New Thermalright Ultima-90 heatsink

Cooling Processors quietly

Moderators: NeilBlanchard, Ralf Hutter, sthayashi, Lawrence Lee

Agent_N
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:53 am

New Thermalright Ultima-90 heatsink

Post by Agent_N » Sat Aug 04, 2007 1:37 pm

Has anyone seen Thermalright's new Ultima-90 on their website yet? Hopefully it will cool very well with a few extra heatpipes. The bonus is that it is smaller than the Ultra-120 which means those of us with cramped cases can have fabulous cooling! It also comes with clips to mount a 120mm fan if you don't think that the 92mm is good enough and you have room for it.

www.thermalright.com

nick705
Posts: 1162
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:26 pm
Location: UK

Re: New Thermalright Ultima-90 heatsink

Post by nick705 » Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:16 pm

Agent_N wrote:The bonus is that it is smaller than the Ultra-120 which means those of us with cramped cases can have fabulous cooling! It also comes with clips to mount a 120mm fan if you don't think that the 92mm is good enough and you have room for it.
Better still, it only weighs 460g, which is good news for cissies like myself who have nightmares about motherboards being hideously maimed by monster heatsinks.

I read a review of an early sample (can't find it now), where it apparently outperformed a Tuniq Tower twice its size using a 120mm fan, although I'd be a bit sceptical until it's confirmed elsewhere.

It's available for pre-order in the USA here incidentally, and they'll allegedly have it in stock on 7th August.

christopher3393
Posts: 289
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:46 pm
Location: Bloomington, MN

Post by christopher3393 » Sat Aug 04, 2007 6:24 pm

Here's the review: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/sho ... p?t=137838

I've pre-ordered one from Heatsink Factory. Looks like a good fit for the Qmicra v2 SFF case that's just launching: http://www.pcdesignlab.com/

krille
Posts: 357
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 4:56 am
Location: Sweden

Post by krille » Sun Aug 05, 2007 1:09 am

But Ultra120-eXtreme should still outperform it with the same fan, no?

LuckyNV
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:26 pm

Post by LuckyNV » Sun Aug 05, 2007 5:29 am

krille wrote:But Ultra120-eXtreme should still outperform it with the same fan, no?
yes, but not by a huge omfgwtf difference, it still has other advantages mentioned above.

Felger Carbon
Posts: 2049
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:06 am
Location: Klamath Falls, OR

Post by Felger Carbon » Sun Aug 05, 2007 8:08 am

With 48 fins spaced over ~90mm, the fin spacing is about the same as the XP-90, or 1.8mm. I've just started using the XP-90 again after 2+ years, and am running it on this computer at the moment at 373RPM using a 92mm A-C PWM fan modified for analog+PWM control, so I can confirm that this fin spacing is wide enough to cool using low airflow! :D

Just ordered one so I can use it on a new build I'm putting together.

Not surprising it performs about the same as the Tuniq. It has the same size cooling fin stack, and the same fin spacing judging from the above photos. Difference is a 120mm fan sticks out the top of the TR90U, but out the bottom of the Tuniq.

What we really need for both these coolers is a 90x120mm fan. Where can I order one of those? :roll:

Felger Carbon
Posts: 2049
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:06 am
Location: Klamath Falls, OR

Post by Felger Carbon » Sun Aug 05, 2007 9:15 am

I'm an incurable HSF junkie. Got to thinking about the original U90. Here's the diff:

original: 45mm x 102mm x 146mm
newver: 55mm x 115mm x 139mm (wider, deeper, shorter)

Checked for current pricing via the former Froogle (now google/products). Discovered SVC (where I'm a frequent flier) sells it for $15, but is out of stock. Jab-tech wants $18 and it's in stock, so I ordered one and some rubber fan mounts I'm running low on. Interesting thing is, if you enter J-T from Froogle, the price is $18. If you just log on and go browsing, the price is $45! I've seen a differential before with Froogle, but never this drastic a difference.

The mounting is similar enough to allow the two HSFs to be swapped without removing the mobo, and I'm curious to see how the two HSFs compare using PWM fans, and to my elderly XP-90 which now uses PWM.

LuckyNV
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:26 pm

Post by LuckyNV » Sun Aug 05, 2007 3:12 pm

also extra heatpipes over the Ultra-90

Agent_N
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:53 am

Re: New Thermalright Ultima-90 heatsink

Post by Agent_N » Mon Aug 06, 2007 3:25 pm

nick705 wrote:
Agent_N wrote:The bonus is that it is smaller than the Ultra-120 which means those of us with cramped cases can have fabulous cooling! It also comes with clips to mount a 120mm fan if you don't think that the 92mm is good enough and you have room for it.
Better still, it only weighs 460g, which is good news for cissies like myself who have nightmares about motherboards being hideously maimed by monster heatsinks.

