currently installed).

I can't find any reviews/specs for the XP-90 that say how much clearance those fins have over the motherboard, so I need to know whether or not the fins will clear the height of my memory modules...

Any chance somebody with an XP-90 could do some measuring?

Thanks
Jooppy

Ralf Hutter
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Post by Ralf Hutter » Fri Oct 29, 2004 10:25 am

jooppy wrote:
I can't find any reviews/specs for the XP-90 that say how much clearance those fins have over the motherboard, so I need to know whether or not the fins will clear the height of my memory modules...

Any chance somebody with an XP-90 could do some measuring?

Thanks
Jooppy
From the bottom of the overhanging fins to the bottom of the heatsink itself (the plate that rests on top of the CPU) is 1.675" on the XP-90.

That should give you plenty of clearance. I checked the installed height of the DDR (with included heatsinks) DIMMS on two of my boards and they run about 1.400" high.

jooppy
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Post by jooppy » Fri Oct 29, 2004 10:32 am

Thanks for the reply, I will be go measure now, but it sounds like it should fit :lol:

Jooppy

taviso
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Re: grills

Post by taviso » Fri Oct 29, 2004 10:40 am

jimmyfergus wrote:Wouldn't it be a good idea to remove your fan grills? I think someone on SPCR staff worked out they reduced airflow 15-20%.
wow, really?! I had just assumed the impact was negligible, I'll give it a shot.
Not that you need your temps to go down, and you may already be running your fans at their lowest working voltage. Still, I would have thought it would only do good. I doubt cables would foul the blades.
That was my only worry, it happened to me once a couple of years ago when a molex came loose and landed on the heatsink, it didnt do any damage as the thermal throttling just kicked in, but it scared me :)

Incidentally, I reversed the fan today to suck rather than blow on to the heatsink (contrary to thermalright's suggestions) and it seems to perform slightly better, maybe because it's so close to my exhaust fan. :)
jooppy wrote:Thanks for the reply, I will be go measure now, but it sounds like it should fit :lol:
Ralf beat me to it, I just had a quick look and there is _plenty_ of clearance there, i dont think you have anything to worry about :)

jooppy
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Post by jooppy » Fri Oct 29, 2004 10:51 am

Whoohoo - it will fit.

One good thing about the XP-90 and my motherboard layout, is that my memory modules will get some free direct cooling :lol:

Jooppy

jimmyfergus
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Re: grills

Post by jimmyfergus » Fri Oct 29, 2004 12:17 pm

taviso wrote:
jimmyfergus wrote:Wouldn't it be a good idea to remove your fan grills? I think someone on SPCR staff worked out they reduced airflow 15-20%.
wow, really?! I had just assumed the impact was negligible, I'll give it a shot.
That was my guess too, but MikeC disabused me. Rereading that topic, he says it was 19-24%!

Spod
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Post by Spod » Thu Nov 04, 2004 9:23 am

I've got an XP-90 on an MSI K8N Neo2 (S939) - it overhangs the memory modules on mine, too, and there's plenty of space, even with heatspreaders.

I use a Nexus 92mm, and my 3500+ 130nm idles at 31ºC according to the motherboard, despite the fan being automatically slowed to about 960 RPM by the motherboard. It's very quiet at this speed.

I got mine from Overclockers.co.uk, and it came complete and undamaged, except for some very slight denting of the fins at the corners.

jooppy
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Joined: Tue Sep 21, 2004 9:53 am

Post by jooppy » Thu Nov 04, 2004 1:52 pm

Well, I have ordered my XP-90 now. I ordered it from Komplett. They still do not have stock though. I emailed them and they said they are chasing up their suppliers and will update me when the find out when they are due back in. If its going to be more than a week, I might just pay the extra and get it somewhere else.

I also just received my Nexus 92mm fan and some Arctic Silver 5 today, which I got from KoolnQuiet.

