Scythe Ninja Copper @ Jabtech.com

Cooling Processors quietly

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Fred
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Post by Fred » Sun Jan 27, 2008 1:23 pm

yamahaSHO wrote:
thejamppa wrote:
continuum wrote:Wow... a full-sized Ninja in copper? o_0 Craaazy...
Makes you drool as the same time goose pumps of the fear for having over 1 kilo's hanging onto mobo... ^.~
I felt the same about the Ultra 120 Extreme, so I made a support bracket.
Is this something to worry about? I myself will probably get a TRUE for my computer... I guess it can hang all by itself, but is a bracket good for it's weight?

Felger Carbon
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Post by Felger Carbon » Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:20 pm

Fred wrote:I guess it can hang all by itself, but is a bracket good for it's weight?
If you throw your computer into the bed of your Ford pickup from 8 feet away, and then drive off to the LAN party without dodging the potholes in the unpaved road, then you need a bracket.

Just sitting there, your computer doesn't need a bracket or other kind of bracing.

thejamppa
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Post by thejamppa » Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:06 pm

Felger Carbon wrote:
Fred wrote:I guess it can hang all by itself, but is a bracket good for it's weight?
If you throw your computer into the bed of your Ford pickup from 8 feet away, and then drive off to the LAN party without dodging the potholes in the unpaved road, then you need a bracket.
That sounds fun, now who offers Ford Pickup and who offers the computer?

Anyway Felger is correct. True isn't made for lan computer's nor is scythe copper.
If seeing is believing, how can blind person believe in anything?
Maturity is just not experience in life but also ability to make compromises.

jigga44
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Post by jigga44 » Sun Jan 27, 2008 6:38 pm

i got my scythe copper last friday (2 days ago)
this was actually my first aftermarket cooler ive ever used on a machine, and one of the first machines that ive built solely designed for quiet/performance.

i must say, ive never liked installing intel's stock 775 hsf/cooler, but BOY oh BOY did i have a hard time with this scythe copper.

i dont know how to explain it, but for the entire heatsink, i was able to get one half clipped in, but clipping the other part in was near impossible, i could not bend it low enough, and the bracket would not clip it in. Maybe i did something wrong, but boy was it hard :(. I eventually had to bend the metal clipping part down a bit, and after some hard pushing the clip hooked in.
Maybe its just me and im a noob, but it was hard ;D.

and on another note, umm the fan that comes with the scythe copper, i could not get it on the heatsink properly, because it would interfere with the ram. (gigabyte p35-ds3l). so i just replaced the antec tricool that came with the case, with the scythe fan, seems to work fine. its definitely quieter.

actually now that i think about it, correct me if im wrong, that is where the fan should go right? like on the right side of the fan, by the ram? i could be wrong, since im a bit unexperienced actively (ive read lots, but not that much hands on work).

but regardless, i didnt put the fan on the heatsink, but im not worried since the psu fan is blowing into it. and it seems to be cooling fine somewhat passively. overall im gettin idle temps of 29-31 degrees. and load, it goes up to mid 40's. mind you, this is also with a q6700 overclocked to 3.2 ghz.

well i didnt think my post would get this long, so i guess i could end it with the recent comp i built (80% complete)

-antec solo case
-intel q6700 oc'd to 3.2ghz w/ scythe copper passive w/ ac mx-2 compound
-ocz platinum 2x1gb DDR2 (4-4-4-15) [mite upgrade this, keeping my eye out for deals)
-sata 7200.10 320gb 16meg sataii hard drive (upgrading this to samsung -spinpoint or wd gp, still undecided)
-evga geforce 7600gt (8800gt and accelero s1, coming in this week :D)
corsair hx520 psu

all in all, everything is great. i guess the scythe copper was a bit of an impulse buy, but im still satisfied (i got it for $59.99 cdn on ncix too), it is doing a good job. i cant wait to replace my hd and get my 8800gt w/accelero cooler, it should help reduce the noise even more, even tho its already whisper quiet :D

NeilBlanchard
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Post by NeilBlanchard » Sun Jan 27, 2008 7:09 pm