I read a review of an early sample (can't find it now), where it apparently outperformed a Tuniq Tower twice its size using a 120mm fan, although I'd be a bit sceptical until it's confirmed elsewhere.

It's available for pre-order in the USA here incidentally, and they'll allegedly have it in stock on 7th August.

Why should you be skeptical, the Ultima-90 has more heatpipes that the Tuniq tower. It isn't necesarily the size of the heatsink or the size of the fan so much as it is the construction quality, and the number and quality of the heatpipes. With 6 heatpipes I wouldn't be surprised if it outperformed a number of high end heatsinks even if using a 92mm fan.

christopher3393
Posts: 289
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:46 pm
Location: Bloomington, MN

Post by christopher3393 » Tue Aug 07, 2007 6:00 am

Now in stock and available at Sidewinder: http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/thulforinso7.html

Crazy PC has it for $44.99: http://www.crazypc.com/products/ultima-90i-50976.html

nick705
Posts: 1162
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:26 pm
Location: UK

Re: New Thermalright Ultima-90 heatsink

Post by nick705 » Tue Aug 07, 2007 7:41 am

Agent_N wrote: Why should you be skeptical, the Ultima-90 has more heatpipes that the Tuniq tower. It isn't necesarily the size of the heatsink or the size of the fan so much as it is the construction quality, and the number and quality of the heatpipes. With 6 heatpipes I wouldn't be surprised if it outperformed a number of high end heatsinks even if using a 92mm fan.
Yes, I am aware of that. :roll: Being sceptical is just common sense - no reflection on the tester, but it's only a single web forum "review" of an early engineering sample, he could have got a particularly good one, the Tuniq Tower might have been a bad one, etc, etc.

As for basing an judgement purely on the design, the engineering world is full of things that looked good on paper, but turned out to be turds in practice.

I'm not saying it won't be a good heatsink (I hope it is, it would suit my needs admirably), but I'd just like to see more hard data independently confirming its performance before jumping to any conclusions.

Felger Carbon
Posts: 2049
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:06 am
Location: Klamath Falls, OR

Post by Felger Carbon » Thu Aug 09, 2007 8:21 am

Felger Carbon wrote:Just ordered one so I can use it on a new build I'm putting together. (Aug 5)
Alas, the new HS comes 16 to a box and not the anticipated 18, and the one they sold me was #17 or #18, so I won't be getting it for the new build.

Had an interesting time yesterday afternoon trying different HSFs in position in the new build. The Asrock K8NF6G-VSTA has a rotated CPU socket and weird positions for the PSU connections and the IDE connector, plus the new case is smaller and tighter. Interesting to see what fits (and allows things to be reached with the mobo in the case) and what doesn't.

One item that fit very well indeed was my yet-untried Apack BTF80. Spent the late afternoon beginning to mod the fan on the unmoddable fan mount for that HSF. :P

Felger Carbon
Posts: 2049
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:06 am
Location: Klamath Falls, OR

Plain old Ultra-90, not the Super-Dooper Xtra Special model

Post by Felger Carbon » Thu Aug 09, 2007 2:49 pm

Here's my $18 TR Ultra-90 in my upcoming build. Note that the HSF points at an angle, a little more to the exhaust fan than the PSU fan (both A-C 120mm PWMs), becuz the PSU fan doesn't pull as much air as the exhaust. You are not supposed to notice that a major part of this particular A-C 92mm PWM fan is missing. :D

Image

You can see the strange locations of the two white PSU connections to the lower-left of the U-90, and the blue IDE mobo connection to its right.

Very easy to mount the HSF. One of few HSFs that you can angle in this manner. I'll use Stretch Magic instead of the wire clips to mount the real 92mm fan, which is on the way. (It seems to be hard to keep A-C PWM fans in stock, except for the 80mm - and I've seen that size out of stock as well some places.)

I'll use the daisy-chain capability of the A-C PWM fans to run all three fans off the one PWM header. I'll use a separate +V supply for the two 120mm fans, so I can have 100% PWM at ~8V, and yet another +V for the 92mm with 100% PWM at a lower voltage - I'll use the Spire SP-205 dual fan controller for those two voltages. Then Quiet Fan will run all three fans at 70% PWM 99.99% of the time (when I'm not testing BurnK7).

nick705
Posts: 1162
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:26 pm
Location: UK

Post by nick705 » Mon Aug 20, 2007 2:40 am

Review at Anandtech. Looks like the early promise is confirmed - the only HSF that notably outguns it is the Ultra-120/Extreme, and then not by a huge amount. It seems to support the idea that the number, size and disposition of the heatpipes is at least as important as the total fin area.