Spod, those temps sound encouraging, since my 3000+ idles with the stock fan at about 39-41ºC (1200-1400rpm) and goes right up to 55ºC (3800-4500rpm) after half an hour of Wolfenstein ET. Does the Nexus on your setup spin up to full speed under load, and what temps do you get under load?

Has anybody got official dB measurements for the stock AMD 64 coolers? It would be good for SPCR reviews to include the mp3's of these heatsinks too, just so that those new to the silent PC scene can hear what a difference a new heatsink/fan can make....

Cheers
Jooppy

Spod
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Post by Spod » Fri Nov 05, 2004 6:17 am

I haven't benchmarked the system using CPUburn or similar, but even at 12V, SPCR measured the Nexus 92mm to be 20 dBA/1m, the same volume as a CNPS-7000 at 5V. If the noise is equal to or less than that, who cares whether it spins up under load?
In fact, I don't think it changes the fan speed unless the fan speed passes a threshold you set in the BIOS. Set that to 60ºC, and it'll probably never spin up.

jooppy
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Post by jooppy » Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:18 pm

Hi

60ºC is a little too hot for my liking, I prefer to set it to 50ºC, but yes you are right, even at full speed it should still be very quiet.

Jooppy

taviso
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Re: grills

Post by taviso » Sat Nov 06, 2004 12:45 pm

jimmyfergus wrote:That was my guess too, but MikeC disabused me. Rereading that topic, he says it was 19-24%!
Whooa. After reading that I bought some sheet metal nibblers and cut the hole-punch grill out of my case, I made a bit of a mess of it, but just put some rubber trim over it and it looks okay :)

Anyway, the amount of airflow increase is incredible, my load temps don't even hit 40 anymore, even with my fans as low as they will go without stalling...it's amazing. I'll do the same to my other machines tomorrow. Thanks for letting me know about this!

hmm, maybe I should switch to one of those low cfm nexus fans now :)

jooppy
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Post by jooppy » Thu Nov 11, 2004 6:27 am

Update:

The XP-90 arrived this morning from Overclock.co.uk. Seems its not just Overclockers.co.uk that seem to have damaged XP-90's.

Mine looks like it had been bumped, or dropped, since about 4 fins in the centre were totally bent in. Even the plastic bag it came in looked damaged at that point.

This could not have happened during transit, since the heatsink was very well packaged in a plastic bag/foam/box. This damage looks like it either happed at the factory, or somebody took it out of the box and dropped it before shipping it.

Either way, it does not really matter, since the fins are very thin, they are really easy to bend, and after a few minutes of panel beating the thing looks like new.

After cleaning the CPU, I applied some arctic silver 5 to the CPU heatspreader. Initally I was going to use the arctic silver recommended single blob method, but realised that due to the way the heatsink needs to be installed, it would be better to use the traditional method.

With the arctic silver on, I tried to install the heatsink. Problem - the DIMMS were in the way, I could not tilt the heatsink forward enough to get the first set of retension clips hooked into the retension socket. Solution - remove the DIMMS during installation. Once the first clips were in place, it was a simple matter of tilting the heatsink back onto the CPU. I did not need to use a screwdriver or any other tools to get the remaining retension clips in place, just a little bit of vertical force with my thumb did the trick.

With the heatsink on, I gave a few little twists to spread the arctic silver around as suggested on their website.

The Nexus fan was easy to install too. I put the provided rubber strips onto the heatsink (one side of the rubber strip has a peel off sticker), then isntalled the wire clips for the fan. Real easy to install, and they clamp the fan very nicely.

I then connected the fan connector to the motherboard fan header, replaced the DIMMS in their original slots, and powered up.

Results:

With CoolnQuiet enabled, my AMD64 3000+ is currently running at 1004Mhz at 30c, and the fan is running under 600rpm.

My bios is set to control the fans with a target temp of 50c +-5c, so after running some Wolfenstein ET for about 20 minutes, the CPU goes up to around 57c and the fan is sitting at around 700rpm.

Not a bad result
:lol:

Jooppy

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