Greetings & welcome to SPCR,

The fan can go anywhere that it works -- in the exhaust is fine. As you say, it is quieter that way, and if the temps are okay, then all the better. :)
Sincerely, Neil
http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/

Fred
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Post by Fred » Mon Jan 28, 2008 12:09 pm

Felger Carbon wrote: If you throw your computer into the bed of your Ford pickup from 8 feet away, and then drive off to the LAN party without dodging the potholes in the unpaved road, then you need a bracket.
Hah! xD

ok. :P

Grafter67
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Post by Grafter67 » Mon Feb 04, 2008 9:16 am

jigga44 wrote:BOY oh BOY did i have a hard time with this scythe copper.

i dont know how to explain it, but for the entire heatsink, i was able to get one half clipped in, but clipping the other part in was near impossible, i could not bend it low enough, and the bracket would not clip it in. Maybe i did something wrong, but boy was it hard :(. I eventually had to bend the metal clipping part down a bit, and after some hard pushing the clip hooked in.
Maybe its just me and im a noob, but it was hard ;D.
Definitely not just you, as my experience was exactly the same. I fitted mine at the weekend and was pleasantly surprised that the motherboard still works after the amount of pressure that was needed. In the end, I had to use a straight edged screwdriver to help lever the clips over the edge

My setup is very similar to yours (Solo case etc) and I can thoroughly recommend the Samsung Spinpoint S 250Gb. Once suspended, it's the nearest thing to a silent HD I've come across.

lm
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Post by lm » Mon Feb 04, 2008 1:17 pm

In addition to surface area and material used, the heat dissipation from the surface of the cooler to the surrounding air also depends on the temperature difference between the air and the surface. But I don't have any numbers that I could use for calculations.

kike_1974
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Post by kike_1974 » Mon Feb 04, 2008 3:11 pm

And how does specific heat capacity of copper and aluminium affect to the heat transference to air?. This concept gives a measure of the difficulty to alter the temperature of a material, and the specific heat capacity of copper is much lower than the one for aluminiun.

So copper has best thermal conductivity, but worse specific heat capacity...

Please, we need a thermodinamics guru ;)

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Post by thejamppa » Fri Feb 08, 2008 5:01 am

*Drools* I just saw that one of my favourite computer shops have gotten Ninja CU in Finland. I have been drooling that for hours now. It looks so pretty and sexy.
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Maturity is just not experience in life but also ability to make compromises.

dshao1
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I like the clips better than the pins on the Ninja B version

Post by dshao1 » Fri Feb 08, 2008 6:04 am

I ordered a Ninja copper because it utilizes clips like the original Ninja and not the push pins of the Ninja "B" version. I have 3 of the original Ninja HSFs and always install them out of the case - I've gotten used to clipping them in securely.

This is the primary reason I ordered it as I couldn't find the original Ninja for sale anywhere. I've never had a version "B" but after reading all the forum messages, I decided I didn't want one of those for a LGA 775 CPU.

I love the Ninjas because I run with it fanless, I also have a lot of dust problems in Beijing - so closely spaced fins would be a problem for me.
[size=75]1. Opty 275 w/Ninja HSF, Asus SK8V M/B, 2GB Corsair RAM, HIS X190Pro IceQ III, 2x80GB WD Scorpios, Seasonic ST-400 PSU, 1x120mm Nexus case fans, all in a generic, steel, tower case.
2. Dual Opty 275s, 2xNinjas, K8N-DL M/B, 4GB RAM, Sapphire 3870, ST-400, 2x80GB WD Scorpios[/size]

JazzJackRabbit
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Post by JazzJackRabbit » Fri Feb 08, 2008 7:42 am

As far as I understand Ninja Copper simply uses scythe retention bracket which can be bought separately for ~$10 or whatnot, so you might have spent $65+shipping for nothing. Of course now you get all copper ninja, but if clips is all you wanted you could have just bought retention bracket.

thejamppa
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Post by thejamppa » Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:29 am