I do like the ability to use a 120mm fan with a relatively small heatsink - there's much less choice of decent 92mm fans, and they can be overpriced and hard to find.

The mounting mechanism is very nice (the production version on the Thermalright website), and almost as good as the Noctua NH-U9/NH-U12 - it's a solid spring-loaded bolt-thru system but, once the support brackets are in place, you can still easily mount/dismount/remount the heatsink itself if need be without removing the motherboard (like the Noctuas). Are you paying attention, Scythe? :P

thejamppa
Posts: 3142
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 9:20 am
Location: Missing in Finnish wilderness, howling to moon with wolf brethren and walking with brother bears
Contact:

Post by thejamppa » Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:44 am

If its similar spring attachment bult-thru than in SI-128 SE, yes its good and secure, but unlike Noctua's similar spring attachment (which is rock solid), it allows twisting of the cooler, which I personally do not like that much. So I placed bit rubber between cooler nod and attachment bar. But twisting ability in cooler does allow user to find perfect alignment for the cooler and overcome some possible problems with high motherboard components.

However, Ultima 90 looks very promising cooler. I also like idea of using 92mm fan or then using oversixed 120mm fan with special designed fan clips. I hope SPCR can review ultima 90 soon.

nick705
Posts: 1162
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:26 pm
Location: UK

Post by nick705 » Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:47 am

thejamppa wrote:If its similar spring attachment bult-thru than in SI-128 SE, yes its good and secure, but unlike Noctua's similar spring attachment (which is rock solid), it allows twisting of the cooler, which I personally do not like that much.
Yes, I agree the Noctua's mounting is even better - apart from the twisting possibility (which in all honesty doesn't really appear to be a problem in practice), the Thermalright has a seperate crosspiece which might be a bit fiddly when tightening the screws. Having three hands would probably be an advantage... :)

The Noctua's system is definitely the best one around IMHO, although the coolers themselves appear to be just a step below the best available (although still very good). What a shame you can never find one single product that combines all the best features of everything else in a particular market sector, but I suppose it was ever thus...

Felger Carbon
Posts: 2049
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:06 am
Location: Klamath Falls, OR

Post by Felger Carbon » Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:14 am

nick705 wrote:The Noctua's... coolers themselves appear to be just a step below the best available (although still very good).
Last week I found out the hard way that Noctua's cooling fins are .5mm thick (by far the thickest I've ever encountered). Using .033mm fins would provide 50% more cooling area at the same weight and likely the same impedance to slow air... Combine this goof with the high-pitch fan that works in open space and fails in many/most real-world cases, and I worry about the experience level of Noctua's engineers. :(

nick705
Posts: 1162
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:26 pm
Location: UK

Post by nick705 » Mon Aug 20, 2007 6:46 am

I'm not sure reducing the thickness from 0.5mm to 0.033mm would allow you to pack in that many more fins, unless you also reduce the spacing between them (which would hamper low-speed airflow, particularly given the apparent limitations of the Noctua fan design). Also, the NH-U12's heatpipe layout doesn't look as efficient as, say, the Ultra-120 or indeed the Ultima-90 - the pipes are located tightly together near the centre of the fins, so thicker fins might be needed to allow effective heat conduction to their nether regions.

Or maybe the fins are just made deliberately thick for marketing reasons, to give an impression of a "quality" product, who knows... :D

I wouldn't say the design was a failure though - according to most reviews it seems to work pretty well, just not at the very highest level.

Felger Carbon
Posts: 2049
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2005 11:06 am
Location: Klamath Falls, OR

Post by Felger Carbon » Mon Aug 20, 2007 7:38 am

nick705 wrote:Review at Anandtech. Looks like the early promise is confirmed - the only HSF that notably outguns it is the Ultra-120/Extreme, and then not by a huge amount.
Keep in mind, the 120mm fan Anand uses is the S-Flex F, and the 92mm fan is the Panaflo H, both fast, noisy fans. Meanwhile, some of the other HSFs are tested using their default slow fans, such as the TT Big Typhoon Vx, the Scythe Infinity, etc.

A fast, noisy fan on a given HS will always outcool a slow quiet fan on the same HS. Is that what we at SPCR want? If Anand also provided dBA readings, or even fan RPM, the reader would be alerted. But the way Anand tests, the high speed fans always (appear to) win.

nick705
Posts: 1162
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2004 3:26 pm
Location: UK

Post by nick705 » Mon Aug 20, 2007 8:30 am

Felger Carbon wrote: Keep in mind, the 120mm fan Anand uses is the S-Flex F, and the 92mm fan is the Panaflo H, both fast, noisy fans. Meanwhile, some of the other HSFs are tested using their default slow fans, such as the TT Big Typhoon Vx, the Scythe Infinity, etc.
Yes indeed, it makes most of the comparisons pretty meaningless. Still, the signs are promising on the basis of its performance relative to the Ultra-120/X (which is consistently reckoned to be the current champ), although I guess it doesn't necessarily indicate how well it will scale down using slower fans.

*inserts customary plea for SPCR review here.... :)

mr_plow_king
Posts: 215
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 6:21 pm
Location: St-Hubert, Qc

Post by mr_plow_king » Mon Aug 20, 2007 12:41 pm

Anandtech tested the Ultima-90 and concluded :

Beyond the Ultra-120 eXtreme, we do not know of an air cooler that outperforms the Ultima-90. Several other top models ( 120 mm ) match its performance, but they don't outperform it.

I can't wait for the SPCR review.

Das_Saunamies
*Lifetime Patron*
Posts: 2000
Joined: Tue May 15, 2007 1:39 am
Location: Finland

Post by Das_Saunamies » Mon Aug 20, 2007 1:20 pm

It certainly looks promising. The low-airflow tests and an estimate on VRM cooling are what I'm waiting for.

TooNice
Posts: 98
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2006 12:57 pm

Post by TooNice » Fri Aug 24, 2007 8:27 am

Felger Carbon wrote:Difference is a 120mm fan sticks out the top of the TR90U, but out the bottom of the Tuniq.
I also noticed that on the pictures in Anandtech. Would that make the Ultima-90 with a 120mm fan taller than a Scythe Ninja despite the heatsink being 11mm shorter?

NyteOwl
Posts: 536
Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2006 7:09 pm
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

Post by NyteOwl » Fri Aug 24, 2007 12:35 pm

I wonder how it would do with one of the Sythe 100mm fans rather than 92 or 120mm. It would seem the logical compromise for fit vs airflow.

nowise
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:12 am

Post by nowise » Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:15 am

I bought this new heat sync and installed it, but I cannot get it to be secure. I can move it around and rotate it if I turn the sync. The screws will not screw down any tighter either. The lowest my temperatures have gotten is in the mid to low 40s with CoreTemp (core temperatures, E6700 @ 3.0 GHZ) idle. I will be disassembling this and trying to reinstall in the next few days.

Has anyone else tried this hardware out yet?

CA_Steve
Moderator
Posts: 7471
Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 4:36 am
Location: St. Louis, MO

Post by CA_Steve » Thu Aug 30, 2007 12:25 pm

nowise wrote:I bought this new heat sync and installed it, but I cannot get it to be secure. I can move it around and rotate it if I turn the sync. The screws will not screw down any tighter either. The lowest my temperatures have gotten is in the mid to low 40s with CoreTemp (core temperatures, E6700 @ 3.0 GHZ) idle. I will be disassembling this and trying to reinstall in the next few days.

Has anyone else tried this hardware out yet?
Welcome to SPCR!

Hard to tell if 40C is great, good, or just ok without knowing what your ambient temp and case temps are...

thejamppa
Posts: 3142
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 9:20 am
Location: Missing in Finnish wilderness, howling to moon with wolf brethren and walking with brother bears
Contact:

Post by thejamppa » Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:32 pm

nowise wrote:I bought this new heat sync and installed it, but I cannot get it to be secure. I can move it around and rotate it if I turn the sync. The screws will not screw down any tighter either. The lowest my temperatures have gotten is in the mid to low 40s with CoreTemp (core temperatures, E6700 @ 3.0 GHZ) idle. I will be disassembling this and trying to reinstall in the next few days.

Has anyone else tried this hardware out yet?
Thermalright SI-128 SE can be rotated aswell, even screws are secured but contact is still great. You need to do small ghetto mod for it: Place piece of rubber, like piece of bike innertube ( about 1,5 cm x 1,5 cm's ) between heatsinks nod and the attachments bars knob. That prevents rotation movement. I did that my my SI-128 SE. It prevents twisting effectively.

newschool
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:50 pm

Post by newschool » Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:54 pm

arghhhh SI-128SE or Ultima 90?????

SI128SE is shorter so less pressure on the mobo BUT it is heavier. And the fan goes at the bottom of the SI128SE so it might cancel his height advantage. So I guess I'll have the choose the better cooler... wich is..?

aztec
Posts: 443
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2005 5:01 am
Location: Foster City, CA

Post by aztec » Tue Sep 04, 2007 10:37 pm

the SI-128 is US$30 at case-mod.

VERY hard to go wrong at that price. :D

newschool
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 9:50 pm

Post by newschool » Wed Sep 05, 2007 8:17 am

They are both the same price in canada.. thats why i am really wondering wich one to get..

Post Reply