For Ninja CU there is Bolt-thru retention and back panel for LGA 775. If I'd have money I'd buy it immediately and pair it with E8500!!
If seeing is believing, how can blind person believe in anything?
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Felger Carbon
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Post by Felger Carbon » Fri Feb 08, 2008 10:06 am

kike_1974 wrote:And how does specific heat capacity of copper and aluminium affect to the heat transference to air? Please, we need a thermodinamics guru ;)
The SHC has absolutely no effect on the heat transference to air. It does have an effect on how fast the heatsink heats up or cools down. While aluminum has a greater SHC per gram, a copper heatsink weighs more, which reduces the difference for a given heatsink. And when I took Thermodynamics 101 at USC (the football factory) in the mid-1960s, it was spelled with a "y". Hey, I actually saw football coach John McKay once. Walked right past him. :P

dshao1
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Post by dshao1 » Fri Feb 08, 2008 12:29 pm

JackJazzRabbit,

Although the clips for the CU and B versions are different, it looks like you're right about the getting the Universal Retention Bracket to get a MB bolt through bracket for the B version (which is included with the CU version).

I guess I'll live with the additional cost, it isn't the first time and I'm sure it won't be the last. Luckily it's not a huge amount :P

I'm sure I'll be happy with it on top of a quad core.
[size=75]1. Opty 275 w/Ninja HSF, Asus SK8V M/B, 2GB Corsair RAM, HIS X190Pro IceQ III, 2x80GB WD Scorpios, Seasonic ST-400 PSU, 1x120mm Nexus case fans, all in a generic, steel, tower case.
2. Dual Opty 275s, 2xNinjas, K8N-DL M/B, 4GB RAM, Sapphire 3870, ST-400, 2x80GB WD Scorpios[/size]

walle
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Post by walle » Fri Feb 08, 2008 2:10 pm

*bump/update*

Been in contact with the post office, apparently the cooler was there but they failed to let me know despite that I telephoned them weeks ago giving them the “track numberâ€

dshao1
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Post by dshao1 » Fri Feb 08, 2008 9:25 pm

Thanks Walle,

I just received it in at my home in the U.S. I won't be able to use it for some time because I bought it in preparation for a new build. Currently looking at the Q9450 or Q9550 with an Asus ROG Rampage Formula motherboard. Both the CPUs and MB are currently unavailable, but I expect them to be by mid-year.

I usually buy what I can in the U.S. and bring it to Beijing (its cheaper in the U.S. and their are more quality brand products and retailers). So I end up buying things in stages for to make carrying it all more convenient.

I'm sure I'll like the Ninja Copper. Its not that large of a price difference between it and a "B" + Retention Kit. :D

BR, Dan
[size=75]1. Opty 275 w/Ninja HSF, Asus SK8V M/B, 2GB Corsair RAM, HIS X190Pro IceQ III, 2x80GB WD Scorpios, Seasonic ST-400 PSU, 1x120mm Nexus case fans, all in a generic, steel, tower case.
2. Dual Opty 275s, 2xNinjas, K8N-DL M/B, 4GB RAM, Sapphire 3870, ST-400, 2x80GB WD Scorpios[/size]

JimX
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Post by JimX » Tue Feb 12, 2008 6:59 am

Image

I installed mine yesterday, very solid but scratches at the lightest touch... :evil:

NeilBlanchard
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Post by NeilBlanchard » Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:17 am

Hello,

What I really want is to have this heatpipe layout used on the standard Ninja!!
Sincerely, Neil
http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/

kike_1974
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Post by kike_1974 » Thu Feb 14, 2008 12:38 pm

Felger Carbon wrote:
kike_1974 wrote:And how does specific heat capacity of copper and aluminium affect to the heat transference to air? Please, we need a thermodinamics guru ;)
The SHC has absolutely no effect on the heat transference to air. It does have an effect on how fast the heatsink heats up or cools down. While aluminum has a greater SHC per gram, a copper heatsink weighs more, which reduces the difference for a given heatsink. And when I took Thermodynamics 101 at USC (the football factory) in the mid-1960s, it was spelled with a "y". Hey, I actually saw football coach John McKay once. Walked right past him. :P
[Offtopic]
Sorry for the misspelling, I'm from Spain and my English is not as good as I'd like to, but I try to do my best to write in the forum.

I don't know anything about football either, here we only talk about soccer ;)

[End offtopic]

TooNice
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Post by TooNice » Sun Feb 17, 2008 7:29 pm

Darn and I just bought the TRUE. I wonder if this is better in performance (definitely wins in aesthetics). A little ironic though - CPU temperature isn't at their historical highest, yet we still see ever heavier heatsinks.

Felger Carbon
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Post by Felger Carbon » Sun Feb 17, 2008 8:50 pm

TooNice wrote:Darn and I just bought the TRUE. I wonder if this is better in performance (definitely wins in aesthetics). A little ironic though - CPU temperature isn't at their historical highest, yet we still see ever heavier heatsinks.
We have overclockers who don't like running garden hoses in and out of their computers for the really big HSFs. And the quad-core CPUs are running hotter and hotter - pretty soon, Prescott territory! :P

Kuroimaho
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Post by Kuroimaho » Mon Feb 18, 2008 6:58 am

This cooler wins in fanless mode so far which is going to be challenged by the orochi in a few days.

Bench of coolers in fanless mode. LINK

Can't wait to see which cooler is going to perform better in fanless mode as I delayed the purchase of a copper Ninja because of the orochi.

thejamppa
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Post by thejamppa » Mon Feb 18, 2008 10:32 am

Darn, SPCR will hard time... Two new scythe passive coolers. Which one shall beat the reining passive champion Ninja as reference cooler? Ninja Copper or Orochi?
If seeing is believing, how can blind person believe in anything?
Maturity is just not experience in life but also ability to make compromises.

Felger Carbon
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Post by Felger Carbon » Mon Feb 18, 2008 1:06 pm

thejamppa wrote:Darn, SPCR will hard time... Two new scythe passive coolers. Which one shall beat the reining passive champion Ninja as reference cooler? Ninja Copper or Orochi?
Hard? Wrong. Piece of cake. The better HSF depends on whether the exhaust fan is on the rear of the computer (95%) or on the top of the computer (5% or less). "Passive" does not mean "fanless" - and the cooling air paths of the two HSs are at right angles. Easy decision!

thejamppa
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Post by thejamppa » Mon Feb 18, 2008 2:41 pm

Felger Carbon wrote:Easy decision!
... which is... ?
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jaganath
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Post by jaganath » Mon Feb 18, 2008 4:36 pm

thejamppa wrote:
Felger Carbon wrote:Easy decision!
... which is... ?
isn't it obvious? FC is saying the Ninja Cu works with conventional ATX fan layout, whereas Orochi doesn't, therefore Ninja wins. However neither could be a reference heatsink simply because they are too heavy. it's irresponsible to recommend such heavy heatsinks.
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Post by souagua » Fri Feb 22, 2008 8:02 pm

I'll be building my first pc in the next few days and I bought the 5th anniversary Ninja.

Does anyone have any experience with the Cu on an AM2+ and running it passive (I won't know if the HSF will interfere with the RAM until I finish getting the parts)? Is there any way to use the 775 backplate for more support?

the build, in short:
Antec Solo
phenom 9600 BB
8GB Mushkin HP PC6400
MSI k9a2 platinum
diamond hd 3870
Corsair 620HX psu

I also got an extra nexus 90mm fan for the case. If I put both the 90mm fan and the scythe fan on the case would that be enough to run the ninja passive? Would a support bracket be a good idea with the AM2+?

thejamppa
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Post by thejamppa » Sat Feb 23, 2008 3:42 am

jaganath wrote:
thejamppa wrote:
Felger Carbon wrote:Easy decision!
... which is... ?
isn't it obvious? FC is saying the Ninja Cu works with conventional ATX fan layout, whereas Orochi doesn't, therefore Ninja wins. However neither could be a reference heatsink simply because they are too heavy. it's irresponsible to recommend such heavy heatsinks.
But would you personally take either of them if you could fit them?
If seeing is believing, how can blind person believe in anything?
Maturity is just not experience in life but also ability to make compromises.

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Post by JazzJackRabbit » Sat Feb 23, 2008 8:45 am

So question, when spcr is going to review copper ninja?

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